IndividualFreedom said:

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Thank you to the brave men and women representing rural republicans who love our public schools! We appreciate you standing up for our kids and our communities against the pressure from loony Dan Patrick. Cheers to Dade Phelan and Senator Nichols for following through on your promise to rural ISDs and voting "NO" on school vouchers.

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So you support govt. control over individual freedom in the name of rural America? Do you also consider yourself a conservative? What I see is a democrat supporting TEA and Unions and the enemy of this nation.

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I think what this poster supports is his freedom from government allowing (read forcing) a bunch of kids into his already successful school.

IndividualFreedom said:

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Thank you to the brave men and women representing rural republicans who love our public schools! We appreciate you standing up for our kids and our communities against the pressure from loony Dan Patrick. Cheers to Dade Phelan and Senator Nichols for following through on your promise to rural ISDs and voting "NO" on school vouchers.

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So you support govt. control over individual freedom in the name of rural America? Do you also consider yourself a conservative? What I see is a democrat supporting TEA and Unions and the enemy of this nation.

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Parents already have the freedom to send their kids to private school if that is what they want to do. I have one kid in private school and one kid in public school.

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I think what this poster supports is his freedom from government allowing (read forcing) a bunch of kids into his already successful school.

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I do not understand.

Old May Banker said:

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geoag58 said:

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Old May Banker said:

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And FTR, I'm 100% in favor of school choice... but there are lots of tentacles to that decision that'll have to be fugued out. What happens to long term debts that districts have, that are based on those dollars that become "portable?"

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There are others states that have already voted yes for school choice. The momentum is here now and the time to move is now. The financial details can be sorted later.

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I believe it passes once they're sorted out.

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Is that what the no voters have said?

Don't understand how Arizona and Florida can do this but Texas can't.

Have you ever lived in a rural area?

I have no idea what anyone has said.... I think for myself beyond the initial emotion of choice being good - which I've already agreed is true.

But to pretend there aren't significant financial hurdles to be addressed is disingenuous IMHO.

murphyag said:

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IndividualFreedom said:

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Thank you to the brave men and women representing rural republicans who love our public schools! We appreciate you standing up for our kids and our communities against the pressure from loony Dan Patrick. Cheers to Dade Phelan and Senator Nichols for following through on your promise to rural ISDs and voting "NO" on school vouchers.

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So you support govt. control over individual freedom in the name of rural America? Do you also consider yourself a conservative? What I see is a democrat supporting TEA and Unions and the enemy of this nation.

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Parents already have the freedom to send their kids to private school if that is what they want to do. I have one kid in private school and one kid in public school.

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So you condemn the kid whose parents don't have the financial means to do what you can afford? Let the money follow the kid and competition will force all schools to improve.

80sGeorge said:

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Don't understand how Arizona and Florida can do this but Texas can't.

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I have no idea what property tax looks like in AZ or FL or how they fund long term debt. I'm only familiar with Texas.

Old May Banker said:

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I have no idea what anyone has said.... I think for myself beyond the initial emotion of choice being good - which I've already agreed is true.

But to pretend there aren't significant financial hurdles to be addressed is disingenuous IMHO.

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Since others states have already done this then there are examples of how to handle the financial side. There will be no mass exodus from good schools. Can't say the same for schools that are already failing their students.

Those other states have the same funding for schools via property tax? Honest question as I have no idea

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Have you ever lived in a rural area?

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School choice may not help rural areas at first, but please help everyone know how it will negatively effect them. If the free market identifies that there is enough demand then perhaps some student's choice is to leave public school, but less students for the public school is less cost. Plus a new option may be much closer for some helping families spend more time together. For every negative, there is a positive. Overall, it is about choice and individual freedom.

IndividualFreedom said:

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Thank you to the brave men and women representing rural republicans who love our public schools! We appreciate you standing up for our kids and our communities against the pressure from loony Dan Patrick. Cheers to Dade Phelan and Senator Nichols for following through on your promise to rural ISDs and voting "NO" on school vouchers.

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So you support govt. control over individual freedom in the name of rural America? Do you also consider yourself a conservative? What I see is a democrat supporting TEA and Unions and the enemy of this nation.

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You are certainly entitled to your opinion, as am I. What I see is the democratic process playing out, in a bi-partisan way. I also see a small-minded person trying to label someone based on a single issue. So if you're not lock-step with every hair-brained GOP idea, then you're Antifa leftist and an enemy of the country? Dude take a step back and breathe.

If we can't get school choice through, they need to at least pass a law that allows people without school aged kids or without kids at all to not have to pay ISD property tax

Old May Banker said:

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Should children and parents in better performing rural districts be forced to accept them?

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I agree with this. And, I have a fundamental problem with tax payer money being used to fund a private enterprise. I know it is used to fund other businesses, but I have a problem with that, too.

What's "hair-brained" about school choice?

Explain how the long term debts - that voters in multiple districts have approved - are repaid when money is portable? Do those banks / bond holders just get told "better luck next time"?

geoag58 said:

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murphyag said:

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IndividualFreedom said:

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Thank you to the brave men and women representing rural republicans who love our public schools! We appreciate you standing up for our kids and our communities against the pressure from loony Dan Patrick. Cheers to Dade Phelan and Senator Nichols for following through on your promise to rural ISDs and voting "NO" on school vouchers.

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So you support govt. control over individual freedom in the name of rural America? Do you also consider yourself a conservative? What I see is a democrat supporting TEA and Unions and the enemy of this nation.

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Parents already have the freedom to send their kids to private school if that is what they want to do. I have one kid in private school and one kid in public school.

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So you condemn the kid whose parents don't have the financial means to do what you can afford? Let the money follow the kid and competition will force all schools to improve.

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What would happen is a bunch of crappy, cheap private schools would open up with no state oversight. The amount of voucher money the state would give out isn't enough to pay for a top notch private school that would provide an equal or better education than public schools.

IndividualFreedom said:

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Have you ever lived in a rural area?

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School choice may not help rural areas at first, but please help everyone know how it will negatively effect them. If the free market identifies that there is enough demand then perhaps some student's choice is to leave public school, but less students for the public school is less cost. Plus a new option may be much closer for some helping families spend more time together. For every negative, there is a positive. Overall, it is about choice and individual freedom.

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What makes rural schools good is the dynamic of interpersonal relationships built over generations of people living in the same community. If there is "freedom" for people to move into these districts without restriction, the dynamic will change. It may not all be bad, but it will fundamentally change what makes the rural district attractive in the first place.

There will be very little movement out of the rural districts. Most people there like what they have.

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What I see is the democratic process playing out, in a bi-partisan way.

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Well now it is time to unveil the check mate. Those GOP that voted NO are ALL publicly supported by the TEA.

This is a vote to maintain the TEA support in effort to continue their political career.

Bird Poo said:

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IndividualFreedom said:

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https://www.thecentersquare.com/texas/article_705ee2da-d577-11ed-9066-5b50f0967ff3.html

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According to the recorded vote, the 24 Republicans who voted with Democrats against funding ESAs were Reps. Steve Allison, Trent Ashby, Ernest Bailes, Keith Bell, DeWayne Burns, Travis Clardy, Drew Darby, Charlie Geren, Justina Holland, Kyle Kacal, Ken King, John Kuempel, Stan Lambert, Brooks Landgraf, Andy Murr, Angelia Orr, Four Price, John Raney, Glenn Rogers, Hugh Shine, Reggie Smith, David Spiller and Gary VanDeaver.

The 10 Republicans who voted "present," were Reps. Brad Buckley, David Cook, Mano DeAyala, Frederick Frazier, Cody Harris, John Lujan, Shelby Slawson, Kronda Thimesch, and Ed Thompson.

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I don't mean to cause more work for you, but could you list their districts as well?

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Kyle Kacal represents Brazos County and has dropped the ball on a lot of issues. It's time for him to go play at his ranch and stay out of politics.

murphyag said:

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geoag58 said:

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murphyag said:

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IndividualFreedom said:

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Thank you to the brave men and women representing rural republicans who love our public schools! We appreciate you standing up for our kids and our communities against the pressure from loony Dan Patrick. Cheers to Dade Phelan and Senator Nichols for following through on your promise to rural ISDs and voting "NO" on school vouchers.

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So you support govt. control over individual freedom in the name of rural America? Do you also consider yourself a conservative? What I see is a democrat supporting TEA and Unions and the enemy of this nation.

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Parents already have the freedom to send their kids to private school if that is what they want to do. I have one kid in private school and one kid in public school.

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So you condemn the kid whose parents don't have the financial means to do what you can afford? Let the money follow the kid and competition will force all schools to improve.

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What would happen is a bunch of crappy, cheap private schools would open up with no state oversight. The amount of voucher money the state would give out isn't enough to pay for a top notch private school that would provide an equal or better education than public schools.

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Yep, it's pretty much a handout to upper-class people to help take the sting off that private school bill.

It probably wouldn't make private school an option for most middle class, and definitely not lower middle class. Then you have all the unintended consequences from doing this (the funding for public schools, private school quality, etc.)

Old May Banker said:

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Those other states have the same funding for schools via property tax? Honest question as I have no idea

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Sounds like you need to do some research before commenting that it won't work.

Irish 2.0 said:

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Old May Banker said:

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These representatives need to be Primaried in March.

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Choosing single issues and claiming those that don't agree with them "should be primaried" seems less than ideal.

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Reducing parental rights for parents to choose education and offer true educational freedom is much more than a single issue.

Why should students in a failing school district be REQUIRED to stay instead of taking the tax dollars to a district or private school that actually educates and improves children?

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Their rights aren't being reduced.

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There will be very little movement out of the rural districts. Most people there like what they have.

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There you go. You said it. Nothing will change because THEY LIKE IT. THEY! Those individuals. Thank you for making the point that matters most.

I've done enough research to know it didn't pass...

IndividualFreedom said:

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There will be very little movement out of the rural districts. Most people there like what they have.

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There you go. You said it. Nothing will change because THEY LIKE IT. THEY! Those individuals. Thank you for making the point that matters most.

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I think you missed the part where it changes their school dynamics. I doubt that many would like it.

John Raney is a total POS, always has been. I despised him for years and am to the point I'd vote for the Democrat just to be rid of him.

Why Brazos County can't get someone better is beyond me, except for the fact he has total control over the good ole boys network.

Kyle Kacal is a liberal pretending to be a conservative. The Democrats can always count on his vote when they need him.

Irish 2.0 said:

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Old May Banker said:

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These representatives need to be Primaried in March.

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Choosing single issues and claiming those that don't agree with them "should be primaried" seems less than ideal.

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Reducing parental rights for parents to choose education and offer true educational freedom is much more than a single issue.

Why should students in a failing school district be REQUIRED to stay instead of taking the tax dollars to a district or private school that actually educates and improves children?

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Because then gubmint has their stank on private schools.

rgag12 said:

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murphyag said:

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geoag58 said:

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murphyag said:

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IndividualFreedom said:

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Thank you to the brave men and women representing rural republicans who love our public schools! We appreciate you standing up for our kids and our communities against the pressure from loony Dan Patrick. Cheers to Dade Phelan and Senator Nichols for following through on your promise to rural ISDs and voting "NO" on school vouchers.

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So you support govt. control over individual freedom in the name of rural America? Do you also consider yourself a conservative? What I see is a democrat supporting TEA and Unions and the enemy of this nation.

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Parents already have the freedom to send their kids to private school if that is what they want to do. I have one kid in private school and one kid in public school.

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So you condemn the kid whose parents don't have the financial means to do what you can afford? Let the money follow the kid and competition will force all schools to improve.

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What would happen is a bunch of crappy, cheap private schools would open up with no state oversight. The amount of voucher money the state would give out isn't enough to pay for a top notch private school that would provide an equal or better education than public schools.

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Yep, it's pretty much a handout to upper-class people to help take the sting off that private school bill.

It probably wouldn't make private school an option for most middle class, and definitely not lower middle class. Then you have all the unintended consequences from doing this (the funding for public schools, private school quality, etc.)

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I think we will find privatizing and competition will expose public schools as being horribly wasteful of the funding they now recieve.

Ultimately, I hope this passes. I also hope that private schools raise their prices so that their teachers get paid better.

To those of you who think that this is going to be some sort of magic bullet that will free the masses to go to the private school of their choice... Hahahahahahahahahahaha

You are so naive.

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What makes rural schools good is the dynamic of interpersonal relationships built over generations of people living in the same community. If there is "freedom" for people to move into these districts without restriction, the dynamic will change.

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I didn't miss a thing. If your argument is that the RURAL schools will get overcrowded, why isn't that happening now? Why would the money following the student increase RURAL public overcrowding? Sure country life is dream for almost everyone, but you have to pay for it. School choice is not going to change that dynamic, property prices will. Nobody is moving to Big Bend area because they now have school choice.


"Woo hoo! Honey pack up our things. We are moving to Terlingua. We have school choice!"

rgag12 said:

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murphyag said:

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geoag58 said:

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murphyag said:

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IndividualFreedom said:

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Thank you to the brave men and women representing rural republicans who love our public schools! We appreciate you standing up for our kids and our communities against the pressure from loony Dan Patrick. Cheers to Dade Phelan and Senator Nichols for following through on your promise to rural ISDs and voting "NO" on school vouchers.

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So you support govt. control over individual freedom in the name of rural America? Do you also consider yourself a conservative? What I see is a democrat supporting TEA and Unions and the enemy of this nation.

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Parents already have the freedom to send their kids to private school if that is what they want to do. I have one kid in private school and one kid in public school.

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So you condemn the kid whose parents don't have the financial means to do what you can afford? Let the money follow the kid and competition will force all schools to improve.

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What would happen is a bunch of crappy, cheap private schools would open up with no state oversight. The amount of voucher money the state would give out isn't enough to pay for a top notch private school that would provide an equal or better education than public schools.

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Yep, it's pretty much a handout to upper-class people to help take the sting off that private school bill.

It probably wouldn't make private school an option for most middle class, and definitely not lower middle class. Then you have all the unintended consequences from doing this (the funding for public schools, private school quality, etc.)

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Or private schools will do what colleges in the state have done with students having easier access to college loans, just up the amount it cost to go. With the increased demand from people with vouchers schools will need to up the tuition limit who can attend.

murphyag said:

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LSCSN said:

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both BCS reps voted no. and i know at least one of them sent their kid to private school. funny stuff.

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I send one of my kids private school and pay over $30,000 a year to do so. My other kid is in our local public school. That is my personal choice as a parent. I don't believe in school vouchers.

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So you get your personal choice because you can afford 30,000/year?

I believe in vouchers because it increases opportunity for everyone. Not just those who can afford private school. It also forces schools to compete for good teachers while increasing their pay.

As usual with anything related to public schools, there are more adults worried about what's best for them instead of worrying about what's best for the kids.

There is no reason that MY tax dollars that go to public school shouldn't be allowed to follow my kid to whatever school district they attend.

And yes, I live in rural area. My kids go to a 2A public school. If it's better for a kid to go to a school in a district they don't live in then that kid's family's tax dollars should go with them. This entire issue isn't about kids. School vouchers would threaten the crappy school districts with crappy teachers because families would have a choice and send their kids and their tax dollars elsewhere. Not having vouchers protects crappy schools with crappy teachers and admin.

But our stupid state govt won't touch anything tax related, especially property taxes, bc it would decrease funding for all their stupid little pet projects. Texas, in all it's glory, has one of the WORST tax systems around. We need some conservatives that are actually conservatives to step up and completely makeover our tax system.