There's really nothing very optimistic going on, from a 'pro-ukraine' perspective. The materiel/weapons they can go get more delivered down the road, but they are out of people, really. I've avoided linking some of the anecdotal images/tweets of younger males being physically abducted by their security folks to be sent to the lines, as I can't tell which ones are real vs. propaganda/fakes, but I do feel bad for the folks being 'expended' in this PR operation.

First week of Ukraine counter-offensive against 900km Russian defensive lines in Zaporozhye was rough. But most UA casualties were cannon fodder conscripts.

We’ll know Ukraine is using full strength (best brigades) when Challenger Tanks are in the mix. #ukrainecounteroffensive pic.twitter.com/YTKT1SAgRr

— 𝗠𝗲𝗿𝗳𝘆 𝗠𝗮𝗰 (@MerfyMac) June 11, 2023

Ukraine War Day #474: American Hubris Burns On the Plains Of Zaporozhie https://t.co/dnuHUQmSqr

— Tim Rourke (@yaxl_to) June 12, 2023

With the mines working so well (including the ability to lay them behind an advancing column as per link above), really traditional 'wedge' armor advances are basically impossible, and adding to that now there is more rain over the country again making it all very difficult, though plausibly maybe the weather will limit Russian ISR and air power advantages on the defensive side of things. Meanwhile, the Russians apparently face less pressure to raise forces to continue;



I keep waiting to read of a revolt/rebellion within the UFA ranks. Will be interesting to see if/when that happens during/after this 'offensive.' Who knows? Meanwhile, nato is meeting this month to discuss sending ground forces to join the Ukrainians. Utter disaster/foolishness...forever war!

Very bad day to be a Ukrainian. I don't understand the hubris of some posters

PlaneCrashGuy said:

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Very bad day to be a Ukrainian. I don't understand the hubris of some posters

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Agreed. It's been a bad year and a half to be a Ukrainian thanks to Putin invading their country. Will be a tough next few months but hopefully they can make enough advances to convince the Russians to end the war and go home.

PlaneCrashGuy said:

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Very bad day to be a Ukrainian. I don't understand the hubris of some posters

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Because the Uke's are pushing again and haven't even committed their full strength yet. Keep rooting for the Russians. It's gone well so far.

The Russians also just blew another dam in a hasty retreat. Some tricks never get old.

Teslag said:

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PlaneCrashGuy said:

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Very bad day to be a Ukrainian. I don't understand the hubris of some posters

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Because the Uke's are pushing again and haven't even committed their full strength yet. Keep rooting for the Russians. It's gone well so far.

The Russians also just blew another dam in a hasty retreat. Some tricks never get old.

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I love how the posters keep posting things like they're horrible and they have DAY #474 in them...

Russia - a supposed "superpower" has basically fought itself to a standstill against a small former SSR and it's taken well over a year to get here...

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Meanwhile, nato is meeting this month to discuss sending ground forces to join the Ukrainians.

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Uh huh

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That leaves negotiations as the only option. There will be a lot of hesitation as the price Russia will ask for to stop the war will be high:

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For starters, will Russia insist on securing the rights to all territory east of the Dnieper River and on a special status for Odessa? I think so. Odessa would no longer be ruled by Ukraine. I also would expect Russia to demand (non-negotiable) the arrest and prosecution of those responsible for the murder of 42 Russian speaking Ukrainians in 2014 who sought refuge in the Trade Unions House.

I also would expect that Russia will demand the dismantling of NATO Aegis missile systems in Poland and Romania and a ban on U.S. or NATO troops being posted in countries that share a border with Ukraine. In light of Russia's stated goal of de-nazification I would not be surprised if Russia demands the laws of Ukraine be changed and that Nazi-affiliated parties and symbols be banned.

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I believe that Russia will want all historic Russian regions, at least those which Lenin and Khrushchev for whatever reasons gave to Ukraine, back under Russian control. Russia will also demand the lifting of all sanctions against it.

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The West is failing to grasp the reality that Russia believes it is winning the war in Ukraine and that it is not suffering economic or political damage at home. And, when you factor in the international arena, the war has proven to be a boon for Russia's efforts to help create a new international financial/trade system that circumvents Washington's control. In other words, Russia has little incentive to entertain negotiations that would require Russian concessions.

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It will still need some time for the 'western' public to move from swallowing 'Ukraine is wining' propaganda towards acknowledging reality. It unfortunately will also still take more Ukrainian and Russian losses.

But I strongly believe, maybe too wishfully, that the end of the war is now coming into sight.

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Grumbling noises…but maybe he is right about the end coming into sight.

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For starters, will Russia insist on securing the rights to all territory east of the Dnieper River and on a special status for Odessa? I think so. Odessa would no longer be ruled by Ukraine. I also would expect Russia to demand (non-negotiable) the arrest and prosecution of those responsible for the murder of 42 Russian speaking Ukrainians in 2014 who sought refuge in the Trade Unions House.

I also would expect that Russia will demand the dismantling of NATO Aegis missile systems in Poland and Romania and a ban on U.S. or NATO troops being posted in countries that share a border with Ukraine. In light of Russia's stated goal of de-nazification I would not be surprised if Russia demands the laws of Ukraine be changed and that Nazi-affiliated parties and symbols be banned.

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Looks like that guy picked the wrong day to quit sniffing glue

Slow down, I'm still writing all this down.

Surely Putin wants Finland back out of NATO, and Norway should have to leave too as good measure.

Remember when they pitched Biden as a placeholder candidate to momentarily return things to normal — & just 2 years later the dollar's crashing & we're on the brink of nuclear armageddon? https://t.co/q0ww8Y3zZw

— Tom Elliott (@tomselliott) June 12, 2023

Michael Rubin: "Biden" needs to give Ukraine tactical nukes. WTAF?

"Guys, it's nuclear war for real this time. Ignore the last 12 months. This time it's really happening!"

GAC06 said:

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People are tribalistic. We've gotten to the point where people will bend reality so long as it means staying in line with the tribe.

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Like claiming WWIII is happening over and over despite being wrong over and over?

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Checkin in on this Monday to see how ya'll durrrn'

Ok let's check in.

Still no world war.

Hope that helps.

Great thanks. Carry on.

Stat Monitor Repairman said:

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GAC06 said:

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Quote:

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People are tribalistic. We've gotten to the point where people will bend reality so long as it means staying in line with the tribe.

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Like claiming WWIII is happening over and over despite being wrong over and over?

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Checkin in on this Monday to see how ya'll durrrn'

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The Taiwan evac plan is already complete. The biden administration took the Afghanistan one and copied it, then crossed out Afghanistan and wrote in Taiwan instead...

Stat Monitor Repairman said:

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GAC06 said:

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Quote:

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People are tribalistic. We've gotten to the point where people will bend reality so long as it means staying in line with the tribe.

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Like claiming WWIII is happening over and over despite being wrong over and over?

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Checkin in on this Monday to see how ya'll durrrn'

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The US is preparing evacuation plans from everywhere all the time.

It's called being prepared...

Ag with kids said:

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Stat Monitor Repairman said:

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GAC06 said:

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Quote:

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People are tribalistic. We've gotten to the point where people will bend reality so long as it means staying in line with the tribe.

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Like claiming WWIII is happening over and over despite being wrong over and over?

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Checkin in on this Monday to see how ya'll durrrn'

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The US is preparing evacuation plans from everywhere all the time.

It's called being prepared...

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Source?

PlaneCrashGuy said:

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Ag with kids said:

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Stat Monitor Repairman said:

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GAC06 said:

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Quote:

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People are tribalistic. We've gotten to the point where people will bend reality so long as it means staying in line with the tribe.

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Like claiming WWIII is happening over and over despite being wrong over and over?

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Checkin in on this Monday to see how ya'll durrrn'

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The US is preparing evacuation plans from everywhere all the time.

It's called being prepared...

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Source?

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Here's an example I found without digging much...

Ag with kids said:

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PlaneCrashGuy said:

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Ag with kids said:

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Stat Monitor Repairman said:

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GAC06 said:

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Quote:

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People are tribalistic. We've gotten to the point where people will bend reality so long as it means staying in line with the tribe.

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Like claiming WWIII is happening over and over despite being wrong over and over?

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Checkin in on this Monday to see how ya'll durrrn'

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The US is preparing evacuation plans from everywhere all the time.

It's called being prepared...

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Source?

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Here's an example I found without digging much...

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"Everywhere all the time"

*3 year old document*

Yeah this is the "another perspective" thread where only pro-Russian bloggers and no **** actual Russian propaganda is accepted as sources.

You're so close.

PlaneCrashGuy said:

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Ag with kids said:

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PlaneCrashGuy said:

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Ag with kids said:

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Stat Monitor Repairman said:

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GAC06 said:

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Quote:

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People are tribalistic. We've gotten to the point where people will bend reality so long as it means staying in line with the tribe.

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Like claiming WWIII is happening over and over despite being wrong over and over?

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Checkin in on this Monday to see how ya'll durrrn'

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The US is preparing evacuation plans from everywhere all the time.

It's called being prepared...

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Source?

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Here's an example I found without digging much...

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"Everywhere all the time"

*3 year old document*

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2022 = 3 years ago.

Cool. First it was spring that changed, now it's years...

BTW...if you knew anything about the government, which you've shown you don't, you'd realize that PREPARING and PUBLISHING can be YEARS apart.

Asia Times: Big Development: Ukraine ready to negotiate.

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His statement came after Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky visited Kherson on June 8th to be updated on the ongoing offensive in the Zaphorize region.

No doubt Zelensky got news that he did not want to hear: The Ukrainian offensive is not going well and Ukrainian army losses have been heavy. The Russians have managed to knock out many Ukrainian tanks, including French-supplied AMX-10s and three front-line German Leopard A-6 models (not the A-4 models transferred from Poland).

The Russians also destroyed the critical Hensoldt TRML-4D AESA radar, part of the Iris-T air defense system that was brought up in range to support Ukraine's forces in the offensive. Its neutralization has given Russian forces command of the air above the battlefield.

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We don't know much about Russian casualties or material losses. We do know that what may have been Ukraine's best-modernized brigade the 47th Mechanized, trained in Europe by NATO, equipped with night vision, thermal imaging gear and infantry fighting vehicles including the US Bradley, and backed by a massive amount of artillery including HIMARS failed to gain ground or roll back the Russians.

It is unclear how much overall damage was done to this brigade, but other units have been mauled so much so that some battalions refused to fight.

Ukraine still has a very large force it can bring to the battle, so the offensive is only in its early stages. But the Russians also have a huge reserve force, perhaps 200,000 soldiers, that they are starting to deploy.

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Here's hoping.

...Rybar, Russian mil blogger, reporting village is back in Russian hands as of this morning...https://t.co/UfsZmjWPMe pic.twitter.com/a2pvey9vwi

— Dan Sabbagh (@dansabbagh) June 13, 2023

There is now overwhelming evidence that the sitting president and his son are owned by the Chinese and the Russians.

Less than 50% chance he’s the nominee in Nov.. https://t.co/sEndU7q1AM

— John Cardillo (@johncardillo) June 13, 2023

The Biden clan is owned/operated by the Russians and Chinese, as most observers have long known. Burisma was/is a Ukrainian company but its board/ownership interests have always been mostly Russian oligarchs (like the widow of the former mayor of Moscow, Baturina, who oh by the way is still exempt from Russian sanctions for some strange unspoken reason).

Follow the money.

Rather be dead than red, give more money to the Nazis! ...wait.

https://www.voanews.com/a/us-providing-325-million-more-in-aid-for-ukraine-/7134105.html

$325 million in more aid for Ukraine, including more stryker and bradleys.

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/canadas-trudeau-visits-kyiv-show-support-2023-06-10/

Canadians throwing another $500 million to slaughter more russian trash.

Teslag said:

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https://www.voanews.com/a/us-providing-325-million-more-in-aid-for-ukraine-/7134105.html

$325 million in more aid for Ukraine, including more stryker and bradleys.

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/canadas-trudeau-visits-kyiv-show-support-2023-06-10/

Canadians throwing another $500 million to slaughter more russian trash.

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Interesting to see Trudeau talk about staying in Ukraine for forever if need be.

F* that noise.

Meanwhile, the WSJ reports Biden officials planning for negotiations and we know leaders of UK, Germany, and France told Zelensky months ago to negotiate.

Article below is us apparently deciding to give Ukraine depleted uranium rounds, but I've seen variations of the quote below now repeated multiple times.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/u-s-set-to-approve-depleted-uranium-tank-rounds-for-ukraine-f6d98dcf

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Top Biden administration officials say the U.S. goal is to enable Ukraine to make as much progress as possible on the battlefield, to put Kyiv in the strong negotiating position if peace talks are eventually held. But there has been disagreement within the Biden administration about how best to support Ukrainian forces, including whether to supply cluster munitions.

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Is the calculation changing fir the Ukraine? Figuring out the juice isn't worth the squeeze?

They are not able to produce even marginally believable propaganda now, are low on cannon fodder from their stock of military age males (see above about conscripting females en masse now), and there is a possibility that Biden might actually be forced to resign over all the corruption they can't keep silent on between his crime family and Russians/Ukrainians, so ending the war/making it stop is now a feasible possibility.

That's how I see it anyway.

pic.twitter.com/FwYxnIBYnp

— The Right To Bear Memes (@grandoldmemes) June 12, 2023

The funniest thing about this (or only funny part) are the realizations of 'war backers' (I don't want to use a prostitution-related word) now coming to realize 'gee, maybe Biden really was in bed with Putin/Zelensky both (the wealthy oligarchs on both sides) to just use this as a mechanism to trigger huge inflation and get cannon fodder killed off while enriching themselves.' China and the BRICS are tremendously pleased, without any doubt at all.

Naturally, some slower ones out there in the media still are in abject denial/don't get it.

Minor update; Russian energy flows (including through Ukraine) into Europe could still have a huge impact once the current transit contracts expire. This is also a factor bringing the Eastern Europeans in particular to push for a negotiated end to the conflict.

PlaneCrashGuy said:

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Is the calculation changing fir the Ukraine? Figuring out the juice isn't worth the squeeze?

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Nope. Offensive is going well, several new towns taken yesterday, and military aid is still pouring in. WW3 still seconds away though I've heard however.

You finally just said F it and just linked straight to RT. Kudus for the honesty now.

Teslag said:

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PlaneCrashGuy said:

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Is the calculation changing fir the Ukraine? Figuring out the juice isn't worth the squeeze?

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Nope. Offensive is going well, several new towns taken yesterday, and military aid is still pouring in. WW3 still seconds away though I've heard however.

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Offensive is a mixed bag according to most media reporting. Which was expected by most I think.

I'm excited to see this horrifying sagas come to a close.

YouBet said:

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Teslag said:

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PlaneCrashGuy said:

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Is the calculation changing fir the Ukraine? Figuring out the juice isn't worth the squeeze?

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Nope. Offensive is going well, several new towns taken yesterday, and military aid is still pouring in. WW3 still seconds away though I've heard however.

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Offensive is a mixed bag according to most media reporting. Which was expected by most I think.

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Yep, lots of probing attacks at present. Will have a much clearer picture in the next few weeks. Though some say it's purely mythological.