I will never buy an electric powered vehicle.

457,110 Views | 7207 Replies | Last: 1 day ago by DannyDuberstein
RGV AG
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12:30a, 4/2/22
AG
All this EV rage and hubbub is fueled out of the US and Europe, for the most part. Without looking it up, I would bet that only a small percentage of the globe, probably around 10-15%, has the purchasing power to purchase an EV. A decent reliable one. I would also bet that no more than probably 35% of the worlds population has access to the power infrastructure/grid to support an EV that is comparable to an ICE vehicle in performance and reliability.

Thus all this effort, expense, damage to the environment (mining/battery building, etc) is being done for products that are only accessible to a small percentage of the worlds population. Now it may be, like it was with ICE, that eventually the technology become affordable for the lower economic scales, but what is that time frame? And what is the cost of developing the infrastructure/grid to support these EV the third world over?

I mean in North America, Central America, the Caribbean, and South America 45' HC containers chock full of 2 cycle tuk-tuk's straight from China are sold months before ever landing. Off brand Chinese vehicles, that suck ass, are sold by the thousands with engine and anti-pollution technology that is probably late 60's at best, and we expect to change over these places to "green" tech? These people can't afford to outright pay for a cheap ass horrible Chinese or Indian 2 cycle motorcycle and what do the green warriors expect them to do? Wait around, afoot or relying on a mule, while the price comes down on EV's and they have enough money to afford cutting edge tech?

Who in the hell is gonna pay for all of this?
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FCBlitz
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1:18a, 4/2/22
We are being forced fed this stuff.

COVID, woke ness, the gay thing, climate change, CRT, Disney with their gender less world and men competing in women's sports We are being forced fed this stuff, and it is being legitimized through our government. Government is making these decision with out our approval.

As an example. The agency I work for is being told to add abunch and I mean abunch of charging stations on base and that all vehicles that we use will be all electric. That means electric golf carts, cars, vans, trucks and semi's. We will not have any gas powered vehicles in our fleet. This is happening now. This week the order was giving….what is your plan to go electric. The government wants to know….

I have long ago started to dislike and have no respect for the Democratic Party …….but I despise the Republican Party because they are cowards, liar and do nothing to fight back. They are worthless. They know what is happening but they DO NOTHING other then looking mad. Then they disappear from the fight.

The Republican Party should be in a war with Democrats. and showing extreme leadership during these times. But they are being beat by Biden.
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TxAgPreacher
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3:00a, 4/2/22
S
Call me when they have a hybrid so efficient that can run for over 300 miles on electric, and then another 300 on gas/diesel while charging the electric again to go even further on a second electric charge. Oh and not in whimpy Prius form... I'm talking Tesla power, and or truck level power.

I don't care if it's expensive or bulky.
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AggieDruggist89
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In reply to nortex97 • 5:13a, 4/2/22
AG
nortex97 said:
AggieDruggist89 said:
Like I said before, we have a plug in hybrid and over 40 solar panels. PG&E in my area during peak hours is over 45 cents per kwh. So when we did the math for the plug in prius, gas was cheaper. So we only charge during solar is kicking.

We also have another prius for daughter.

I won't buy an EV. Not now. **** no.
The thing is, you are probably (based on your username) very good at math, and consideration/analyses of possible side effects etc. The BEV objective is to make everyone who isn't strong at that accept/embrace them, and only then/when it is too late lament that 'this isn't really a good thing for me/my country/family.'


Actually, PG&E peak rate is about $0.50 per kwh. What's it take to fully charge a large capacity Tesla battery? 80 kwh?

It will cost $40 to charge one at my house.
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beerad12man
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In reply to GAC06 • 5:26a, 4/2/22
AG
GAC06 said:
You are wrong because battery tech has already advanced significantly from the stuff you mentioned. But the good news is no one is forcing you to buy an EV.

You mentioned a ranch so it may not be a great fit for you. For people that live in cities (most people) EV's offer significant advantages over ICE vehicles


Well governments sure are trying their best to force peoples hands, or at least coerce the timeline
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Kearney McRaven
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In reply to Medaggie • 5:51a, 4/2/22
Great reply. Thanks for the information.
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Aggie Spirit
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5:56a, 4/2/22
AG
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Who?mikejones!
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6:07a, 4/2/22
Backing electric vehicles seem like the worst decision our govt could've made if the environment was their major concern.

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Bobaloo
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6:16a, 4/2/22
Nothing like the rumble of a purring ICE!
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PA24
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6:41a, 4/2/22
AG
Texas Tea feeds my family and has for 3 generations. No to green energy.
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YouBet
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6:42a, 4/2/22
AG
We live in the city. I would consider owning 1 EV while keeping 1 ICEV. I only drove about 5k miles per year so I have a use case for ownership.

It would come down to TCO for me over a 10 yr period as that is typically how long I drive a car. I'm due for a new vehicle in about four years.

One advantage for EVs is not paying for gas but that is going away so that will negate a major cost savings with EV. Just a matter of when they pass the new mileage usage fee. That could greatly impact my decision.
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doubledog
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In reply to Goodnight Irene • 7:15a, 4/2/22
Goodnight Irene said:
I saw a Tesla while driving around Austin today with the vanity plate "sun run". You just need to leave it in the sun and it will charge up like that ladies
Just raise Unicorns and harvest their farts....
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Husky Boy Jr.
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7:25a, 4/2/22
AG
Any hot boomer takes on how iPads will never take off or ride sharing won't work?
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backintexas2013
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In reply to Husky Boy Jr. • 7:26a, 4/2/22
AG
You don't see the difference between those two things and an electric vehicle that takes a long time to charge?
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'03ag
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In reply to DannyDuberstein • 7:46a, 4/2/22
DannyDuberstein said:
The whole concept of owning a vehicle is convenience and utility. You may not like the reasons because you rarely venture past the nearest starbucks, but one being significantly less convenient is a valid reason
Good god this is so bizarre. OF COURSE that's a great reason YOU shouldn't buy an EV. It has nothing to do with why someone else should or shouldn't buy one.

I don't have an electric car. It doesn't fit my needs. It may fit someone else's. You have people here saying "I like benefits A, B, and C about electric cars" and the response is "but it won't go across the country!" That's stupid.

The issue of range and charge times, and how to solve them, are so plainly obvious in 2022. Any buyer can figure out if an EV is going fit their needs. It's REALLY easy. To the point that questioning why someone bought one over range concerns is insane. It's like seeing someone bought a Camry and thinking you're dunking on them by asking how much plywood the bed holds. Any rational person would say their use case must not involve plywood and go about their day.

There are certainly people buying EVs to be woke and ending up with car that doesn't quite work for them. I think those are edge cases. There's plenty of people for whom they legitimately provide all the utility necessary.
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'03ag
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In reply to agdaddy04 • 7:48a, 4/2/22
agdaddy04 said:
Just a couple questions. Is your electricity at home free? Do electric cars not have brakes?
EVs consume brakes at a very low rate because of regenerative braking.
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nortex97
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In reply to backintexas2013 • 7:51a, 4/2/22
AG
Oh, I think the infrastructure for a whole lot of fast chargers could be built (this would take trillions), so they can be charged all over the place, safely (though there will be a lot more fires if so).

The abject lack of appreciation for those costs/facts by BEV drivers is why I essentially look at them like I do guys with super jacked up trucks tuned to 'roll coal' with truck nuts under them etc. Spend your money as you wish, on your transportation, but it is harmful to others and very sad to 'look down on' those who just think you are helping the CCP/supporting child slavery etc.
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whoop1995
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In reply to '03ag • 7:56a, 4/2/22
AG
'03ag said:
agdaddy04 said:
Just a couple questions. Is your electricity at home free? Do electric cars not have brakes?
EVs consume brakes at a very low rate because of regenerative braking.
After looking up what regenerative braking is it sounds like a pretty neat concept that can add mileage to your ev just don't get into the city or go up hill.

Kind of funny what some of the things on the internet said about it:

Disadvantages of Regenerative Braking

The most obvious is a decrease in effectiveness at low speeds. In slow-moving stop-and-go traffic, regenerative braking cannot capture much energy and feed it back to the battery, significantly reducing system benefits for many commuters during rush hour.

How much range does regenerative braking add?


Though usually regenerative braking only adds 10-15% more range with city driving and a negligible amount with highway driving, under optimum conditions such as an extended trip downhill, regenerative braking can recharge your vehicle up to 50%. Over time, this can really add up.

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agent-maroon
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In reply to '03ag • 7:59a, 4/2/22
AG
'03ag said:
DannyDuberstein said:
The whole concept of owning a vehicle is convenience and utility. You may not like the reasons because you rarely venture past the nearest starbucks, but one being significantly less convenient is a valid reason
Good god this is so bizarre. OF COURSE that's a great reason YOU shouldn't buy an EV. It has nothing to do with why someone else should or shouldn't buy one.

I don't have an electric car. It doesn't fit my needs. It may fit someone else's. You have people here saying "I like benefits A, B, and C about electric cars" and the response is "but it won't go across the country!" That's stupid.

The issue of range and charge times, and how to solve them, are so plainly obvious in 2022. Any buyer can figure out if an EV is going fit their needs. It's REALLY easy. To the point that questioning why someone bought one over range concerns is insane. It's like seeing someone bought a Camry and thinking you're dunking on them by asking how much plywood the bed holds. Any rational person would say their use case must not involve plywood and go about their day.

There are certainly people buying EVs to be woke and ending up with car that doesn't quite work for them. I think those are edge cases. There's plenty of people for whom they legitimately provide all the utility necessary.
That's a fine opinion, but I think that most people's issue with EV's is that the government is working to take away the personal choice of which vehicle that they can buy to meet their needs and are giving their reasons why.

I personally don't care if you ride a unicycle to work if it meets your needs and saves on fuel. But don't try to take away MY choice on what vehicle I can buy.
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'03ag
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In reply to agent-maroon • 8:09a, 4/2/22
Again. That's a FINE reason to not buy an EV for yourself. It's even a fine reason to tell someone else you don't think they should buy one. Not ONCE have I questioned people arguing on that basis
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TRADUCTOR
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In reply to ttu_85 • 8:34a, 4/2/22
ttu_85 said:
Ive been driving the little known Lexus CT-200's for over 15 years. Never a problem, 40+ MPG, never breaks down, No trickle charging. Carries a ton of stuff. as of now EV's cant touch the reliability, utility of a good Hybrid. When they get there I'll be game to buy but right now the specs are not there, yet.

I dont buy on fads, or because the MSM or gov tells me what to do. I buy on reliability, utility, functionality, and worry free driving.


So sensible.
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TequilaMockingbird
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8:41a, 4/2/22
How much does it cost to charge a vehicle at a charge station when you're traveling?
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'03ag
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In reply to TequilaMockingbird • 8:47a, 4/2/22
Don't have numbers right in front of me, but I looked into it and the added miles/dollar were a lot higher than gas

A lot EVs come with free charging on some networks for the first year or 2 of ownership
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cecil77
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8:49a, 4/2/22
AG
Thursday headed back. 30 miles south of SA on I37. Traffic usually flows 80+. Big slowdown. Cause was a Tesla in the right lane going under 45mph, clearly trying to nurse the battery.

Commuting/city - no problems. Regenerative breaking, doesn't push the range.

Cross country - little regenerative breaking, range goes down, pushes range, much more time spent
"refueling".

Winter: Range decreases significantly in the cold.

Costs - The fuel savings are real, but overstated compared to the lower cost of equivalent IC vehicles.

Performance: Dale gas!!! Will win every stoplight drag race.

Battery manufacturing/disposal/replacement - the elephant in the room. Biggest reason holding back mass movement to EVs.

IF the government stays out of it, over time, the tech will improve to the point that the market will decide and there may well be significant number of EVs on the road. The hugely expensive (both to install and maintain) 3 phase super charging stations will be problematic to deployed in large numbers. But again, given time and demand, the market could move that way.

As is normal, governmental intervention will screw it up.

And I still don't know why the train locomotive paradigm isn't being developed. A small, very efficient IC that is used sole to charge the battery, never for motive on it's own. It would run at one rpm tuned for the highest efficiency, and wouldn't have to be very big. Use a small fuel tank so that there's no worry of stale fuel.


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Boo Weekley
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In reply to aggiehawg • 8:51a, 4/2/22
OP, the earth thanks you for not getting an EV. To manufacture each EV battery, you must process…


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Rattler12
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In reply to GAC06 • 8:53a, 4/2/22
GAC06 said:
Something like a Tesla outperforms most cars on the road as far as speed and acceleration. They are very quiet. More storage space. You would never need to stop at a gas station again. The car charges at home and is ready every day. You save money on gas, especially now when gas is high. There are theoretical advantages as far as upkeep and maintenance since there are far less moving parts, plus less consumables like oil, oil filter, air filter, fluids.
How much to replace the batteries ? $18 to 20 K ?
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Sully Dog
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In reply to nortex97 • 8:56a, 4/2/22
nortex97 said:
GAC06 said:
You are wrong because battery tech has already advanced significantly from the stuff you mentioned. But the good news is no one is forcing you to buy an EV.

You mentioned a ranch so it may not be a great fit for you. For people that live in cities (most people) EV's offer significant advantages over ICE vehicles
The bad news is that is changing, per the law Washington is now passing banning new gas cars after 2030.
Ideas so good we have to force you to do it.
Deplorable Neanderthal Clinger
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aggiehawg
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In reply to agent-maroon • 8:57a, 4/2/22
AG
Quote:
That's a fine opinion, but I think that most people's issue with EV's is that the government is working to take away the personal choice of which vehicle that they can buy to meet their needs and are giving their reasons why.

I personally don't care if you ride a unicycle to work if it meets your needs and saves on fuel. But don't try to take away MY choice on what vehicle I can buy.
This is my main point. It simply is unrealistic for a country our size to have a one-size-fits-all approach.
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Gunny456
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In reply to MapGuy • 9:05a, 4/2/22
AG
My BIL bought a hybrid. Pretty cool at first. Then the engine started running hot. It has been at the dealership for 8 months and $2300 later it still has issues. They told him that being that it is a hybrid he now just needs a new engine at a cost of $10,000.
Their reason to him for the issues is because it is a hybrid and they " don't know about all the bugs in them yet".
He has talked to some other customers with similar issues. I just feel bad for him as he really was hyped on getting the hybrid. Hope they all are not like his experience.
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'03ag
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In reply to cecil77 • 9:06a, 4/2/22
cecil77 said:

...
And I still don't know why the train locomotive paradigm isn't being developed. A small, very efficient IC that is used sole to charge the battery, never for motive on it's own. It would run at one rpm tuned for the highest efficiency, and wouldn't have to be very big. Use a small fuel tank so that there's no worry of stale fuel.


There are/were a few on the market. Chevy Bolt. BMW had that as an option on the i3. I don't really get it either unless customers demonstrated a preference for PHEVs? It allows them to combine the performance of the two and offer more total hp.

On the i3 they called it the Range Extender but it reduced the pure EV range a little because the battery was smaller to make room for the ICE. So it comes at the expense of performance as well.

I'm guessing right now there's just very little overlap between customers who want their wheels driven by electric only, and customers who are concerned with range.
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fixer
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In reply to aggiehawg • 9:08a, 4/2/22
aggiehawg said:
GAC06 said:
The context of this argument is personal vehicles. Are you a trucker?
I am not a trucker. But bet you don't know how many truckers own their own rigs and contract out for runs.


Here is the deal. Rail and 18 wheeler trucks provide EVERYTHING to the US.

Yeah, I live in a rural area. Guess how my grocery store, hardware store, banks get their needed supplies to sell or trade?

The electricity grid is not equipped to handle that load...anywhere
This.

all day.

Toyota's Chief Says Electric Vehicles Are Overhyped - WSJ
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Marcus Brutus
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In reply to Gunny456 • 9:08a, 4/2/22
Gunny456 said:
My BIL bought a hybrid. Pretty cool at first. Then the engine started running hot. It has been at the dealership for 8 months and $2300 later it still has issues. They told him that being that it is a hybrid he now just needs a new engine at a cost of $10,000.
Their reason to him for the issues is because it is a hybrid and they " don't know about all the bugs in them yet".
He has talked to some other customers with similar issues. I just feel bad for him as he really was hyped on getting the hybrid. Hope they all are not like his experience.


What vehicle is it?
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Gunny456
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In reply to Boo Weekley • 9:19a, 4/2/22
AG
Thanks for posting this. It needs to be shown to everyone. However the proponents will make excuses and say this is not true.
I was taught in grade school that there is no such thing as perpetual energy.
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Gunny456
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In reply to Marcus Brutus • 9:20a, 4/2/22
AG
Ford
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Tom_Fox
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9:34a, 4/2/22
I live in Midland. The roads suck. You are surrounded by 18 wheelers and big ass trucks everywhere.

You would have to be suicidal to drive a Tesla as your daily driver here.

Having said that, I am all for liberals driving them everywhere. I imagine, I would barely feel the impact in the passenger seat when my daughter plows into them with her Z71 Tahoe.
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