LOL.hph6203 said:Better is not utopia. I know words are hard for you, but they're not that hard.techno-ag said:It's a common expressed by all of you that things will be better in two or three years.hph6203 said:
Name one poster that says "EV utopia" is a couple of years away.
It's a Five Year Plan.nortex97 said:techno-ag said:It's a common expressed by all of you that things will be better in two or three years.hph6203 said:
Name one poster that says "EV utopia" is a couple of years away.
Communism is bound to work out next time.
I assume because he was mesmerized by the thread title...GAC06 said:
Why?
I know you are being facetious, but the Model Y is right at the average for a new car and with the credit, close to 40K. Adding a charger is around 1K.bobbranco said:
He parks it in his big garage and charges it, probably daily. He's loaded and loves his expensive things.
Quote:
FSD Beta v12 has been one of the most anticipated updates to Tesla's controversial ADAS level 2 system, which it hopes will eventually become level 4 or even 5.
The Tesla v12 software update is introducing what Musk has been calling "end-to-end neural nets". The biggest difference with previous FSD updates is that the vehicle's controls are now being handled by neural nets rather than being coded by programmers.
It is being touted as the difference maker that should bring a lot of improvements. Musk again claimed, like he has with many FSD Beta updates before, it is "mind-blowing".
techno-ag said:
Tesla Full Self Driving Beta v12 is here, introducing neural nets into the mix.
https://electrek.co/2024/03/16/tesla-full-self-driving-beta-v12-finally-rolls-out/Quote:
FSD Beta v12 has been one of the most anticipated updates to Tesla's controversial ADAS level 2 system, which it hopes will eventually become level 4 or even 5.
The Tesla v12 software update is introducing what Musk has been calling "end-to-end neural nets". The biggest difference with previous FSD updates is that the vehicle's controls are now being handled by neural nets rather than being coded by programmers.
It is being touted as the difference maker that should bring a lot of improvements. Musk again claimed, like he has with many FSD Beta updates before, it is "mind-blowing".
Quote:
Hertz Global Holdings Inc. is replacing its chief executive officer in the wake of a disastrous bet on electric vehicles that the company began unwinding in recent months.
…
Under new owners Knighthead Capital Management and Certares Management, the rental company announced plans to order 100,000 vehicles from Tesla Inc., sending the automaker's market capitalization soaring past the $1 trillion mark at the time.
Those bets went awry last year, when Tesla slashed prices across its lineup to keep growing vehicle sales. This hammered the resale value of used Model 3 sedans and Model Y crossovers just after Hertz had added tens of thousands of those vehicles to its fleet.
By December, Hertz started selling off 20,000 electric vehicles, or about a third of its EV fleet. Germany's Sixt SE - a leading car-renter in Europe - is taking even more drastic measures, phasing Teslas out of its fleet entirely.
This is the sort of driving that's really hard to code explicitly, but our end-to-end approach brings in almost effortlessly. https://t.co/gw4vipu9iY
— Ashok Elluswamy (@aelluswamy) February 23, 2024
This clip blew my mind, next level for FSDBeta v12.3 in finding its way out of a bad situation. Nice work @Tesla_AI pic.twitter.com/9cDccpr2uO
— Chuck Cook (@chazman) March 16, 2024
Here’s the video of Tesla FSD V12.2.1 encountering an unexpected road closure at 46mph. pic.twitter.com/uFurzlAyMF
— Miss Jillybean (@MissJilianne) March 4, 2024
Teslag said:
What the **** does EV utopia even mean?
Well...yeah...They need to get to Level 3 first.hph6203 said:
Can't say level 4 is coming soon, but this is the first time since it was initially released where it has been extremely surprising the things it can do (and that version was very bad compared to this). Things that they seemingly did not intentionally train on that emerged from feeding it data, and things that it generally failed at previously. It doesn't do all these things consistently yet, but it seems they're on a path to progressively fine tune as they get more and more driving data from more and more vehicle sales
It was for awhile parking in parking spaces in parking lots, but they have seemingly removed it because it might have been unintentional behavior and someone had a minor fender bender while trying to wait for it to park.
Still a long way to go, but this was a pretty big jump forward.
Ag with kids said:Well...yeah...They need to get to Level 3 first.hph6203 said:
Can't say level 4 is coming soon, but this is the first time since it was initially released where it has been extremely surprising the things it can do (and that version was very bad compared to this). Things that they seemingly did not intentionally train on that emerged from feeding it data, and things that it generally failed at previously. It doesn't do all these things consistently yet, but it seems they're on a path to progressively fine tune as they get more and more driving data from more and more vehicle sales
It was for awhile parking in parking spaces in parking lots, but they have seemingly removed it because it might have been unintentional behavior and someone had a minor fender bender while trying to wait for it to park.
Still a long way to go, but this was a pretty big jump forward.
True...BigRobSA said:Ag with kids said:Well...yeah...They need to get to Level 3 first.hph6203 said:
Can't say level 4 is coming soon, but this is the first time since it was initially released where it has been extremely surprising the things it can do (and that version was very bad compared to this). Things that they seemingly did not intentionally train on that emerged from feeding it data, and things that it generally failed at previously. It doesn't do all these things consistently yet, but it seems they're on a path to progressively fine tune as they get more and more driving data from more and more vehicle sales
It was for awhile parking in parking spaces in parking lots, but they have seemingly removed it because it might have been unintentional behavior and someone had a minor fender bender while trying to wait for it to park.
Still a long way to go, but this was a pretty big jump forward.
"Look at me! I know how to math!!!1"
Nobody likes a braggart!
V12.4 is another big jump in capabilities.
— Elon Musk (@elonmusk) March 17, 2024
Our constraint in training compute is much improved.
Yeah...it is...hph6203 said:
Nah. Not how it works.
BIDENOMICS: Folks in CA are paying $1-2K a month for electric. Everything is fine according to NPR. https://t.co/OManIQfdnL
— @amuse (@amuse) March 17, 2024
Honestly, there's no difference in you asserting that than there is an EV fan asserting that you are harming the environment by not owning one.RanchoBrushyTop said:
EVs will eventually prove to be one of the worst environmental catastrophes ever. Why anyone defends them, let alone owns one, baffles me.
cecil77 said:Honestly, there's not difference in you asserting that than there is an EV fan asserting that you are harming the environment by not owning one.RanchoBrushyTop said:
EVs will eventually prove to be one of the worst environmental catastrophes ever. Why anyone defends them, let alone owns one, baffles me.
Buy one, don't buy one. Just leave me out of it.
i'm about to own one. Will still have my wife's Yukon and son's Sierra, and probably buying my daughter a jeep or bronco next year when she turns 16. It may not unbaffle you, but me selling my F150 and getting a Rivian is for fun.RanchoBrushyTop said:
EVs will eventually prove to be one of the worst environmental catastrophes ever. Why anyone defends them, let alone owns one, baffles me.
I never said the levels were gated.hph6203 said:
They are not gated levels. They do not have to deploy a level 3 system prior to deploying a level 4 system. They can develop their autonomous software as a level 2 system and improve it until the rate of human intervention exceeds a threshold of competency to be deployable as a level 4 system. Whether they decide to implement it as a level 3 system is dependent upon their risk tolerance/time it takes to get to level 4 capability and whether they even approach it.
They currently have the capability of demonstrating reliability of their system at a rate of ~1 million miles per day. In 3 years they'll have >6 million vehicles on the road in the U.S. if they felt they had a system ready for level 4 deployment they could provide a free trial to their fleet of vehicles and generate up to 43 billion miles (or more) over a 6 month period. If they achieve the reliability necessary to deploy as a level 4 system they will have the most thoroughly tested and proven autonomous driving system in the world.
So I looked at my @PGE4Me bill to try to figure out why it is so high this month. $1,650.75.
— Thomas Hawk (@thomashawk) March 17, 2024
Apparently I'm paying $411.07 for something called Ava Community Electric Generation Charges. $397.94 for gas charges -- and then some whopping $841.74 for PG&E Electric "delivery"… https://t.co/y8ExB3JGNu
hph6203 said:
Forgive me, when I said it's unclear when they'll get to level 4 autonomy and you said "they need to get to level 3 first", I thought you were saying "they need to get to level 3 first." When you said "they need to get to level 3 first" what you actually said was "I would get to level 3 first."
hph6203 said:
Forgive me, when I said it's unclear when they'll get to level 4 autonomy and you said "they need to get to level 3 first", I thought you were saying "they need to get to level 3 first." When you said "they need to get to level 3 first" what you actually said was "I would get to level 3 first."
Hint: You can reach levels without releasing a software build...hph6203 said:
Forgive me, when I said it's unclear when they'll get to level 4 autonomy and you said "they need to get to level 3 first", I thought you were saying "they need to get to level 3 first." When you said "they need to get to level 3 first" what you actually said was "I would get to level 3 first."
You do realize the the difference between Level 3 and Level 4 is whether you need a person in the driver's seat or not, right?hph6203 said:
You can't really say that's not how Tesla has developed their system, they have never deployed a system beyond level 2, which is minimally defined as a vehicle with lane keeping and adaptive cruise control.
With respect to the other systems, their go to market systems were level 3 systems, but they had no other choice because they had to demonstrate competence to the consumer as well as needed to generate some offset to their development costs. Tesla is a profitable company with a level 2 system and are capable of generating millions in revenue with a level 2 system, because the vehicles are owned by the operators.
I'm not saying they definitively won't deploy a level 3 system, I'm saying it is not necessary for them to do so because they can demonstrate a system reliable enough to be deployed as a level 4 system while it operates as a level 2 system. I also don't really see the purpose of a level 3 system for their business, because most of the utility can be derived by deploying an extremely competent level 2 system.
If they ever get to a level 4 system with current hardware it will be the most thoroughly proven autonomous system in history. It will be interesting to see how rapidly this current method improves, because it surpassed the old method in under 12 months of development while the other method took, I believe, 6 years.
Well, they're not Level 3...so...hph6203 said:
Can is not need. You're trying to shift the argument now. Words have meanings.
