cecil77 said:

---

Quote:

---

They all have a place in a free market world and I don't see any of the power trains going away in my lifetime.

---

That would be a wonderful place to kill this thread.

---

First time on the internet?

Downhill slide continues.

Quote:

---

Why is Tesla stock dropping?

Tesla shares are down over 32% in 2024 after a more than 11% decline over the past month. After a 4.5% decline in Wednesday's session, Tesla shares have declined a further 1.4% premarket on Thursday.

---

https://m.investing.com/news/stock-market-news/why-does-tesla-stock-keep-dropping-3337832

techno-ag said:

---

While a universal shifting scheme is unrealistic, manufacturers could at least create transmission functions that are less confusing and don't lead to accidents.

---

Is there really a problem with shifting accidents? Looks like you're creating a solution for a problem that doesn't exist.

Teslag said:

---

techno-ag said:

---

While a universal shifting scheme is unrealistic, manufacturers could at least create transmission functions that are less confusing and don't lead to accidents.

---

Is there really a problem with shifting accidents? Looks like you're creating a solution for a problem that doesn't exist.

---

Read up thread. Looks like Tesla's led to at least one, and Nissan's causes a few issues as well.

There was nothing other than an anecdote that her husband thinks she got confused by the shifter. A possible one off incident is not a problem. It's an anomaly.

Can I suggest you move to Europe if you're looking for a landing spot that will regulate you into an ever-increasing sense of safety and an ever-decreasing amount of freedom?

I learned to drive on a standard transmission and a little over twenty years ago, I drove a standard transmission in England for thirty days (so I was shifting with my left hand (as wheel was on the Right). I drive a Honda Odyssey Van with Push Button Transmission.

Last week I began looking at mid size and three-Row SUVs at several dealers and was surprised at the number of ways there are to shift. I can see people making mistakes with a new car that has a different transmission. Now throw in an aging population and people with the onset of dementia driving a new vehicle.....

WolfCall said:

---

I learned to drive on a standard transmission and a little over twenty years ago, I drove a standard transmission in England for thirty days (so I was shifting with my left hand (as wheel was on the Right). I drive a Honda Odyssey Van with Push Button Transmission.

Last week I began looking at mid size and three-Row SUVs at several dealers and was surprised at the number of ways there are to shift. I can see people making mistakes with a new car that has a different transmission. Now throw in an aging population and people with the onset of dementia driving a new vehicle.....

---

Well according to the EVangelists on this thread, you're a fascist for thinking these thoughts.

Of course different shift schemes can be confusing. But these rarified gents look down their noses at the hoi polloi for thinking so, just because their favorite model has an odd shift system. So they must defend it at all costs.

Under the shell is where this truck is going to show all of the advances Tesla has made. Hoping they tear down the refreshed Model 3 too to see if they have an onboard bi-directional inverter like the Cybertruck that they just haven't permitted access to yet.

People with dementia shouldn't be driving at all, much less worrying about the shifter

Teslag said:

---

People with dementia shouldn't be driving at all, much less worrying about the shifter

---

They shouldn't be running the country either, yet here we are...

techno-ag said:

---

WolfCall said:

---

I learned to drive on a standard transmission and a little over twenty years ago, I drove a standard transmission in England for thirty days (so I was shifting with my left hand (as wheel was on the Right). I drive a Honda Odyssey Van with Push Button Transmission.

Last week I began looking at mid size and three-Row SUVs at several dealers and was surprised at the number of ways there are to shift. I can see people making mistakes with a new car that has a different transmission. Now throw in an aging population and people with the onset of dementia driving a new vehicle.....

---

Well according to the EVangelists on this thread, you're a fascist for thinking these thoughts.

Of course different shift schemes can be confusing. But these rarified gents look down their noses at the hoi polloi for thinking so, just because their favorite model has an odd shift system. So they must defend it at all costs.

---

I would say you are attacking an EV shift system that is no more unusual than those found on many cars just because it is an EV. You just hate that the facts don't line up with your world view.

Kansas Kid said:

---

akm91 said:

---

There are going to those that don't charge their vehicles before evacuation; it's just human nature. Just like there are those that wont' top their tank before evacuation.

Trying to buy gas during evacuation was insane despite the abundant infrastructure along the interstates. I can't imagine what it would be like for EV's looking to charge during evacuation.

---

It take a lot more effort to fully fill a gasoline tank before an evacuation because there are frequently lines as others are trying to do the same. For an EV, assuming you can charge at home, it just requires adjusting a simple app setting assuming you normally only charge to 80%. Will some not fully charge, probably, but it will be a small minority and not a majority.

I would assume most people evacuate less than 200-250 miles which under evacuation driving conditions (ie rarely over 40-50 mph and a lot of stop and go traffic), most should make it without charging because unlike an ICE that loses range in stop and go traffic, an EV gains it due to slower driving conditions and regenerative breaking (and virtually no battery usage when stopped). I agree if someone needs to charge because they are going further, it will create delays at the charging stations due to the time to charge but they will be out of harms way.

---

Too logical and factual for this thread.

techno-ag said:

---

Tesla touch screen linked to Angela Chao's death.

Quote:

---

Angela Chao - billionaire sister of former Secretary of Transportation Elaine Chao and sister-in-law of Mitch McConnell - died last month when her Tesla Model X sank in a manmade pond on her 900-acre Texas ranch. She was trapped in the car as it flooded, unable to open the unpowered doors, as friends and rescue crews tried to find a way to break in. Now, a report from the Wall Street Journal claims the Tesla's touchscreen-based shifting interface may have contributed to her getting in the water to begin with.

---

https://jalopnik.com/a-tesla-touchscreen-mix-up-killed-angela-chao-report-1851327161

---

Interesting. My Y has a gear shift similar to many ICE cars. Did not know the X is different.

It's on the touch screen. You swipe up to put it in drive, down to reverse. If it confuses you then there's not much to help someone.

Teslag said:

---

It's on the touch screen. You swipe up to put it in drive, down to reverse. If it confuses you then there's not much to help someone.

---

Actually there is an alternative. There are buttons on the center console of the touch screen is a problem.

Fisker Stock: EV Startup Plummets On Report Tesla Rival Mulling Bankruptcy | Investor's Business Daily (investors.com)

Quote:

---

Fisker (FSR) plunged 50% early Thursday, on a report that the U.S. EV startup and would-be Tesla rival is preparing for a possible bankruptcy filing.

Fisker has hired restructuring advisors to aid in a possible bankruptcy filing, The Wall Street Journal reported Wednesday night, citing sources.

The EV startup last month said it could run out of cash this year, issuing a "going concern" warning. In late February, Fisker delayed full 2023 financial results, saying it lacked sufficient accountants.

Fisker has struggled with stalling EV demand and ongoing production hurdles facing many EV startups. In June, Fisker finally began U.S. deliveries of its first EV, the Ocean SUV.

Fisker stock dived 50% to 16 cents on Wednesday. Shares rose 1 cent to 32 cents on Wednesday, but had crashed 82% in 2024 heading into Thursday.

---

Lucid cannot be far behind. Rivian is on a watch list too.

Just one more data point that people that want an EV at this time pretty much buy a Tesla.

They have innovative products but don't know how to manufacture at scale. They seem prime to get gobbled up by a Detroit auto company. GM specifically seems to be struggling.

Dill-Ag13 said:

---

Fisker Stock: EV Startup Plummets On Report Tesla Rival Mulling Bankruptcy | Investor's Business Daily (investors.com)

Quote:

---

Fisker (FSR) plunged 50% early Thursday, on a report that the U.S. EV startup and would-be Tesla rival is preparing for a possible bankruptcy filing.

Fisker has hired restructuring advisors to aid in a possible bankruptcy filing, The Wall Street Journal reported Wednesday night, citing sources.

The EV startup last month said it could run out of cash this year, issuing a "going concern" warning. In late February, Fisker delayed full 2023 financial results, saying it lacked sufficient accountants.

Fisker has struggled with stalling EV demand and ongoing production hurdles facing many EV startups. In June, Fisker finally began U.S. deliveries of its first EV, the Ocean SUV.

Fisker stock dived 50% to 16 cents on Wednesday. Shares rose 1 cent to 32 cents on Wednesday, but had crashed 82% in 2024 heading into Thursday.

---

Lucid cannot be far behind. Rivian is on a watch list too.

---

https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2024/03/14/investing/tesla-growth-stock-elon-musk/index.html

Headline: Tesla is the worst performing stock in the S&P 500. Analysts say it has further to fall

Hasn't broken the 52 week low, 152.37, yet. Support after that is around 113.

James May's point about the lack of charger infrastructure is a valid one, even in the UK:

Quote:

---

James May likes a broad spectrum of cars, from modern-day supercars to classics, cult icons, cheap hatchbacks, and electric vehicles. Indeed, he has owned six EVs over the years but during a recent interview, admitted that he is still not convinced by them.

The Grand Tour host most recently took delivery of the updated TeslaModel 3, having previously owned a Model S and two Toyota Mirai hydrogen models. While there are some things that he loves about EVs, including the silent running, he believes they continue to be held back by charging.

While there are many more chargers dotted around the UK than there used to be, May thinks there needs to be many more of them. That doesn't mean hundreds of thousands but millions. With this in mind, he says that automakers are fitting EVs with increasingly large battery packs as an acknowledgment that there aren't enough chargers. Were an automaker to release an EV with 150 miles (242 km) of range that can be recharged in 1 minute through an expansive charging network, he would love to own one.

May later reiterates the point that it is current battery technology and chargers that are holding back EVs. He believes that powering a car with an electric motor is the best way given how much simpler it is than a complex internal combustion engine.

The presenter made his comments during a fascinating podcast with The Intercooler presented by automotive journalists Dan Prosser and Andrew Frankel which is worth watching in its entirety.

At one stage in the podcast, they wonder if there will ever be a collectible electric vehicle, noting how mechanically similar they are to one another and comparing them to boring digital watches. In addition to speaking about EVs, the trio discusses May's early career as a journalist as well as his stint on Top Gear and The Grand Tour.

---

Not gonna happen anytime soon, James.

nortex97 said:

---

James May's point about the lack of charger infrastructure is a valid one, even in the UK:

Quote:

---

James May likes a broad spectrum of cars, from modern-day supercars to classics, cult icons, cheap hatchbacks, and electric vehicles. Indeed, he has owned six EVs over the years but during a recent interview, admitted that he is still not convinced by them.

The Grand Tour host most recently took delivery of the updated TeslaModel 3, having previously owned a Model S and two Toyota Mirai hydrogen models. While there are some things that he loves about EVs, including the silent running, he believes they continue to be held back by charging.

While there are many more chargers dotted around the UK than there used to be, May thinks there needs to be many more of them. That doesn't mean hundreds of thousands but millions. With this in mind, he says that automakers are fitting EVs with increasingly large battery packs as an acknowledgment that there aren't enough chargers. Were an automaker to release an EV with 150 miles (242 km) of range that can be recharged in 1 minute through an expansive charging network, he would love to own one.

May later reiterates the point that it is current battery technology and chargers that are holding back EVs. He believes that powering a car with an electric motor is the best way given how much simpler it is than a complex internal combustion engine.

The presenter made his comments during a fascinating podcast with The Intercooler presented by automotive journalists Dan Prosser and Andrew Frankel which is worth watching in its entirety.

At one stage in the podcast, they wonder if there will ever be a collectible electric vehicle, noting how mechanically similar they are to one another and comparing them to boring digital watches. In addition to speaking about EVs, the trio discusses May's early career as a journalist as well as his stint on Top Gear and The Grand Tour.

---

Not gonna happen anytime soon, James.

---

Yup. Simple physics holds us back. You can only pack so much juice so fast into a certain mass. They keep experimenting with different materials but keep bumping into the same limitations. All the breakthroughs in battery life lately have come through better power management more so than more efficient materials.

(The EVangelists will deny or downplay this and insist utopia is just a few years away. )

You will not need anywhere close to what you have now for gas stations.

When I had my BMW, I would pour gas 5 times a month or 60 times a year. With my Tesla, I have charged 6 times ins 3 years. Most people who buys EVs are like me and rarely need supercharging.

Quote:

---

Most people who buys EVs are like me and rarely need supercharging.

---

IF that is true, it means they all have ICE cars for longer trips, and the EV is for local/commuting.

Which brings us right back where it always does. If I'm never forced to use one or rely on one, I don't give a crap what you drive.

He parks it in his big garage and charges it, probably daily. He's loaded and loves his expensive things.

Medaggie said:

---

You will not need anywhere close to what you have now for gas stations.

When I had my BMW, I would pour gas 5 times a month or 60 times a year. With my Tesla, I have charged 6 times ins 3 years. Most people who buys EVs NOW are like me and rarely need supercharging.

---

fify

Name one poster that says "EV utopia" is a couple of years away.

I just can't get past "pouring gas"...

I accept it's used some places, it's just looks/sounds so weird to me.

hph6203 said:

---

Name one poster that says "EV utopia" is a couple of years away.

---

It's a common expressed by all of you that things will be better in two or three years.

Medaggie said:

---

You will not need anywhere close to what you have now for gas stations.

When I had my BMW, I would pour gas 5 times a month or 60 times a year. With my Tesla, I have charged 6 times ins 3 years. Most people who buys EVs are like me and rarely need supercharging.

---

Don't you mean "streamed electricity?"

techno-ag said:

---

hph6203 said:

---

Name one poster that says "EV utopia" is a couple of years away.

---

It's a common expressed by all of you that things will be better in two or three years.

---

Communism is bound to work out next time.

I will never buy an EV

Why?

techno-ag said:

---

hph6203 said:

---

Name one poster that says "EV utopia" is a couple of years away.

---

It's a common expressed by all of you that things will be better in two or three years.

---

Better is not utopia. I know words are hard for you, but they're not that hard.