***Russian - Ukraine War Tactical and Strategic Updates*** [Warning on OP]

7,971,502 Views | 48543 Replies | Last: 4 hrs ago by 74OA
aggiehawg
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Quote:

I agree that everyone should be skeptical of tweets and unconfirmed reports, but... I do remember that the guy who said Russia would be done by Sunday walked that statement back pretty quickly to clarify that he did not mean Russia would be in full retreat by Sunday. I cannot remember exactly what he did say, but he did clarify it and he clarified pretty quickly (not after Sunday came and went).
Can't find it right now but I seem to recall that he limited it to the original resources allocated for this invasion.

And indeed, deploying civilian vehicles and not military vehicles at this point corroborates that take.

But that also raises the question of the Belarusian military vehicles? Were those denied to Putin? Or have they already been deployed to some extent?
Tex117
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RebelE Infantry said:

Teddy Perkins said:




Madness. Utter madness
Yeah...I think this is getting way WAY too close to the fire.

Today's winner for the General Board Burrito Lottery is:

Tex117
mickeyrig06sq3
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ATX_AG_08 said:


The frontloader and car being the rear escort is a nice cap to that one.
GarryowenAg
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Outside Sumy

DallasAg 94
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Teddy Perkins
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GAC06
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DallasAg 94 said:

TChaney said:



There is no excuse to target civilians the way Russia is doing.
Here is the problem with that statement... and it goes beyond this conflict.

If civilians are arming themselves and fighting... they are combatants. If you are making molotov cocktails, you are actively participating.

If you can't distinguish between soldiers and civilians, there are no civilians.


Some civilians are participating so just shoot up a car on a whim.
mickeyrig06sq3
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DallasAg 94 said:

TChaney said:



There is no excuse to target civilians the way Russia is doing.
Here is the problem with that statement... and it goes beyond this conflict.

If civilians are arming themselves and fighting... they are combatants. If you are making molotov cocktails, you are actively participating.

If you can't distinguish between soldiers and civilians, there are no civilians.
There's a line between collateral damage and targeting civilians. Russia has pole vaulted over that line, buck-naked, with a jet pack, and doing a helicopter.
Teddy Perkins
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So damn sad.
aggiehawg
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mickeyrig06sq3 said:

DallasAg 94 said:

TChaney said:



There is no excuse to target civilians the way Russia is doing.
Here is the problem with that statement... and it goes beyond this conflict.

If civilians are arming themselves and fighting... they are combatants. If you are making molotov cocktails, you are actively participating.

If you can't distinguish between soldiers and civilians, there are no civilians.
There's a line between collateral damage and targeting civilians. Russia has pole vaulted over that line, buck-naked, with a jet pack, and doing a helicopter.
They are shelling and dropping dumb bombs on apartment buildings. That is targeting civilians.
12th Man Stan Account
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DallasAg 94 said:

LMCane said:



it is all going to come down to which side can bring in reinforcements,

I disagree. The price for Putin will be Zelenskyy. He dies and Putin wins. There will be a power struggle and Putin will put in his proxy leader.

Putin withdraws... and Ukraine becomes Belarus. The people may hate the leader but they have no choice. Russia ceases all industries and inserts its leaders.

That's how Communism works.
Not gonna happen. Any puppet regime Putin installs won't last a month. 2014 was the tipping point, now the Ukrainian people won't settle for anything less than full self-determination.
Agsuffering@bulaw
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Facts on the ground changed.

Zelensky made an offer the Russians might accept bc the Russians moved from unconditional surrender to something less unreasonable.

Sweden is no longer terrified of the Russian army.

The UN are a bunch of jive posturing masqueraders.
74OA
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Russia brings its armored trains to the fight in Ukraine. RELICS
TXAggie2011
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DallasAg 94 said:

LMCane said:

it is all going to come down to which side can bring in reinforcements,
I disagree. The price for Putin will be Zelenskyy. He dies and Putin wins. There will be a power struggle and Putin will put in his proxy leader.

Putin withdraws... and Ukraine becomes Belarus. The people may hate the leader but they have no choice. Russia ceases all industries and inserts its leaders.

That's how Communism works.
Lukashenko came to power in wildly different circumstances than what is going on in Ukraine.

And if you may recall, when living standards fell and unemployment rose in places such as Belarus and Ukraine, Moscow lost all control and its empire crumbled.
aggiehawg
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Another General bites the dust. But even more importantly the Russian communications are bad and deteriorating. Not secure.
4the_Record
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Attacking Civilians like that is wrong and a war crime, no matter what.
There is no possible justification which should even be considered.

Those soldiers have armor and training and the responsibility to ensure any target they engage is a hostile combatant. If they don't like those rules, then they need to surrender or turn around and go home.

Yes, the Russians soldiers are in a poor position but still not so poor as Ukraine's citizens.

aezmvp
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aggiehawg said:



Another General bites the dust. But even more importantly the Russian communications are bad and deteriorating. Not secure.
The FSB doesn't have secure comms? Holy *****
JFABNRGR
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74OA said:

Russia brings its armored trains to the fight in Ukraine. RELICS
that thing looks like something more suited to carrying tactical nukes.

Not hard to make a train derail either. UKR should also direct any further attacks on trains while they are also over a bridge. Way harder to repair than a few ties and rail.
JFABNRGR
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4the_Record said:

Attacking Civilians like that is wrong and a war crime, no matter what.
There is no possible justification which should even be considered.

Those soldiers have armor and training and the responsibility to ensure any target they engage is a hostile combatant. If they don't like those rules, then they need to surrender or turn around and go home.

Yes, the Russians soldiers are in a poor position but still not so poor as Ukraine's citizens.


which should compel the world to do more now to help UKR. The futile attempt at prosecuting war crimes, even if successful won't bring back the dead.
ATX_AG_08
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aggiehawg said:



Another General bites the dust. But even more importantly the Russian communications are bad and deteriorating. Not secure.


This is the supposed recording of that call informing abt the dead general.

Asks "How bad is it?" (talking abt the general)
Answer: "as bad as it gets"


TXAggie2011
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DallasAg 94 said:

TChaney said:

There is no excuse to target civilians the way Russia is doing.
Here is the problem with that statement... and it goes beyond this conflict.

If civilians are arming themselves and fighting... they are combatants. If you are making molotov cocktails, you are actively participating.

If you can't distinguish between soldiers and civilians, there are no civilians.
Technically speaking under the law of war, you have to be "directly" participating to be a legitimate target and producing weapons is not direct participation. We don't want anymore total wars.

And even if you don't want to agree with that line, you would need some strong, clear intelligence to support dropping bombs on hospitals, on apartment blocks, shooting up a car, and many of the atrocities the Russians are commiting.

Can it be hard to distinguish? Yep. But, you're going to lose the benefit of the doubt when you conduct an unjustified invasion of a sovereign nation. Tough luck.
No Spin Ag
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aggiehawg said:

mickeyrig06sq3 said:

DallasAg 94 said:

TChaney said:



There is no excuse to target civilians the way Russia is doing.
Here is the problem with that statement... and it goes beyond this conflict.

If civilians are arming themselves and fighting... they are combatants. If you are making molotov cocktails, you are actively participating.

If you can't distinguish between soldiers and civilians, there are no civilians.
There's a line between collateral damage and targeting civilians. Russia has pole vaulted over that line, buck-naked, with a jet pack, and doing a helicopter.
They are shelling and dropping dumb bombs on apartment buildings. That is targeting civilians.


That they're knowingly doing it just says so much about Putin's military. It's just monstrous.
There are in fact two things, science and opinion; the former begets knowledge, the later ignorance. Hippocrates
aggiehawg
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Oof.

ETA:


This is a new system. Double oof!
74OA
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JFABNRGR said:

74OA said:

Russia brings its armored trains to the fight in Ukraine. RELICS
that thing looks like something more suited to carrying tactical nukes.

Not hard to make a train derail either. UKR should also direct any further attacks on trains while they are also over a bridge. Way harder to repair than a few ties and rail.
Hasn't been associated with nukes. Used before vs Chechens.

Javelin top attack would do a number on the armored cars.

Russia is flailing around and trying anything to make their logistics more survivable.
VaultingChemist
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Supplies are getting through to the front lines.
ATX_AG_08
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ATX_AG_08
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ABATTBQ11
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DallasAg 94 said:

TChaney said:



There is no excuse to target civilians the way Russia is doing.
Here is the problem with that statement... and it goes beyond this conflict.

If civilians are arming themselves and fighting... they are combatants. If you are making molotov cocktails, you are actively participating.

If you can't distinguish between soldiers and civilians, there are no civilians.


Shoot civilians, civilians arm themselves, justify yourself shooting civilians because they're armed.

Seems reasonable.
McInnis 03
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Just watched Zelensky speech to the UK House of Commons. Wow. He's exactly the man Ukraine needs. Wow.
Irish 2.0
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Mark Fairchild
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I believe this to be a mistake.
Gig'em, Ole Army Class of '70
BusterAg
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Possible that the general was captured? That would be worse for the RU army than KIA, right?
TRM
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aggiehawg
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Teddy Perkins said:


Can someone explain how that gets accomplished. Talk to me like I'm five.

TIA.
Big Al 1992
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TRM said:

NE of Kyiv.



How fast do Russian tanks move? My guess they are spaced out so far apart and moving fast to not be the next Russian convoy memorialized on Twitter after an ambush or missile attack. Do they not have support in front or behind?
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