aggiehawg said:

---

nortex97 said:

---

zephyr88 said:

---

Secolobo said:

---

Video shows new angle of Ashli Babbitt shooting inside Capitol

---

So, the ARMED POLICE who were standing within 10' of the dudes smashing the windows were right there all along?

---

Yes, on both sides. The plain-clothed black officer on the left side of the door, with cufflinks (again matching the guy identified as I have linked by Sperry), is the shooter though (with a glock, same type he lost in 2019). Oh, and the BLM/Antifa guys were there too.

I think it looks like a glock 22, but I'm not a glock aficionado/expert.

---

Neither am I but I seem to recall reading that model glock doesn't have a safety? Can anyone confirm that?

---

Most if not all glocks don't have external safetys. The safety is built into the trigger and is activated when you pull it.

zephyr88 said:

---

Secolobo said:

---

Video shows new angle of Ashli Babbitt shooting inside Capitol

---

So, the ARMED POLICE who were standing within 10' of the dudes smashing the windows were right there all along?

---

Correct. Multiple armed police, right there with all of them. Doing nothing other than basically overseeing the whole thing. Once she was shot, and lying on the ground, the armed officer gave the thumbs up and confiming nod to the law enformcement on the other side of the doors as if to so, "Ok, good job. All good."

The whole thing stinks to high heaven. I thourghly believe the capital 'riot' was an orchestrated event that - aside from from Babbitt's shooting - was anticipated or least allowed to proceed to create the narrative the Dems are now pushing.

Thanks.

titan said:

---

Here's an illustration that came to mind. Form a rectangle long side east-west in your mind. Or take your phone and turn it sideways. The phone is the House chamber. The main entrance is in the center and top of your phone. Huge crowd pounding on the [North] door there, though not many can fit the entrance vestibule at a time. That crowd of officers with guns drawn is facing the main entrance.

The Speaker's Lobby hall runs along the bottom side of the rectangle; the commotion with Ashli Babbit is at the lower right corner of your phone or the SE corner of the rectangle. The culprit is shooting her from the left, the row off offices and doorways running along the south side of the Lobby hall. Babbit's crowd got there by going left from the main entrance crowd, around a corner (now going south) around another corner (now going west) to confront that east glass panned door right after rounding the corner. There is a staircase there that CP were coming up right amongs the protestors, on the protestor side of the door pane.

Both of these events are happening in the 2:39-2:44 range and mean rather precisely.

That's the knot.

---

Great description!

President Trump's biggest mistake was not processing with, or leading the demonstration as he mentioned he might. He would have also been able to immediately make clear when to tamp back. Or even something as simple as when they arrive "Wait, who are these idiots already here from the busses? They are not mine."

It would all have been exposed and dialed down faster if he had been more at the forefront.

Once they knew that election changing fraud would never be investigated anywhere close to "Russia Collusion", most of the GOP moved on. They don't care if there is evidence the election was stolen, they only care if it will be proven in court.

Just like they don't care if Capitol cops were waving protestors in by following Schumer orders or if they were just not at all concerned or threatened. The ONLY way anyone will ever hear about a cop waving protestors in the building is if that cop has pro Trump social media posts or some way to link them to protestors.

Cassius said:

---

She was unarmed and killed because she was trespassing. I'd say there was no justifiable use of deadly force by the officer. But he's the right color and party; she was the wrong color and party. Case closed.

---

IMO, he may very well have had reasonable shoot to kill orders for anyone that breaches that specific point.

That being said, just a few feet away, cops are chillaxing and hamming it up with protesters and there just wasn't enough warning to give people reason to believe that, in a matter of just a few feet, things escalate from "hey let's take a selfie with the cops, this is kind of cool" to "you will without a doubt be shot and killed if you cross this certain point". From literally opening the doors and letting these people in and asking them to just behave, to not having a proper barricade before the shoot-to-kill zone...this was very poorly handled and I can see why some people think it may have been by design.

At the very least, there should have been several cops armed in front of that door warning people loud and clear that they will die if they cross that door/window/whatever.

Also, did they even have radio coms? That seems like a basic necessity. If so, and an order was given to shoot anyone who breaches floor, then those cops at external doors would have known. So presumably the relaxed nature and waving in happened BEFORE the order was given, or they didn't have coms, or something more shady was going on. )

And again, if you watch, there is no reason to believe he wasn't just as likely to miss and nail one of the Capitol Police standing so casually with backs to the pane trying to talk, or the ones ascending the staircase and emerging in the line of fire.

Whether Pelosi's or Schumer's security guard, the other element is she had evacuated several minutes before, and Schumer is up north with Pence, Romney, etc. So you wonder a bit what was in play. At the far end of the Hall may be sufficient reason -- beyond the west panel door (the twin of the East one) members of the House and Press are then descending the staircase and evacuating -- just beyond that. So that's probably his motive and may be sufficient.

Pity no warning though (except from Sullivan ironically)

Best to just flag the troll and let Brandon deal with it, or not.

Secolobo said:

---

thirdcoast said:

---

It's also not helpful for the narrative for white conservatives to not be outraged by a black cop killing a white girl. It forces both sides to discuss the circumstances of the encounter and value those facts over skin color of cop or victim. That process is incredibly destructive as it would have likely led to George Floyd type cases never making it past the local news. If that happens, dems lose one of their most effective voter turnout schemes.

It sucks that she thought it wasn't dangerous to breach the floor of Congress. But now everyone from BLM to Handsmaid tale to Taliban know what is off limits. They should suffer same fate, and if not, then we should all be outraged.

---

But security opened the gates and the damn doors.

---

But not that window.

Secolobo said:

---

thirdcoast said:

---

It's also not helpful for the narrative for white conservatives to not be outraged by a black cop killing a white girl. It forces both sides to discuss the circumstances of the encounter and value those facts over skin color of cop or victim. That process is incredibly destructive as it would have likely led to George Floyd type cases never making it past the local news. If that happens, dems lose one of their most effective voter turnout schemes.

It sucks that she thought it wasn't dangerous to breach the floor of Congress. But now everyone from BLM to Handsmaid tale to Taliban know what is off limits. They should suffer same fate, and if not, then we should all be outraged.

---

But security opened the gates and the damn doors.

---

Do you have the right to enter any area you want once let into a building, considering the doors were barricaded and she was crawling thru a broken window?

So if someone broke into a Library the death penalty is deserved?. What a country!

Cassius said:

---

GeorgiAg said:

---

So that's why Trump brought this up - to stoke racial tensions. What a jackass.

---

So you are accusing Trump of knowing who shot her when he brought it up and asked who shot her?

Where is your evidence of that?

---

You are talking to a Biden supporter they aren't very smart.

TheEternalPessimist said:

---

Some Junkie Cosmonaut said:

---

WHOOP!'91 said:

---

YellowPot_97 said:

---

Secolobo said:

---

thirdcoast said:

---

It's also not helpful for the narrative for white conservatives to not be outraged by a black cop killing a white girl. It forces both sides to discuss the circumstances of the encounter and value those facts over skin color of cop or victim. That process is incredibly destructive as it would have likely led to George Floyd type cases never making it past the local news. If that happens, dems lose one of their most effective voter turnout schemes.

It sucks that she thought it wasn't dangerous to breach the floor of Congress. But now everyone from BLM to Handsmaid tale to Taliban know what is off limits. They should suffer same fate, and if not, then we should all be outraged.

---

But security opened the gates and the damn doors.

---

She was climbing through a broken window of a barricaded door in the US Capital building.
How anyone is defending her is beyond me.

---

Nobody is "defending her", people are wondering if what she did warrants being killed.

---

Exactly. It's so curious what warrants a discussion based upon one's political ideology.

Just discussing this event always quickly becomes "wHy ArE yOu DeFeNdInG hER?!?"

---

F that. I will defend her. She was unarmed. Should not have been shot.

Byrd and the CP police shot her because the cathedral of government power is so sacred to them that the vermin (aka Patriots) should not be allowed to protest there the same way the anti-Kavanaugh crowd did.

---

I want you to remember those words on the off chance some unarmed crackhead kicks in a window to try to get in your home.

Gigem314 said:

---

Ellis Wyatt said:

---

BoydCrowder13 said:

---

Is this the new Benghazi?

---

Oh, look. Totally NOT a Concerned Moderate using a Concerned Moderate talking point.

---

They don't even try to hide it.

---

His dumb family are Biden supporters you are shocked by his post?

Tanya 93 said:

---

Secolobo said:

---

thirdcoast said:

---

It's also not helpful for the narrative for white conservatives to not be outraged by a black cop killing a white girl. It forces both sides to discuss the circumstances of the encounter and value those facts over skin color of cop or victim. That process is incredibly destructive as it would have likely led to George Floyd type cases never making it past the local news. If that happens, dems lose one of their most effective voter turnout schemes.

It sucks that she thought it wasn't dangerous to breach the floor of Congress. But now everyone from BLM to Handsmaid tale to Taliban know what is off limits. They should suffer same fate, and if not, then we should all be outraged.

---

But security opened the gates and the damn doors.

---

Do you have the right to enter any area you want once let into a building, considering the doors were barricaded and she was crawling thru a broken window?

---

Does entering a restricted area = death penalty? asking for a friend.

Tanya 93 said:

---

Secolobo said:

---

thirdcoast said:

---

It's also not helpful for the narrative for white conservatives to not be outraged by a black cop killing a white girl. It forces both sides to discuss the circumstances of the encounter and value those facts over skin color of cop or victim. That process is incredibly destructive as it would have likely led to George Floyd type cases never making it past the local news. If that happens, dems lose one of their most effective voter turnout schemes.

It sucks that she thought it wasn't dangerous to breach the floor of Congress. But now everyone from BLM to Handsmaid tale to Taliban know what is off limits. They should suffer same fate, and if not, then we should all be outraged.

---

But security opened the gates and the damn doors.

---

Do you have the right to enter any area you want once let into a building, considering the doors were barricaded and she was crawling thru a broken window?

---

What primary grade are you about to start in a month or so? The proper role of law enforcement is to arrest trespassers, not to kill them. Especially an unarmed woman with a veritable army around you of law enforcement.

Anonymous Source said:

---

TheEternalPessimist said:

---

Some Junkie Cosmonaut said:

---

WHOOP!'91 said:

---

YellowPot_97 said:

---

Secolobo said:

---

thirdcoast said:

---

It's also not helpful for the narrative for white conservatives to not be outraged by a black cop killing a white girl. It forces both sides to discuss the circumstances of the encounter and value those facts over skin color of cop or victim. That process is incredibly destructive as it would have likely led to George Floyd type cases never making it past the local news. If that happens, dems lose one of their most effective voter turnout schemes.

It sucks that she thought it wasn't dangerous to breach the floor of Congress. But now everyone from BLM to Handsmaid tale to Taliban know what is off limits. They should suffer same fate, and if not, then we should all be outraged.

---

But security opened the gates and the damn doors.

---

She was climbing through a broken window of a barricaded door in the US Capital building.
How anyone is defending her is beyond me.

---

Nobody is "defending her", people are wondering if what she did warrants being killed.

---

Exactly. It's so curious what warrants a discussion based upon one's political ideology.

Just discussing this event always quickly becomes "wHy ArE yOu DeFeNdInG hER?!?"

---

F that. I will defend her. She was unarmed. Should not have been shot.

Byrd and the CP police shot her because the cathedral of government power is so sacred to them that the vermin (aka Patriots) should not be allowed to protest there the same way the anti-Kavanaugh crowd did.

---

I want you to remember those words on the off chance some unarmed crackhead kicks in a window to try to get in your home.

---

yeah, that's the same exact thing....

She fell victim to a protest's inherent `inertia' ---- Leftist Dems do it all the time at their riots. When you pass a barrier or level of escalation, they keep pushing the next envelope. This mob apparently wanted to reach the House to disrupt proceedings. (They don't seem to have realized they would evacuate the things-- you see this puzzling surprise - duh -- on the part of the protestors pushing into the Senate chamber. )

She didn't even break in --- not entering the Capitol, not that window pane. But she was crawling through an already busted window frame. That's protest inertia -- -she was going to enter the Speaker's Lobby Hall, and presumably try to enter the House galleries (or even ground floor---they may not have realized what level they were at---it would have been at the floor level--not a gallery).

She was shot for pushing the envelope. Exceedingly tragic, because a warning is not unlikely to have sufficed. That mob didn't escalate, but backed down the moment a gun was fired. It was an Occupy protest in tone.

It comes down to: the lack of warning, even the usual barked order, was criminal. She must might have frozen after landing on the other side with an `Oh S " response and put her hands up. The lack of warning is what is so wrong here --- with CP among the very protestors sending such a lower key message. Not even clubs in use.

Very tragic and avoidable actions on both sides.

Onceaggie2.0 said:

---

Tanya 93 said:

---

Secolobo said:

---

thirdcoast said:

---

It's also not helpful for the narrative for white conservatives to not be outraged by a black cop killing a white girl. It forces both sides to discuss the circumstances of the encounter and value those facts over skin color of cop or victim. That process is incredibly destructive as it would have likely led to George Floyd type cases never making it past the local news. If that happens, dems lose one of their most effective voter turnout schemes.

It sucks that she thought it wasn't dangerous to breach the floor of Congress. But now everyone from BLM to Handsmaid tale to Taliban know what is off limits. They should suffer same fate, and if not, then we should all be outraged.

---

But security opened the gates and the damn doors.

---

Do you have the right to enter any area you want once let into a building, considering the doors were barricaded and she was crawling thru a broken window?

---

Does entering a restricted area = death penalty? asking for a friend.

---

It can

Some may not like it, but that is what can and sometimes should happen when people try to break into restricted areas in federal buildings

The reality is many people would not be upset she was shot if this was a BLM protest breaking unto the exact same area under the same circumstances

Cassius said:

---

Anonymous Source said:

---

TheEternalPessimist said:

---

Some Junkie Cosmonaut said:

---

WHOOP!'91 said:

---

YellowPot_97 said:

---

Secolobo said:

---

thirdcoast said:

---

It's also not helpful for the narrative for white conservatives to not be outraged by a black cop killing a white girl. It forces both sides to discuss the circumstances of the encounter and value those facts over skin color of cop or victim. That process is incredibly destructive as it would have likely led to George Floyd type cases never making it past the local news. If that happens, dems lose one of their most effective voter turnout schemes.

It sucks that she thought it wasn't dangerous to breach the floor of Congress. But now everyone from BLM to Handsmaid tale to Taliban know what is off limits. They should suffer same fate, and if not, then we should all be outraged.

---

But security opened the gates and the damn doors.

---

She was climbing through a broken window of a barricaded door in the US Capital building.
How anyone is defending her is beyond me.

---

Nobody is "defending her", people are wondering if what she did warrants being killed.

---

Exactly. It's so curious what warrants a discussion based upon one's political ideology.

Just discussing this event always quickly becomes "wHy ArE yOu DeFeNdInG hER?!?"

---

F that. I will defend her. She was unarmed. Should not have been shot.

Byrd and the CP police shot her because the cathedral of government power is so sacred to them that the vermin (aka Patriots) should not be allowed to protest there the same way the anti-Kavanaugh crowd did.

---

I want you to remember those words on the off chance some unarmed crackhead kicks in a window to try to get in your home.

---

yeah, that's the same exact thing....

---

Why? It's apparently OK to do it in a tax payer funded building. Why not do it at some other place you're also paying for?

Tanya 93 said:

---

The reality is many people would not be upset she was shot if this was a BLM protest breaking unto the exact same area under the same circumstances

---

Ahhhh yes. Having trouble supporting your argument? Play the racism card!

Anonymous Source said:

---

Cassius said:

---

Anonymous Source said:

---

TheEternalPessimist said:

---

Some Junkie Cosmonaut said:

---

WHOOP!'91 said:

---

YellowPot_97 said:

---

Secolobo said:

---

thirdcoast said:

---

It's also not helpful for the narrative for white conservatives to not be outraged by a black cop killing a white girl. It forces both sides to discuss the circumstances of the encounter and value those facts over skin color of cop or victim. That process is incredibly destructive as it would have likely led to George Floyd type cases never making it past the local news. If that happens, dems lose one of their most effective voter turnout schemes.

It sucks that she thought it wasn't dangerous to breach the floor of Congress. But now everyone from BLM to Handsmaid tale to Taliban know what is off limits. They should suffer same fate, and if not, then we should all be outraged.

---

But security opened the gates and the damn doors.

---

She was climbing through a broken window of a barricaded door in the US Capital building.
How anyone is defending her is beyond me.

---

Nobody is "defending her", people are wondering if what she did warrants being killed.

---

Exactly. It's so curious what warrants a discussion based upon one's political ideology.

Just discussing this event always quickly becomes "wHy ArE yOu DeFeNdInG hER?!?"

---

F that. I will defend her. She was unarmed. Should not have been shot.

Byrd and the CP police shot her because the cathedral of government power is so sacred to them that the vermin (aka Patriots) should not be allowed to protest there the same way the anti-Kavanaugh crowd did.

---

I want you to remember those words on the off chance some unarmed crackhead kicks in a window to try to get in your home.

---

yeah, that's the same exact thing....

---

Why? It's apparently OK to do it in a tax payer funded building. Why not do it at some other place you're also paying for?

---

You responding to me doesn't make your analogy any less stupid.

Onceaggie2.0 said:

---

Gigem314 said:

---

Ellis Wyatt said:

---

BoydCrowder13 said:

---

Is this the new Benghazi?

---

Oh, look. Totally NOT a Concerned Moderate using a Concerned Moderate talking point.

---

They don't even try to hide it.

---

His dumb family are Biden supporters you are shocked by his post?

---

Not surprised one bit. It's amusing how they pretend to be R voters but then eventually the truth slips out in some way.

Some Junkie Cosmonaut said:

---

Tanya 93 said:

---

The reality is many people would not be upset she was shot if this was a BLM protest breaking unto the exact same area under the same circumstances

---

Ahhhh yes. Having trouble supporting your argument? Play the racism card!

---

Then switch it to Antifa or Occupy Wall Street or Planned Parenthood. I don't play the racism card. I said repeatedly last summer that BLM protestors, especially when making attacks on government buildings, should be shot. Period

The issue is the reason behind the protest that make some upset she was shot
Many would not be asking why she didn't get a warning if it was a left leaning group

Anonymous Source said:

---

Secolobo said:

---

thirdcoast said:

---

It's also not helpful for the narrative for white conservatives to not be outraged by a black cop killing a white girl. It forces both sides to discuss the circumstances of the encounter and value those facts over skin color of cop or victim. That process is incredibly destructive as it would have likely led to George Floyd type cases never making it past the local news. If that happens, dems lose one of their most effective voter turnout schemes.

It sucks that she thought it wasn't dangerous to breach the floor of Congress. But now everyone from BLM to Handsmaid tale to Taliban know what is off limits. They should suffer same fate, and if not, then we should all be outraged.

---

But security opened the gates and the damn doors.

---

But not that window.

---

If she was a black female and the shooter a white male...can you at least admit that you would be saying "maybe there should have been a better warning/barricade right there, just a few feet away from cops chillaxing with the people they let in?"

Or at least that the vast majority of people would be saying this. I am not saying she should not have been shot or that shoot to kill orders (if this was the case) were out of line. However, in such a hectic situation, a reasonable person would expect a much more clear barricade or warning that clearly let's people know "right here you can ham it up with friendly police officers, but right here just a couple feet away, you will 100% be shot and killed for entry".

Anonymous Source said:

---

TheEternalPessimist said:

---

Some Junkie Cosmonaut said:

---

WHOOP!'91 said:

---

YellowPot_97 said:

---

Secolobo said:

---

thirdcoast said:

---

It's also not helpful for the narrative for white conservatives to not be outraged by a black cop killing a white girl. It forces both sides to discuss the circumstances of the encounter and value those facts over skin color of cop or victim. That process is incredibly destructive as it would have likely led to George Floyd type cases never making it past the local news. If that happens, dems lose one of their most effective voter turnout schemes.

It sucks that she thought it wasn't dangerous to breach the floor of Congress. But now everyone from BLM to Handsmaid tale to Taliban know what is off limits. They should suffer same fate, and if not, then we should all be outraged.

---

But security opened the gates and the damn doors.

---

She was climbing through a broken window of a barricaded door in the US Capital building.
How anyone is defending her is beyond me.

---

Nobody is "defending her", people are wondering if what she did warrants being killed.

---

Exactly. It's so curious what warrants a discussion based upon one's political ideology.

Just discussing this event always quickly becomes "wHy ArE yOu DeFeNdInG hER?!?"

---

F that. I will defend her. She was unarmed. Should not have been shot.

Byrd and the CP police shot her because the cathedral of government power is so sacred to them that the vermin (aka Patriots) should not be allowed to protest there the same way the anti-Kavanaugh crowd did.

---

I want you to remember those words on the off chance some unarmed crackhead kicks in a window to try to get in your home.

---

Oh, never mind, ignore my last post...I see that you are...challenged.

The cold hard facts is that it was Dem political corruption, not the lack of right, why Antifa-BLM protesters were not shot burning down the police stations or attacking the courthouse on the west coast. Had one of them been shot doing that, it would have been the more normal thing entering a restricted area, especially if warned. The difference was in the enforcement, not the potential intrusion.

It is the apparent lack of warning here that is really troublesome. He takes enough time to just drop her. Sullivan has time to warn more than once.

Tanya 93 said:

---

Onceaggie2.0 said:

---

Tanya 93 said:

---

Secolobo said:

---

thirdcoast said:

---

It's also not helpful for the narrative for white conservatives to not be outraged by a black cop killing a white girl. It forces both sides to discuss the circumstances of the encounter and value those facts over skin color of cop or victim. That process is incredibly destructive as it would have likely led to George Floyd type cases never making it past the local news. If that happens, dems lose one of their most effective voter turnout schemes.

It sucks that she thought it wasn't dangerous to breach the floor of Congress. But now everyone from BLM to Handsmaid tale to Taliban know what is off limits. They should suffer same fate, and if not, then we should all be outraged.

---

But security opened the gates and the damn doors.

---

Do you have the right to enter any area you want once let into a building, considering the doors were barricaded and she was crawling thru a broken window?

---

Does entering a restricted area = death penalty? asking for a friend.

---

It can

Some may not like it, but that is what can and sometimes should happen when people try to break into restricted areas in federal buildings

The reality is many people would not be upset she was shot if this was a BLM protest breaking unto the exact same area under the same circumstances

---

The country would have f-ing burned and many would have died or suffered physical harm if a black woman was killed in the same exact scenario. Although, what these people were protesting was a much more valid and commendable cause than the completely false narrative pushed and accepted by BLM, so apples and oranges.

Quote:

---

Or at least that the vast majority of people would be saying this. I am not saying she should not have been shot or that shoot to kill orders (if this was the case) were out of line. However, in such a hectic situation, a reasonable person would expect a much more clear barricade or warning that clearly let's people know "right here you can ham it up with friendly police officers, but right here just a couple feet away, you will 100% be shot and killed for entry".

---

The key phrase to fix on so not to over defend something as well, is my 11:23 post makes clear why indeed, "shoot to kill orders" if they had been given, are themselves possibly not out of line at that moment. Security, like military, have to think in terms of capabilities -- not intentions which cannot be know for sure. The capability was that mob could take down or start going through that door and rush the evacuees on the far end of the hall after breaking that door in turn.

Like you say, it is the incredible contrast not even a 5 yard line apart that really muddies the picture- -that was an Occupy protest in character---- some indication that the attitude had changed should have been conveyed.

SB 43rd STREET OG said:

---

Anonymous Source said:

---

Secolobo said:

---

thirdcoast said:

---

It's also not helpful for the narrative for white conservatives to not be outraged by a black cop killing a white girl. It forces both sides to discuss the circumstances of the encounter and value those facts over skin color of cop or victim. That process is incredibly destructive as it would have likely led to George Floyd type cases never making it past the local news. If that happens, dems lose one of their most effective voter turnout schemes.

It sucks that she thought it wasn't dangerous to breach the floor of Congress. But now everyone from BLM to Handsmaid tale to Taliban know what is off limits. They should suffer same fate, and if not, then we should all be outraged.

---

But security opened the gates and the damn doors.

---

But not that window.

---

If she was a black female and the shooter a white male...can you at least admit that you would be saying "maybe there should have been a better warning/barricade right there, just a few feet away from cops chillaxing with the people they let in?"

Or at least that the vast majority of people would be saying this. I am not saying she should not have been shot or that shoot to kill orders (if this was the case) were out of line. However, in such a hectic situation, a reasonable person would expect a much more clear barricade or warning that clearly let's people know "right here you can ham it up with friendly police officers, but right here just a couple feet away, you will 100% be shot and killed for entry".

---

A bunch of furniture piled up against those doors and a guy screaming "HE'S GOT A GUN!!" three times should have told most "reasonable" people that here is where you stop. You can choose to go further, but your life is at stake should you do so.

**** around and find out. And she did.