MouthBQ98 said:

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Schiff is a material witness and probable co-conspirator in handling leaked privileged information and conspiring with government personnel that may have aided and abetted a felony. His own back side is very much on the line.

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Can the senate have a hearing and call his ass to testify?

TexAgs91 said:

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Byron York:

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Whistleblower started Trump-Ukraine matter, framed issue in way House Dems have adopted for impeachment. Now Chairman Schiff orders GOP: Do not talk about whistleblower in impeachment hearings. If you do, you'll hear from Ethics Committee.

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Schiff needs to stop obstructing. I hear that's illegal.

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Ok, something did surprise me. I honesty can't believe he's going to limit all of this conversation. If I were the republicans the first thing I did while everyone is watching is mention the whistleblower and how he worked with schiff early on. Then I'd sit back and watch the fireworks.

You don't have to even say his name, but say how key he is in this whole thing.

MooreTrucker said:

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Schiff and Ethics should never be used in the same sentence.

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andyv94 said:

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MouthBQ98 said:

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Schiff is a material witness and probable co-conspirator in handling leaked privileged information and conspiring with government personnel that may have aided and abetted a felony. His own back side is very much on the line.

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Can the senate have a hearing and call his ass to testify?

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Call his aide, Thomas Eager first. He's the guy who flew to Ukraine to meet with Bill Taylor and get him to text Sondland on the quid pro quo despite Taylor not being on the call, nor readout and only knew what Trump did and didn't say until Trump released the transcript.

The quid pro quo texts were a complete set-up.

aggiehawg said:

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andyv94 said:

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MouthBQ98 said:

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Schiff is a material witness and probable co-conspirator in handling leaked privileged information and conspiring with government personnel that may have aided and abetted a felony. His own back side is very much on the line.

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Can the senate have a hearing and call his ass to testify?

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Call his aide, Thomas Eager first. He's the guy who flew to Ukraine to meet with Bill Taylor and get him to text Sondland on the quid pro quo despite Taylor not being on the call, nor readout and only knew what Trump did and didn't say until Trump released the transcript.

The quid pro quo texts were a complete set-up.

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Should this be a separate investigation or part of the Senate trial?
If the Senate Republicans were to leak perspective witnesses for the trial, impeachment might disappear faster than rape accusations for the Virginia Lt. Gov.

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Should this be a separate investigation or part of the Senate trial?

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I don't care which as long as it is public testimony.

I'm not sure. They aren't granted oversight powers over each other, and are coequal excepting specific constitutional provisions for each.

Secolobo said:

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"The House's impeachment inquiry, and the Committee, will not serve as venues for any Member to further the same sham investigations into the Bidens or into debunked conspiracies about 2016 U.S. election interference.

The House's impeachment inquiry, and the Committee, will only serve as venues for any Member to further the same sham investigations and debunked conspiracies about 2016 U.S. election interference by President Trump."

If Schiff really does stay the course, I would bet that the senate simply voted to decline any articles of impeachment passed their way with a note that says, "try again and perhaps this time, run an actual investigation instead of trying to parade partisan hackery as an investigation."

BuddysBud said:

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aggiehawg said:

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andyv94 said:

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MouthBQ98 said:

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Schiff is a material witness and probable co-conspirator in handling leaked privileged information and conspiring with government personnel that may have aided and abetted a felony. His own back side is very much on the line.

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Can the senate have a hearing and call his ass to testify?

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Call his aide, Thomas Eager first. He's the guy who flew to Ukraine to meet with Bill Taylor and get him to text Sondland on the quid pro quo despite Taylor not being on the call, nor readout and only knew what Trump did and didn't say until Trump released the transcript.

The quid pro quo texts were a complete set-up.

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Should this be a separate investigation or part of the Senate trial?
If the Senate Republicans were to leak perspective witnesses for the trial, impeachment might disappear faster than rape accusations for the Virginia Lt. Gov.

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I think I said before I'm on the "House won't impeach" bandwagon. Right now, respect for Executive Privilege keeps Trump from using privileged information from the Obama White House. If impeachment negates Executive Privilege, he gets to use Obama/Biden materials...not because he "wants" to, but because the House forced his hand.

If Biden/Obama/HRC actually have exposure for Ukraine, China, Iran, or anywhere, Pelosi knows it and will "reluctantly" kill impeachment because "there's no way the Senate would remove Trump anyway".

So there is a gag order on Biden and Burisma, but that is literally the quid in the impeachment charge! How exactly do you not talk about it and still bring impeachment charges with a straight face?

The Senate sets up rules for the trial. The house brings charges. The senate doesn't conduct the actual trial, they or a subset of them are a jury. The counsels I am not sure of, but Roberts, with no specific constitutional guidance, would preside over the trial, I believe. The issue would be very much what does the senate allow As admissible versus what authority Roberts would have to decide. It seems like the senate should have wide latitude to set those conditions but Roberts could narrowly hold them to it.

To me, a partisan house impeachment justifies equally partisan senate trial rules.

blindey said:

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If Schiff really does stay the course, I would bet that the senate simply voted to decline any articles of impeachment passed their way with a note that says, "try again and perhaps this time, run an actual investigation instead of trying to parade partisan hackery as an investigation."

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If this were to happen, once the Senate votes to decline the articles of impeachment, they should immediately open hearings about the Schiff investigation. I fear that the later would never happen because either the Republican Senators have no spine or the Republican Senators have their own secret deals that they wouldn't want exposed.

BuddysBud said:

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blindey said:

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If Schiff really does stay the course, I would bet that the senate simply voted to decline any articles of impeachment passed their way with a note that says, "try again and perhaps this time, run an actual investigation instead of trying to parade partisan hackery as an investigation."

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If this were to happen, once the Senate votes to decline the articles of impeachment, they should immediately open hearings about the Schiff investigation. I fear that the later would never happen because either the Republican Senators have no spine or the Republican Senators have their own secret deals that they wouldn't want exposed.

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3 or 4 more years of "investigations" that serve no purpose but for sound bites for the minions to argue over. sounds awesome.

Farmer Ag said:

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If the Dems vote to impeach, I would like to see a full Senate trial and bring Schiff and everyone of his minions, as well as Pelosi and anyone else involved in this shenanigan, as witnesses to be grilled and roasted in a public setting. They would be on the record. Let's see what they say then.

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I completely agree

blindey said:

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If Schiff really does stay the course, I would bet hope that the senate simply voted to decline any articles of impeachment passed their way with a note that says, "try again and perhaps this time, run an actual investigation instead of trying to parade partisan hackery as an investigation."

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FIFY

policywonk98 said:

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captkirk said:

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He didn't leak exactly. He totally made **** up. He told journalists that Putin told Trump to fire Comey. That's worse. Shows he's willing to lie to hurt POTUS

I can't believe he kept his job after that

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It's near impossible to fire any federal worker. I'm not sure if a CIA officer could even be fired after becoming a mass shooter.

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You jest, perhaps. But its true --- and holds for many `civil service' types. The British Empire it was just as true. And not to Godwin the thread, but it was said that Hitler himself said once he could order a member of the chancellery shot easier than he could fire him. That kind of sums up the legal papework.

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You jest, perhaps. But its true --- and holds for many `civil service' types. The British Empire it was just as true. And not to Godwin the thread, but it was said that Hitler himself said once he could order a member of the chancellery shot easier than he could fire him. That kind of sums up the legal papework.

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Welp. EOT, right there.

ETA: Staff don't end this thread. I was being facetious!

Here's Schiff in the movie Billy Madison discuss ethics:

aggiehawg said:

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Quote:

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You jest, perhaps. But its true --- and holds for many `civil service' types. The British Empire it was just as true. And not to Godwin the thread, but it was said that Hitler himself said once he could order a member of the chancellery shot easier than he could fire him. That kind of sums up the legal papework.

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Welp. EOT, right there.

ETA: Staff don't end this thread. I was being facetious!

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I agree. It wasn't intended as a call to close it, staff. Just a salute to a witty true line.

I wonder if he is still representing her.

The comments were excellent.

"Does she mind meeting you in a Starbucks?"

I'm sure he'll be back, but the legal sock someone stuck in his mouth has been a nice reprieve for the last 6-8 months.

Edit: Titan, that's the best use of Godwin I've ever seen!

https://theconservativetreehouse.com/2019/11/12/finally-ap-confirms-horowitz-report-principal-review-phase-underway-invitations-for-witnesses-and-lawyers/

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.....
According to the Associated Press:

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The Justice Department's watchdog is nearing the release of its report on the early stages of the FBI's Russia investigation, a document likely to revive debate about a politically charged probe that shadowed President Donald Trump's administration from the outset.

The inspector general in recent days has invited witnesses and their lawyers who were interviewed for the report to review portions of a draft this week and next, a critical final step toward making the document public, according to multiple people familiar with the process who insisted on anonymity to discuss it.

As part of that process, the people will have opportunities to raise concerns or suggest potential edits, making it unclear precisely when in the coming weeks a final version could be ready for release. Inspector General Michael Horowitz told Congress in a letter last month that he did not expect a lengthy review period and that he intended to make as much of the report public as possible, with minimal redactions. (read more)

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Generally speaking, and using the 2018 IG report on FBI conduct as a guide, the 'Principal Review' phase under Horowitz usually lasts 10 business days, or two weeks. All principals, and lawyers who review the report, are required to sign non-disclosure agreements.

Presuming this is principal review week one (seems certain), that would put the final report publication after the week of November 25th through November 29th. [NOTE: Thanksgiving day is November 28th]

The inspector general may allow principal comments to be added to the final report; however, the IG usually adds rebuttal information for any principal additions. Once the principal review and final OIG referencer check is complete the report moves to publication and public distribution......

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So the likely release time frame will be the first week of December at a minimum. I sure am tired of waiting.

Gotta make sure all T's are dotted and I's are crossed.