Russian Orthodox Relics Used To Inspire Russky Troops

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10andBOUNCE
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11:12a, 9/17/26
AG
We all have anecdotal life experiences.

My experience with the Catholic Church is that I have come across literally zero people who seemed to have taken their religion seriously. I don't cross paths THAT often, but at work mostly, the general experience was that Catholics I knew liked to party and would once a year come into work with a black cross on their foreheads and complain about lent.

My parents grew up in parochial Catholic schools in Chicago and they are vehemently against that tradition and convinced the gospel was never presented and the reading of the Bible was just not a thing. So, that is what I have to go on as it relates to my personal experience with the Church that has apparently been passed down from Christ and the Apostles. It would be pretty unfair of me to paint that picture across all of the RCC, but it still is my real experience I have had. What am I supposed to do with that as a reformed confessional Baptist that have Catholics telling me that only the RCC is the true Church?
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KingofHazor
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In reply to Captain Pablo • 11:28a, 9/17/26
Captain Pablo said:
KingofHazor said:
Zobel said:
No thanks, modern Anglicanism is like the poster child for the problem, full on globohomo.

You're demonstrating your lack of knowledge. Most of American Anglicanism is the opposite.


Only because of how you define "American Anglicanism"

If you are conveniently limiting that definition to the ACNA, sure. You can call it what you want, but the ACNA is not part of the Anglican community.

But you know who is? The ECUSA. And when you add them, the ACNA (even if you included them in the definition of "Anglicanism") is a fraction of total American Anglican membership

You may not "claim" the ECUSA, but they're the real deal in global Anglicanism


OK, I stand corrected to the extent that "Episcopalian" churches consider themselves part of the Anglican community.

What I was referring to was the movement that started about 20 or so years ago (and started by my church, by the way) in which many Episcopalians could take no more of the heresy from the ECUSA (now the "TEC"). They tried to form new TEC churches but were refused, so they found African Anglican Bishops who were delighted to work with them and formed new and explicitly Anglican and theologically conservative churches in the U.S. under the African bishops.
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Captain Pablo
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11:48a, 9/17/26
AG
This whole flex is idiotic

Protestantism being historically responsible for all the good things in life

Oh look, the Confederacy. 97% Protestant. Did they defend slavery from the pulpit? Yep they sure did

Puritans? Henry 8? Yeah really swell people
There

And this backward ol' Catholics crap. Were they responsible for facilitating much of the advances and funding in art, architecture, and scholarship of the Renaissance? How about the preservation of manuscripts and literature. Oh look. Yeah they were

The point is not that Protestantism is bad. It's that there's plenty of "bad" to go around. And "good", as well

****ing stupid thread


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KingofHazor
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In reply to Serotonin • 11:55a, 9/17/26
Serotonin said:
KingofHazor said:
Quote:
Protestant Christianity is all about literacy (read your personal Bible!) and intellectual understanding to be saved, but how does this work with old people who are confused, young kids who can't read, or people who are too dumb to grasp even basic concepts?

That sounds like a liberal Democrat wrote that. "Everybody is stupid so they need me or people like me to make decisions for them."

Your caricature of Protestant Christianity is wrong, dead wrong. You ignore all of the Protestants and Protestant leaders who have focused on a deep spiritual walk with God. As an example, it is simply silly to describe Protestants such as Wesley or Whitfield as being "all about . . . intellectual understanding". To the contrary, the lack of focus on intellectual matters has been a failing of Protestantism.

Why do you think that literacy exploded in NW Europe and England immediately after the Reformation? It was so that people could read their Bibles. It was Protestant churches that pioneered Sunday Schools for the explicit purpose of teaching the illiterate, especially children, to read.

Ya'll complain about the inaccurate caricatures of the RCC and the EO by Protestants, but then immediately turn around and do the same to Protestants.

I think "intellectual" is being used in two different ways here...

In my original point, "intellectual" means something like textual/cognitive. So this would be spirituality mediated mainly thru reading, hearing, interpreting, and thinking about words and texts.

You use "intellectual" to mean theologically sophisticated which is fine (and I agree with you) but that's a different discussion. I don't want to get caught up in semantics so for clarity I'll rename my use of intellectual as 'textual/cognitive'.

My point isn't that Protestants believe that unintelligent people can't be saved or that Protestants aren't spiritual. The point is that the spirituality is funneled through a much narrower channel which is heavily textual/cognitive: The service itself is centered on the sermon, and in personal life the spiritual focus is more heavily on reading of scripture, Bible studies, reading commentaries, etc. I don't think this is controversial.

In Catholicism and Orthodoxy, those things also exist and are good but there's a much wider range of practices that are bodily, material, communal, ascetic, and ritual: fasting together, feast days, processions, visiting monasteries and meeting monks/nuns, having spiritual elders and prayer rules, pilgrimage to holy sites, venerating icons or the Cross, lighting candles, using prayer ropes or rosaries, receiving holy water, house blessings, relics, prostrations, daily services, communal meals connected to the liturgical calendar, and so forth.

We have a mentally *disabled* young man in our parish who can participate in all of these things. He'll never be reading scripture or Bible commentaries, and in a chruch setting where those things are the main spiritual path, he is left out.

So that's the actual comparison. It isn't "Protestants think too much" and "Catholics and Orthodox don't think." It's that Protestantism has discarded most of the the non-textual forms of devotion and concentrated Christian practice more heavily into textual and cognitive channels. Is this even debatable??

Your point about Protestant literacy is the exact point I'm making. There had to be an enormous effort to teach people to read because of how central the textual mode had become.

And before you say it, yes, high church Anglicans and Lutherans are the exception and are kind of halfway between RCC and Protestant. But they help clarify the pattern. As Protestant denominations moved further away from the RCC they retained less and less of that inheritance.

This going to shock you but I largely agree with you. One of the grave weaknesses in Protestantism is a concentration on Bible study to the exclusion of all else. "Dicsipleship" in many Protestant churches only means "Bible Study". What's strange, though, is that I don't recall Christ, while discipling his followers, ever engaging in Bible study per se.

The danger with liturgy, however, can be that it can become dead and a replacement for true Christianity. Many of the older Protestants who were friends of my parents had grown up in churches with a strong liturgy. They left because they felt those churches were dead. Too many of those churches taught that being a Christian was solely going to church on Sunday, going through the Sunday morning liturgy, and observing fasts and other calendar events.

I don't see much instruction from Christ or any of the writers of the New Testament that define Christianity as feast days, processions, visiting monasteries, meeting monks or nuns, prayer rules, pilgrimages, venerating icons or the cross, lighting candles, using prayer ropes or rosaries, et cetera. Rather the New Testament clearly shows that the life of a Christian is following Christ. And don't virtually all of the early church fathers and RCC Saints agree? Didn't St Ignatius of Antioch, Polycarp, Augustine, St Francis, Thomas Kempis, and so forth?
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CrackerJackAg
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In reply to KingofHazor • 2:03p, 9/17/26
AG
KingofHazor said:
Zobel said:
Yes, the RCC and Orthodox people on this forum who have spent their entire lives in a deeply culturally Protestant society, and many of whom were raised in various Protestant sects have completely unfounded opinions about the topic. This seems entirely plausible.

But y'all seem to extrapolate from your limited experiences in a Southern Baptist Church in a small Texas town to all of Protestantism.

Y'all's points about Protestantism frequently display a lack of knowledge of its breadth and depth.


I went Southern Baptist, to Evangelical (Pentecostal leaning roots then mega church) then to Presbyterian in my lifetime.

All fell short…

All really about the same from a 10,000 ft view.
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CrackerJackAg
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In reply to KingofHazor • 2:07p, 9/17/26
AG
KingofHazor said:
Serotonin said:
KingofHazor said:
Quote:
Protestant Christianity is all about literacy (read your personal Bible!) and intellectual understanding to be saved, but how does this work with old people who are confused, young kids who can't read, or people who are too dumb to grasp even basic concepts?

That sounds like a liberal Democrat wrote that. "Everybody is stupid so they need me or people like me to make decisions for them."

Your caricature of Protestant Christianity is wrong, dead wrong. You ignore all of the Protestants and Protestant leaders who have focused on a deep spiritual walk with God. As an example, it is simply silly to describe Protestants such as Wesley or Whitfield as being "all about . . . intellectual understanding". To the contrary, the lack of focus on intellectual matters has been a failing of Protestantism.

Why do you think that literacy exploded in NW Europe and England immediately after the Reformation? It was so that people could read their Bibles. It was Protestant churches that pioneered Sunday Schools for the explicit purpose of teaching the illiterate, especially children, to read.

Ya'll complain about the inaccurate caricatures of the RCC and the EO by Protestants, but then immediately turn around and do the same to Protestants.

I think "intellectual" is being used in two different ways here...

In my original point, "intellectual" means something like textual/cognitive. So this would be spirituality mediated mainly thru reading, hearing, interpreting, and thinking about words and texts.

You use "intellectual" to mean theologically sophisticated which is fine (and I agree with you) but that's a different discussion. I don't want to get caught up in semantics so for clarity I'll rename my use of intellectual as 'textual/cognitive'.

My point isn't that Protestants believe that unintelligent people can't be saved or that Protestants aren't spiritual. The point is that the spirituality is funneled through a much narrower channel which is heavily textual/cognitive: The service itself is centered on the sermon, and in personal life the spiritual focus is more heavily on reading of scripture, Bible studies, reading commentaries, etc. I don't think this is controversial.

In Catholicism and Orthodoxy, those things also exist and are good but there's a much wider range of practices that are bodily, material, communal, ascetic, and ritual: fasting together, feast days, processions, visiting monasteries and meeting monks/nuns, having spiritual elders and prayer rules, pilgrimage to holy sites, venerating icons or the Cross, lighting candles, using prayer ropes or rosaries, receiving holy water, house blessings, relics, prostrations, daily services, communal meals connected to the liturgical calendar, and so forth.

We have a mentally *disabled* young man in our parish who can participate in all of these things. He'll never be reading scripture or Bible commentaries, and in a chruch setting where those things are the main spiritual path, he is left out.

So that's the actual comparison. It isn't "Protestants think too much" and "Catholics and Orthodox don't think." It's that Protestantism has discarded most of the the non-textual forms of devotion and concentrated Christian practice more heavily into textual and cognitive channels. Is this even debatable??

Your point about Protestant literacy is the exact point I'm making. There had to be an enormous effort to teach people to read because of how central the textual mode had become.

And before you say it, yes, high church Anglicans and Lutherans are the exception and are kind of halfway between RCC and Protestant. But they help clarify the pattern. As Protestant denominations moved further away from the RCC they retained less and less of that inheritance.

This going to shock you but I largely agree with you. One of the grave weaknesses in Protestantism is a concentration on Bible study to the exclusion of all else. "Dicsipleship" in many Protestant churches only means "Bible Study". What's strange, though, is that I don't recall Christ, while discipling his followers, ever engaging in Bible study per se.

The danger with liturgy, however, can be that it can become dead and a replacement for true Christianity. Many of the older Protestants who were friends of my parents had grown up in churches with a strong liturgy. They left because they felt those churches were dead. Too many of those churches taught that being a Christian was solely going to church on Sunday, going through the Sunday morning liturgy, and observing fasts and other calendar events.

I don't see much instruction from Christ or any of the writers of the New Testament that define Christianity as feast days, processions, visiting monasteries, meeting monks or nuns, prayer rules, pilgrimages, venerating icons or the cross, lighting candles, using prayer ropes or rosaries, et cetera. Rather the New Testament clearly shows that the life of a Christian is following Christ. And don't virtually all of the early church fathers and RCC Saints agree? Didn't St Ignatius of Antioch, Polycarp, Augustine, St Francis, Thomas Kempis, and so forth?


I've never heard of the situation you are referencing. I imagine those people weren't very active and once they got into a Protestant service they enjoyed the simplicity"being fed" on Sunday instead of the work (literal meaning of liturgy). The one hour services are pretty easy I guess.

All the other things are not required but do help create a nice rounded Christian life if you participate.

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KingofHazor
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In reply to CrackerJackAg • 2:12p, 9/17/26
Quote:
I've never heard of the situation you are referencing.

What situation? The folks that think going to church with liturgy is all it takes to be a Christian?
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CrackerJackAg
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In reply to KingofHazor • 2:16p, 9/17/26
AG
KingofHazor said:
Quote:
I've never heard of the situation you are referencing.

What situation? The folks that think going to church with liturgy is all it takes to be a Christian?


Yeah, that's not a thing in reality.

No Orthodox Church teaches that. Liturgy is the baseline and minimum.

Not saying people don't think or do it but that conclusion is lack of participation on a personal level.

Honestly I felt more that way as a Protestant. Rush to church to be on time, blast out in an hour and go to lunch.

Sundays start at 8am and go past noon in the Orthodox world. You have Saturday night too.

That's all baseline.
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KingofHazor
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In reply to CrackerJackAg • 2:48p, 9/17/26
That is undoubtedly true for you, but what about the millions of Roman Catholics who live in heavily RCC areas? The stereotype of the Catholics that live like pagans and then go to Mass and confession is not false.

What about the millions of EO who live in predominantly EO areas? Do you really think that they view their faith the same as you do?

My perspective is that Americans who convert to EO ought to spend a fair amount of time in a heavily EO culture first. They'll find that the vitality that they experience here in America is wholly lacking in traditional EO cultures. EO is still a new, shiny thing here in the U.S.

I've known a lot of people who were EO and from EO countries and their Christianity was cultural only.

Your complaints about Protestantism have some validity, but those same failures apply to any faith where it is the dominant faith in a culture.
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UTExan
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In reply to KingofHazor • 2:50p, 9/17/26
Bingo, King.
“If you’re going to have crime it should at least be organized crime”
-Havelock Vetinari
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Zobel
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In reply to KingofHazor • 2:52p, 9/17/26
AG
Cultural followers of a faith isn't unique to any faith.

There are plenty of Sunday (or even just Christmas and Easter) Protestants in the US. And there are (almost) no Protestants in Europe. Womp womp.
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KingofHazor
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In reply to Zobel • 2:55p, 9/17/26
Zobel said:
Cultural followers of a faith isn't unique to any faith.

That's exactly what I said. Womp, womp.

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UTExan
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In reply to Zobel • 5:15p, 9/17/26
Zobel said:
Cultural followers of a faith isn't unique to any faith.

There are plenty of Sunday (or even just Christmas and Easter) Protestants in the US. And there are (almost) no Protestants in Europe. Womp womp.


Wrong again:
" Evangelical Christianity is growing rapidly in France and now represents the majority of practicing Protestants in the country.Growth and DemographicsPopulation Share: Evangelicals make up about 1.6% to nearly 3% of the total French population, numbering roughly 745,000 to close to 1 million active believers.New Churches: A new evangelical church opens in France roughly every 10 days.Backgrounds: Many new attendees are converts from a Catholic background or from families with no religious affiliation. Data from the CNEF website (National Council of French Evangelicals) notes that growth is especially strong among younger and lower-income demographics."

“If you’re going to have crime it should at least be organized crime”
-Havelock Vetinari
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A is A
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In reply to UTExan • 6:05p, 9/17/26
AG
Stoped the moment I saw the flag waving color guard grandmas
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Vox Clamantis
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In reply to UTExan • 9:51a, 9/18/26
UTExan said:
Zobel said:
Cultural followers of a faith isn't unique to any faith.

There are plenty of Sunday (or even just Christmas and Easter) Protestants in the US. And there are (almost) no Protestants in Europe. Womp womp.


Wrong again:
" Evangelical Christianity is growing rapidly in France and now represents the majority of practicing Protestants in the country.Growth and DemographicsPopulation Share: Evangelicals make up about 1.6% to nearly 3% of the total French population, numbering roughly 745,000 to close to 1 million active believers.New Churches: A new evangelical church opens in France roughly every 10 days.Backgrounds: Many new attendees are converts from a Catholic background or from families with no religious affiliation. Data from the CNEF website (National Council of French Evangelicals) notes that growth is especially strong among younger and lower-income demographics."



I have zero doubt that Protestantism is growing, the end times are approaching and heresies will run rampant.

Protestantism is the count chocula of Christianity, Evagelicalism is the Lucky Charms of Protestantism. Colorful characters, bright colors and sugar on the inside.

I know many people are personally who have left the Church for an evangelical gathering because of various reasons; most of them having to do with location, children programs, their kids desires, or friends who went there.

How could evangelicalism not grow when all you need is to find an evangelical community that says what you want them to say and makes you feel how you want to feel? When they stop? Find another one.

The apostolic churches are pulling the best and brightest from Protestantism, and you're getting the orange theory moms who want childcare

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CrackerJackAg
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In reply to UTExan • 9:58a, 9/18/26
AG
UTExan said:
Zobel said:
Cultural followers of a faith isn't unique to any faith.

There are plenty of Sunday (or even just Christmas and Easter) Protestants in the US. And there are (almost) no Protestants in Europe. Womp womp.


Wrong again:
" Evangelical Christianity is growing rapidly in France and now represents the majority of practicing Protestants in the country.Growth and DemographicsPopulation Share: Evangelicals make up about 1.6% to nearly 3% of the total French population, numbering roughly 745,000 to close to 1 million active believers.New Churches: A new evangelical church opens in France roughly every 10 days.Backgrounds: Many new attendees are converts from a Catholic background or from families with no religious affiliation. Data from the CNEF website (National Council of French Evangelicals) notes that growth is especially strong among younger and lower-income demographics."



More facts:

Protestants make up roughly one and a half percent of Christians in France.

Driven 99% by immigrants from Sub-Saharan Africa, the Caribbean, and ethnic Romani communities. Not converts from Catholicism or non believers. Transfer of Protestants not growth

Country is overwhelmingly majority Catholic.

No one there is buying the evangelical ***** It's just Third World transfer.

Furthermore significant movement away from protestantism as traditional mainstream, Protestant churches have declined. Like I said it's mostly Third World imported nonsensical evangelical and Pentecostal that is having the effect of pushing native protestants towards the Catholic Church

Dr. Jerry A. Johnson (Early 2026): Former president of the National Religious Broadcasters (NRB) and a longtime conservative Southern Baptist leader (former president of Criswell College and trustee of Southern Baptist Theological Seminary). He publicly announced his conversion to Roman Catholicism, which caused significant discussion across the evangelical community.

Francis Beckwith (2007): One of the most famous historical instances of this was Beckwith, who was the sitting president of the Evangelical Theological Society (ETS) when he resigned and announced he was returning to the Catholic Church.

Hank Hanegraaff (2017): Known nationally as the "Bible Answer Man," Hanegraaff's conversion shocked the evangelical world when he was received into the Eastern Orthodox Church.

Congrats on taking third world uneducated people's (I assume that's what you guys have to target since they don't know any better) out of Africa & the Caribbean and transferring them to Europe.




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10andBOUNCE
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In reply to Vox Clamantis • 10:38a, 9/18/26
AG
Vox Clamantis said:
UTExan said:
Zobel said:
Cultural followers of a faith isn't unique to any faith.

There are plenty of Sunday (or even just Christmas and Easter) Protestants in the US. And there are (almost) no Protestants in Europe. Womp womp.


Wrong again:
" Evangelical Christianity is growing rapidly in France and now represents the majority of practicing Protestants in the country.Growth and DemographicsPopulation Share: Evangelicals make up about 1.6% to nearly 3% of the total French population, numbering roughly 745,000 to close to 1 million active believers.New Churches: A new evangelical church opens in France roughly every 10 days.Backgrounds: Many new attendees are converts from a Catholic background or from families with no religious affiliation. Data from the CNEF website (National Council of French Evangelicals) notes that growth is especially strong among younger and lower-income demographics."



I have zero doubt that Protestantism is growing, the end times are approaching and heresies will run rampant.

Protestantism is the count chocula of Christianity, Evagelicalism is the Lucky Charms of Protestantism. Colorful characters, bright colors and sugar on the inside.

I know many people are personally who have left the Church for an evangelical gathering because of various reasons; most of them having to do with location, children programs, their kids desires, or friends who went there.

How could evangelicalism not grow when all you need is to find an evangelical community that says what you want them to say and makes you feel how you want to feel? When they stop? Find another one.

The apostolic churches are pulling the best and brightest from Protestantism, and you're getting the orange theory moms who want childcare


While we disagree on some of these ideas, this was really funny. I can appreciate the humor here, even if it was a backhanded insult.
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TeddyAg0422
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In reply to KingofHazor • 7:43p, 9/23/26
AG
KingofHazor said:
TeddyAg0422 said:
Just for clarification, are you separating American Anglicanism from Episcopalianism?

Absolutely.

Much of current American Anglicanism is theologically conservative Episcopalians who grew disgusted with the Episcopal church and left. Another big bunch of current Anglicans are people who spent years in evangelical mega-Churches and wanted something more and deeper.

My Anglican church is a mix of both, with a few refugees from liberal Methodist churches thrown in.

Hopefully you get some refugees from this sicko's "church."
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CrackerJackAg
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In reply to TeddyAg0422 • 8:50a, 9/24/26
AG
TeddyAg0422 said:
KingofHazor said:
TeddyAg0422 said:
Just for clarification, are you separating American Anglicanism from Episcopalianism?

Absolutely.

Much of current American Anglicanism is theologically conservative Episcopalians who grew disgusted with the Episcopal church and left. Another big bunch of current Anglicans are people who spent years in evangelical mega-Churches and wanted something more and deeper.

My Anglican church is a mix of both, with a few refugees from liberal Methodist churches thrown in.

Hopefully you get some refugees from this sicko's "church."


I mean she's as "right" as any Protestant. I'm sure she felt compelled by the Holy Spirit, and this is the personal interpretation that she made.

As an Orthodox, I obviously don't believe this lunacy.

The question is on what formal authority can any Protestant declare her wrong?

You claim your reading of the Bible is correct

She claims her reading of the Bible is led by the Spirit.

To her Paul saying 'there is neither male nor female in Christ' (Galatians 3:28) is obviously proof that resurrection transcends biological sex.

You have no ecumenical councils, no apostolic succession, and no magisterium. You both appeal to the same book using private judgment.

The moment the Reformation declared that individual conscience trumps the historic consensus of the Church it made this inevitable. You opened the door to private reinterpretation 500 years ago

You don't get to act shocked when modern progressives walk through that exact same door.

The best intention, Bible, loving people open the door for the destruction of the church and corruption of Christianity

Heresy has never come from people who hated the Bible.

It has always come from people who read the Bible using their own private lens like Arius, Nestorius and Marcion. All quoted Scripture voraciously and loved the Bible.

There was a Church and Councils to correct these problems in the Orthodox world.

It's never going to get better on the Protestant side. It's just going to continue to move along and atrophy.

What is the protestant response in correction for Jehovah's Witnesses, Mormons, Cristian Dispensationalism, David Koresh, Progressive Liberals etc…

My beef with every protestant is not so much a belief system because that can vary so much. It's just the fact that you participate in a system that makes Christianity on Earth untenable and lead so many down the road to incorrect beliefs and salvation because you said it was OK and continue to defend the concept.






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UTExan
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In reply to CrackerJackAg • 10:23a, 9/24/26
Hmmm. You must feel awful about Orthodox Russia attacking an Orthodox monastery in Ukraine then.
“If you’re going to have crime it should at least be organized crime”
-Havelock Vetinari
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In reply to UTExan • 10:33a, 9/24/26
AG
UTExan said:
Hmmm. You must feel awful about Orthodox Russia attacking an Orthodox monastery in Ukraine then.


Why wouldn't I?

That's a pretty weird question.

Not doing your weird thing where you jump around and try to play gotcha games.

I don't doubt you can lie and defend your behavior to yourself, but I certainly don't believe you could defend this to Christ. Your endlessly destructive and hateful trolling is not productive (or even clever/intelligent) and is not contained in the heart of a contented person.

You don't bother me as I've come to see you enough. I'm just sad for you. I've been there doing the same things at times and you have to first recognize and admit the bad you are putting into Gods Kingdom and try to move forward in a better way.

Unless of course it is your intention to drive division and discord for personal jollies. Looks like it any way…



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Vox Clamantis
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In reply to UTExan • 10:59a, 9/24/26
UTExan said:
Hmmm. You must feel awful about Orthodox Russia attacking an Orthodox monastery in Ukraine then.


What does that have to do with anything? Should I throw out random references to the Boer wars or something.
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UTExan
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In reply to CrackerJackAg • 12:27p, 9/24/26
I am not the one calling those with opposing views "insane", BTW.
I am glad you are happy in your spiritual home in Orthodoxy.

I would not be.
“If you’re going to have crime it should at least be organized crime”
-Havelock Vetinari
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Captain Pablo
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In reply to UTExan • 2:05p, 9/25/26
AG
UTExan said:
I am not the one calling those with opposing views "insane", BTW.
I am glad you are happy in your spiritual home in Orthodoxy.

I would not be.


What would you say about that Episcopal priestess? How would you describe what she says? Lunacy? Insanity? Wrong? Right? Acceptable personal interpretation?
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Captain Pablo
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In reply to UTExan • 2:14p, 9/25/26
AG
UTExan said:
I am not the one calling those with opposing views "insane", BTW.
I am glad you are happy in your spiritual home in Orthodoxy.

I would not be.


You started this bulls***
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UTExan
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In reply to Captain Pablo • 2:24p, 9/25/26
Captain Pablo said:
UTExan said:
I am not the one calling those with opposing views "insane", BTW.
I am glad you are happy in your spiritual home in Orthodoxy.

I would not be.


What would you say about that Episcopal priestess? How would you describe what she says? Lunacy? Insanity? Wrong? Right? Acceptable personal interpretation?


I would say she will have to answer to the Lord Jesus Christ.
“If you’re going to have crime it should at least be organized crime”
-Havelock Vetinari
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UTExan
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In reply to Captain Pablo • 2:27p, 9/25/26
Captain Pablo said:
UTExan said:
I am not the one calling those with opposing views "insane", BTW.
I am glad you are happy in your spiritual home in Orthodoxy.

I would not be.


You started this bulls***


I was intrigued with the paradox of one Orthodox country attacking another Orthodox country and using relics of the dead to "inspire" its soldiers.
That strikes me as strange and non-scriptural.
“If you’re going to have crime it should at least be organized crime”
-Havelock Vetinari
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Captain Pablo
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In reply to UTExan • 2:30p, 9/25/26
AG
UTExan said:
Captain Pablo said:
UTExan said:
I am not the one calling those with opposing views "insane", BTW.
I am glad you are happy in your spiritual home in Orthodoxy.

I would not be.


What would you say about that Episcopal priestess? How would you describe what she says? Lunacy? Insanity? Wrong? Right? Acceptable personal interpretation?


I would say she will have to answer to the Lord Jesus Christ.


Wait, what? You don't have an opinion?

You sure weren't short of opinions for five pages on this thread when it came to the faith and beliefs of others, but you are silent about that priestess? lol wow



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UTExan
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In reply to Captain Pablo • 2:34p, 9/25/26
Captain Pablo said:
UTExan said:
Captain Pablo said:
UTExan said:
I am not the one calling those with opposing views "insane", BTW.
I am glad you are happy in your spiritual home in Orthodoxy.

I would not be.


What would you say about that Episcopal priestess? How would you describe what she says? Lunacy? Insanity? Wrong? Right? Acceptable personal interpretation?


I would say she will have to answer to the Lord Jesus Christ.


Wait, what? You don't have an opinion?

You sure weren't short of opinions for five pages on this thread when it came to the faith and beliefs of others, but you are silent about that priestess? lol wow





She strikes me as strange and just as I will not be the judge of the Russian Orthodox Church which supports Putin's terrorism I will also not be the judge when Christ deals with her. HTH.
“If you’re going to have crime it should at least be organized crime”
-Havelock Vetinari
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CrackerJackAg
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In reply to UTExan • 4:56p, 9/25/26
AG
UTExan said:
Captain Pablo said:
UTExan said:
I am not the one calling those with opposing views "insane", BTW.
I am glad you are happy in your spiritual home in Orthodoxy.

I would not be.


You started this bulls***


I was intrigued with the paradox of one Orthodox country attacking another Orthodox country and using relics of the dead to "inspire" its soldiers.
That strikes me as strange and non-scriptural.


Still hateful…

Sad.

Honestly why are y'all still engaging with this guy?

I'm not convinced he is even Christian and he's just here sowing dissent.
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UTExan
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7:28p, 9/28/26
I was able to attend a public lecture this evening by the Rev. Dr. Andria Saria of the Georgian Orthodox Church who spoke about the Russian oppression of the Georgian people since the 1700s through the invasion by the Red Army in 1923. The bottom line is that the Russians, including the Russian Orthodox Church, have sought to erase Georgian identity through negating the autocephalic status of the Georgian church (The GOC was able to regain its autocephalic status in the early 1990s). He did mention that the ROC attempted to replace Georgian ecclesiastical officials. Then the Communists came, declaring war on all faith. After the fall of Communism, the GOC once again became prominent although it faces challenges of secularization of society today. He related very troublesome relations persist with the Russian Orthodox Church because it supports Vladimir Putin's expansionist agenda and occupies part of Georgia.

“If you’re going to have crime it should at least be organized crime”
-Havelock Vetinari
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94chem
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In reply to Vox Clamantis • 9:13p, 9/30/26
Vox Clamantis said:
UTExan said:
Perhaps I am trying to understand why American "Christian nationalism" is such a problem for some here when it manifests so benignly compared to the brutal Russian subjugation of peoples they have conquered and why the Russian Orthodox hierarchy supports it.


The only people worried about Christian nationalism hate both Christianity and nationalism, so I wouldn't worry much about their opinions


Total BS. I finished reading the entire Bible for the 2nd time in 3 years this morning, and have been in BSF for 17 years. Christian nationalism disgusts me, and is a lie from the pit of hell. People who aren't Christians telling me that I must be a Christian to participate in this nation? No thank you. Take that crap and shove it in the Stygian Pit where it belongs.
94chem,
That, sir, was the greatest post in the history of TexAgs. I salute you. -- Dough
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94chem
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In reply to UTExan • 9:22p, 9/30/26
UTExan said:
And here we are worried about Protestant Christian Nationalism when it's been a thing in Europe for centuries.

" Bone fragments from the sword hand of a medieval Russian prince who won a famous victory over the Mongols have been sent to the front in Ukraine to raise army morale in the Russian Orthodox Church's latest show of support for President Vladimir Putin's war.
The sarco****us of Grand Prince Dmitry Donskoy, who died in 1389 and is revered by Russian nationalists for defeating the Mongol Golden Horde at the 1380 Battle of Kulikovo, was uncovered this summer during restoration work at Moscow's Cathedral of the Archangel inside the Kremlin."

" The Russian Orthodox Church, which has backed Putin throughout the conflict, said it had dispatched a fragment of Donskoy's right hand to Donetsk, one of four Ukrainian regions Putin said he had incorporated into Russia in 2022, a move Kyiv rejected as an illegal land grab.
Referring to Donskoy as "the holy commander," the Moscow Patriarchate of the Russian Orthodox Church said part of his remains had been sent to the front to stand invisibly shoulder-to-shoulder with Russian troops."
https://www.defensenews.com/global/2026/09/10/russia-sends-bones-of-medieval-warrior-prince-to-ukraine-front-to-boost-morale/


The Orthodox Church has been the shill of the Russian government for a thousand years. The bowed the knee to Putin, Stalin, the czars, and helped persecute any other church that wouldn't do so.
94chem,
That, sir, was the greatest post in the history of TexAgs. I salute you. -- Dough
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Vox Clamantis
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In reply to 94chem • 8:44a, 10/1/26
94chem said:
Vox Clamantis said:
UTExan said:
Perhaps I am trying to understand why American "Christian nationalism" is such a problem for some here when it manifests so benignly compared to the brutal Russian subjugation of peoples they have conquered and why the Russian Orthodox hierarchy supports it.


The only people worried about Christian nationalism hate both Christianity and nationalism, so I wouldn't worry much about their opinions


Total BS. I finished reading the entire Bible for the 2nd time in 3 years this morning, and have been in BSF for 17 years. Christian nationalism disgusts me, and is a lie from the pit of hell. People who aren't Christians telling me that I must be a Christian to participate in this nation? No thank you. Take that crap and shove it in the Stygian Pit where it belongs.


I don't think you understand what Christian nationalism is but who am I to argue with a guy who reads at a ,667 bibles a year pace?
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Serotonin
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In reply to 94chem • 9:45a, 10/1/26
AG
Quote:
Christian nationalism disgusts me

1. As Zobel has pointed out many times, every political order is based on assumptions about what constitutes a good life, what marriage and family are, what obligations people have to each other, what children should be taught. Secular liberal society is not neutral, it has positive answers to the questions that compete with the answers Christians would give. If you identify as a secular liberal more than you identify as a Christian then you probably like the idea of a society based on secular liberalism.

2. Europe developed for a millennia and a half in a 'Christian nationalism' framework and was a hotbed of human creativity and refinement. The cultural sophistication from art, architecture, music, philosophy, scientific and engineering progress are unmatched in any other time in human history. That's not a controversial argument: Europe extended its power/influence to every part of the globe, and the artistic and architectural legacy of its 'Christian Nationalism' period draws visitors from every corner of earth.

3. What about Jewish nationalism? If you are against Christian nationalism in Russia then are you against Jewish nationalism in Israel? In fact, Israel is proof that a dynamic modern state on the cutting edge of industry and technology can also be based on religious identity with public religious expression and holidays.

The problem, ultimately, is that secular liberalism consumes the inherited Christian social capital while simultaneously destroying the institutions that would replenish that social capital. This would lead to moral decay, a loss of an coherent ideas about the goals of society, and collapsing levels of civic engagement and social trust. That's exactly what we see today.

But I'm interested in hearing the Biblical support for modern secular liberalism.
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