Joe Boudain said:

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PacifistAg said:

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And a misunderstanding of Romans 13! With yesterday's hilarious Luke 22:36 and millstone references, this is such a wonderful trifecta!

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That commentary is from the work of a bunch of Benedictine monks with degrees from Oxford, Cambridge, Malta, etc etc; but I'm sure they were mistaken.

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Appeal to authority fallacy. Don't worry. I do it to when I share comments from early church fathers about these matters. It's just an issue of whose interpretation you want to believe.

You choose the interpretation that leads to you respecting and wanting to emulate the Taliban. I choose the interpretation that leads me to want to emulate the One who had done no violence (Is 53:9).

Joe Boudain said:

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PacifistAg said:

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Dilettante said:

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Can it really be bustup if he hasn't mentioned George Lemaitre?

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My guess is that it's bustup because he got really touchy about mentioning the prostitute and lying to his wife.

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Yes, you went down some weird rabbit holes yesterday, cursing, throwing ad hominem attacks, delighting in me being uncomfortable that my wife would be in the bathroom with a man. Very little substance, lots of personal attacks, and curse words.

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Oh she wouldn't be in the bathroom with a man. She'd be in there with me. A woman. And I delight in the fact that you talk all this nonsense about wanting to be like the Taliban, but you're too ineffectual to do a damn thing about it when confronted with the situation. It was really just to show you for the flaccid and insecure man you are. You won't do anything, so instead you'll try to empower people to do it for you. It's funny.

I don't think people get to keep blaming some boogey man called bustup. They instead need to accept that there are many people out there that have these crazy opinions.

PacifistAg said:

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Joe Boudain said:

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PacifistAg said:

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And a misunderstanding of Romans 13! With yesterday's hilarious Luke 22:36 and millstone references, this is such a wonderful trifecta!

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That commentary is from the work of a bunch of Benedictine monks with degrees from Oxford, Cambridge, Malta, etc etc; but I'm sure they were mistaken.

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Appeal to authority fallacy. Don't worry. I do it to when I share comments from early church fathers about these matters. It's just an issue of whose interpretation you want to believe.

You choose the interpretation that leads to you respecting and wanting to emulate the Taliban. I choose the interpretation that leads me to want to emulate the One who had done no violence (Is 53:9).

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Yes, my entire religion is based upon an appeal to authority, and the Apostolic Succession of the Catholic Church ensures that authority which has come from Christ himself.

Quad Dog said:

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I don't think people get to keep blaming some boogey man called bustup. They instead need to accept that there are many people out there that have these crazy opinions.

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This is true. That said, wanting to emulate the Taliban is totally something bustup would have done, which is why I think several have made that jump.

Joe Boudain said:

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PacifistAg said:

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Joe Boudain said:

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PacifistAg said:

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Dilettante said:

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Can it really be bustup if he hasn't mentioned George Lemaitre?

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My guess is that it's bustup because he got really touchy about mentioning the prostitute and lying to his wife.

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Yes, you went down some weird rabbit holes yesterday, cursing, throwing ad hominem attacks, delighting in me being uncomfortable that my wife would be in the bathroom with a man. Very little substance, lots of personal attacks, and curse words.

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Oh she wouldn't be in the bathroom with a man. She'd be in there with me. A woman. And I delight in the fact that you talk all this nonsense about wanting to be like the Taliban, but you're too ineffectual to do a damn thing about it when confronted with the situation. It was really just to show you for the flaccid and insecure man you are. You won't do anything, so instead you'll try to empower people to do it for you. It's funny.

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How have I been confronted by the situation? Am I supposed to attack someone? Start carrying on? Would you like for me to start cussing at you? I don't get what your play is, other than provoke me to behave as you have.

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My point is that you want to imprison people like me simply for being who God created me to be, yet if you saw me in public, especially sharing a space with your wife, you wouldn't do or say a damn thing. You hide behind the skirt of the state to do your evil, but trust me, it doesn't absolve you of the evil in your heart. It just shows your lack of conviction.

For me it's mostly that Bustup used to purchase a star when he got banned to avoid the rookie post limit. I don't think that behavior is too common.

Dilettante said:

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For me it's mostly that Bustup used to purchase a star when he got banned to avoid the rookie post limit. I don't think that behavior is too common.

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Good catch. It does make me feel better that nobody has starred his idiotic OP.

PacifistAg said:

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Joe Boudain said:

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PacifistAg said:

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Joe Boudain said:

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PacifistAg said:

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Dilettante said:

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Can it really be bustup if he hasn't mentioned George Lemaitre?

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My guess is that it's bustup because he got really touchy about mentioning the prostitute and lying to his wife.

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Yes, you went down some weird rabbit holes yesterday, cursing, throwing ad hominem attacks, delighting in me being uncomfortable that my wife would be in the bathroom with a man. Very little substance, lots of personal attacks, and curse words.

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Oh she wouldn't be in the bathroom with a man. She'd be in there with me. A woman. And I delight in the fact that you talk all this nonsense about wanting to be like the Taliban, but you're too ineffectual to do a damn thing about it when confronted with the situation. It was really just to show you for the flaccid and insecure man you are. You won't do anything, so instead you'll try to empower people to do it for you. It's funny.

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How have I been confronted by the situation? Am I supposed to attack someone? Start carrying on? Would you like for me to start cussing at you? I don't get what your play is, other than provoke me to behave as you have.

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My point is that you want to imprison people like me simply for being who God created me to be, yet if you saw me in public, especially sharing a space with your wife, you wouldn't do or say a damn thing. You hide behind the skirt of the state to do your evil, but trust me, it doesn't absolve you of the evil in your heart. It just shows your lack of conviction.

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"God created me like this" is a massive cop-out when confronted with difficulty regarding temptation. As a pacifist, and a professing Christian, I find it odd that you think prayer counts as "doing nothing". Do you consider prayer "doing nothing?". It sounds like you at least have a grudging respect for the Taliban in that they have complete conviction in their beliefs.

Joe Boudain said:

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PacifistAg said:

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Joe Boudain said:

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PacifistAg said:

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Joe Boudain said:

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PacifistAg said:

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Dilettante said:

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Can it really be bustup if he hasn't mentioned George Lemaitre?

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My guess is that it's bustup because he got really touchy about mentioning the prostitute and lying to his wife.

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Yes, you went down some weird rabbit holes yesterday, cursing, throwing ad hominem attacks, delighting in me being uncomfortable that my wife would be in the bathroom with a man. Very little substance, lots of personal attacks, and curse words.

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Oh she wouldn't be in the bathroom with a man. She'd be in there with me. A woman. And I delight in the fact that you talk all this nonsense about wanting to be like the Taliban, but you're too ineffectual to do a damn thing about it when confronted with the situation. It was really just to show you for the flaccid and insecure man you are. You won't do anything, so instead you'll try to empower people to do it for you. It's funny.

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How have I been confronted by the situation? Am I supposed to attack someone? Start carrying on? Would you like for me to start cussing at you? I don't get what your play is, other than provoke me to behave as you have.

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My point is that you want to imprison people like me simply for being who God created me to be, yet if you saw me in public, especially sharing a space with your wife, you wouldn't do or say a damn thing. You hide behind the skirt of the state to do your evil, but trust me, it doesn't absolve you of the evil in your heart. It just shows your lack of conviction.

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"God created me like this" is a massive cop-out when confronted with difficulty regarding temptation. As a pacifist, and a professing Christian, I find it odd that you think prayer counts as "doing nothing". Do you consider prayer "doing nothing?". It sounds like you at least have a grudging respect for the Taliban in that they have complete conviction in their beliefs.

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Not a cop-out at all. I was born as a trans woman. It has nothing to do with temptation. Yes, I get it. You are ignorant on this topic. And who said I think prayers counts as "doing nothing"? So you'll pray if I go into the restroom at the same time as your wife, but outside of that time, you'll seek to have the government throw me in prison and tear my family apart. Again, you have no convictions. You hide behind the state to have them do your evil. You presumably want me imprisoned because I'm a threat of some sort, yet will just fall back to T&P if I'm in the restroom with the wife you cheated on.

And no, I can say I have no respect for the Taliban. For the same reason I have no respect for you. They're evil. I would rather you repent. I would rather they repent. I'm just highlighting your inconsistency and lack of conviction, albeit a conviction to do evil.

And goodness, what are you praying for when I'm in the restroom? I am there to evacuate waste from my body.

PacifistAg said:

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Joe Boudain said:

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PacifistAg said:

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Joe Boudain said:

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PacifistAg said:

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Joe Boudain said:

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PacifistAg said:

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Dilettante said:

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Can it really be bustup if he hasn't mentioned George Lemaitre?

---

My guess is that it's bustup because he got really touchy about mentioning the prostitute and lying to his wife.

---

Yes, you went down some weird rabbit holes yesterday, cursing, throwing ad hominem attacks, delighting in me being uncomfortable that my wife would be in the bathroom with a man. Very little substance, lots of personal attacks, and curse words.

---

Oh she wouldn't be in the bathroom with a man. She'd be in there with me. A woman. And I delight in the fact that you talk all this nonsense about wanting to be like the Taliban, but you're too ineffectual to do a damn thing about it when confronted with the situation. It was really just to show you for the flaccid and insecure man you are. You won't do anything, so instead you'll try to empower people to do it for you. It's funny.

---

How have I been confronted by the situation? Am I supposed to attack someone? Start carrying on? Would you like for me to start cussing at you? I don't get what your play is, other than provoke me to behave as you have.

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My point is that you want to imprison people like me simply for being who God created me to be, yet if you saw me in public, especially sharing a space with your wife, you wouldn't do or say a damn thing. You hide behind the skirt of the state to do your evil, but trust me, it doesn't absolve you of the evil in your heart. It just shows your lack of conviction.

---

"God created me like this" is a massive cop-out when confronted with difficulty regarding temptation. As a pacifist, and a professing Christian, I find it odd that you think prayer counts as "doing nothing". Do you consider prayer "doing nothing?". It sounds like you at least have a grudging respect for the Taliban in that they have complete conviction in their beliefs.

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Not a cop-out at all. I was born as a trans woman. It has nothing to do with temptation. Yes, I get it. You are ignorant on this topic. And who said I think prayers counts as "doing nothing"? So you'll pray if I go into the restroom at the same time as your wife, but outside of that time, you'll seek to have the government throw me in prison and tear my family apart. Again, you have no convictions. You hide behind the state to have them do your evil. You presumably want me imprisoned because I'm a threat of some sort, yet will just fall back to T&P if I'm in the restroom with the wife you cheated on.

And no, I can say I have no respect for the Taliban. For the same reason I have no respect for you. They're evil. I would rather you repent. I would rather they repent. I'm just highlighting your inconsistency and lack of conviction, albeit a conviction to do evil.

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You can say "I was born as X" and insert practically any sort of behavior as benign or evil as you want and blame it on God, it's a cop-out. We are all charged to carry our cross and for many people it's far easier to blame God and do what they want than it is to soldier on even when they fall.

You're trying to goad me into saying I would do violence to you, I'm not going to do that. I don't need to do that. As mentioned above by St.Paul, the state has a different mandate than I do; it would be inappropriate for me to usurp their mantle of authority.

Blame God? Far from it. I celebrate Him and am thankful He made me His daughter. Being transgender isn't a "behavior". And not trying to goad you to do violence at all. I know your type and know you wouldn't do that. Would you confront me? Would you try to block me? Would you tell your wife not to go in? It's telling that you can only think of terms of doing violence, which must explain your affinity for the Taliban.

In reality though, you wouldn't even be able to tell so it's all a moot point. I just like showing you for who you are. You are evil.

I've wondered that as well. I think it was actually a group. It could be one guy, but the internet doesn't have a moron shortage so it seems a bit more likely that he found some friends.

Btw, I love the irony of Joe/bustup complaining that I'm trying to goad him, as he starts a thread intended to do that very thing. There's no other explanation for starting a thread praising the Taliban and holding them up as an example to follow, especially in light of the trail of death and destruction they are currently leaving behind them.

Then, of course, he also uses a grotesquely antisemitic image that implies that Jews in the government hate the Taliban because the Taliban opposes child rape.

I am starting to believe you are another cross for me to bear.

My soul is secure with my Lord. Also, just to clarify, it's not a lifestyle. I was trans long before I transitioned. It's merely who I am.

But you're greater point is correct. If he thinks my soul in trouble, government is not the remedy.

Beer Baron said:

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Quote:

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If he thinks my soul in trouble, government is not the remedy.

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It's almost like peoples' souls aren't what people like this really care about, but the harming and having power over people they don't like, is.

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Yep. Exactly. People like Joe/Bustup couldn't care less about my soul. In fact, I believe people like this honestly would prefer I burn in hell forever (assuming they subscribe to ECT). They'll deny it with a lot of christianese type language, but if their desire was for me to change, as the old saying goes "you catch more flies with honey than you do vinegar". But they just want to make people like me, people like you, suffer.

Thankfully, my faith is rooted in Christ, not what some bigot thinks about me.

The ultimate problem I have with any utopian vision for society is: How do you get from Point A to Point B?

Society is not an old car where you can drop a new engine, transmission in, refurbish seats, etc. It's governed by uncountable human interactions. If you've ever seen a married couple get into a bad argument or kids fighting on a vacation, you know that it's an absolute miracle that our society functions as well as it does. Most do not.

Can we improve? Yes. But such a radical utopian vision never works out as expected, and the amount of bloodshed, terror, and suffering needed to get there spoil any benefits.

PacifistAg said:

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Dilettante said:

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For me it's mostly that Bustup used to purchase a star when he got banned to avoid the rookie post limit. I don't think that behavior is too common.

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Good catch. It does make me feel better that nobody has starred his idiotic OP.

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I wouldn't feel too great about that. Remember, releasing Barabbas would have gotten the most stars on the Texas R&P religious poll.

Paul said it best - you overcome evil with good.

Serotonin said:

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The ultimate problem I have with any utopian vision for society is: How do you get from Point A to Point B?

Society is not an old car where you can drop a new engine, transmission in, refurbish seats, etc. It's governed by uncountable human interactions. If you've ever seen a married couple get into a bad argument or kids fighting on a vacation, you know that it's an absolute miracle that our society functions as well as it does. Most do not.

Can we improve? Yes. But such a radical utopian vision never works out as expected, and the amount of bloodshed, terror, and suffering needed to get there spoil any benefits.

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Good question, you have to have a fixed end in site in order to work towards something. The goal is moving the ball towards the goal post, not necessarily throwing a 90 yard touchdown pass. I again point to Hungary who has managed some great things through legislation, what I call "social engineering".

People like Joe do not speak for the Catholic Church. Right off the bat he erred when he admired the evil being wrought by the Taliban in hope of achieving a good like eliminating abortion.

Abortion, in my Catholic formed opinion, will only ever come to an end when people value life at all stages above everything.

Joe Boudain said:

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PacifistAg said:

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Dilettante said:

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For me it's mostly that Bustup used to purchase a star when he got banned to avoid the rookie post limit. I don't think that behavior is too common.

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Good catch. It does make me feel better that nobody has starred his idiotic OP.

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I wouldn't feel too great about that. Remember, releasing Barabbas would have gotten the most stars on the Texas R&P religious poll.

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Ignorant AND evil is no way to go through life, sweetie.

PabloSerna said:

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People like Joe do not speak for the Catholic Church. Right off the bat he erred when he admired the evil being wrought by the Taliban in hope of achieving a good like eliminating abortion.

Abortion, in my Catholic formed opinion, will only ever come to an end when people value life at all stages above everything.

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Don't let perfect be the enemy of good. Every innocent life saved by making abortion illegal is a positive.

PacifistAg said:

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PabloSerna said:

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People like Joe do not speak for the Catholic Church. Right off the bat he erred when he admired the evil being wrought by the Taliban in hope of achieving a good like eliminating abortion.

Abortion, in my Catholic formed opinion, will only ever come to an end when people value life at all stages above everything.

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Oh yeah. I certainly don't judge the RCC on evil men like Joe/Bustup.

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What did Paul also say about the state's roll in countering the Antichrist in Thessalonians, and the proper role of the state in Romans?

Does the end justify the means?

PabloSerna said:

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Does the end justify the means?

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By the principle of double effect, yes if the means are moral or morally neutral.

PabloSerna said:

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You started this thread by saying Catholics should be more like the Taliban. Please do some research on the Taliban before writing something like that. Hard to find any moral good in their actions lately.

Catholics should be more like Jesus brother.

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Like Jesus, there is a time for sacrifice and a time for righteous anger at blasphemies, evil perpetrated against children, and murder. Our Church is not a church of pacifism nor of non-interventionism.

Please go and answer me what Paul wrote about in Thessalonians and Romans regarding the role of the state in combatting the antichrist, and the role of the state in society.