I dislike the following of the new trilogy:

Rey - too good at everything and her dark side "struggle" was a weird mirror dream; no real arc in TLJ

Old characters - Han was fine in Force Awakens, Leia has been dull and Mary Poppins was awful, and Luke did nothing but sulk and die

Rose - some of her lines are Anakin "I hate sand" bad; no point to be in the movie

Finn - Way too fast of a character arc; went from being only in it to help Rey to the leader of the Resistance in essentially 12 hours

Holdo/Poe storyline - just awful; Holdo's plan didn't work (most of the Resistance killed in their escape crafts) so Poe was right in the end

Snoke - Useless villain; they are bringing back Palpatine because they are in the 3rd movie of a trilogy and don't have a real villain

Ben Solo - Adam Driver is a great actor but I don't like his portrayal; comes off as a whiny brat and his dark side turn happened offscreen so you don't even get his motivation; basically a less cool Vader

And I can only name 23 characters total, though I'm sure there are other minor roles we don't know about, along with potential surprise cameos from Anakin, Obi-Wan, Yoda, etc. Still, I can only see half of these having any arc to speak of...

Rey
Kylo
Palpatine
Luke
Leia
Lando
Finn
Poe
General Hux
General Pryde
Rose
Jannah
Zorii Bliss
Wedge
Lieutenant Connix (Billy Lourde's character)
Snap Wexley (Greg Grunberg's character)
Dominic Monaghan's character
Chewey
Maz
Babu Frik
C-3PO
R2-D2
BB-8

Quote:

---

Ben Solo - Adam Driver is a great actor but I don't like his portrayal; comes off as a whiny brat and his dark side turn happened offscreen so you don't even get his motivation; basically a less cool Vader

---

I've never understood this complaint. This is part of his character, and part of what makes him interesting.

If he was just a hardened badass all the time, it would get boring pretty quick. He might be cool, but he just wouldn't be that interesting a character.

Other new droid is D-0. Maybe?

Oh, yeah. And then the six additional members of the Knights of Ren as well.

Let the final battle...wait for it, wait for it...begin

Brian Earl Spilner said:

---

Quote:

---

Ben Solo - Adam Driver is a great actor but I don't like his portrayal; comes off as a whiny brat and his dark side turn happened offscreen so you don't even get his motivation; basically a less cool Vader

---

I've never understood this complaint. This is part of his character, and part of what makes him interesting.

If he was just a hardened badass all the time, it would get boring pretty quick. He might be cool, but he just wouldn't be that interesting a character.

---

It shouldn't be part of his character. He is supposed to be like 30 years old. We shouldn't be a whiny brat. Have him be a conflicted character. There is a better way of doing it.

I just don't like that he has the same demeanor as Anakin in ROTS. It didn't work for me then and it doesn't work for me now.

But he is a conflicted character. Are you saying those two are mutually exclusive?

Reminds me of:

"You think you're safe... ... ... you are not" from the ST Into Darkness trailer.

BoydCrowder13 said:

---

It shouldn't be part of his character. He is supposed to be like 30 years old. We shouldn't be a whiny brat.

---

You never met a whiny 30 year old?

tk for tu juan said:

---

Let the final battle...wait for it, wait for it...begin

---

VERY interesting. I was wondering what was taking so long for this spot to make it online, and now we know. They cut the shot of Rey holding the dagger, which *was* included in the original Tuesday night TV airing...



... and essentially replaced it with a shot of Lando. Here's the original spot in-full...

I will say, the dagger is basically the McGuffin of the movie - or *one* McGuffin, I should say - so I can understand why they cut it. Weird that the shot made it in the first place, though.

Yeah the spot looked familiar from before. Guessing that is some navigational aid hidden in the hilt of the dagger

Exactly...

So, do you expect that is what she will be looking for right off the bat, similar to Finn going for the map to Skywalker right at the start of TFA?

Basically, yeah. I can't remember how soon it's introduced, but it's definitely in the first act. I think the dagger is acquired rather early, then it's used to acquire another McGuffin, which I believe is the same one Kylo is looking for. There's seemingly a lot of "one clue leads to the next clue" in the movie, which could be fun, but I only briefly scanned the first two acts of the reddit plot leaks once, months ago, so thankfully much of it is a bit fuzzy now.

I Have Spoken said:

---

So, do you expect that is what she will be looking for right off the bat, similar to Finn going for the map to Skywalker right at the start of TFA?

---

You mean Poe?


I still like TLJ, but Poe and Finn have had more great lines and action in these commercials than they did in that movie. Pumped by Finn's line about taking the war to them.

Yes. I'm a moron.

Technically, Poe already had the map to Skywalker and hid it in BB-8 to keep it from Kylo Ren.

I Have Spoken said:

---

BoydCrowder13 said:

---

It shouldn't be part of his character. He is supposed to be like 30 years old. We shouldn't be a whiny brat.

---

You never met a whiny 30 year old?

---

That were supposed to be the "Supreme Leader" and ruler of the galaxy? Just doesn't work for me.

TCTTS said:

---

---

... and that is why I have failed..... I should have thought of this.

TCTTS said:

---

And I can only name 23 characters total, though I'm sure there are other minor roles we don't know about, along with potential surprise cameos from Anakin, Obi-Wan, Yoda, etc. Still, I can only see half of these having any arc to speak of...

Rey
Kylo
Palpatine
Luke
Leia
Lando
Finn
Poe
General Hux
General Pryde
Rose
Jannah
Zorii Bliss
Wedge
Lieutenant Connix (Billy Lourde's character)
Snap Wexley (Greg Grunberg's character)
Dominic Monaghan's character
Chewey
Maz
Babu Frik
C-3PO
R2-D2
BB-8

---

So I wasn't sure if this '24' was 24 individual character arcs, or 24 arcs across the story.
For example:
Finn - who he is
Finn - his relationship with Poe or whoever
etc....

If they are trying to wrap up or squeeze in stuff about 24 different characters, that seems like its going to be a mess jammed down our throats.

I want to see full resolution for:
Luke
Leia
Chewie
R2D2
C3PO
Rey
Kylo
Poe
Finn
Palps
Lando


I'm interested in hearing more about:
Maz
Wedge (just a passing nod is ok)

Could care less about the rest.

tk for tu juan said:

---

Then stop whining about it

---

*Eyeroll*

I'm guessing Hayden Christianson was perfect as well?

He was essentially the same character.

Nearly every Star Wars fan I know (some that have read the entire extended universe) was completely turned off of Star Wars because of TLJ. 2 of them are not even going to watch ROS in theaters.

I'm going to go watch it but I don't feel near the hype I once did.

There is a reason they are bringing back the Emperor, changing Rey's parentage, likely bringing back force ghost Luke, writing out Rose for most of the movie and giving Kylo back his mask. DAMAGE CONTROL.

Box office projections have the Rise of Skywalker making $600M domestically. That may seem like a lot but it is less than TLJ and $300M less than Force Awakens. For the last Star Wars movie (at least for now), the hype is low.

TCTTS said:

---

BoydCrowder13 said:

---

tk for tu juan said:

---

Then stop whining about it

---

*Eyeroll*

I'm guessing Hayden Christianson was perfect as well?

He was essentially the same character.

Nearly every Star Wars fan I know (some that have read the entire extended universe) was completely turned off of Star Wars because of TLJ. 2 of them are not even going to watch ROS in theaters.

I'm going to go watch it but I don't feel near the hype I once did.

There is a reason they are bringing back the Emperor, changing Rey's parentage, likely bringing back force ghost Luke, writing out Rose for most of the movie and giving Kylo back his mask. DAMAGE CONTROL.

Box office projections have the Rise of Skywalker making $600M domestically. That may seem like a lot but it is less than TLJ and $300M less than Force Awakens. For the last Star Wars movie (at least for now), the hype is low.

---

- Abrams and Terrio have both said Palpatine returning was an organic decision, and when they cite the evidence their reasoning makes perfect sense. Not only that, but they consulted Lucas before writing the script, and bringing Palpatine back was apparently the direction Lucas was ultimately going to take it as well.

- Rey's parentage isn't changing. She's still going to have the same, "nobody" parents. There's just going to be a bit more to her origin, which is what Abrams had planned from the beginning.

- They were never not going to bring back Luke for the final installment of the Skywalker Saga.

I'm not saying you're wrong to dislike TLJ (again, I dislike chunks of it as well) or that you or your friends should be more excited for TROS. Just don't go manipulating these points to justify your position.

---

We will see. I'm betting Disney made some huge changes to their Star Wars plans based on the reception to TLJ. Starting with the cancellation of many of the planned Star Wars movies and the "delay" of Rian Johnson's new trilogy. I'm predicting that JJ's vision is entirely different than Rian Johnson's.

Original trilogy - Great
Prequels - Just awful dialogue and acting but I maintain that the plot is much better than the current trilogy; the Palpatine rise to power is a good story
Rogue One - Flawed but great
New trilogy - It just seems to be an aimless retread; if you watched the movies and didn't read any of the tie-in novels you wouldn't understand at all where the First Order came from, why Leia wasn't working with the Republic, etc. Force Awakens was a retread and TLJ seemingly destroyed the good guy army (apart from 10 people), killed the big bad we just met, and left the only legacy characters left alive as Leia (for whatever scenes we have), Lando and Chewie.

It just feels like they are starting over from scratch in the 3rd movie of a trilogy.