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I think the first season was a total of nine days and this season so far is another week or so.

Edit: According to THIS TIMELINE last week's episode happened on day 19.

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Good gawd, and they are already riddling boats with bullets and taking people hostage? There is no way in hell that would happen.

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I think the first season was a total of nine days and this season so far is another week or so.

Edit: According to THIS TIMELINE last week's episode happened on day 19.

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Good gawd, and they are already riddling boats with bullets and taking people hostage? There is no way in hell that would happen.

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You're underestimating the idiots and some of the doomsday preppers that are just waiting for something like this to happen

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I think the first season was a total of nine days and this season so far is another week or so.

Edit: According to THIS TIMELINE last week's episode happened on day 19.

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Good gawd, and they are already riddling boats with bullets and taking people hostage? There is no way in hell that would happen.

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You're underestimating the idiots and some of the doomsday preppers that are just waiting for something like this to happen

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Take a look back at the LA riots and imagine what it could have been had there been a total absence of law enforcement.

I'm not saying it wouldn't go down like this, but it does seem like people go crazy pretty quickly and resort to extreme measures a little quicker than I'd imagine. Yeah, some people would probably go around killing and looting but I feel like there would be people that banded together/helped each other.

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I think the first season was a total of nine days and this season so far is another week or so.

Edit: According to THIS TIMELINE last week's episode happened on day 19.

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Good gawd, and they are already riddling boats with bullets and taking people hostage? There is no way in hell that would happen.

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You're underestimating the idiots and some of the doomsday preppers that are just waiting for something like this to happen

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Take a look back at the LA riots and imagine what it could have been had there been a total absence of law enforcement.

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The LA riots are a great example. Due to the riots, most of the police presence was confined to a small area. Did the rest of LA use that opportunity to go on killing sprees or to rob each other? No. Of the 3.5 million people of LA, only a tiny percentage was involved in any violence at all. TWD would have you think that 99 out of every 100 persion would go on killing sprees. Furthermore, if you look at the LA riot deaths they were nothing like TWD. In TWD, you have guys who want stuff, so they use the lawlessness to go around killing people for their stuff. That rarely happened in the riots. There you had some blacks shooting at cops out of anger and cops firing back, but they also counted a heart attack (from somebody watching the riots TV), car accidents due to broken traffic lights, etc. but nothing like bands of marauders going on deadly mugging sprees.

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The LA riots are a great example. Due to the riots, most of the police presence was confined to a small area. Did the rest of LA use that opportunity to go on killing sprees or to rob each other? No.

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My only reservation about this argument is that the rest of LA was not threatened during the riots. Also, riots are local, riots are quelled, riots are temporary - when the whole nation is turning to zombies with no hope of turning back; I think things are much different.

Just a thought.

and we saw the military firebombing our own city

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I think the first season was a total of nine days and this season so far is another week or so.

Edit: According to THIS TIMELINE last week's episode happened on day 19.

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Good gawd, and they are already riddling boats with bullets and taking people hostage? There is no way in hell that would happen.

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You underestimate people.

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and we saw the military firebombing our own city

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Pretty sure FIREBOMBING would turn a survival/no ****s given switch on in most people.

You're comparing apples to....filet mignon.

Big difference between geographically isolated riots in LA and a worldwide zombie takeover in TWD/FTWD.

That's kind of my thinking too. I guess I figured we were further in- I really wanted more build up and focus on society breaking down

Still I was late to TWD so this is good

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That's kind of my thinking too. I guess I figured we were further in- I really wanted more build up and focus on society breaking down

Still I was late to TWD so this is good

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I'm beginning to think it's a bigger genre issue than this story vs. that story not having as much about society breaking down. Just started listening to a zombie (loose term) podcast recently (We're Alive), and it jumps pretty quick into things.

What I'm getting at, is that origin stories are great and all, but it's just not what studios get the big bucks for, etc.

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...No way in hell would there be this sort of ORGANIZED violence only a few weeks in...

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My thoughts... Mass chaos, looting, rioting, kinds of violence like we saw from the barber shop, I get at day 19. That roaming bands are this organized, and are loyal enough to people they met sometime in the last 19 days, is what is difficult for me to understand.

...edit to realize that I was a page behind when I posted this, and it's already been covered.

There are PLENTY of historical examples to look at. The Siege of Leningrad makes TWD world look like a cake walk. It lasted 872 DAYS and killed at least a 3rd of the population (probably 1.3-1.5 million people). People were fed 125 grams of bread per day for years which was 50% sawdust. What some people did during that siege would make TWD writers squirm. Can you see Rick killing his infant daughter or wife in order to feed Carl? Well that sort of thing happened in Leningrad. People risked jail to eat corpses and risked death to murder and eat people. People were murdered for their ration cards. But guess what? Even under those extremely harsh conditions, the reports of murders for ration cards was still a tiny percentage of the population. In a 6 month period in 1942 an estimated 600,000 people died, but only 1,216 were murders. Their reaction to their situation was NOTHING like what we see in TWD. They sure as hell didn't have bands of marauders going around killing other Leningrad citizens for their stuff. In fact there were plenty of cases of people sharing food if they felt they had more because they felt guilty that their 126 grams was too much compared to their buddy's 125. And, BTW, Russians of that era were pretty damn savage people compared to Americans.

There are plenty of other examples, from plagues to wars of annihilation to look at. Humans grew up in a world without laws, governments, police or anything. But guess what? We always formed governments in order to band together to provide each other protection. Surely if wolves, apes, and cavemen are/were smart enough to create tribes for protection, then Americans in the 21st century would figure that concept out as well.

And we are talking 19 freaking days here. There is NO FREAKING WAY.

Okay, you go on and continue comparing historical events to a zombie apocalypse.

I'm just comparing the mentality of humans. Humans have not and do not act that way. Even under WORSE conditions.


Don't get me wrong. I enjoy the show (TWD), but this aspect requires EXTREME suspension of belief. Almost as much as the existence of zombies at all.

And where were your complaints about somebody else bringing up the LA riots? Seems like you are fine with that historical comparison.

Like anyone could ever know that...

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Like anyone could ever know that...

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Sure we do. The Soviet police took record during that siege. They were kept locked up until recently, but they're there to read now. Even the ass backward Soviets, who's value of life was so low that they threw millions of bodies into the war, acted with more civility than Americans in either walking dead.

It's just another something that is completely unrealistic in this show. Doesn't mean we can't still enjoy it. Zombies are unrealistic too. Especially these zombies.

I can't see how it's hard to think after 19 days people would forms groups and have some type of leadership.....just imagine the neighborhood you live in, the street alone. I live at the end of a cul-de-sac. Everyone on my street already watches out for each other if someone is out of town, just imagine if the world ended, all we would have left would be each other.

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I can't see how it's hard to think after 19 days people would forms groups and have some type of leadership.....just imagine the neighborhood you live in, the street alone. I live at the end of a cul-de-sac. Everyone on my street already watches out for each other if someone is out of town, just imagine if the world ended, all we would have left would be each other.

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People banding together for mutual protection and survival? Sure.

People becoming a group of cold-blooded hunter/killers with the ability to track down yachats from a fishing boat? Umm....

Still best episode this season, so hey!

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I can't see how it's hard to think after 19 days people would forms groups and have some type of leadership.....just imagine the neighborhood you live in, the street alone. I live at the end of a cul-de-sac. Everyone on my street already watches out for each other if someone is out of town, just imagine if the world ended, all we would have left would be each other.

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Agreed. I can't imagine after 19 days that anybody in my neighborhood saying, "hey... let's go take out that other neighborhood and steal all their stuff!!" never mind have others actually follow him. We'd probably start building a wall, have guys patrolling in shifts, etc.

And before anybody says, "what about Hitler? Germany was one big bunch of marauders taking out his neighbors!!" Dudes like Hitler, Genghis Khan, hell even Billy the kid, Bonnie and Clyde, etc. are the exception. That's why people write about them. The vast majority of people are law abiding and peaceful and are so numerous that their stories are common and boring. TWD would make it seem the other way around.

In Los Angeles and Stalingrad/Leningrad there was still an overarching civil authority. In LA, the cops could come around the corner any minute. In the WW2 seiges, you basically could not take a dump without a political officer confirming that you buried in correctly.

Do we have any historical examples of a COMPLETE breakdown of civil authority? Think Lord of the Flies. I cannot think of one off the top of my head.

I would like to think we would do better than TWD , but I am not sure of it.

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I can't see how it's hard to think after 19 days people would forms groups and have some type of leadership.....just imagine the neighborhood you live in, the street alone. I live at the end of a cul-de-sac. Everyone on my street already watches out for each other if someone is out of town, just imagine if the world ended, all we would have left would be each other.

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Agreed. I can't imagine after 19 days that anybody in my neighborhood saying, "hey... let's go take out that other neighborhood and steal all their stuff!!" never mind have others actually follow him. We'd probably start building a wall, have guys patrolling in shifts, etc.

And before anybody says, "what about Hitler? Germany was one big bunch of marauders taking out his neighbors!!" Dudes like Hitler, Genghis Khan, hell even Billy the kid, Bonnie and Clyde, etc. are the exception. That's why people write about them. The vast majority of people are law abiding and peaceful and are so numerous that their stories are common and boring. TWD would make it seem the other way around.

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Y'all are still underestimating the power of having your whole city wiped out and many people probably didn't get away with food, water, etc... 19 days is plenty of time to start going hungry, becoming dehydrated, etc...and most people wouldn't know how to filter bad water, hunt for food, etc...

You would have everyone scavenging for food because the worlds production of food and water stopped. So I do agree people would band together but there will be plenty people already panicking and starting to steal, kill, etc...

And when you have a million dollar yacht, people will target you.

And yes I know plenty of fishing boats that have radar etc that can track other boats movements

Bingo.

Bingo to you too

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In Los Angeles and Stalingrad/Leningrad there was still an overarching civil authority. In LA, the cops could come around the corner any minute. In the WW2 seiges, you basically could not take a dump without a political officer confirming that you buried in correctly.

Do we have any historical examples of a COMPLETE breakdown of civil authority? Think Lord of the Flies. I cannot think of one off the top of my head.

I would like to think we would do better than TWD , but I am not sure of it.

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That's because one of the first things people do is establish a civil authority. Practically the entire mammal class does this. If bees, fish, dogs, cats, monkeys, apes, etc. are smart enough, then why the hell wouldn't 21st century humans?

When Jews were taken from their homes up and stuck in ghettos and later concentration camps that was a complete breakdown of their civil authority. Did they start killing and stealing each others' stuff? A tiny minority did, but the vast majority did not. They established leaders and rules within the ghettos and camps and kept "law" and order.

In a TWD scenario people would do the same. There would be some jackasses, but the vast majority would band together to fight such jackassery. Archeologists have dug up some old ass societies and long before we could write it's clear that we banded together in such ways. It's in our genes. We would be extinct otherwise.

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I can't see how it's hard to think after 19 days people would forms groups and have some type of leadership.....just imagine the neighborhood you live in, the street alone. I live at the end of a cul-de-sac. Everyone on my street already watches out for each other if someone is out of town, just imagine if the world ended, all we would have left would be each other.

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Agreed. I can't imagine after 19 days that anybody in my neighborhood saying, "hey... let's go take out that other neighborhood and steal all their stuff!!" never mind have others actually follow him. We'd probably start building a wall, have guys patrolling in shifts, etc.

And before anybody says, "what about Hitler? Germany was one big bunch of marauders taking out his neighbors!!" Dudes like Hitler, Genghis Khan, hell even Billy the kid, Bonnie and Clyde, etc. are the exception. That's why people write about them. The vast majority of people are law abiding and peaceful and are so numerous that their stories are common and boring. TWD would make it seem the other way around.

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Y'all are still underestimating the power of having your whole city wiped out and many people probably didn't get away with food, water, etc... 19 days is plenty of time to start going hungry, becoming dehydrated, etc...and most people wouldn't know how to filter bad water, hunt for food, etc...

You would have everyone scavenging for food because the worlds production of food and water stopped. So I do agree people would band together but there will be plenty people already panicking and starting to steal, kill, etc...

And when you have a million dollar yacht, people will target you.

And yes I know plenty of fishing boats that have radar etc that can track other boats movements

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In Leningrad they were starving for 872 days and they didn't go WD on each other. 19 days is a joke.

The entire first season we saw what maybe 10-15 zombies total? It's not like one in every four people were zombies or anything. So that means (and TWD flat out says this) that the REAL danger is the living not the dead. That notion is a load of crap. The living would band together like we always have in history. The black plague killed 1/3 of all of Europe. And in some areas far more than that. Yet they didn't go on massive murdering sprees killing 99% of Europeans. They banded together and 2/3rds of them survived.

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In Los Angeles and Stalingrad/Leningrad there was still an overarching civil authority. In LA, the cops could come around the corner any minute. In the WW2 seiges, you basically could not take a dump without a political officer confirming that you buried in correctly.

Do we have any historical examples of a COMPLETE breakdown of civil authority? Think Lord of the Flies. I cannot think of one off the top of my head.

I would like to think we would do better than TWD , but I am not sure of it.

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Practically the entire mammal class does this. If bees, fish, dogs, cats, monkeys, apes, etc. are smart enough, then why the hell wouldn't 21st century humans?

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I know this is getting sidetracked, but bees and fish aren't mammals.

I think some of y'all are taking this too seriously

They had gangs at this point in TWD so it makes sense to have them in FTWD

aTmAg can't not get the last word in.

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I think some of y'all are taking this too seriously

They had gangs at this point in TWD so it makes sense to have them in FTWD

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To be fair I don't think we know what they had at this point. From what I can find, Rick was in a coma for 45 days. If this is truly in day 19 then we're nowhere near that. Also, wasn't the gang that showed up in season 1 an actual gang from before the apocalypse?

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In Los Angeles and Stalingrad/Leningrad there was still an overarching civil authority. In LA, the cops could come around the corner any minute. In the WW2 seiges, you basically could not take a dump without a political officer confirming that you buried in correctly.

Do we have any historical examples of a COMPLETE breakdown of civil authority? Think Lord of the Flies. I cannot think of one off the top of my head.

I would like to think we would do better than TWD , but I am not sure of it.

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Practically the entire mammal class does this. If bees, fish, dogs, cats, monkeys, apes, etc. are smart enough, then why the hell wouldn't 21st century humans?

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I know this is getting sidetracked, but bees and fish aren't mammals.

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I know.. my point is even fish and bees have that figured out. Obviously people would (and have) too.

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aTmAg can't not get the last word in.

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So people quote me and make a statement, and I shouldn't be able to respond?

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I can't see how it's hard to think after 19 days people would forms groups and have some type of leadership.....just imagine the neighborhood you live in, the street alone. I live at the end of a cul-de-sac. Everyone on my street already watches out for each other if someone is out of town, just imagine if the world ended, all we would have left would be each other.

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Agreed. I can't imagine after 19 days that anybody in my neighborhood saying, "hey... let's go take out that other neighborhood and steal all their stuff!!" never mind have others actually follow him. We'd probably start building a wall, have guys patrolling in shifts, etc.

And before anybody says, "what about Hitler? Germany was one big bunch of marauders taking out his neighbors!!" Dudes like Hitler, Genghis Khan, hell even Billy the kid, Bonnie and Clyde, etc. are the exception. That's why people write about them. The vast majority of people are law abiding and peaceful and are so numerous that their stories are common and boring. TWD would make it seem the other way around.

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Y'all are still underestimating the power of having your whole city wiped out and many people probably didn't get away with food, water, etc... 19 days is plenty of time to start going hungry, becoming dehydrated, etc...and most people wouldn't know how to filter bad water, hunt for food, etc...

You would have everyone scavenging for food because the worlds production of food and water stopped. So I do agree people would band together but there will be plenty people already panicking and starting to steal, kill, etc...

And when you have a million dollar yacht, people will target you.

And yes I know plenty of fishing boats that have radar etc that can track other boats movements

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In Leningrad they were starving for 872 days and they didn't go WD on each other. 19 days is a joke.

The entire first season we saw what maybe 10-15 zombies total? It's not like one in every four people were zombies or anything. So that means (and TWD flat out says this) that the REAL danger is the living not the dead. That notion is a load of crap. The living would band together like we always have in history. The black plague killed 1/3 of all of Europe. And in some areas far more than that. Yet they didn't go on massive murdering sprees killing 99% of Europeans. They banded together and 2/3rds of them survived.

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Where in Fear the Walking Dead have you seen multiple multiple groups killing 99% of people? You had the two families we see now and Strand band together. Yes they have run across one or two groups that have been bad but they have seen others, the family in the house on the shore, the group of people on life rafts, the Asian girl and burned friend that haven't been murderous people.

Yes they didn't save the people on the life rafts but when you have million dollar yacht and need to protect your family first Idk if I would let 50 people on board either. I might throw them a rope and pull them to shore but probably wouldn't let them on the boat.

And you comparing war and a disease outbreak where the government is still in tact is laughable. There is literally nothing left to society. The military is gone, cops gone, food and water gone. There WILL be people scavenging and murdering for things. Not all, but quiet a few. In FEAR you don't see all groups murdering 99% of people like you are suggesting

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Where in Fear the Walking Dead have you seen multiple multiple groups killing 99% of people? You had the two families we see now and Strand band together. Yes they have run across one or two groups that have been bad but they have seen others, the family in the house on the shore, the group of people on life rafts, the Asian girl and burned friend that haven't been murderous people.

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The 99% number I'm getting from the fact that in TWD 99% of humanity is dead (probably more). In FTWD, they really haven't run into many people at all because they were contained by the military (who were mostly portrayed as thugs) and now are on the water. But the fact that 19 days in they have already ran into 2 bad groups defies any common sense.

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Yes they didn't save the people on the life rafts but when you have million dollar yacht and need to protect your family first Idk if I would let 50 people on board either. I might throw them a rope and pull them to shore but probably wouldn't let them on the boat.

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I agree with this.

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And you comparing war and a disease outbreak where the government is still in tact is laughable. There is literally nothing left to society.

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What government was intact for the Jews within concentration camps? If they wanted to, they could have killed each other all day long and the Germans would not have minded at all. Yet they didn't do that.

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The military is gone,

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Actually the military wasn't gone. Yet after the inexplainable gap in episdoe 4 or 5 of the first season, LA seemed all but empty of living people except in a few quarantined areas. What happened to all those people? They sure as hell don't show 3.8 million worth of walkers or anything.

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cops gone, food and water gone. There WILL be people scavenging and murdering for things.

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Ok, how about the the Donnor party? They were starving and freezing for months. Of the 87 people who went in, one was murdered, but it was not due to hunger or other desperation. It was for his money long before they got trapped. When things got really bad, they ate the carcusses of their relatives and crap like that, but they didn't kill anybody or otherwise behave like they do in TWD.

Furthermore, if you look at TWD, there are fatasses all over the place. They are not anywhere near as bad off as the cases I'm describing. Yet pretty much everybody in TWD has killed somebody.

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Not all, but quiet a few. In FEAR you don't see all groups murdering 99% of people like you are suggesting

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Like I said previously. The 99% comes from how many people are left by the time TWD starts.