Star Wars Discussion Thread

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fig96
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Just finished The Director and the Jedi, well worth watching for anyone at all interested in film production. A few notes:

- Mark Hamill is very open about his dislike of the chosen direction for Luke, as was Rian Johnson about his opinion. They didn't shy away from it at all.

- Some really cool bits showing set and prop design.

- It's hard not to like Johnson. He's genuinely thrilled to be there and it shows. Some good discussion with him on the overall story too, whether you agree with the direction he took or not.

- One or two little asides show you that Hamill is everything you hope he would be.

- The ending...wow.
AliasMan02
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I don't see how you can watch TLJ, whether you liked Johnson's choices regarding Luke or not, and not be excited about him having the reins of his own original trilogy.
John Matrix
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I'm sure this is been beaten to death on the other thread, but the direction they took Luke in is the only way that made any kind of dramatic sense. If we were to gotten Mark Hamill doing his best Alec Guinness impersonation lime a lot of butthurt fanboys wanted, it would've been incredibly boring story wise. And frankly, not very realistic. Sure this takes place in a galaxy far far away, but Star Wars is fundamentally a human story with fundamental human truths. And one of those truthis is that you tend to get more cynical with age. You learn the world is fundamentally a bad place, and it grates on you. You experience failure, which was the Ultimate conflict Luke faces. The fact that he overcame that cynicism and fully embraced the force made Luke's arc thatmuch more powerful and emotional. The last Jedi isn't a perfect film, but it gets Luke right.
jr15aggie
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John Matrix said:

I'm sure this is been beaten to death on the other thread, but the direction they took Luke in is the only way that made any kind of dramatic sense. If we were to gotten Mark Hamill doing his best Alec Guinness impersonation lime a lot of butthurt fanboys wanted, it would've been incredibly boring story wise. And frankly, not very realistic. Sure this takes place in a galaxy far far away, but Star Wars is fundamentally a human story with fundamental human truths. And one of those truthis is that you tend to get more cynical with age. You learn the world is fundamentally a bad place, and it grates on you. You experience failure, which was the Ultimate conflict Luke faces. The fact that he overcame that cynicism and fully embraced the force made Luke's arc thatmuch more powerful and emotional. The last Jedi isn't a perfect film, but it gets Luke right.

TLDR

Luke should have been there in the flesh... green lightsaber... chopping off legs of walkers like a boss! Kylo runs away in his ship and Luke looks up at the fleeing shuttle and says, "See you around, Kid!"

Credits!
Pro Ag
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AliasMan02 said:

I don't see how you can watch TLJ, whether you liked Johnson's choices regarding Luke or not, and not be excited about him having the reins of his own original trilogy.


To quote Urban Ag from the last page:
Quote:

The fact is that the most movie goers found the TLJ to be entertaining, worth the price of admission, but just not that great.


I feel like I'm in this camp. I'm a big Star Wars fan and would have liked a different end for Luke, however I was okay with it. I still didn't like the rest of the movie though and because of that I'm not super excited to see what Johnson does.
AliasMan02
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Pro Ag said:

AliasMan02 said:

I don't see how you can watch TLJ, whether you liked Johnson's choices regarding Luke or not, and not be excited about him having the reins of his own original trilogy.


To quote Urban Ag from the last page:
Quote:

The fact is that the most movie goers found the TLJ to be entertaining, worth the price of admission, but just not that great.


I feel like I'm in this camp. I'm a big Star Wars fan and would have liked a different end for Luke, however I was okay with it. I still didn't like the rest of the movie though and because of that I'm not super excited to see what Johnson does.



I feel the overwhelming issues people have with TLJ relate to baggage from the franchise, for better or worse. Given what we saw in TLJ in terms of creative approach and some level of fearless storytelling, giving him a blank slate to tell a new story is a total no brainier to me.
Pro Ag
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My main issues weren't with the baggage:

Space Leia
Canto Bright/Rose
Holdo

Only thing I really like how he handled was Kylo.
fig96
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Flashdiaz said:

Brian Earl Spilner said:


last shot is Rian and Mark sitting down
RJ: It's nice right
MH: yeah
RJ: you like it
MH: I love it.



I wonder what they were talking about because it sure wasn't about Luke's character.



I'll be buying this on blu-ray... and yes I have the Phantom Menace as well.
Mark was one of the first people to learn the title of the film, this was right after Rian told him.
agracer
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Urban Ag said:

fig96 said:



Yes, the fanboy uber nerds tweeted the F out of "what should have happened". I get it. But this is such a small portion of the overall audience. The fact is that the most movie goers found the TLJ to be entertaining, worth the price of admission, but just not that great. So sorry that multi-millionaires have to suffer the hyper-critical, Star Wars, nerd-a-thon, Twitter-verse. Boo hoo. TLJ was just not that good. Deal with it.
I don't know a single person who saw the movie and wasn't very disappointed. And "entertaining, worth the price of admission" is a pretty low bar for a SW movie and this one didn't even get that far.
Cstrickland05
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agracer said:

Urban Ag said:

fig96 said:



Yes, the fanboy uber nerds tweeted the F out of "what should have happened". I get it. But this is such a small portion of the overall audience. The fact is that the most movie goers found the TLJ to be entertaining, worth the price of admission, but just not that great. So sorry that multi-millionaires have to suffer the hyper-critical, Star Wars, nerd-a-thon, Twitter-verse. Boo hoo. TLJ was just not that good. Deal with it.
I don't know a single person who saw the movie and wasn't very disappointed. And "entertaining, worth the price of admission" is a pretty low bar for a SW movie and this one didn't even get that far.


It wasn't the droid, I mean movie, I was looking for, but liked it more than TFA.
tamusc
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agracer said:

Urban Ag said:

fig96 said:



Yes, the fanboy uber nerds tweeted the F out of "what should have happened". I get it. But this is such a small portion of the overall audience. The fact is that the most movie goers found the TLJ to be entertaining, worth the price of admission, but just not that great. So sorry that multi-millionaires have to suffer the hyper-critical, Star Wars, nerd-a-thon, Twitter-verse. Boo hoo. TLJ was just not that good. Deal with it.
I don't know a single person who saw the movie and wasn't very disappointed. And "entertaining, worth the price of admission" is a pretty low bar for a SW movie and this one didn't even get that far.
You must run in a very depressing group of people. All but one of the people who I know saw it enjoyed the hell out of it.
agracer
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AliasMan02 said:

I don't see how you can watch TLJ, whether you liked Johnson's choices regarding Luke or not, and not be excited about him having the reins of his own original trilogy.
He allowed on of the most anticipated moments in SW history (maybe just below is "I am your Father" true or not) to become a joke. Hamill throwing his light saber over his shoulder was right up there with Jar Jar and Ewoks...actually it was worse than the Ewoks. So no, I'm not excited at all for the plot holes, ridiculous story lines that gets almost everyone killed, SJW crap and pointless side quests that do nothing to develop the main characters.
jabberwalkie09
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Pro Ag said:

My main issues weren't with the baggage:

Space Leia
Canto Bright/Rose
Holdo

Only thing I really like how he handled was Kylo.

Sums up pretty much how I feel about it.
fig96
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One of the last scenes of The Director and the Jedi. Warning: will quickly get dusty wherever you are.


Brian Earl Spilner
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FTACO97
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Dear Lord, here we go again....

If you truly don't like TLJ, why do you keep reading these threads?

Let...it....go.....
redline248
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FTACO97 said:

Dear Lord, here we go again....

If you truly don't like TLJ, why do you keep reading these threads?

Let...it....go.....


Because this the "Star Wars discussion" thread, which includes discussion about why we may or may not like TLJ.

Edit: I bet you've never told anyone talking about the prequels in a negative manner to let it go.
tamusc
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agracer
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redline248 said:

FTACO97 said:

Dear Lord, here we go again....

If you truly don't like TLJ, why do you keep reading these threads?

Let...it....go.....


Because this the "Star Wars discussion" thread, which includes discussion about why we may or may not like TLJ.

Edit: I bet you've never told anyone talking about the prequels in a negative manner to let it go.
FTAC does have a point..I don't know why I keep reading this thread. I was just so disappointed in TLJ and I let it get the better of me when people bring it up.
Brian Earl Spilner
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tv1113
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Truthfully I haven't clicked on a SW thread except solo since the release of TLJ, but the digital release coming available really got me depressed about how disappointing the movie was. I don't know that I was ever excited for Solo but now I'm not looking forward to Episode 9.
heddleston
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I compartmentalize Star Wars, admitting up front that nothing will ever touch the wonder and enjoyment I got wearing out my bootlegged VHS that had all 3 OT movies recorded off HBO in 1988 or whatever. The OT is its own entity and anything since has been its own apocryphal thing that i can take or leave. Because of this I really really enjoyed TLJ, probably more than I did TFA(which i liked, but haven't bothered to watch all the way thru since the theater) or RO(which i honestly may just be petty on this one, because the R2/3PO cameo at the end ticked me off). I'll probably get TLJ to watch again at home.
Zombie Jon Snow
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heddleston said:

I compartmentalize Star Wars, admitting up front that nothing will ever touch the wonder and enjoyment I got wearing out my bootlegged VHS that had all 3 OT movies recorded off HBO in 1988 or whatever. The OT is its own entity and anything since has been its own apocryphal thing that i can take or leave. Because of this I really really enjoyed TLJ, probably more than I did TFA(which i liked, but haven't bothered to watch all the way thru since the theater) or RO(which i honestly may just be petty on this one, because the R2/3PO cameo at the end ticked me off). I'll probably get TLJ to watch again at home.

Much the same.

Although mine was born from watching the original SW 25 times in 77-78 in theaters. And then the magic of opening day for ESB and RotJ.

The prequels turned me off so much (yes I was there opening day for those too)....that once the next trilogy came around my hopes were simply to the point that I just wanted them to be fun and not suck.

TFA did that although upon multiple viewings it became less and less fun....there just isn't much to it and so much retread.

RO was a huge shot in the arm to me, but a standalone thing outside the main story.

TLJ I enjoyed just for the fun of being a SW movie and not a retread. I actually enjoyed turning some things on their ear and not just sucking up to the fan desires. It surprised me and I had fun..... that's what I want in a movie. If it met every expectation and did exactly what you wanted it would be boring (imho).

Now I'm looking forward to how Abrams can wrap it all up in IX.

And based on RO I'm looking forward to spinoffs like Solo and because of TLJ and GOT the following trilogies which will not be bound by SW rules and expectations from the Skywalker story.


SeattleAgJr
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Ugh. Animated Rose. Just what we ALL want....


Rose Tico and Luke Skywalker's fuzzy friends, the Porgs from Star Wars: The Last Jedi, are among the new characters making their debut in Lucasfilm's online animated series Star Wars: Forces of Destiny . Making its debut with a series of 16 three-minute shorts, Forces of Destiny debuted online last July, featuring narratives highlighting such heroines of the Star Wars movie series and animated TV series as Princess Leia, Padme Amidala, Rey, Jyn Erso and Ahsoka Tano. Created with a young female audience in mind as a way to introduce them to the Star Wars universe, Forces of Destiny in most cases featured the voices of the stars who originated the roles in live-action or elsewhere, including Natalie Portman, Daisy Ridley, Felicity Jones and Ashley Eckstein.

Eventually the series expanded to feature other familiar Star Wars characters, including Luke Skywalker, Chewbacca, Anakin Skywalker, Han Solo and Finn. With a full merchandising campaign to support the series, it was clear from the start that Forces of Destiny was going to be more than a one-shot venture, and now, Lucasfilm is giving a sneak peek at who will be featured in the next set of Forces of Destiny episodes.

According to EW, eight more Forces of Destiny episodes will be simultaneously released Monday at 10 p.m. PT on YouTube and Disney.com, and debut March 25 on the Disney Channel. The new episodes will feature not only the likes of Rey, Jyn and Padme, but will introduce Rose (Kelly Marie Tran) to the series. The episode, which will also feature the voice of Tran, finds Rose, Finn and BB-8 on their way to Canto Bight (featured in The Last Jedi), where they encounter dangerous creatures aboard a pod. Also crossing over from the eighth episode in the Skywalker family saga will be the Porgs, in an episode that will feature the cuddly creatures interacting with Rey during her Jedi training on Ahch-To.

Mark Hamill will be returning to Forces of Destiny as Luke, in an episode that will take place during his training with Yoda on Dagobah, which of course was a pivotal setting in The Empire Strikes Back. Other episodes will include Rey in a Force Awakens setting, as well as the return of Jyn Erso, the fearless leader of the Rebels in Rogue One: A Star Wars Story .

While the Forces of Destiny episodes are tailored with a younger audience in mind, there's no question that they will appeal to Star Wars fans of all ages. With stories carefully crafted around popular scenes in the Star Wars films and animated series, Lucasfilm is giving viewers even more material to expand the Star Wars canon, and perhaps in some cases, they will give some narrative clarity to some unanswered questions in the films. Best of all, it gives Star Wars fans new material to enjoy as they patiently await the release of Solo: A Star Wars Story in May, as well as Episode IX in 2019.




dave94
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agracer said:

AliasMan02 said:

I don't see how you can watch TLJ, whether you liked Johnson's choices regarding Luke or not, and not be excited about him having the reins of his own original trilogy.
He allowed on of the most anticipated moments in SW history (maybe just below is "I am your Father" true or not) to become a joke. Hamill throwing his light saber over his shoulder was right up there with Jar Jar and Ewoks...actually it was worse than the Ewoks. So no, I'm not excited at all for the plot holes, ridiculous story lines that gets almost everyone killed, SJW crap and pointless side quests that do nothing to develop the main characters.
I still don't understand why the lightsaber toss was met by such hatred and the thought that it was blasphemy. I think it was an effective way to show where Luke's mindset was, right off the bat. I even enjoyed that it was done in a humorous way, totally unexpected.

This romanticized idea of what Luke would say or do when Rey was standing there offering it to him (accentuated of course by the wait between movies) makes me wonder what exactly would have been the scenario that would have pleased everyone?

SeattleAgJr
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anything would have been better than the so called "deconstructed" garbage that we got.

deconstruction can work very well, when that is the effort upfront.

Not in the middle movie of a trilogy, which is capping off a larger trilogy.

And not when you take all your beloved characters and do 180s with all of them.
that betrays both the characters and the audience.
Cinco Ranch Aggie
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I thought the lightsaber toss was funny. It was completely against what I expected; I figured Luke would start off asking questions like "Where did you get THIS?" and then launch into some kind of Jedi lesson about why he had abandoned the Jedi and no longer needed such a weapon. I didn't expect some kind of awesome action sequence at the handover of the lightsaber.

My biggest problem with TLJ is Rose. That character smacks of SJW garbage. No army has ever won a war by winning with love, or whatever craptastic bullcrap that idiot spewed on that battlefield. Or the Canto Bight sequence where she frees the animals from the evil racers. All of that right there devalues this entry into the Star Wars saga for me.

I didn't have much of a problem with Haldo on the surface of things. I'd rather that character not even exist, and just have Ackbar perform that role. But digging a little deeper, Haldo could easily have avoided the problems she caused by acting like a supposed military badass (how else would one get promoted to the rank of Admiral without having exemplified the abilities required for such a rank?) That certainly does not come while wearing a purple cocktail dress. I get the necessity of information being withheld from lower-ranking officers, but it seems that someone of Poe's stature would have made it okay to pull him aside and just explain what her plans were.

===============

I am just about a life-long Star Wars nut (not quite life-long in that I was already 10 when I first saw Star Wars). There was a definite emotional investment in the original movies that followed me throughout the years between ROTJ and TPM, and lasted through the prequel trilogy as well. At that point I really thought that was it, and there would be no more Star Wars movies. And I was fine with that. The story had been wrapped up quite nicely as far as I was concerned. Then along comes the Lucas sale to Disney and suddenly we're getting new movies. Yes, exciting, and yes, TFA was a lot of fun. But I've realized that I have never made the emotional connection to these new movies that I did to the first six. Having said that, I did really like TFA even though I don't think it is holding up to repeated viewings in the same way other entries in this saga have. TLJ comes along and appears to take a massive dump on fan expectations and the known nature of some of these characters while at the same time bringing real-Earth-world crap like SJW into this galaxy far, far away. For the first time I can say that I hold little anticipation for a new episode in the saga (unlike the Solo movie, for which I am quite excited to see). JJ Abrams will need to knock it out of the park and jettison some of the in-your-face bullcrap that Rian Johnson gave us.
I Have Spoken
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Rose sucks, and that was completely Rian Johnson's fail. Can't blame JJ for that ****ty character. Also, can't blame JJ for screwing up Finn. And guess who wanted Captain Phasma in TFA... Rian Johnson.
SeattleAgJr
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CJS4715 said:

Rose sucks, and that was completely Rian Johnson's fail. Can't blame JJ for that ****ty character. Also, can't blame JJ for screwing up Finn. And guess who wanted Captain Phasma in TFA... Rian Johnson.
Rians Star Wars Trilogy will be about 4 small boys, seeking adventure in the galaxy, and in every episode Phasma shows up and is killed.
One of the boys will use his catch phrase: OH MY GOD!! YOU KILLED PHASMA!
RebAg13
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SeattleAgJr said:

CJS4715 said:

Rose sucks, and that was completely Rian Johnson's fail. Can't blame JJ for that ****ty character. Also, can't blame JJ for screwing up Finn. And guess who wanted Captain Phasma in TFA... Rian Johnson.
Rians Star Wars Trilogy will be about 4 small boys, seeking adventure in the galaxy, and in every episode Phasma shows up and is killed.
One of the boys will use his catch phrase: OH MY GOD!! YOU KILLED PHASMA!
This post shows a strange obsession of hate for a movie.
Brian Earl Spilner
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Dear God, Solo cannot come quick enough.
SeattleAgJr
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Brian Earl Spilner said:

Dear God, Solo cannot come quick enough.
Don't get ahead of yourself.

Solo might royally suck.

I hope not, but all the behind the scene trauma does not bode well.

Let's all hope Opie was able to pull a rabbit out of his hat.

redline248
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Brian Earl Spilner said:

Dear God, Solo cannot come quick enough.


You think that will matter? It's been 10+ years since Revenge of the Sith, and those discussions continue. TLJ sucked almost as much as those, and that discussion will continue also.
Ulrich
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dave94 said:

I still don't understand why the lightsaber toss was met by such hatred and the thought that it was blasphemy. I think it was an effective way to show where Luke's mindset was, right off the bat. I even enjoyed that it was done in a humorous way, totally unexpected.

I think if the rest of the movie had been different there would be way less *****ing about the lightsaber, but that scene is a perfect metaphor for how a lot of people felt that Johnson treated the franchise, characters, super-fans, and everything Abrams set up in VII.

I was one of the people who argued that almost all the apparent flaws in VII only looked like flaws because the payoff would come later in the trilogy, but it's hard for me to imagine coming back from VIII in a way that improves the whole series. IX may be a good standalone movie though.
Ulrich
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AliasMan02 said:

I don't see how you can watch TLJ, whether you liked Johnson's choices regarding Luke or not, and not be excited about him having the reins of his own original trilogy.

I have zero excitement about Johnson getting a trilogy. I've read scores of the books, seen the first six probably a dozen times each, and was in the theater opening night for VII and opening weekend for VIII, but I currently have no intention of watching Johnson's trilogy in the theater. If word of mouth is great I might change my mind, but as of now I'm going to Redbox it.

I really wish someone else had gotten the trilogy because then I'd be looking forward to it. Of course, the way things have gone since Disney took over there's a 40% chance someone else WILL end up directing it.
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