As convincing as that video is, I still think it'll be more a situation of Luke grappling with both the dark side and the light, rather than him being downright evil. The whole going-into-seclusion thing feels like him knowing how dangerous he can be, so he essentially attempts to remove himself from the equation completely. He doesn't want to cause any harm, he doesn't want to sway anyone else. Which wouldn't be the actions of someone who has straight up chosen the dark side.

That said, I just thought of a pretty cool twist... what if Kylo is after Luke's lightsaber not for his own gain, but rather because he wants to return it to Luke? Maybe it was even Luke who sent him on his mission. How crazy would that be to think Kylo is after Luke's lightsaber for some nefarious personal reason, only to see him deliver it in person to Luke in the final scene?

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Yeah.. this makes too much sense at this point..



There's a LOT of potential evidence leading to Luke being evil.

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In the words of Queen Padme Amidala Skywalker... I don't believe you. I can't.

Killing younglings...

Imagine if they would have replaced the following quote:

Original: Anakin is the father isn't he? [Pause] I'm so sorry.
New: Anakin knocked you up, didn't he? [Pause] I felt it.

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God, I love this girl.

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I can't imagine any scenario where Abrams pulls off a "Luke is evil" storyline. A "Luke is conflicted" storyline is plausible.

Kylo Ren could be a guy that Luke mentored. Or a double agent. Any of those would be more believable than Luke turning to Dark Side.

I wouldn't. Everyone gives in, with the right reasons. The emperor didn't know them to turn Luke.

If the next triology had 10k Sith and then 2 Jedi, and they had to destroy the sith led by Luke, I'd watch the Sht out of that.

http://www.rollingstone.com/movies/lists/50-best-star-wars-characters-20151203

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I can't imagine any scenario where Abrams pulls off a "Luke is evil" storyline. A "Luke is conflicted" storyline is plausible.

Kylo Ren could be a guy that Luke mentored. Or a double agent. Any of those would be more believable than Luke turning to Dark Side.

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Luke turned to the dark side during ROTJ. Search your feelings. You know it to be true.

Re: Luke going dark side --

I'm not fully against it, but there would have to be a damn good explanation as to what caused him to turn. He faced temptation throughout Empire and Jedi and never turned (except for a few seconds on Death Star II, maybe), so you have to wonder what could've possibly caused him to finally turn once the Sith were exterminated.

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I'm not fully against it, but there would have to be a damn good explanation as to what caused him to turn.

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But, they wouldn't have to explain it in TFA necessarily. Please don't cliffhanger the **** out of me, Disney.

I agree with TCTTS in he didn't go to the dark side, but more that he was struggling with balance of them. From the underlying stuff in this movie I have questioned if there are really 3 sides in the movie. The New Republic, the First Order, and the Resistance.

I don't care if he goes dark or not as long as it's a bad ass movie and it works

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I agree with TCTTS in he didn't go to the dark side, but more that he was struggling with balance of them. From the underlying stuff in this movie I have questioned if there are really 3 sides in the movie. The New Republic, the First Order, and the Resistance.

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Resistance will be effectively the New Republic-backed ongoing rebellion in First Order controlled systems, I think.

I'm gonna go ahead and assume that Kylo is pulling some sort of Force essence from Vader's helmet. If a tree can be "soaked" in the Force from being in the Jedi temple, imagine Vader's helmet.

The first six movies were purely about Anakin Skywalker and a tale of rise, corruption, fall, and ultimately redemption.

Anakin Skywalker WAS the chosen one to bring balance to the force, he just did it by killing most of the Jedi. At the end of EP3 there was Yoda and Obi-Wan... and DV and the Emperor.

After Jedi when Anakin redeems himself the force is unbalanced once again.

There is a very real possibility that Luke is bad, why else would Kylo Ren be worshiping Vader's burnt helmet? It would be as epic as the reveal at the end of Empire.

Could that even be Luke in the black gear?

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I'm gonna go ahead and assume that Kylo is pulling some sort of Force essence from Vader's helmet. If a tree can be "soaked" in the Force from being in the Jedi temple, imagine Vader's helmet.

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Huh? Is this some eu story behind the tree in jedi?

It's in the new canon. Mentioned in the recent comics.

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The first six movies were purely about Anakin Skywalker and a tale of rise, corruption, fall, and ultimately redemption.

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With the release of the prequels, the first 6 movies became about the story of a akin skywalker.

When star wars was written he was an interesting villain of a out the same level of import as Darth maul.

After empire he was a little more important since he got bumped up to lead bad guy with trarkins death.

In jedi, he was still a supporting character to Luke's story of temptation and (unfortunately) rejection of the dark side.


The prequels would have been better if they never mentioned anakin.

I didn't watch the video... not that it would change my opinion, but this close to release I really don't need any theories that I'm sure have good points on both sides. Our discussion here is more than enough speculation... I'm just ready to see the movie now.

BTW, I'm also of the opinion Luke is NOT bad. Jaded and conflicted perhaps, but not fully dark side. I guess we'll find out in less than 2 weeks... less than 2 weeks....LESS THAN 2 WEEKS!!!!!!!!!!

Yeah, when you rewatch the first movie, notice how there really isn't much importance placed on Vader yet. He's a menacing (and iconic) villain, but you can tell he wasnt meant to be that central to the story yet.

I'm in the middle of reading How Star Wars Conquered The Universe (fantastic read), and it's crazy how many iterations there were of Vader, and how much all the characters changed and evolved.

Lucas did not combine the characters of Anakin and Vader until the first film was already finished.

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Yeah, when you rewatch the first movie, notice how there really isn't much importance placed on Vader yet. He's a menacing (and iconic) villain, but you can tell he wasnt meant to be that central to the story yet.

I'm in the middle of reading How Star Wars Conquered The Universe (fantastic read), and it's crazy how many iterations there were of Vader, and how much all the characters changed and evolved.

Lucas did not combine the characters of Anakin and Vader until the first film was already finished.

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How can you say that? With the pivotal dialogue during the scene with obi wan and then Luke watching him kill obi wan???

He was a Jedi that had betrayed Obi-Wan, but he wasn't meant to be Anakin Skywalker yet.

And what I mean is that it was still Luke's adventure at that point, not the story of Vader's redemption.

I will say that one thing Scott card did right with the ender series was call on dedicated fans to vet each new story to make sure it didn't contradict anything he had already written.

I wish star wars had done that

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That is Terrible . It should have stayed a mystery

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They need to keep the idea out of movies, imo. You could hint at the idea for the fanboys without making it a central point in the movie, I think.

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Could that even be Luke in the black gear?

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I don't think so, but it'd be pretty incredible.

Which black gear are we talking about? Kylo Ren or the shot with R2D2?

I think it's widely accepted by now that that's Luke with R2. Otherwise it's a hell of a fake out in the trailers.

There is zero chance he's Kylo. We've heard Driver's voice and seen his face.

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Could that even be Luke in the black gear?

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I don't think so, but it'd be pretty incredible.

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Do you mean in the Kylo outfit? No... in the recent shot of him looking at the Vader mask you can easily see Drivers flowing black hair sticking out the back. There's no twist there, it's Kylo Ren / Adam Driver.

But there's definitely something going on with Luke. Can't wait to find out and hope I'm not disappointed with the direction they've chosen to go!