We've almost reached the amount of time the state requires people to live apart, finalization papers get filed on Monday. I have no clue how long they'll float around in the system before getting processed thanks to the rona, but whatever. This mess is pretty much done.

Claude! said:

---

She'll find the note I left hanging on her door
She'll laugh, when she reads the part that says I'm leaving
Cause I've left that girl, so many times before

---

holy ****, Glen Campbell reference outta ****ing nowhere!

Are you getting primary custody?

Ragoo said:

---

Are you getting primary custody?

---

Thought he was - and she doesn't want to be primary.

Truth!

Stat Monitor Repairman said:

---

---

Holy **** - that is ****ing hilarious!

Old RV Ag said:

---

Stat Monitor Repairman said:

---

---

Holy **** - that is ****ing hilarious!

---

That is depressing as hell. I know a few guys that had that happen to them, just like that. Makes you think.

Hamburger Dan said:

---

Old RV Ag said:

---

Stat Monitor Repairman said:

---

---

Holy **** - that is ****ing hilarious!

---

That is depressing as hell. I know a few guys that had that happen to them, just like that. Makes you think.

---

That's what's so amazing about it. In one compact page, it spells out what happens so so often.

McDadeTXAggie said:

---

Ags4DaWin said:

---

McDadeTXAggie said:

---

hunterntexas said:

---

McDadeTXAggie said:

---

I'll probably be making one of these threads in about 2 years when my daughter is off for college.

---

I figured we would make it until the son graduated HS, but we barely got him out of 6th grade.
He's starting HS (supposedly) in the fall.
The last two years of my life have been so much better than the 10-15 before that.

---

Wife #1 was better than wife #2

If this doesn't work out and I don't expect it too. I'll stay single after a divorce. Women are controlling, entirely way to insecure, and unreasonable. I've been treated like a criminal for over 4 years

---

Maybe its not the women. Maybe its you. Or maybe its the women you are picking. Regardless the only constant factor in wife #1 wife #2 and other women in your life is you.

A few good rules to go by with women-
1) Never marry a woman who thinks her dad is perfect or whose dad called her a princess

2) Stay away from women who have taken hormonal birth control for long periods of time. It messes with their personalities, increases anxiety, insecurity, etc.

3) You have to make sure to keep yourself in alpha status while dating/marrying them. women need a strong husband.

4) controlling women, just like dogs that misbehave and bite randomly are controlling because they do not feel solid in their environment or the relationship. This could mean emotional damage from past relationships. This could mean an anxiety disorder/special kind of crazy. This could mean sociopath. This could mean hormonal issues. This could mean that you are failing to fill the masculine role she needs filled (insert sex joke here we will get to that later). In short you need to identify the cause of anxiety and correct. Most of the time these issues can be corrected with good communication and a man that knows how to fill the masculine role. unfortunately for many gen x'ers and millenials feminism's main goal was to neuter the man which was awful for relationships.

5) women who are shrews have not gotten laid properly in a long time. women need sex as much as men or their personalities change. Western MD'S knew this as far back as the early 1900's and actually prescribed vibrator sessions in their offices for such women.

Your woman should want to get laid at least 2x a week and when she does not get that then she should be jonesing for it to the point that she is asking for it if not making direct overtures to you. Now this isn't always the case and extreme stress can certainly throw that average off, but if the above isn't happening you need to step up ur game in the bedroom as well in other aspects of the relationship.

TLDR- A controlling woman is a symptom of a relationship with a man that is not healthy. Fix you first and 8/10 times the issue with her corrects itself.

---

She is extremely anxious, and won't go on meds. Her anxiety is exhausting and affects the entire household. She reads into everything, her mind starts racing and then everything starts crumbling. Nothing I do helps and I've tried everything. Her anxiety makes her come off as crazy and unreasonable at times. I don't know how she gets through life. She hid all of this very well when we dated.

Her insecurities drive her need to control. I hate being controlled and never have been controlled up until her. I allowed it to a degree because I know marriage requires lots of give and take. I'm a fan of marriage and doing things ad partners through life

I agree with you on the common denominator idea. I'm not cut out for this and I don't mind admitting it. I thought I was but wife #2 taught me all i need to know.

---

I didn't intend to come across like such a dick. And trust me I have told my own story on here before. It came down to divorce or meds for me and my wife. i feel very fortunate our marriage mattered enough for her to choose meds.

But even after that it required alot of work. But I will tell you this....if any guy is considering marriage, follow the above advice you will be fine and not have to worry about that diagram they drew in this thread.

Quote:

---

But I will tell you this....if any guy is considering marriage, follow the above advice you will be fine and not have to worry about that diagram they drew in this thread.

---

The advice about working on yourself rather than trying to fix your spouse is fine, but everything else is pretty much insane.

And you really only need to worry about the diagram if you are like the guy in the diagram - unmotivated and letting her dictate your life until it causes you to self destruct.

That's not what that diagram depicts at all. It's a story of a guy that does everything he's supposed to do to be supportive and responsible and a woman that believes that the man is there to serve her without the responsibility of serving in return. It's supposed to be a relationship of mutual sacrifice and trust to achieve mutual goals and some people in this world do not understand the concept for a variety of reasons. The percentage of people that don't is increasing as time goes on.

I don't get how you see that and see unmotivated, or allowing the woman to dictate the entirety of the relationship. It shows an individual working hard, being responsible, doing what they're supposed to do and the other person never recognizing or being satisfied with the effort, because they believe that their partner is supposed to revolve solely around them and serve their needs totally. You are both responsible for your own happiness and the happiness of your partner and you both have to be equally committed to both aspects and if you are solely focused on your own needs you're going to ruin your relationships.

It cuts both ways and is not just a female problem. I've seen male friends that have done this to their relationships, and I've seen friends whose wives have done it to their relationships and I've seen healthy relationships where it is mutual. Your partner is responsible for aspects of your own goals, but they are not responsible for the totality of them. They're there to assist, not to make it happen for you.

My parents have been married for nearly 40 years and I've never seen my mother or father chew the other one out, because they recognize that they're both independent people and part of a relationship. The closest it has come is my dad telling my mom that it was time to retire and that she didn't owe the school she worked for any more than she had already given and that the situation (her job) was devolving into a scenario where she was being made unhappy by it. She retired 10 years ago and they've been happy ever since. My parents relationship was preceded by my dad having another wife that reflects what's in that diagram. I have two brothers that have very healthy relationships, and two brothers that, from my perspective, have less than ideal relationships, one is my brother's fault, one that is a mutual problem between my brother and his wife, but leaning towards his wife. Neither is as bad as that diagram.

ETA: The issue as I see it now is that there's been a shift in society from the man being the provider and the woman being the caretaker, to both being the provider and both being the caretaker and the balance of that is much harder to achieve because you have to shift roles dynamically between two people and when one person doesn't shift when necessary it can cause resentment. My parents relationship worked as well as it did/does, because my dad was still dominantly the provider and my mother was still dominantly the caretaker. My mom's job was bonus money and a way to fill her days rather than the primary role she filled, and she only took that job when all of the kids were old enough to carry some responsibility to care for themselves. When my mom went to work at 9 years old I started doing my own laundry, making sure my room was (relatively) clean and when discipline was necessary it largely fell to my dad, and when comfort was necessary it largely fell to my mom.

Gender roles were a thing for a long time for a reason and we're in an era of adaptation and hopefully we figure it out before we have a population of non-functional people.

Quote:

---

That's not what that diagram depicts at all. It's a story of a guy that does everything he's supposed to do to be supportive and responsible and a woman that believes that the man is there to serve her without the responsibility of serving in return. It's supposed to be a relationship of mutual sacrifice and trust to achieve mutual goals and some people in this world do not understand the concept for a variety of reasons. The percentage of people that don't is increasing as time goes on.

I don't get how you see that and see unmotivated, or allowing the woman to dictate the entirety of the relationship. It shows an individual working hard, being responsible, doing what they're supposed to do and the other person never recognizing or being satisfied with the effort, because they believe that their partner is supposed to revolve solely around them and serve their needs totally. You are both responsible for your own happiness and the happiness of your partner and you both have to be equally committed to both aspects and if you are solely focused on your own needs you're going to ruin your relationships.

---

I think you're surmising things that aren't present in the comic and you're seeing what you want to see. If you go panel by panel, she wants 2 things and he just says OK to them. We have no indication whether he was motivated in his career or doing his part of the household tasks before she starts to ***** at him. We only see it done after. We don't know if he's doing work or playing games on the computer, but the order intimates that he is doing the household chores because she yelled at him to. Then, we get to the end of the first part by showing that it's caused him to resent or be stewing about it while with his kids.

And, this was my point: the comic isn't saying what people think it is. Now, it's a stupid meme, so it could be purely unintentional...which I find it funnier if that's the case.

Quote:

---

ETA: The issue as I see it now is that there's been a shift in society from the man being the provider and the woman being the caretaker, to both being the provider and both being the caretaker and the balance of that is much harder to achieve because you have to shift roles dynamically between two people and when one person doesn't shift when necessary it can cause resentment. My parents relationship worked as well as it did/does, because my dad was still dominantly the provider and my mother was still dominantly the caretaker. My mom's job was bonus money and a way to fill her days rather than the primary role she filled, and she only took that job when all of the kids were old enough to carry some responsibility to care for themselves. When my mom went to work at 9 years old I started doing my own laundry, making sure my room was (relatively) clean and when discipline was necessary it largely fell to my dad, and when comfort was necessary it largely fell to my mom.

---

This sounds like the argument for why we have men who are unable to cope emotionally.

Where, in the whole of that meme, do you see the woman taking responsibility for doing anything at all? That's the point. I don't think it's an accurate representation of every relationship existent today, or even the majority, but it is representative of many of them. Because what's happened is that women have begun doing a portion of what the man used to be solely responsible for (providing), and some women continue to expect that the man is going to do everything he was previously responsible for plus a portion of what she used to be solely responsible for because she's now doing a portion of his main role.

So the meme is "Let's get married." "Let's have kids." "Stop working and go do the chores around the house." "Does the chores" "Work" "Come home, go take the kids to play!" "Tells girlfriend that he's not attentive enough." "Opens herself up to temptation from a man that's fulfilling none of the responsibilities in the relationship." "Complains that he's taking some time for himself, after fulfilling all the responsibilities of the relationship" "Acts on the temptation from a man fulfilling none of the responsibilities of a relationship." "Man discovers betrayal." "Loses his relationship." "Wife gets the kids and the house and the man is left alone."

So when you say I'm seeing things that aren't there, you're right. I'm seeing the man taking care of the responsibilities and the woman not taking care of any and complaining because the man is not fulfilling every responsibility (work, chores, childcare and then not being attentive enough) when they're supposed to be equitably divided. You're talking about video games and the need to nag, when that's not what's presented in the meme. You're reading into what's the possible cause, rather than focusing what's actually occurring in each frame. There's not a single frame in the entire meme that is not about the woman asking for something or having her desires fulfilled until the betrayal frame.

And I'm just talking about the meme, not agreeing that it's the reality.

It's a comic/ meme, it's ok if you see it differently. It's ok to have a different opinion.

Old RV Ag said:

---

Ragoo said:

---

Are you getting primary custody?

---

Thought he was - and she doesn't want to be primary.

---

You are correct, sir! She has yet to pick the kids up from day care when it's her time or have either one, let alone both for more than a few hours on the weekend. Her grandma mostly has them during her time.

Quote:

---

So the meme is "Let's get married." "Let's have kids." "Stop working and go do the chores around the house." "Does the chores" "Work" "Come home, go take the kids to play!" "Tells girlfriend that he's not attentive enough." "Opens herself up to temptation from a man that's fulfilling none of the responsibilities in the relationship." "Complains that he's taking some time for himself, after fulfilling all the responsibilities of the relationship" "Acts on the temptation from a man fulfilling none of the responsibilities of a relationship." "Man discovers betrayal." "Loses his relationship." "Wife gets the kids and the house and the man is left alone."

---

I just think you're choosing to look past the beginning part. they could have easily written it with them both saying they wanted marriage/kids and reflected more that she was truly doing nothing while he worked. They could have chosen to show the guy happy to play with his kids.

But they didn't.

I also didn't say he was playing video games. I said it could be either way - working or not working.

it's also a meme that I don't know if the author really intended it be that detailed. I just thought it was interesting that you can see a pattern of a man abdicating his responsibilities from the get-go.

I haven't seen this level of literary analysis and criticism since my high school English teacher made us read Jane Eyre.

You should have just read Pink Monkey instead.

diehard03 said:

---

Quote:

---

That's not what that diagram depicts at all. It's a story of a guy that does everything he's supposed to do to be supportive and responsible and a woman that believes that the man is there to serve her without the responsibility of serving in return. It's supposed to be a relationship of mutual sacrifice and trust to achieve mutual goals and some people in this world do not understand the concept for a variety of reasons. The percentage of people that don't is increasing as time goes on.

I don't get how you see that and see unmotivated, or allowing the woman to dictate the entirety of the relationship. It shows an individual working hard, being responsible, doing what they're supposed to do and the other person never recognizing or being satisfied with the effort, because they believe that their partner is supposed to revolve solely around them and serve their needs totally. You are both responsible for your own happiness and the happiness of your partner and you both have to be equally committed to both aspects and if you are solely focused on your own needs you're going to ruin your relationships.

---

I think you're surmising things that aren't present in the comic and you're seeing what you want to see. If you go panel by panel, she wants 2 things and he just says OK to them. We have no indication whether he was motivated in his career or doing his part of the household tasks before she starts to ***** at him. We only see it done after. We don't know if he's doing work or playing games on the computer, but the order intimates that he is doing the household chores because she yelled at him to. Then, we get to the end of the first part by showing that it's caused him to resent or be stewing about it while with his kids.

And, this was my point: the comic isn't saying what people think it is. Now, it's a stupid meme, so it could be purely unintentional...which I find it funnier if that's the case.

---

wow. while my delivery was admittedly very crass, my points are also supported by science and quite a few relationship coaches and marriage counselors (female btw). where did you think i came up with that?

That aside.....you're interpretation of the meme was that dense and yet you had the balls to call me insane?

Hi pot! My name is kettle!

Also your interpretation of the meme indicates some very interesting issues that I suspect underly the core of your personality. Your automatic interpretation of the man which was not depicted in the script was one of laziness and abdication of responsibility.

This could indicate a few things. Did ur dad abandon you and your mother when you were young or was he just emotionally unavailable, either working all the time or off playing the ponies instead of going to your little league games?

The fact that your first move which was wholly unsupported by the cartoon on the surface was to twist the meaning of the cartoon and transfer blame from the woman to the husband would also indicate that you have some deep seeded feelings of inadequacy in your own relationship. which woman in your life trampled all over your heart? Did a woman you had a sexual relationship with in your life constantly tell you how you would never measure up and emasculate you regularly or did your mother constantly compare you to a dead beat father?

I'm beginning to understand how everyone ended up divorced.

Quote:

---

wow. while my delivery was admittedly very crass, my points are also supported by science and quite a few relationship coaches and marriage counselors (female btw). where did you think i came up with that?

That aside.....you're interpretation of the meme was that dense and yet you had the balls to call me insane?

---

Yes, most reasonable people would call you what typed insane.

Quote:

---

Also your interpretation of the meme indicates some very interesting issues that I suspect underly the core of your personality. Your automatic interpretation of the man which was not depicted in the script was one of laziness and abdication of responsibility.

---

I'm just going by what's in the slides. She's literally proposing to him. She's pursuing him. You're the one who said a man should always be Alpha. I'm sorry - I don't see Alpha male in this comic.

Quote:

---

This could indicate a few things. Did ur dad abandon you and your mother when you were young or was he just emotionally unavailable, either working all the time or off playing the ponies instead of going to your little league games?

The fact that your first move which was wholly unsupported by the cartoon on the surface was to twist the meaning of the cartoon and transfer blame from the woman to the husband would also indicate that you have some deep seeded feelings of inadequacy in your own relationship. which woman in your life trampled all over your heart? Did a woman you had a sexual relationship with in your life constantly tell you how you would never measure up and emasculate you regularly or did your mother constantly compare you to a dead beat father?

---

4 edits got you here? Come on, man. This is the GB, but come on.

How the hell has an interesting and fun divorce thread turned into this?

Because "I'm right, and you're an idiot for disagreeing"!! More or less.

I'm all for having a different opinion, but some people just take it to a whole notha level with the low blows. I guess it makes them feel superior. I feel sorry for their spouse!

Mostly spelling errors. i have fat fingers and hate autocorrect. Sorry?

I also find it interesting that you went straight to attacking me via number of edits i made rather than refuting my brief analysis of your psychoses. Rather you ignored my assertions completely.

That being said and let me state my rules for marriage more a little more diplomatically.

Hormone therapy has been proven to alter behavior patterns in women. sometimes these affects last decades. Hormonal birth control has been proven to change women's preferences in mates both their physical traits as well as the personality qualities they look out for.

If your dating partner is on birth control while you are dating and once you want to have kids she goes off of her hormonal birth control meds HER personality will change. This is supported by every study done on female personality and birth control ever done. Hell women's magazines habe even highlighted this. What she desires in a mate will change. She might become less attracted to you. She will become to some extent a different person as her behavior changes.

Why as a man would you want the person you have pledged to spend your life with to change in such an extreme and unpredictable way AFTER you marry them? To go into a marriage knowing that your spouse will change dramatically at the drop of a hat would be dumb! And if you marry a woman who has been on the pill your entire dating relationship make no mistake the second she goes off of it her personality will change. Once again ^^^^science and biology^^^

Do not marry a woman who thinks her dad was perfect or whose dad called her princess- to a woman who believes her dad was perfect you as a man will never measure up to the imaginary greatness of her father. good luck ever making her happy. as for a woman who was called princess by her dad all her life- her feelings about what she deserves and what you should do for her and sacrifice for her and provide for her will be completely out of whack with reality because daddy always provided for her whatever her heart desired and she blithely accepted it without really seeing and experiencing and participating in the hard work that it required to get that stuff. her daddy was her prince and sacrificed all for her and her views of men and the proper relationship with a man will be forever clouded by that whacked out relationship. her dad has put her on a pedestal all her life and now she believes she belongs there. so in your relationship with her if you do not keep her on that pedestal she will not be happy, but a relationship where one person is valued above another is not a healthy one, and will end up in resentment and being taken advantage of.

Have sex with your wife. Good sex. Headboard shaking, sheets wet sex. for women more than men sex can be a drug. the endorphins released in women are so intense when done right that it can be like imprinting on an individual. if she associates being with you the same way a drug addict associates heroine with a high she will not cheat on you. You become her high.

Women are anxious creatures. this is a fact. google how many more women suffer from anxiety than men. The difference is significant. hormone therapy makes this worse^^^biology is a *****^^^

anxious people need security to not feel anxious. taking on the masculine role in the relationship provides the security a woman emotionally needs and craves.

case in point- When a man makes dinner plans for his S/O how does that make her feel?

QUESTION FOR THE LADIES
You come home from work and find a note on the bed from your guy. It reads- wear this and the red heels i like. I have taken the kids to your mother's. Be ready by 6:30 and be ready for a fun night. You get ready and he is home promptly by 6:30 with your favorite flowers. He drives. He takes you to your favorite restaurant. No arguments about what you feel like eating. He knows what restaurant is your favorite because you went there a month ago together and said how much you loved everything about the restaurant. You can't believe that he remembered because there was so much else going on at the time and the comment you made was just in passing. But your guy, he was listening to you and filed that precious piece of information away because what you like is important to him.

When you get there the line is out the door, but your man puts his hand gently on the small of your back and ushers you past everyone else waiting in the cold and he opens the door for you. He called ahead and made a reservation! you are taken directly to your table. He pulls out your chair as you sit. He takes care of the bill without a word. after dinner He takes you to listen to music at your favorite bar. You shiver slightly because the night breese is cool and the dress he picked out is a little flimsy. He notices and saying "Allow me." removes his suit jacket and drapes it over your shoulders, then pulls you tight into his body so you can feel the warmth and strength of his chest. "Is that better?" He asks as you snuggle deeper into him. then this man drives you home.

so women....

How do you feel? Are you stressed?
Would you consider this a romantic evening?
What are you going to do to him when you get home?
Is divorce or cheating on the table?

^^^^^This is an alpha. He listens to his mate and knows her. She doesn't have to ask. he shows her that he is thinking about her and does FOR her.

Is this insane?

I think Staff should put a warning sign on this post for females because they may have a flash flood in their panties after reading all this Alpha goodness.

Not gonna lie. I'm thinking of joining your team after reading that.

Beer Baron said:

---

I think Staff should put a warning sign on this post for females because they may have a flash flood in their panties after reading all this Alpha goodness.

---

It was when I did this exact thing for my wife out of the blue and she ended up being pissed most of the night- the snuggling when i gave her my jacket never happened- that I knew I was not the reason for the relationship problems we were having.

The reasons had something to do with one of the above mentioned "what to watch out for before marrying her" things above.

i told the female friends i had at the time what happened because i had no ****ing clue what i did wrong and they basically told me "that ***** is crazy".

Ags4DaWin said:

---

i told the female friends i had at the time what happened because i had no ****ing clue what i did wrong and they basically told me "that ***** is crazy".

---

"With all things being equal, the simplest explanation tends to be the right one."

All that stuff is nice but it doesn't tell the whole story. You could do all of that generally material type stuff and still treat her like ***** I have a friend who does that. He thinks checking the flowers/dinner/purchases/gentlemanly gestures stuff is all that's required but he generally doesn't treat her very well. He doesn't get it.

MAS444 said:

---

All that stuff is nice but it doesn't tell the whole story. You could do all of that generally material type stuff and still treat her like ***** I have a friend who does that. He thinks checking the flowers/dinner/purchases/gentlemanly gestures stuff is all that's required but he generally doesn't treat her very well. He doesn't get it.

---

I don't disagree. the question then becomes do you treat her like this on a day to day basis. do you tell her Honey I am going to take out the trash for you instead of forcing her to ask you to do it. do you follow through with your commitments? Do you show her you value her?

Do you listen and then take her opinion and needs into consideration and consult WITH her- not TO her- not DEFER TO her when making a decision?
^^^^This is critical that alot of guys miss^^^^
These are all important things for sure.

"take out the trash for you"?

What kind of **** BS is this? How about just take out the trash and not make doing chores something that should be celebrated as a gift to the other people in the household.

One of the greatest lines I learned while at A&M was:
Quit needing to do things. If it needs doing, do it. Otherwise it doesn't really need to be done.

My ex-wife acting like all the household chores were not her problem (but all the money in the bank was) is directly what caused our divorce.

Yeah, the whole "look at me, what I did for you, planned for you, decided for you", etc. doesn't play out so well with all women. Just do it, without being asked, without needing to announce it, to be patted on the back for it. Have a servant's heart, doing chores or planning events and outings because you want to, because you love your spouse. Don't ignore them, don't pressure them, don't control them. It's a mutual respect.

If you need to announce or be noticed, so you can build up points for her to snuggle with you later, so be it. If you see the need to direct their every move, decision, etc, and that works for you, have at it. Seems a bit controlling to me, but to each his own.