Yikes!

Beer Baron said:

---

Yeah but based on that guy's posts on R&P I think it was serious.

---

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poe%27s_law

Beer Baron said:

---

Bo Darville said:

---

Rutedown said:

---

This thread was like chum to the sharks. Prepare for the extreme views

---

What do you consider "extreme"?

---

For starters, that post a couple above yours calling for arranged marriages of 15 year olds. That seemed kind of weird.

---

Y'all Qaeda is here to establish Sharrel Law

Oryx said:

---

Beer Baron said:

---

Bo Darville said:

---

Rutedown said:

---

This thread was like chum to the sharks. Prepare for the extreme views

---

What do you consider "extreme"?

---

For starters, that post a couple above yours calling for arranged marriages of 15 year olds. That seemed kind of weird.

---

Y'all Qaeda is here to establish Sharrel Law

---

Gotdammit we don't need another law firm.

Oryx said:

---

Y'all Qaeda is here to establish Sharrel Law

---

Did Al Qaeda burn down Sharrel's she-shed?

His writing reads a lot more like a nihilistic dystopianist to me. He sees a very dark vision of the future in many terms, and he wants to usher that in that destruction. It's just spite and resentment against life itself, but it makes it easier if the person can find a convenient target to blame and rationalize their actions against.

Unfortunately, there are all sorts of people out there that harbor deep resentment and irrational hatred, have lived hard unforgiving lives, and have serious mental health issues. You never know who it may be thst actually goes over the edge. Some shoot, some bomb, some burn, some drive through crowds.

In the bright side, even with all that, the world is actually getting better and safer all the time, statistically speaking.

IMO it's less a gun issue and more of a cultural issue. America has largely adopted a culture of death. Look at the most watched shows on TV, the movies that make the most money, the games that are the most popular, the music, the top stories on the news, etc. Everywhere you go you see death so is it any wonder that an entire generation is/has grown up not placing the same value on life that previous ones did? Toss in the number of kids in a single parent household, increasing numbers of high school drops outs, religion on the decline, etc. and this is what you get. It's not about gun control because even if we stopped the sale of guns there would still be hundreds of millions of them in this country. Until we retrain our society on what is and is not acceptable things will only get worse IMO.

Shife said:

---

Oryx said:

---

Y'all Qaeda is here to establish Sharrel Law

---

Did Al Qaeda burn down Sharrel's she-shed?

---

Yep, and now Sharrel will get a new shi-shi'er she-shed.

TexasAggie_97 said:

---

IMO it's less a gun issue and more of a cultural issue. America has largely adopted a culture of death. Look at the most watched shows on TV, the movies that make the most money, the games that are the most popular, the music, the top stories on the news, etc. Everywhere you go you see death so is it any wonder that an entire generation is/has grown up not placing the same value on life that previous ones did? Toss in the number of kids in a single parent household, increasing numbers of high school drops outs, religion on the decline, etc. and this is what you get. It's not about gun control because even if we stopped the sale of guns there would still be hundreds of millions of them in this country. Until we retrain our society on what is and is not acceptable things will only get worse IMO.

---

This is the part that the gun control crowd refuses to acknowledge. Stopping the sales, and even confiscation, of guns will do exactly ZERO to stop the gun violence. It will only punish, as has been pointed out, the law-abiding gun owners. The non-law-abiding types will continue on status quo.

UTExan said:

---

Have arranged marriages at 15/16.

All that sexual frustration/sublimation goes away and parents support the couple/family until they can get decent jobs/finish school. It will probably also have the desired effect of reducing gender studies programs. And it will increase the birth rate.

---

A few comments and question for discussion:

How do we explain that the overall murder rate is significantly down while the number of mass shootings is up?

On the gun issue, I think the current psycho types will find another way to kill large numbers. In the middle east and Europe they use bombs. Why not here if guns are restricted? Will the numbers go up or down in that case?

It seems to me the focus should be the fringe groups that are encouraging each other through social media. Treat them just like online Jihadists.


The left will tell you that the gun violence levels in Chicago are created by guns purchased in nearby states with lax gun control laws yet they want to disarm border states. Imagine the carnage if guns are removed from Texas. The Mexican cartels would have a field day.

MooreTrucker said:

---

P.C. Principal said:

---

TSUAggie said:

---

The question needs to be how do we stop any and all violence, not just 'gun violence'. If these guys don't have guns, they will just find some other way to carry out their evil intentions. Some people are just ****ed up in the head.

---

This dodges the issue, though. You're basically saying "well they'll commit crimes anyway so let's not even try." We all know that they use guns because guns are more efficient. If the El Paso guy walked into Walmart with a knife he wouldnt have caused near as much damage and you know it.

Gun violence is a huge problem in the US. I cannot believe we still have a large contingent of people acting like this isn't the case. Most gun control measures probably won't work because there are already as many guns as there are people in the country and the cat is way out of the bag.

We still dont know all the facts about the latest mass shootings du jour so I wont speculate yet. But I do remember the Sutherland Springs church shooter had red flags all over the place but it was somehow glossed over when he bought his gun at Academy. Wtf? Are we not enforcing the background check laws already on the books? Maybe that's a good place to start with harsh penalties for gun vendors who bypass them. Also step up the penalties for anyone who commits a crime with a gun regardless if people were shot.

And mental health. We still treat it like a joke and not a very serious public health issue. Lots of money needs to go into funding proper mental health treatment in the US.

Also is forum 16 seriously arguing that the El Paso shooter wasn't driven by white nationalism? Jesus Christ, the mental gymnastics. Why is it so hard to condemn white nationalism and say it is an evil disgusting movement?

---

A registered Dem AND a white nationalist? Does such an animal even exist? Not according to most Dems.

Anybody saying we don't have a problem is full of dung, but gun control which has been proven NOT to work is not the answer.

The bolded statement is absolutely the answer, and would solve MANY more problems than just gun violence.

---

Mental health is clearly an issue that needs addressing, but solely blaming that for shootings is overgeneralizing. The US does not have higher rates of mental illness than other advanced countries, and there's little to no evidence that the shooters in lots of recent shootings were mentally ill. Many can simply be attributed to virulent hatred of a group of people mixed with ease of access to firearms.

P.C. Principaland said:

---

there's little to no evidence that the shooters in lots of recent shootings were mentally ill.

---

Except that their value for human life led to murdering a bunch of people.

Yeah, but there's a difference between "I'm mad and can't get laid so I'm going to murder a lot of people" crazy, and "I'm going to murder a bunch of people because the voices in my microwave told me to" kind of crazy.

We have ways to treat the latter, but it's expensive and not always easy to keep people on their meds, etc. These people are legitimately mentally ill. The former though - that's a bigger problem in my opinion, because they're not actually experiencing hallucinations or anything, they're just pissed off. I'm not sure how you un-nuttify that kind of nutjob.

It's not as simple as hatred. Lots of people hate other people but do nothing violent. No, these shooters have some very clear typologies and characteristics: they are nihilistic, they are anti-social or have social difficulties, they usually have been in a troubled or abusive situation as a child, they all have recently experienced a life setback or trauma that sort of set them over the edge of just fantasizing, and they often exhibit signs of narcissism or psychopathy. They don't all fit the pattern completely but they do all fit some element of it.

What BB said.

Low regard for human life isn't mental illness, it's evil and depravity. And in the case of the El Paso guy (and e.g. Orlando, NZ, Pittsburgh synagogue), the killer was consumed with hatred for a group of people. The El Paso guy is an evil white supremacist who planned out his attack and drive 10 hours to do it. When it comes to our safety and well being, the spread of evil, hateful ideologies are more of a threat than mental illness, though mental illness is clearly a problem.

Yet somehow every year by nearly every objective measure the U.S. and the world are better off than we were 10 years ago.

BostonAg74 said:

---

And that bleeds over to the second amendment extremists who see limitations on weapons of war as a threat to firearms for self defense and hunting.

---

This is where a lot of people check out with liberal talking points.

Just about every weapon in history was created as a weapon of war, including sling shots. This talking points doesn't make any sense. AR varieties are far from extreme. They're the most common rifle platform sold to the public and used today.

They're used to plink, hunt, and protect homes like all other carbines / rifles. Just because someone doesn't like them it doesn't mean they are unique or extreme.

The weapon of war has historically been used to define weapons derived from wars not used to hunt (nukes, bombs, etc.). The AR platform doesn't fit here. Hell ARs are so scary the average liberal politician doesn't take a second to even understand basic definitions or how they work.

The .556/.223 caliber itself is less lethal than most traditional "hunting" rifle cartridges. They also don't shoot at any higher rate than any other semi automatic rifle or hand gun. People like them because they are highly customizable. You can use one platform for multiple uses (.22 for plinking, .556 for small game, .300 BLK for close range or self defense, 6.5 for long distance).

If the issue was truly about limiting senseless killing, there would be a focus on larger issues of violance and mental health instead of the tools used. But instead agendas are the goal.

Gang shootings in cities with the strictest gun control kill / mame more people each weekend than mass shootings, but this apparently isn't important. 2/3rds of shooting deaths are actually suicides at magnitudes of order higher than mass shootings, but this apparently isn't important. Hammers and machettes kill more people yearly than "weapons of war, but this apparently isn't important.

Nothing changes because there was isn't any data to support bans or restrictions and the real issues aren't important. Just votes and manufactured emotion. Nothing proposed would have stopped either of the killers this week from tools that can kill people. And so it just goes around and around.

harge57 said:

---

Yet somehow every year by nearly every objective measure the U.S. and the world are better off than we were 10 years ago.

---

So we don't need to make America great again? I'm so confused on what the message is supposed to be...

This guy doesn't seem like much of a white supremacist. Those guys are all noise and have been for decades. They are small an number, make tiny protests, and go back to changing oil or stocking produce somewhere.

This guy didn't seem to rave about Muslims, or Jews, or Blacks, or Asians, or anyone besides illegal Hispanic immigrants. His obsession was very focused. He may have been a racist, but not necessarily a supremacist. He was definitely a Nationalist but a quite progressive one. He seems more ruled by nihilistic spiteful hopelessness than anything else.

Say what you will about Steven Crowder, he tends to egg people on a little more than I'd like, but this video was very telling. The appearance of the gun apparently matters more than it's lethality. You can't have a discussion about guns if you are uneducated about guns.

Quote:

---

there's little to no evidence that the shooters in lots of recent shootings were mentally ill.

---

I disagree with this but don't have time to search for links, if anyone would like to help.

MooreTrucker said:

---

Quote:

---

there's little to no evidence that the shooters in lots of recent shootings were mentally ill.

---

I disagree with this but don't have time to search for links, if anyone would like to help.

---

https://www.apa.org/news/press/releases/2019/08/statement-shootings

MooreTrucker said:

---

Quote:

---

there's little to no evidence that the shooters in lots of recent shootings were mentally ill.

---

I disagree with this but don't have time to search for links, if anyone would like to help.

---

you don't need a link. Mentally stable people don't go out and murder as many people as they can.

Ragoo said:

---

MooreTrucker said:

---

Quote:

---

there's little to no evidence that the shooters in lots of recent shootings were mentally ill.

---

I disagree with this but don't have time to search for links, if anyone would like to help.

---

you don't need a link. Mentally stable people don't go out and murder as many people as they can.

---

Well, this was my thought but that doesn't seem to be enough for people these days (not directed at you specifically, Principal).

MooreTrucker said:

---

Ragoo said:

---

MooreTrucker said:

---

Quote:

---

there's little to no evidence that the shooters in lots of recent shootings were mentally ill.

---

I disagree with this but don't have time to search for links, if anyone would like to help.

---

you don't need a link. Mentally stable people don't go out and murder as many people as they can.

---

Well, this was my thought but that doesn't seem to be enough for people these days (not directed at you specifically, Principal).

---

Well no, it's not enough. People assume because someone is a big enough evil POS to go out and shoot people they must be mentally ill, but that isn't always the case at least from a clinical sense. For the El Paso guy the evidence weighs in the opposite direction. He wrote a manifesto of his awful evil beliefs and then drove 10 hours to go commit the attack with Hispanic immigrants as the target. Premeditated and planned out, which does not suggest mental illness. He's just a horribly racist evil person who wanted to do something violent.

It's like the insanity defense in a trial. Very difficult to prove.

Builder93 said:

---

Say what you will about Steven Crowder, he tends to egg people on a little more than I'd like, but this video was very telling. The appearance of the gun apparently matters more than it's lethality. You can't have a discussion about guns if you are uneducated about guns.

---

Can you own a gun while being uneducated about guns?

Unfortunately, yes.

And maybe I should have said, "an educated discussion about guns"

Licenced gun ownership/carry is mandatory.

While were at it, solve football concussion issue by removing helmets

Builder93 said:

---

Say what you will about Steven Crowder, he tends to egg people on a little more than I'd like, but this video was very telling. The appearance of the gun apparently matters more than it's lethality. You can't have a discussion about guns if you are uneducated about guns.

---

That basically describes 99.99% of liberal gun control advocates. They want to ban something they do not understand.

AgsMyDude said:

---

RealTalk said:

---

Scumbag liberals....
Dumbass conservatives....

This is why nothing will ever get fixed in this country.

---

Yep. Our country is extremely divided right now. Both sides care more about winning their side than working together.

And both are to blame for it.

---

There is nothing to work with, with the liberals. Everything they want except for MJ legalisation is bad mojo. They are lying scum bags who hate America and white people. Why would anyone agree to negotiate with such pathological liars?

For the right, it's not so much about winning, but stopping the progressive leftist agenda from destroying the most successful country in the history of the world. An agenda which is unarguably supported by globalist that want to see the downfall of the American superpower. Liberals vary greatly, but they are either brainwashed, shockingly ignorant, insane, flat out evil, or a combination of the former options.

Do not take the overwhelming liberal bias in popular media, academia, and bureaucracy lightly. It is very dangerous!

please go away