PascalsWager said:

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Aggie7158 said:

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Surely Mu will run the 400 from now on in future Olympics right? She would pass Felix for the most medals if she does.

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I think she has the 400 and 800 double on the cards for Paris. My question is for the 2028 HOME olympics. Its seems unlikely but if you had to choose what's more likely: adding the 1500 or the 200 for Mu in LA?

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1500 is completely different training than 800. 1500 goes with 3000 much better than 800. 400 and 800 training are the same.

94chem said:

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PascalsWager said:

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Aggie7158 said:

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Surely Mu will run the 400 from now on in future Olympics right? She would pass Felix for the most medals if she does.

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I think she has the 400 and 800 double on the cards for Paris. My question is for the 2028 HOME olympics. Its seems unlikely but if you had to choose what's more likely: adding the 1500 or the 200 for Mu in LA?

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1500 is completely different training than 800. 1500 goes with 3000 much better than 800. 400 and 800 training are the same.

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I'm just playing devils advocate here; I don't know much about track. But Sifan Hassan medaled in the 1500, 5000, and 10k. Is it really absurd to think that someday someone will try the 200, 400, and 800? I believe Felix tried the 200 and 400 one time.

PascalsWager said:

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94chem said:

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PascalsWager said:

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Aggie7158 said:

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Surely Mu will run the 400 from now on in future Olympics right? She would pass Felix for the most medals if she does.

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I think she has the 400 and 800 double on the cards for Paris. My question is for the 2028 HOME olympics. Its seems unlikely but if you had to choose what's more likely: adding the 1500 or the 200 for Mu in LA?

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1500 is completely different training than 800. 1500 goes with 3000 much better than 800. 400 and 800 training are the same.

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I'm just playing devils advocate here; I don't know much about track. But Sifan Hassan medaled in the 1500, 5000, and 10k. Is it really absurd to think that someday someone will try the 200, 400, and 800? I believe Felix tried the 200 and 400 one time.

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1500, 5000, and 10000 are the same training. 800 is way different. This isn't high school. You can't just dominate by having the highest VO2max. Even the most elite trainers in the world don't really know what the 800 is. But it is not the 1500. Not even close. Those 1500 runners look like famine survivors. Here's a list of people who have doubled - scroll to the end. It's not that the 800/1500 can't be done. It's that it can't be done by an elite 400 runner.

https://www.podiumrunner.com/events/olympics/as-hassan-confirms-olympic-triple-attempt-a-look-at-historic-multi-medalists/

Full disclaimer - my daughter is a 2:17 800 runner as a sophomore, and also runs cross country for a state contender. I know the training challenges of trying to do both distances, and being an 800 specialist trying to train with the XC team.

94chem said:

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PascalsWager said:

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Aggie7158 said:

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Surely Mu will run the 400 from now on in future Olympics right? She would pass Felix for the most medals if she does.

---

I think she has the 400 and 800 double on the cards for Paris. My question is for the 2028 HOME olympics. Its seems unlikely but if you had to choose what's more likely: adding the 1500 or the 200 for Mu in LA?

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1500 is completely different training than 800. 1500 goes with 3000 much better than 800. 400 and 800 training are the same.

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I don't agree with this. 400 / 800 training are not the same. Just a couple of months ago we learned Mu trains with the 800 group at A&M and not the 400 group. If training for the two groups is the same then why are there two groups?

On a broader view, training can be tailored for any double. 100/200, 200/400, 400/800, 800/1500, 1500/5000, 5000/10000. At the Olympic level all have been done (i.e. gold medal double), but are rare (a little more common on both ends, i.e. 100/200 and 5000/10000) with only all-time greats having the ability to accomplish.

Also, I doubt Mu has the speed to win gold at 200 and I doubt anyone could handle the 400/800/1500 schedule and win gold. I think 400/800 is very possible for her in 2024 and I wouldn't rule out 800/1500 later if she want's to pursue. No idea if she has the talent to win at 1500, but I wouldn't rule it out.

Sodadude said:

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94chem said:

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PascalsWager said:

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Aggie7158 said:

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Surely Mu will run the 400 from now on in future Olympics right? She would pass Felix for the most medals if she does.

---

I think she has the 400 and 800 double on the cards for Paris. My question is for the 2028 HOME olympics. Its seems unlikely but if you had to choose what's more likely: adding the 1500 or the 200 for Mu in LA?

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1500 is completely different training than 800. 1500 goes with 3000 much better than 800. 400 and 800 training are the same.

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I don't agree with this. 400 / 800 training are not the same. Just a couple of months ago we learned Mu trains with the 800 group at A&M and not the 400 group. If training for the two groups is the same then why are there two groups?

On a broader view, training can be tailored for any double. 100/200, 200/400, 400/800, 800/1500, 1500/5000, 5000/10000. At the Olympic level all have been done (i.e. gold medal double), but are rare (a little more common on both ends, i.e. 100/200 and 5000/10000) with only all-time greats having the ability to accomplish.

Also, I doubt Mu has the speed to win gold at 200 and I doubt anyone could handle the 400/800/1500 schedule and win gold. I think 400/800 is very possible for her in 2024 and I wouldn't rule out 800/1500 later if she want's to pursue. No idea if she has the talent to win at 1500, but I wouldn't rule it out.

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Yes, if you want to nit-pick, of course you won't agree. I don't want to write a tome. but I already said that the 800 is its own animal. There is not set formula. But it is much closer to the 400 than the 1500. The 400/800/1500 schedule isn't the problem. The extreme differences in the races is the problem.

Also, fwiw, the 1500 isn't really a thing. I mean, I guess they had to pull some shenanigans with the metric system to make it a 1.5K. Why can't we just have the darned mile? Even the 1600 comes up a few strides short. Have to remember that when I'm doing my track workouts

Agree Mu doesn't look to have the speed to run 21 high/22 low to win the 200. What makes her special is her strength. Go back to indoors and look at her 200M splits for a 400M race. The "normal" girls drop about 4 or 5 seconds from lap 1 to lap 2. The elite girls drop 3 seconds. Mu only lost 2 seconds from lap 1 to lap 2.

TRM said:

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Agree Mu doesn't look to have the speed to run 21 high/22 low to win the 200. What makes her special is her strength. Go back to indoors and look at her 200M splits for a 400M race. The "normal" girls drop about 4 or 5 seconds from lap 1 to lap 2. The elite girls drop 3 seconds. Mu only lost 2 seconds from lap 1 to lap 2.

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I certainly respect your knowledge of T&F but it is interesting to note that if my research is correct , Mu has only been timed in the 200 once which was her junior year in high school (age 16) and she ran 23.63. Is it not possible to think that with speed training she could now run in the low 22's (maybe faster) particularly with 2 1/2 more years of physical maturity?

box65 said:

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TRM said:

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Agree Mu doesn't look to have the speed to run 21 high/22 low to win the 200. What makes her special is her strength. Go back to indoors and look at her 200M splits for a 400M race. The "normal" girls drop about 4 or 5 seconds from lap 1 to lap 2. The elite girls drop 3 seconds. Mu only lost 2 seconds from lap 1 to lap 2.

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I certainly respect your knowledge of T&F but it is interesting to note that if my research is correct , Mu has only been timed in the 200 once which was her junior year in high school (age 16) and she ran 23.63. Is it not possible to think that with speed training she could now run in the low 22's (maybe faster) particularly with 2 1/2 more years of physical maturity?

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It's certainly possible. Mu would also have to deal with Mboma who is already running a 21.8 and holds the U20 WR or her 18 yr old countrywoman Masilingi (22.2).

Miller-Uibo finished last, but she gave up in that last round when it was apparent she was fit enough - she's run 21.7 before.

It's all hypothetical but I doubt the schedule allows it. The 800 and 200 were run 30 minutes apart from each other.

She's not at the Olympic medal level in the 200 and 1500. Will be cool to see her try some in random meets though.

That's a huge ask. Hasn't been done even a single time by a man or woman in nearly 50 years.

box65 said:

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TRM said:

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Agree Mu doesn't look to have the speed to run 21 high/22 low to win the 200. What makes her special is her strength. Go back to indoors and look at her 200M splits for a 400M race. The "normal" girls drop about 4 or 5 seconds from lap 1 to lap 2. The elite girls drop 3 seconds. Mu only lost 2 seconds from lap 1 to lap 2.

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I certainly respect your knowledge of T&F but it is interesting to note that if my research is correct , Mu has only been timed in the 200 once which was her junior year in high school (age 16) and she ran 23.63. Is it not possible to think that with speed training she could now run in the low 22's (maybe faster) particularly with 2 1/2 more years of physical maturity?

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If we take her 48.3 leg and apply the Clyde Hart formula (48.3 - 3.5)(0.5)=22.4. Hart used it the other way in order to estimate 400m potential based on 200m speed of an athlete. Of course, a relay split should be faster than an open 400 out of blocks. However, based on this, I'd guess she could run 22 flat or so right now.

As another estimate, Lee Evans was said to be the best 400 runner ever given his relatively poor top-end speed. He ran 43.8 in the 400 and 10.5 in the 100. This would put her at 11.5 in the 100. She has to be faster than that.

Thoughts?

https://instagr.am/p/CSSbe5_H4R4

TXAggie2011 said:

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coloradoag69 said:

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It's been informative and entertaining reading your thoughts about Mu.

I think her best chances are the 400 / 800 double plus the 4x400 women's and mixed relays. Particularly the mixed relay was the first track event, so why not send out our best team? I don't know if the mixed relay will now be a permanent event, but if it is, why can't we field a team that would win by as big a margin as both the men and women's 4x400 teams did?

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The mixed relay is permanent, as far as I know.

There may be more emphasis placed on it over time, but its a good way to get the rest of the relay pool a race or two before the men's and women's relays later in the meet.

This year, the mixed 4x400 final was the same session as the women's 800 semis. It'd likely be pretty hard to convince Mu to run 1200 meters in one session.

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It was added because most countries cannot field 4 men or 4 women at a high enough standard for the same sex relays but could do two men and two women. Higher participation rates by the countries.

double aught said:

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Awesome greeting, but put your phones down people and enjoy it.

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This is my biggest peeve about society these. What in the hell is the point of filming something you'll never watch again.

wangus12 said:

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double aught said:

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Awesome greeting, but put your phones down people and enjoy it.

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This is my biggest peeve about society these. What in the hell is the point of filming something you'll never watch again.

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It's ridiculous. Most of this is for social media bragging. "Look where I am, everyone!"