I think you've misunderstood and think I don't know why Holland wasn't getting a lot of attention or that it was stupid not to re-sign him.

I'm saying that I wouldn't have cared either way, as with a 1-year deal it's not something that is going to really hurt your club.

As for it being a roster issue... Kyle Lohse got 2 starts last year. Lucas Harrell got 4. AJ Griffin got TWENTY-THREE. The two years before that the Rangers averaged 13+ starters. Having a place for a guy like Holland to get starts wouldn't be an issue, it rarely is.

Cashner actually happens to be the perfect example of this. Sure there's upside... But this is his 7th year in the league and he's only had one season where he's actually put up really good numbers.

30 years old, 7 years in the league, ERA+ of 95. $10 million.

30 years old, 8 years in the league, ERA+ of 100. $11 million (with $1.5m to go a different direction)


It's basically a "change of scenery" type move. I have little doubt that Texas would have been in on Holland at $6m/year -- Holland felt it was time to go somewhere else if money was the same.

Kyle Lohse and AJ Griffin signed minor league contracts. Lucas Harrell came over in a trade. None were a November/December off-season commitment to be on the 25 man roster like signing Derek Holland would have been.

I think the Rangers signaled they were done with Derek Holland when they spent $11.5 million to replace him on the roster rather than keeping him for $11 to $12.5 million (11 million plus next year's 1.5 million buyout). They were moving on.

They made the decision to bet on someone else filling out the rotation with effective pitching.

Quote:

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I think you've misunderstood and think I don't know why Holland wasn't getting a lot of attention or that it was stupid not to re-sign him.

I'm saying that I wouldn't have cared either way, as with a 1-year deal it's not something that is going to really hurt your club.

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My first post was a general comment on Derek Holland's market value. Addressed to no one.

My second post was a direct response to what you just said you were saying---that a 1-year deal doesn't hurt the club. I'm saying there is an opportunity cost whenever you sign a major league free agent.

To put it explicitly in terms of "harm": If you sign a guy who performs worse than someone else you could have signed, the club has been hurt.

There's no qualifier there. That would include a 1-year deal. You've got room to carry 5 starting pitchers on the roster and you'll need each one every 5 days. You add a player and that means you're not adding one of a bunch of other players. That's opportunity cost...

...and back to my first post about his market value: I don't think many teams were going to be inclined to pass over some other available free agents for Derek Holland. Hence, he wasn't going to get a whole lot on the market.

Just a point of order...

Cashner and Holland are very similar in where they are. Both have lost velocity, which made them hitable.

The difference is why they became hitable and what can be done to correct them.

I think the Rangers felt they have done everything they know how, in order to fix Holland.

With Cashner, I've hear multiple times that Brocail believes he can fix him.

In 2015, Tom House was on the broadcast when the Rangers played SD and Sheilds was pitching. He pointed out that Shields had shortened his stride. As a result, the rpm was decreased and he had less movement.

I don't know Cashner, and I have little trust in Brocail. But, he could know something.

Yeah. The Rangers must have seen something and with signs pointing to them having a quiet offseason, they must have wanted to leave little to chance in acquiring Cashner.

Buster Olney called the signing "puzzling" and other experts have questioned it, too.

Cashier used to be a solid ground ball pitcher...he got away from that and his performance suffered. Perhaps Brocail thinks he can get the ground balls back? We'll just have to wait and see.

http://m.mlb.com/news/article/208303460/mlb-hot-stove-free-agent-and-rumor-roundup/


Rangers looking into Encarnacion
The Texas Rangers have not ruled out signing first baseman Edwin Encarnacion, general manager Jon Daniels suggested while appearing on MLB Network Radio on Wednesday.
Daniels left open the possibility of bringing in the free-agent slugger, but told host Casey Stern, "It's got to be the right situation to do it."
Encarnacion hit .263 with 42 home runs and an American League-leading 127 RBIs for the Blue Jays last season and is considered to be one of the best hitters available in free agency. The 33-year-old has hit 30-plus home runs in five consecutive seasons.
The Rangers are in need of a first baseman after their primary option in 2016, Mitch Moreland, signed a one-year deal with the Red Sox. Bringing in Encarnacion would fill the power void left by Moreland, who hit 22 home runs for Texas last season.
Encarnacion was said to be seeking an $80 million contract earlier this offseason, but the market has not turned out as expected. It's possible he could go the route Mets outfielder Yoenis Cespedes took last offseason when he signed a three-year deal that included an opt-out clause after one season, allowing him to hit the open market a year later, but without having any Draft-pick compensation tied to him.
Daniels hinted on SiriusXM that the Rangers may be willing to open their wallet for the right player.
"We're going to have the highest payroll in the history of the franchise," Daniels told Stern.
Encarnacion has also been connected to several other teams, including the Blue Jays and Indians.

We hardly knew ya.... Dragmire wasn't a Ranger for long.




By Adam Berry / MLB.com | @adamdberry | December 14th, 2016

PITTSBURGH -- The Pirates brought back Brady Dragmire on Wednesday, claiming the right-hander off waivers from the Rangers less than two weeks after Texas picked him up from Pittsburgh.
The Bucs initially acquired Dragmire on Oct. 5, sending cash to the Blue Jays in exchange for the 23-year-old right-hander. The Rangers claimed him off waivers on Dec. 2, then designated him for assignment Tuesday to make room for free-agent outfielder Carlos Gomez.
With the addition of Dragmire, the Pirates' 40-man roster is full.
Dragmire, a 17th-round Draft pick in 2011, pitched for Double-A New Hampshire last season. He went 4-6 with a 4.38 ERA over 45 relief appearances, totaling 41 strikeouts and 28 walks in 72 innings. Over six Minor League seasons, he has recorded 2.11 outs on the ground for every one out in the air.

EE really would make a lot of sense. Right handed power bat at a position of need for sure, and he could also DH. Signing him would also likely make the outfield situation a little bit less dire in terms of production from whoever we'll have in LF, assuming we move Choo to more of a DH role, which would seem to make the most sense given his recent injury issues.

EE makes sense on a 3 year deal.

4 years of EE... You end up with two guys on your roster that you'd really rather have DH'ing (Choo/EE) for a long time.

I have zero interest in EE.

In unrelated information... MLB has increased penalties for positive PED tests.

Anyone have a list of players with exceptions for Adderall?! Asking for a friend.

DallasAg 94 said:

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I have zero interest in EE.

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If we can get him at a discounted price, why?

Maybe Gomez/Lucroy/Rua replace Beltran/Desmond/Moreland's production, but I'd feel a whole lot better with another bonafide slugger in the lineup.

As much as I like Napoli and as much as I dislike Encarnacion, there is no doubt who the more reliable producer is.

Looks like Hambone has a workout scheduled with the Rangers in hopes of getting a MiL deal.

free_mhayden said:

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EE makes sense on a 3 year deal.

4 years of EE... You end up with two guys on your roster that you'd really rather have DH'ing (Choo/EE) for a long time.

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I'm probably fine with him at first base most of the time during a 4-year contract---its only passable defense that I think you can keep up alright, but the bat is well worth it. More worried about that bat, which DH doesn't get you away from.

That said, I personally find it a bit silly to have zero interest in him without knowing the price.

For me, the question is where does the price end up at; will I financially feel comfortable platooning him in years 3, 4 or whenever if his age catches up to him.

KT 90 said:

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DallasAg 94 said:

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I have zero interest in EE.

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If we can get him at a discounted price, why?

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He has always sent the Brady Anderson Ryan Braun vibe.

One report has 10% of MLB on Adderall. That is alarming, as well as disappointing to me.

DallasAg 94 said:

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KT 90 said:

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DallasAg 94 said:

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I have zero interest in EE.

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If we can get him at a discounted price, why?

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He has always sent the Brady Anderson Ryan Braun vibe.

One report has 10% of MLB on Adderall. That is alarming, as well as disappointing to me.

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I bet its higher

PatAg said:

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DallasAg 94 said:

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KT 90 said:

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DallasAg 94 said:

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I have zero interest in EE.

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If we can get him at a discounted price, why?

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He has always sent the Brady Anderson Ryan Braun vibe.

One report has 10% of MLB on Adderall. That is alarming, as well as disappointing to me.

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I bet its higher

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Yes. That was an old stat. One poster on here indicated the positive impact it gives. If it does give the benefit most believe, those using it have an advantage to make the show, which will boost it's numbers. In addition, as easy as it is to get... more players will dabble with it.

SIAP Look at June 2 - July 20. Dear sweet mother of mercy. It's going to be rough.

http://texas.rangers.mlb.com/schedule/sortable.jsp?c_id=tex&year=2017

I don't know what "CalltothePen" is but their minor league "expert" released his top 10 Rangers prospects list:

http://calltothepen.com/2016/12/21/texas-rangers-top-10-prospects-2017/

Plus one bonus newcomer to watch out for pick!

10. Yanio Perez (21-3B-Cuba, #29 MLB): I don't know anything about this kid. However a "5 Tool Guy" who doesn't play CF? Video shows him at 3B and RF.

9. Jairo Beras (21-OF-A+, #11 MLB): Projected in article to be in AA for 2017.

8. Brett Martin (21-LHP-A+, #8 MLB): Projected in article to be in AA for 2017

7. Eric Jenkins (19-OF-A, #7 MLB): Projected in article to be at A+ in 2017.

6. Cole Ragans (19-LHP-Rk, #5 MLB): Projected for extended ST, then NWL (Spokane)

5. Ronald Guzman (22-1B-AAA, #4 MLB): Projected AAA.

4. Ariel Jurado (20-RHP-AA, #6 MLB): Projected AA or AAA.

3. Andy Ibanez (23-2B-AA, #2 MLB): Projected AAA, and possible position switch to LF

2. Yohander Mendez (21-LHP-AAA, #1 MLB): Projected AAA with callup during season.

1. Leody Taveras (18-OF-ShortA, #3 MLB): Projected full A.

Newcomer: Alex Speas (18-RHP-Rk, #9 MLB): Projected Adv Rk.

I'm not a fan of clickbait articles that make you click through their list. I'm also not sure they provided anything of additional value.

So the latest rumor that is picking up steam is that Texas is looking to offer EE a 3 year deal, front-loaded, with an opt-out after the first year... Which basically amounts to Texas either getting 1 year of productive EE or 3 years of highly questionable production.

Some of the talk among beat reporters is that this is our year to "go for it", but I just don't see it... Not just that adding EE doesn't really make us a AL pennant favorite, but also Daniels has never seemed the go for it type in the off-season, and I have faith he'll always re-tool and keep us competitive. I feel like his "go for its" happen at the mid-season trade deadline.

I would be totally fine if we got Napoli over EE, if we could get Napoli for more than basically a year. Either of those guys would perform well here, I would think. Immediate fill in at 1B.

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I'm not a fan of clickbait articles that make you click through their list. I'm also not sure they provided anything of additional value.

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The irony of this on a message board full of fan fiction novelettes.

And also, folks gotta stop copying and pasting the contents of copyrighted articles.

jtstanley4621 said:

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I would be totally fine if we got Napoli over EE, if we could get Napoli for more than basically a year. Either of those guys would perform well here, I would think. Immediate fill in at 1B.

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I just don't think Napoli is a real difference maker. Fills a need, but he's a 800ish OPS guy if he doesn't decline (he's 35). He's a "good year" Mitch Moreland without the glove.

EE is the type of guy that can basically "replace" one of the holes in your rotation with his production.

TXAggie2011 said:

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Quote:

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I'm not a fan of clickbait articles that make you click through their list. I'm also not sure they provided anything of additional value.

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The irony of this on a message board full of fan fiction novelettes.

And also, folks gotta stop copying and pasting the contents of copyrighted articles.

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The only thing taken from the link you provided is the numbers they gave to the left of the names, and their projected team for 2017. If someone wants the analysis, they can go through the clicks.

Your sensitivity leads me to believe you have an interest in the site and want people to go there. Sorry to ruin your fun.

I was hoping there would be some value, but even their disclaimer says the rankings were based on watching online video and reading reviews of players.

free_mhayden said:

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So the latest rumor that is picking up steam is that Texas is looking to offer EE a 3 year deal, front-loaded, with an opt-out after the first year... Which basically amounts to Texas either getting 1 year of productive EE or 3 years of highly questionable production.

Some of the talk among beat reporters is that this is our year to "go for it", but I just don't see it... Not just that adding EE doesn't really make us a AL pennant favorite, but also Daniels has never seemed the go for it type in the off-season, and I have faith he'll always re-tool and keep us competitive. I feel like his "go for its" happen at the mid-season trade deadline.

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Seems like I've either read that about EE, or for another player. Seems logical of a plan. Seems like more security for the player with less risk than the "pillow contract" as they've been called (cheap 1 year deal to re-establish a higher contract).

Regardless of whom they get, I'll be happy and celebrate how great it is.

I agree. JD has generally gone the route of the mid-season addition. The downside is, it costs prospects, but you have more assurance of what you get for the final push of the season. Getting the off-season guy costs little, but has little assurance they'll be worth the money. Plus, it often costs a long-term over-priced contract.

$85M committed in 2018, with a big group of FAs: Yu Darvish, Jonathan Lucroy, Carlos Gomez and Andrew Cashner

With the new stadium build... the Rangers need to get the STH numbers up. I think they'll sign Lucroy.

If we can get 3 (or so) minor leaguers to make the team, signing Darvish could be affordable. Unless he wants Greinke money. Add Drew Robinson (OF), Mendez (SP) and Gallo (1B) during the season, and I'd be happy. Leclerc, as well.

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Your sensitivity leads me to believe you have an interest in the site and want people to go there.

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Like I said, I don't know what the site is.

It says the list is based on conversations with scouts.

EE has been a much better player than Napoli. Never know what can happen in the future but EE has been a difference maker while Napoli really has not.

In between Choo, Beltre, Darvish, and FWIW, the offseason trade for Fielder, Daniels has made plenty of off-season commitments.

This is coming down to a bunch of flawed players and whatever Daniels' budget is.

Yeah I was speaking more towards the "go for it" attitude. Daniels obviously has made some big time acquisitions in the off-season, but they for the most part were all fits for the short and long-term and not 1-year type deals (though obviously most guys of that caliber aren't available in 1 year deals).

Where as at the trade deadline he has made those "go for it" moves -- Lee, Garza, Dempster, etc...

Sign EE and you're looking at this for your lineup:

1) Gomez
2) Choo
3) EE
4) Beltre
5) Odor
6) Lucroy
7) Andrus
8) Mazara
9) Rua

That's pretty stout.

Problem is the rotation is still just Hamels, Darvish, Perez and a couple of question marks (and even Perez as a #3 is still a question mark... he's a #4-type thus far).

That's why I think the EE signing would be big as it would pickup whatever win-shares that we're missing from one of those rotation spots... No EE and rolling with a #4/#5 of Cashner and Colby?

Yuck.

Encarnacion to Cleveland, per ESPN.

Well ****

Guess we're getting Napoli

This team is going to have more holes going into this coming season than we did going into last. Not sure what the exact plan was this offseason, but it appears to have failed or been heavily altered. We currently have nothing meaningful at DH or 1B, saying the back end of the rotation is a question mark is being generous, and 2/3 of our OF have serious Jekyll and Hyde tendencies. Plenty of time until the start of spring training, but options at this point seem to be very limited.

They've got a healthy Darvish from game 1. Significant upgrade at C with Lucroy. Sign Napoli and they are certainly no worse at 1B. Gomez in CF. While there's work to do, I feel just fine about this team compared to the April 2016 roster.

DannyDuberstein said:

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They've got a healthy Darvish from game 1. Significant upgrade at C with Lucroy. Sign Napoli and they are certainly no worse at 1B. Gomez in CF. While there's work to do, I feel just fine about this team compared to the April 2016 roster.

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With Darvish, we hope he's healthy for game 1, but there's certainly plenty of time for him.to tweak something between now and then, and with his history, wouldn't be surprising. 1B/DH we have Napoli and nothing else, but I'm also not sold on Rua and Gallo looks like Hellen Keller with his strikeout rate at this point. Gomez can be a really good CF, but he can also be extremely lazy and Choo is a mystery at this point.