JJMt said:Absolutely wrong. Just because you disagree with the family's decision doesn't give you the right to make that decision.Infection_Ag11 said:Marcus Aurelius said:Reasonable families. Doctors not empowered to make those decisions in the US. I guess for good reasons. But these are desperate times. This is not the case in other countries. America litigious.Fenrir said:
Who do you want making those decisions?
It may sound cold, but we really should allow medical professionals to make the call not to intubate a 100 year old with dementia and respiratory failure. That's not only cruel for the patient, but wasteful to the healthcare industry and puts other lives that could actually be saved at risk. It's obscene the futile care we are forced to provide and the unnecessary pain and suffering and wasted resources it leads to.
I can't think of a worse idea than giving people who have no connection to the patient at all the right to make life and death decisions.
You use the 100 year old on a vent as your propaganda point, but where does it stop? Who are you to decide the value of another's life?
You are advocating for sweeping changes in national policies off of one anecdotal, bad decision. I thought that you were a numbers guy? You don't like anecdotal stories as evidence. Well, I suppose that's true only if you don't like the anecdotes.
That story isn't anecdotal, it's a recurrent, widespread and pervasive scenario for anyone who routinely cares for critically ill patients. And it's correlation with increased healthcare costs is extensively documented and well understood.
With regards to where it ends, I discussed that previously. It should be an extremely rare occurrence with very specific criteria, as our policies for withdrawing care on brain dead patients without family consent are.
And it's precisely the lack of emotional connection that allows for objective judgements. A family's emotional connection often leads them to ask for things that are harmful to the patient and lead to unnecessary pain and suffering. It is families, not doctors, whose decisions most commonly harm patients.
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