They're not fine because there's no accountability for the quote. If I'm giving a quote on the condition of anonymity then I can say whatever the hell I want and nobody is going to hold me accountable for it.

Maybe in this particular case the quotes are all truly honest and fine, but how do we know that? How do we know "anonymous scout" isn't trying to hurt Maker's draft stock so his team can get him later in the draft? Isn't that what you'd do?

That's the problem with anonymous quotes in this story, in recruiting stories, in political stories, in stories about the military or whatever it might be. There's no accountability for the quote, and there's no accountability for the writer.

I'll get off my journalism soap box but people complain all the time about how journalism is gone to crap but then they pay for anonymously sourced stories.

Agree that there could be ulterior motives at play with the negative comments, but a quote doesn't have to be anonymous for it to be bull****.

Recruiting websites, the main source of information for college sports, have turned into propaganda machines. Pro and college teams are restricting the flow of information more and more each year, to the point that anybody going in record with a negative comment is banned. Urban Meyer is banning certain reporters/newspapers. All different sorts of ****ery is going on.

If we didn't have anonymous quotes, I'd argue news coverage in general, not just sports, would be worse off. I do agree that some anonymous quotes can be over the top, because you're giving the person freedom from accountability.

And my argument is that we're already worse off because we do allow anonymous quotes. It's absolutely stupid.

If you can't put your name on it, then don't say it, and if you can't get someone to put their name on it, then don't write it until you can. With very few exceptions, that should be the way it works.

For example, in this case, I'm sure there are a number of college coaches/assistants who recruited Thon but now can't that could give you a quote or two about his ability compared to other players they've recruited. How about the guys that recruited Kevin Durant, do they think he compares to Kevin Durant?

There are plenty of people that you could have quoted.

I saw Maker play multiple times in person last summer. Unless he has improved dramatically, he is not ready for the NBA at this point, for the multiple reasons already pointed out in this thread. Is he a rare talent with his height/skill set? Yes. Does that make him a sure fire NBA star? No.

He would absolutely get drafted. He would not be a lottery pick unless someone wants to take a flyer on him due to the hype surrounding him (creating some fan base buzz).

IMO, he was never seriously considering college. I do NOT base this on anything other than reading between the lines, but if denied entry in the NBA draft, he would be playing in Europe next year anyway. And I think that could be really beneficial for his progress anyway.

Regardless, I am rooting for him and hope HH is right. Really talented and a super nice kid.

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For example, in this case, I'm sure there are a number of college coaches/assistants who recruited Thon but now can't that could give you a quote or two about his ability compared to other players they've recruited. How about the guys that recruited Kevin Durant, do they think he compares to Kevin Durant?

There are plenty of people that you could have quoted.

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How many quotes have you seen from a head coach or assistant coach that disparages a player from another team/school?

BTW, I think part of this silliness stems from the new internet fad employed by certain sites comparing a recruit with an NBA player. For instance, I have seen on at least two places where Jarrett Allen is compared with Tim
Duncan. And I get it. Allen has a similar "style" of game at HIS level. Does this mean he can play like Duncan now? Of course not. Does this mean he will EVER be able to play like Duncan? Almost certainly not. We are talking about arguably the greatest PF in the history of the game. But it makes it interesting for today's audience I guess.

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BTW, I think part of this silliness stems from the new internet fad employed by certain sites comparing a recruit with an NBA player. For instance, I have seen on at least two places where Jarrett Allen is compared with Tim
Duncan. And I get it. Allen has a similar "style" of game at HIS level. Does this mean he can play like Duncan now? Of course not. Does this mean he will EVER be able to play like Duncan? Almost certainly not. We are talking about arguably the greatest PF in the history of the game. But it makes it interesting for today's audience I guess.

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thats not a "new internet fad". that is as old as mankind.

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BTW, I think part of this silliness stems from the new internet fad employed by certain sites comparing a recruit with an NBA player. For instance, I have seen on at least two places where Jarrett Allen is compared with Tim
Duncan. And I get it. Allen has a similar "style" of game at HIS level. Does this mean he can play like Duncan now? Of course not. Does this mean he will EVER be able to play like Duncan? Almost certainly not. We are talking about arguably the greatest PF in the history of the game. But it makes it interesting for today's audience I guess.

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thats not a "new internet fad". that is as old as mankind.

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Touche'

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How many quotes have you seen from a head coach or assistant coach that disparages a player from another team/school?

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Why would they be disparaging? Just an honest assessment. And he's not going to any school so why would it matter?

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Why would they be disparaging? Just an honest assessment. And he's not going to any school so why would it matter?

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ok, how many quotes have you seen from a head coach or assistant coach that includes negative comments about a player from another team/school? I really don't remember any, ever.

And I would presume most coaches don't want to go on record saying a guy is very raw and much worse than people might think for multiple reasons:

1. It benefits the coach in no way.
2. Thon has a handler. The handler might have future players. You would unnecessarily burn a bridge with that handler by giving negative scouting reports of one of his prized possessions.

You can frame the question so that it's not just ragging a kid. Maybe a coach says "We really think he could be a great mid-range player if he developed his upper body at the college level..." or something which is a way of saying "dude is weak as hell" without actually saying it. A coach doesn't have to say "this guy sucks."

Also I'm not necessarily saying that it has to be college coaches, that was just an example. Maybe coaches that faced him in high school? Former coaches? There are tons of options.

Here's my point though. "Anonymous scout #1" had this to say:

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He's a guy that I think is more two or three years away. If we were drafting him, [we'd tell him to] go spend two or three years in Europe or in the D-League. In my opinion, I don't even think he's a roster guy next year. At some point, I feel like it's just been a hype machine. I've watched probably five games. And what really wows you is that he's super tall. I tried to watch him and then I tried to go back and watch Kevin Durant in high school. This kid has some things where you're like, 'maybe.' But Kevin Durant you knew was a sure shot. I don't see that in this kid. So when you start making comparisons and say he's gonna be a player, we've been saying that since the 10th grade, but now he's in the 12th grade and we're not saying he's a sure shot. We haven't seen that evolution. We haven't seen him take that next step. So what makes me want to take him even in the first round at all, unless you're a deep playoff team and you don't care if he plays in three years or not.

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Now, not a single thing in there is specific. Why is he a roster guy? Why has it just been a hype machine? What evolution do you want to see? What is the next step?

This guy got to remain anonymous, call a high school a kid a "hype machine," and then not give any actual scouting input as to why. That's ridiculous.

But again, I do get the skepticism towards quotes from anonymous scouts.

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You can frame the question so that it's not just ragging a kid. Maybe a coach says "We really think he could be a great mid-range player if he developed his upper body at the college level..." or something which is a way of saying "dude is weak as hell" without actually saying it. A coach doesn't have to say "this guy sucks."

Also I'm not necessarily saying that it has to be college coaches, that was just an example. Maybe coaches that faced him in high school? Former coaches? There are tons of options.

Here's my point though. "Anonymous scout #1" had this to say:

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He's a guy that I think is more two or three years away. If we were drafting him, [we'd tell him to] go spend two or three years in Europe or in the D-League. In my opinion, I don't even think he's a roster guy next year. At some point, I feel like it's just been a hype machine. I've watched probably five games. And what really wows you is that he's super tall. I tried to watch him and then I tried to go back and watch Kevin Durant in high school. This kid has some things where you're like, 'maybe.' But Kevin Durant you knew was a sure shot. I don't see that in this kid. So when you start making comparisons and say he's gonna be a player, we've been saying that since the 10th grade, but now he's in the 12th grade and we're not saying he's a sure shot. We haven't seen that evolution. We haven't seen him take that next step. So what makes me want to take him even in the first round at all, unless you're a deep playoff team and you don't care if he plays in three years or not.

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Now, not a single thing in there is specific. Why is he a roster guy? Why has it just been a hype machine? What evolution do you want to see? What is the next step?

This guy got to remain anonymous, call a high school a kid a "hype machine," and then not give any actual scouting input as to why. That's ridiculous.

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I guess it comes down to personal preferences. I don't necessarily care about have a name attached to a scouting report, in large part because I likely wouldn't know who the hell the scout is anyways.

But I'd rather hear an honest opinion from an anonymous source than hear Luke Steele from the Milwaukee Bucks or Mike VandeGarde from the Sixers say that if he gets stronger and develops a midrange game, he'll be a much better prospect.

And by the looks of things, Thon does in fact appear to be another product of the hype machine. So I'm ok with someone saying that.

This is just one example, but it's an epidemic in sports "journalism."

And of course you're okay with someone saying that because it's what you think.

But having a name on it matters even if you don't know the name because it means the person that said it is accountable for saying it. Other people in that person's field are going to know who said it. That's the entire point. It's a real quote that the person has ramifications for saying.

Otherwise, and obviously SI (you'd think, although their OSU story got absolutely scorched a few years back) would check it, but a writer could just make up quotes and attribute them to unnamed sources.

nonanonymous scouting report of Mr Maker

http://upsidemotor.com/2016/04/25/nba-draft-scouting-report-thon-maker/

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And slow your roll on #1 pick. Most people dont even project him as a lottery pick in the 2017 nba draft

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Wherever you saw that.....wow. That's absolutely,100% ridiculous. This kid will be an MVP candidate within his first 5 years in the NBA.

However, if he actually does skip college basketball, it might take him 6-7 years.

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Okay, Hickory...read wac's post above with that latest scouting report on Maker...do you still think this guy is a probable future NBA MVP candidate?

The NBAPA accepted the age limit in exchange for salary cap changes that were in the players' interests. Stern wanted to get NBA scouts out of high school gyms and proposed 20 as the age limit.

I think it's a mistake to think of this as collusion between the NBA and colleges to keep college basketball alive. But it is intentional that the NBA doesn't want athletes directly in the NBA immediately out of high school. I know Mark Cuban is on record (his blog iirc) as preferring degreed graduates which might be a little silly in the opposite direction, but his reasoning is because of the need for players to not just make money but to also have some grounding in life skills in order to be "professionals".

I don't have an opinion on Maker. Imagine that he does go in the first round and gets developed and is on an NBA bench within three years. That could be less risky with guaranteed pay v. going through a college program. Plus he meets the age requirement and the year gap after HS graduation requirement. I don't know him well enough to even wish him the best of luck, but I don't see why supposedly amateur college athletics should get in the way of a kid wanting to take his talent directly to the NBA. Officially in the "none of our business" category in my opinion.

It of course is a ceiling, and not a given, but to say an athletic 7 footer who can handle the ball and has a nice looking shot could never be the next Kevin Durant is ridiculous. Of course he could be.

BTW, Thon is taller and heavier than Durant coming out of HS (Durant was 204, Maker is 225 now). I can't find any HS stats for Durant, but I would assume he was not as good of a shooter as he is now. No reason to think Maker won't fill into his body as well as start making more shots.

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It of course is a ceiling, and not a given, but to say an athletic 7 footer who can handle the ball and has a nice looking shot could never be the next Kevin Durant is ridiculous. Of course he could be.

BTW, Thon is taller and heavier than Durant coming out of HS (Durant was 204, Maker is 225 now). I can't find any HS stats for Durant, but I would assume he was not as good of a shooter as he is now. No reason to think Maker won't fill into his body as well as start making more shots.

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I nominate you to bump this thread in 5 years and see how valid the Durant/Maker comparisons were.

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To each their own. And I know about the talent. IMO Thon is better at 19 than Giannis Antetokounmpo was at 19. You can quote me on my prediction.

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Well Gianni went 15th and isn't close to being an mvp candidate. Thon would have to be a lot better.

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It of course is a ceiling, and not a given, but to say an athletic 7 footer who can handle the ball and has a nice looking shot could never be the next Kevin Durant is ridiculous. Of course he could be.

BTW, Thon is taller and heavier than Durant coming out of HS (Durant was 204, Maker is 225 now). I can't find any HS stats for Durant, but I would assume he was not as good of a shooter as he is now. No reason to think Maker won't fill into his body as well as start making more shots.

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I'll help you. Maker's handles and shot are nowhere near as good as Durant's were at the same age. When Durant was 19 and finishing his first year of college (same age as Maker is now), people were saying Durant was a transcendent offensive player who would contribute from day 1. Scouts are saying Maker is raw as hell and has a long way to go before he can meaningfully contribute.

Eh Giannis turned 21 a few months ago and is knocking on the door of top 15 player status. He's not yet in the mvp conversation yet, but he's not far off. After they gave him primary ball handler duties, he made the last twenty-ish games of the nba season his ***** and was a triple double and five by five threat every night.

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Jake Fischer (@JakeLFischer)
Several teams have entirely ruled Thon Maker out of the first round due to his age. Multiple sources believe Maker to be 21-23, not 19.

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That's ridiculous! If it's true, I wonder at what age he started claiming he was 4 years younger than he really was. How does that even work? Summer before high school, "na I'll enroll in 5th grade".

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That's ridiculous! If it's true, I wonder at what age he started claiming he was 4 years younger than he really was. How does that even work? Summer before high school, "na I'll enroll in 5th grade".

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It's actually not an uncommon practice for foreign-born players to lie about their age (or for their handlers to lie/go along with the lie) in order to make them more valuable prospects. The misrepresentation of age normally takes place when a kid changes schools or migrates countries.

Happens all the time in baseball with Latin players who come from countries that aren't overly concerned with factual documentation. Miguel Tejada and Rafael Furcal are two high-profile examples. Former A&M basketball recruit Shabazz Muhammad was busted for lying about his age. Julio Franco, who somehow is still playing baseball in his 50s, admitted near the end of his career he was actually 4 years older than people were led to believe.

In Thon's case, he left Sudan when he was 5 or 6, moved to Uganda, then Australia, then eventually the US when he was 13. And then he changed schools 3 times. It would be simple at any of those transitions to falsify records and make him 4 years younger (or more likely, a little bit was taken off at different points).

Apparently even Marv Levy lied about his age to get the Bills HC job. People do funny things when millions of dollars are on the table.

I love this thread. Gave out a lot of blue stars today.

Hey.