Ryder Cup 2023 thread

70,621 Views | 1342 Replies | Last: 1 yr ago by 98Ag99Grad
Woodan99
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HeyAbbott said:

Here is the media already:

Rickie Fowler conceding the putt to win the Ryder Cup is the most Rickie Fowler thing ever

Fitting that Rickie Fowler is the first one to greet the Ryder Cup winners on the green

Did RickieFowler not want to miss his own putt, so he conceded his #usa team's tournament out of his own nerves?




And they are just getting started.

Media will turn this into an anti-team usa disaster. From Zach to Cantlay to Riki and other random stories they came up with
Buck Compton
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Bunch of ****ing morons. On the green and walking on Jordan's line
DannyDuberstein
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Yeah, bethpage is gonna be effin bonkers.
2wealfth Man
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AG
Crazy scene on 18
1872walker
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aginlakeway said:

cb1919 said:

aginlakeway said:

I just looked.

So Fowler lost 3 and 1? What would the score have been had he not conceded that putt?

What hole was it on again?

No trying to be difficult ... I am unable to watch this morning.


It probably wouldn't have changed. It was on the 16th and he was down 1. 99% chance Fleetwood makes it. But with that much pressure, you make him make it.

Agree. Thanks for the information.

So him conceding the putt didn't cost the US the cup. It just officially eliminated them from any chance of winning.

Then you need to make him make it.





HeyAbbott
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AG
It will be a typical rowdy NYC crowd
LCE
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Guess I lost track..thought Fleetwood had 2 putts from there to win hole.
DannyDuberstein
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AG
HeyAbbott said:

It will be a typical rowdy NYC crowd


It's rowdy for the US Open. The RC is gonna be an entire new level of nuts
1872walker
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LCE said:

Guess I lost track..thought Fleetwood had 2 putts from there to win hole.


Rickie was putting for par from further away. He'd need to make and Fleetwood would need to miss. Low probability, but you let it play out.
aggiegolfer2012
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DannyDuberstein said:

First Ryder Cup ever where I looked at both rosters and thought the Euros had the best talent beforehand


The play 8 really played into their hands this week. They easily had the best 3 players, by quite a margin. The only guy we have that can stack up with Hovland, Rahm and Rory is Scheffler, and his form just isn't there.
Add in Fleetwood and they probably had 4 of the best 5 or 6 when it comes to recent play.

Still think Young helps this team. Hindsight about Rickie's health make him an pick over Rickie, but he definitely should've been there over Burns. But that's the only team change I'd have made.

With the last 5 matches being
16.5-11.5
19-9
17.5-10.5
17-11
16.5-11.5
all in favor of the home team, the discussion needs to be had about limiting the home team's involvement on course set up.
Woodan99
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DannyDuberstein said:

HeyAbbott said:

It will be a typical rowdy NYC crowd


It's rowdy for the US Open. The RC is gonna be an entire new level of nuts
Fans are going to go all out since we just lost this one.

cb1919
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cb1919 said:

If it comes down to it….I hate Fowler being the one to bring it home


I was onto something 3 hours ago
2wealfth Man
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aggiegolfer2012 said:

DannyDuberstein said:

First Ryder Cup ever where I looked at both rosters and thought the Euros had the best talent beforehand


The play 8 really played into their hands this week. They easily had the best 3 players, by quite a margin. The only guy we have that can stack up with Hovland, Rahm and Rory is Scheffler, and his form just isn't there.
Add in Fleetwood and they probably had 4 of the best 5 or 6 when it comes to recent play.

Still think Young helps this team. Hindsight about Rickie's health make him an pick over Rickie, but he definitely should've been there over Burns. But that's the only team change I'd have made.

With the last 5 matches being
16.5-11.5
19-9
17.5-10.5
17-11
16.5-11.5
all in favor of the home team, the discussion needs to be had about limiting the home team's involvement on course set up.
would it be good to add a few young hungry guys ala Europe?
Woodan99
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cb1919 said:

cb1919 said:

If it comes down to it….I hate Fowler being the one to bring it home


I was onto something 3 hours ago
I need you to come to Vegas with me. I'll cut 20% of all winnings.
LCE
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Gotcha. Yep should have made him putt it. I was thinking of another hole. Thanks
Woodan99
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I'ts been fun in this thread.

Thank you for the hospitality.

Until next time!
Lt. Joe Bookman
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Lowery to Fairway Jesus….
"I ****ing love youuuuuu"
aggiegolfer2012
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Who do you mean? Outside of Young anyways. Zalatoris injury kept him off the team, he fits that mold. Theegala finished 23rd on points and people were mad about picking JT at 15.
I think we have a team full of young hungry guys. The difference is their top end was playing way better golf than ours. When 3 of the 4 matches on the course are gonna have Rahm/Hovland/Rory, you're going to be in every match. I can't think of an American I feel that way about right now.
98Ag99Grad
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With the exception of 2-3 players, all of these guys play on the PGAT to make a living. This isn't the 90s where you have more than half of team Europe being unknown players. Again they got waxed in alt shot. They have to figure that out. All of the stat geek guys should examine why Europe is that much better and see what changes the US should make and the captain actually listen and use that info
aggiegolfer2012
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98Ag99Grad said:

With the exception of 2-3 players, all of these guys play on the PGAT to make a living. This isn't the 90s where you have more than half of team Europe being unknown players. Again they got waxed in alt shot. They have to figure that out. All of the stat geek guys should examine why Europe is that much better and see what changes the US should make and the captain actually listen and use that info


Europe has lost their alt shot matches 4.5 to 11.5 in the last 2 Ryder Cups in America. So they aren't that much better at it.
This is home teams having way too much control over course set up and it really shows up in foursomes. Since Zinger started this mess of manipulating the course setup in 2008, the home team is 45.5-18.5 in alternate shot. That's ridiculous.
98Ag99Grad
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So what in course setup favored Europe? The driving stats show very minimal difference in accuracy and a slight advantage in length to Europe. Green speed should also be nullified since most play in America.
Chipotlemonger
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I don't buy the course set up being solely responsible for that stat disparity. The game style difference between the euros and Americans is smaller than it's ever been.
aggiegolfer2012
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Not sure, I'm not privy to all the data they have. Broadcast kept talking about how the approach distances basically eliminated wedge play. I don't know how accurate that is because I can't see strokes gained approach based on different distances.
They had 5 of the best 6 players in strokes gained off the tee this week and 4 of the top 5 in approach. Hovland, Rahm, McIlroy and Fleetwood combined averaged +8.5 strokes gained T2G, USA only had 2 players gain a full stroke T2G.
Chipotlemonger
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I mean the euros have bombers too that benefit from wedge play. I don't buy the setup being such a big factor in those first 2 days. The euros just kicked our butts, simple as that.
aggiegolfer2012
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I'm not saying it was the entire reason.
But I'm saying it's part of the reason the home team has 72win% in Foursomes the last 15 years and only a 56win% in the other two formats.

Ran out of posts as a rookie, but edit just to say that I'm tired of home team blowouts. This is tied for the most points a visiting team has scored in the last 5 cups. Something has to change,
Chipotlemonger
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We would have to go back and look at a lot of stats to back it up. For this week at least, I don't think it made a difference.
DannyDuberstein
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I don't think it's setup. I think it's the fact that alt shot is a very difficult style of play where it's hard for a player to find a rhythm, and then when you layer a hostile crowd on top of that, you have guys on the visiting team really prone to wobbling. RC crowds 25-30+ years ago were not exactly tame, but what we are seeing the past 20-25 - and especially the last 10 - is a whole different ballgame
AustinCountyAg
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America got there ass kicked for the simple fact that the majority of the team haven't played competitive tournament golf in weeks. You don't show up to majors taking weeks off thinking you will win. No different here.

It isn't brain surgery
Tailgate88
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Woodan99 said:

DannyDuberstein said:

HeyAbbott said:

It will be a typical rowdy NYC crowd


It's rowdy for the US Open. The RC is gonna be an entire new level of nuts
Fans are going to go all out since we just lost this one.




No kidding! There are dudes booking hotel rooms now.
Woodan99
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Tailgate88 said:

Woodan99 said:

DannyDuberstein said:

HeyAbbott said:

It will be a typical rowdy NYC crowd


It's rowdy for the US Open. The RC is gonna be an entire new level of nuts
Fans are going to go all out since we just lost this one.




No kidding! There are dudes booking hotel rooms now.
Which reminds me. I got selected for tickets for the Augusta National Women's AM

I need to book those quickly.
Big Baccala
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Euros 7-1 in foursomes was backbreaking.
Deluxe
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98Ag99Grad said:

So what in course setup favored Europe? The driving stats show very minimal difference in accuracy and a slight advantage in length to Europe. Green speed should also be nullified since most play in America.
Yea. They kept alluding it during the telecast and I thought it was kinda strange.

At Whistling Straits, our game plan was to force Europe to outgun our guys on a big boy golf course from 175+. I thought the Euro strategy this weekend would be to turn it into a short iron competition (like they did in France).

But when I thought about it more, it kinda made sense. Top to bottom, it's hard to say which team is better with long irons. We had an edge at Whistling Straits, but the teams that showed up at Marco Simone seemed to be much more evenly matched from that range.

To me, the setup was all about catering to Rory's strengths. The Euros knew Hovland was in form and playing like the best player in the world. They also knew Rahm would show up and lead like the fighting Spaniard that he is. If they could get Rory going too, it would be almost impossible for the Americans to overcome that.

Rory's weakness is short irons and wedge play. Luke basically eliminated that aspect of the competition this weekend. Genius IMO. He was an effing beast this week.

But even with Hovland, Rahm and Rory totally going off, we still competed very well against the Euros from Friday afternoon forward. I don't have that many second guesses in terms of who we brought and our strategy. No more than usual anyway.

Like others have said, this weekend was about the Euros big guns getting off the bus on Friday morning ready to ball out and ours needing a full round or two to get back into performance shape. The Euros prepped for this weekend like a major and they were ready to throw punches. Our guys eased into the weekend.

I was impressed with how Scottie, Cantlay, Xander and Morikawa bounced back at certain times on Sat/Sun. Cantlay singe-handedly kept us in it on Saturday. Scottie was a ball-striking god against Rahm. But it was almost too little too late.

We needed those four ready to play on Friday morning and they were not. Hopefully they learned a good lesson because I think the script is going to be similar in 2027. Those are our ball striking studs and we need them ready to play from the jump.

Max and JT should get auto-exemptions to every Ryder Cup indefinitely. Heart and soul of the team.

Scottie/Brooks - Don't take it personally if we ask you to play four ball only in 2027, although Scottie might deserve one more crack at foursomes with Will Z.

Rickie - See ya. Covid, whatever. You've played in three road Ryder Cups. You've had plenty of chances to bring it on the road. It's just not your thing.

Jordan - You're on notice. That was pathetic. New baby, whatever. I bet he would have found a way to prep if it was Augusta. Can't show up looking like that. He better SHOW UP at Bethpage (with his game and leadership) or, tbh, he can stay home too.

Burns, Wyndham, Harman - All showed me something. All fought hard enough to deserve another look in a couple years.

The thing I hate most about the Ryder Cup is that we have to wait another four years to get another crack at the Euros on their soil. We'll probably win at Bethpage in another seemingly unexciting cup. We'll be hungry, out for revenge, have fans/setup on our side. Blah blah blah.

But a win at home in 2025 doesn't mean anything for 2027. Plans need to be put in place going forward to make sure our guys get tournament reps leading up to 2027 and arrive on the first tee ready to fight.
Deluxe
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pbrancazio said:

Euros 7-1 in foursomes was backbreaking.
It was the exact same story in 2014 and 2018. We knew we had to get our foursomes lineup optimized this go around.

Scottie, Cantlay, Xander and Morikawa - our best ball strikers that we really needed to count on in that format - weren't ready to play from the jump. And we got smoked.
cb1919
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AG
In a many ways, it was the perfect storm for the Europeans this year and in this event in general.

- Home field is a massive advantage in these things. All these guys play a sport that only plays one event (the Ryder Cup) where you have fans rooting against you. In Europe, VERY passionate fans.

- Their guys played out of their minds. They were making putts from everywhere. Rahm chipped in 5 times (I think) on day 1. They've figured out a way to play beyond their talent and we play below it, especially in Europe.

- Friday afternoon session 18th hole. They flipped 3 matches to halves. Rose makes a long putt. Rahm makes a long putt that hits the back of the lip pops up in the air and still drops.

- Zach made some horrendous decisions with pairings. The most glaring is Spieth. He played horrible Friday afternoon. You send him out for ALT SHOT on Saturday morning. He plays terrible. You send him out again Saturday afternoon.

- We seem to be a team that excels as front runners and crumble with any adversity. Just look at Burns…yesterday he is screaming "I can't hear you" but gets down early to Rory today and looks like a scared little puppy.

- Our number 1 player has the putter yips. He wins the match today easily without that.

- They always bring a lot of emotions to a very emotional event. At best, half of our team looks emotionally invested or even like they want to be there. I'll pick on Rickie because I think he should have his American citizenship revoked. The dude looks like he's playing a practice round for the Rocket Mortgage today. Same thing he did in Paris. I remember vividly in Paris….he made a long putt to win a hole and he just gave a slight wave and walked to the hole. They then cut to Rose who made a long putt on another hole to win a hole and he's fist pumping looking like his eyes are going to pop out of his head he's screaming so loud. Same thing from Ricky today while the US is putting the pieces together of the biggest comeback in Ryder Cup history.

- Our team needed hat gate on Saturday afternoon to rally around. You couldn't rally around winning the Ryder Cup day 1??

- Europeans are a team. America is a bunch of individuals. Look how much red was on the board today when they were all playing on their own.
Tailgate88
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Quote:

Plans need to be put in place going forward to make sure our guys get tournament reps leading up to 2027 and arrive on the first tee ready to fight.


This is the biggest takeaway for me. Gotta be in shape when you show up on day one and practice rounds with your buddies ain't cutting it.
 
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