*****Official 2019/2020 Houston Astros offseason thread*****

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Deluxe
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In reply to W • 12:38p, 1/14/20
AG
W said:
slightly shifting gears...will the new Astros GM have different ideas about what to do with Correa (and his pending free agency after 2021)?

since the 'stros don't have 1st & 2nd round picks for 2 years...a Correa trade (midseason or next offseason) could make up for some of that
Part of me just wants to accept that 2025-2027 will likely be rebuilding years and just go totally all-in the next 4-5 years. So trade any prospect that is still a few years away and get guys to help win now. The Freudis Nova, Korey Lee and Jordan Brewer types.

But then again, we do have the Cole comp pick this year and potentially comp picks for Brantley and Springer next year. So maybe I'm jumping the gun a little. In the grand scheme of things, it's almost like the prospect cushion we gained from the Cardinals comp picks a few years ago are sort of being erased the next couple years. Could potentially proceed business as usual.
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Deluxe
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In reply to Ag_07 • 12:43p, 1/14/20
AG
Ag_07 said:
And I think they may go after Beltran for two reasons...

One being he's not a current player protected by the MLBPA

Two being that he's currently still in the league. He's not retired and actually managing a team.

I think those two reasons will open the door the them somehow getting him with some kind of punishment.
I kinda think Beltran is going to skate by from an MLB punishment standpoint for now. If it's shown that Beltran participated in a scheme with another team (ie the 16 Yankees, 16 Rangers or 19 Yankees), I think the pressure on the Mets from the general public/media to cut ties will be intense.

But I also think his ability to succeed as a manager is severely hampered without access to electronic sign stealing capabilities. He may not last more than a couple years regardless.
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Beat40
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In reply to bobinator • 1:07p, 1/14/20
bobinator said:
Yeah... at least all of the operational details. I had no idea what the MLB was actually going to do. Kinda figured it was going to be pretty bad though.

I just don't understand how they thought they'd get away with it when there's that much organizational turnover in pro baseball.


Has your contact ever said any other teams they were thinking we doing something similar?
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W
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In reply to Deluxe • 1:07p, 1/14/20
AG
Good point. I forgot about the comp picks.

and ultimately so much depends on Yordan and Tucker. If they become (Tucker) or remain (Yordan) all-star caliber players, the franchise will be just fine hitting-wise. And can focus money & picks on the pitching side
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the last of the bohemians
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1:08p, 1/14/20
The question we should all be asking....are the Yankees one of the other 8 teams?
That opens up Pandora's box if so.
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irish pete ag06
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In reply to the last of the bohemians • 1:15p, 1/14/20
AG
the last of the bohemians said:
The question we should all be asking....are the Yankees one of the other 8 teams?
That opens up Pandora's box if so.
Beltran came from the Yankees via the Rangers. Beltran was a major culprit named in the report. I seriously doubt Beltran came up with this on his own during the 2016 or 2017 season.
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Bobby Jimbo
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In reply to W • 1:19p, 1/14/20
AG
W said:
slightly shifting gears...will the new Astros GM have different ideas about what to do with Correa (and his pending free agency after 2021)?

since the 'stros don't have 1st & 2nd round picks for 2 years...a Correa trade (midseason or next offseason) could make up for some of that
Technically Luhnow was the only one who promised that he wouldn't trade him...

Welp.
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bobinator
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In reply to Beat40 • 1:20p, 1/14/20
AG
No, and I definitely got the impression that they felt like they were getting an edge by doing it, not just doing it because other people were doing it if that makes sense.

If they made a 30 for 30 about these last few years for the Astros I think the central theme would be that you need to be careful when you start thinking you're way smarter than everyone else in the room.
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W
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In reply to Bobby Jimbo • 1:21p, 1/14/20
AG
that's where I was going. Gonna be a new sheriff in town soon
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the last of the bohemians
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1:23p, 1/14/20
forgot that about Beltran...this smells like NY journalists blaming Astros and Red Sox for things that the Yankees probably did as well. Tough to believe the organization consumed with winning was being left out of creating an in game advantage.
It smells I tell you...
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Frok
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1:51p, 1/14/20
AG
Wow, there are like 6 different threads on this.

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Marvin
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1:58p, 1/14/20
AG
What I'm thinking today:
.
Mike Fiers is an ass
Yankees and Dodgers can kiss my ass.
Buster Olney can stick it up his pompous ass.
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Wabs
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In reply to the last of the bohemians • 2:01p, 1/14/20
AG
the last of the bohemians said:
forgot that about Beltran...this smells like NY journalists blaming Astros and Red Sox for things that the Yankees probably did as well. Tough to believe the organization consumed with winning was being left out of creating an in game advantage.
It smells I tell you...
I'm sure the MLB plans to dig deep to see if similar stuff was going on with the Yankees (and Rangers) when Beltran was with them....

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Harry Stone
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2:13p, 1/14/20
AG
I think the thing that is getting to me the most are the self-righteous ******* players and media that are calling out the Astros when they all know damn well every organization in baseball is doing it to some degree, and many at the level the Astros did in 2017
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Beat40
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In reply to bobinator • 2:17p, 1/14/20
Thanks.
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ccaggie05
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2:18p, 1/14/20
AG
The silence from these ass hats like Passan on other teams that might have also done something similar while continuing to fan the flames that the Astros punishment didn't go far enough speaks volumes.

It's obvious that the league is only going to investigate what the media gives them. The media folks have no interest in going the Beltran route and figuring out their precious Yankees are likely guilty as well. They got their scalp. Those pesky Astros who refused to remain in their lane as a mid level team are now going to be forced back into line and it makes room for the big dogs like the Yankees/Dodgers.

I'm furious at the Astros for letting this happen. I'm furious at Mike Fiers for being a ****ing snitch. I'm furious at the national sports media scumbags who put all their focus on the Astros while ignoring pretty much every other allegation other than the Red Sox. I'm furious at the league for doing everything in their power to only come down hard in the Astros, basically ignoring everybody else (except the Red Sox, likely forced by Cora's actions in Houston) while acting as of this was an effort to clean up the league of this.
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aTm2004
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2:20p, 1/14/20
AG
Crane is a lib and golf buddies with Obama, I wonder if he can tell Hillary Mike Fiers has information that will lead to her arrest?
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CFTXAG10
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2:29p, 1/14/20
AG
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Mr.Ackar07
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2:39p, 1/14/20
I do wonder a little if the Astros had any help during the Game 5 WS comeback. I would think that at some point the noise level would drown out any communication other than with a runner on base picking up the signals.
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CFTXAG10
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2:48p, 1/14/20
AG
The funny thing is that most of the leaks have said the players really didn't think it was all that effective, and it was eventually stopped sometime early in the 2018 season if I am hearing right. So in spite of them giving up this replay system, they went on to the ALCS in 18 against a team that was using the system and beat us (Boston, who went on to win the WS). They then went to the World Series again in 19 without the system.

I agree with some of the posters on here who have pointed out that this system was unnecessary. Could have easily won it without any assistance at all. Not enough being made about how dominant our pitching has been over the last few years and how good we have been defensively (especially with our analytics, shift, etc.).

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Ag_07
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2:57p, 1/14/20
AG
It's also worth reminding all the rescind the title drum beaters that sign stealing didn't help JV put up ridiculous numbers in the 2017 run, it didn't help Bregs take Sale deep in Fenway, it didn't help LMJ make the Yankees his ***** by spinning curveball after curveball after curveball, it didn't help Marwin take Jensen yard at Dodger Stadium, it didn't help Peacock whip it out and drag it all over the face of the Dodgers lineup, it didn't help Springer jumping all over Yu in GM 7, and it certainly didn't help CFM come out of the pen in GM 7 and sit down Dodger after Dodger to bring the hardware home.

Stealing signs is not why we won the WS.
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CFTXAG10
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In reply to Ag_07 • 3:03p, 1/14/20
AG
Ag_07 said:
It's also worth reminding all the rescind the title drum beaters that sign stealing didn't help JV put up ridiculous numbers in the 2017 run, it didn't help Bregs take Sale deep in Fenway, it didn't help LMJ make Yankees his ***** by spin curveball after curveball after curveball, it didn't help Marwin take Jensen yard at Dodger Stadium, it didn't help Peacock whip it and drag it all over the gave of the Dodgers lineup, it didn't help Springer jumping all over Yu in GM 7, and it certainly didn't help CFM come out of the pen in GM 7 and sit down Dodger after Dodger to bring the hardware home.

Stealing signs is not why we won the WS.
Exactly. Well put.
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Nuke LaLoosh
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3:03p, 1/14/20
AG
Probably unpopular opinion:

I have no problem with what the astros did. Other teams were doing the same thing, we just did it better and were the first to get caught. Getting caught is what I'm mad about.

If you sort through all the BS on Twitter, you'll find a lot of former players talking about how it is done everywhere. The astros broke an unwritten rule, just better than the other teams did it.

Just further proves that we are the Joneses. Now, unfortunately, we have to trust Crane to not become a dumbass/cheapass and further ruin this franchise.

I want inside hires for the manager job and for the GM job. Retain every semblance of the badassery that we had going for us before all this mess.

If Crane has balls, we sign springer to a new deal tomorrow, and he breaks the damn bank for what's left of this seasons free agency and next years free agency.

Know how to shut people the hell up? Go out there and win the whole damn thing again.

So excited about this season.

LETS. FKN. GO.
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CFTXAG10
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3:10p, 1/14/20
AG
I apologize for multiple posts, but I just had the opportunity to read the full Manfred report. Something that stuck out to me was this quote from the commish....

Quote:
At the outset, it is important to understand that the attempt to decode signs being used by an opposing catcher is not a violation of any Major League Baseball Rule or Regulation. Major League Baseball Regulations do, however, prohibit the use of electronic equipment during games and state that no such equipment "may be used for the purpose of stealing signs or conveying information designed to give a Club an advantage."
Everybody steals signs. Hell, it states right here in the report that it is legal. Lots of teams use electronic equipment to do so. Teams take a lot of precautions, including mound visits and talking between innings, to change up the signs so teams won't have an advantage.

This boils down to being told to stop using electronic equipment to steal signs in August/September 2017 and yet you continued to do it for the rest of the season and postseason. But how much did it really help? and how much did it help over and above the sign stealing you could have done without electronics? Not much at all....
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Drip99
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In reply to Ag_07 • 3:20p, 1/14/20
AG
Ag_07 said:
It's also worth reminding all the rescind the title drum beaters that sign stealing didn't help JV put up ridiculous numbers in the 2017 run, it didn't help Bregs take Sale deep in Fenway, it didn't help LMJ make the Yankees his ***** by spinning curveball after curveball after curveball, it didn't help Marwin take Jensen yard at Dodger Stadium, it didn't help Peacock whip it out and drag it all over the face of the Dodgers lineup, it didn't help Springer jumping all over Yu in GM 7, and it certainly didn't help CFM come out of the pen in GM 7 and sit down Dodger after Dodger to bring the hardware home.

Stealing signs is not why we won the WS.
Yep but the haters will say we were 8-1 during the 2017 post season at home and want the title stripped.
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Deluxe
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In reply to Drip99 • 3:43p, 1/14/20
AG
It's funny because the Yankees were 5-0 at home and 1-6 on the road in the 2017 playoffs. Probably just a coincidence.
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Deluxe
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In reply to Nuke LaLoosh • 3:47p, 1/14/20
AG
Nuke LaLoosh said:
Know how to shut people the hell up? Go out there and win the whole damn thing again.

So excited about this season.

LETS. FKN. GO.
I'm pumped too. Gimme the Yankees in the ALCS. I want to feel their hate when we take the field. And I want to see them cry more tears than they cried in 2015, 2017 and 2019 combined when we KO them again.
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Mr.Ackar07
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In reply to Deluxe • 3:50p, 1/14/20
Deluxe said:
Nuke LaLoosh said:
Know how to shut people the hell up? Go out there and win the whole damn thing again.

So excited about this season.

LETS. FKN. GO.
I'm pumped too. Gimme the Yankees in the ALCS. I want to feel their hate when we take the field. And I want to see them cry more tears than they cried in 2015, 2017 and 2019 combined when we KO them again and Cole is left warming up in the bullpen.
FIFY
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n_touch
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In reply to Mr.Ackar07 • 3:52p, 1/14/20
I would rather him on the mound in MMP having to walk off with his head low as the good guys run out of the dugout
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agproducer
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4:01p, 1/14/20
AG
According to Vegas, how much does losing Luhnow and Hinch hurt the Astros in 2020? Apparently, not much. The team has the third best is to win the whole thing: 7/1. They are behind the yet-to-be-caught, holier-than-thou Yankees and Dodgers.

LET'S FKN GO!!
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the last of the bohemians
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4:05p, 1/14/20
That's because Vegas knows any coach can win 100 games with this team.
With McCullers back, a full Greinke season, and probably a healthier lineup this season, no reason to not expect great things.
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Farmer1906
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In reply to agproducer • 4:40p, 1/14/20
AG
agproducer said:
According to Vegas, how much does losing Luhnow and Hinch hurt the Astros in 2020? Apparently, not much. The team has the third best is to win the whole thing: 7/1. They are behind the yet-to-be-caught, holier-than-thou Yankees and Dodgers.

LET'S FKN GO!!
We'd be ahead of the Dodgers if we were in the NL too.
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k20dub
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5:56p, 1/14/20
AG
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ClickClack
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In reply to Ag_07 • 6:23p, 1/14/20
AG
Ag_07 said:
It's also worth reminding all the rescind the title drum beaters that sign stealing didn't help JV put up ridiculous numbers in the 2017 run, it didn't help Bregs take Sale deep in Fenway, it didn't help LMJ make the Yankees his ***** by spinning curveball after curveball after curveball, it didn't help Marwin take Jensen yard at Dodger Stadium, it didn't help Peacock whip it out and drag it all over the face of the Dodgers lineup, it didn't help Springer jumping all over Yu in GM 7, and it certainly didn't help CFM come out of the pen in GM 7 and sit down Dodger after Dodger to bring the hardware home.

Stealing signs is not why we won the WS.


Exactly, my friend.

Also why this whole thing is especially maddening. It wasn't needed. This team was just as good without all of this stupidity.
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bearkatag15
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6:25p, 1/14/20
AG


Red Sox news might drop soon
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