I would love to see you try to punch him
HOU@TEX Trash Talking Thread
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Last: 4 yr ago by Charlie Conway
Odor already donkey punched him
quote:Me too.
I would love to see you try to punch him
quote:This was from October. Are there any Astros fans that care to dispute this now?
Here's the sad reality that only the honest Astros fan will admit to themselves. They never really had anything to "come and take". They overachieved in a division that was down and whose champion has been the most injured team in baseball history over the last two seasons. Teams that have two or maybe three players in the lineup hitting above .250 don't win divisions. The team has a couple of solid young players and then a whole bunch of spare parts that may or may not be deserving of platoon time on an average major league ball club, much less a contender. They traded away their best prospect for an aging center fielder that doesn't get on base. They will find out fairly quickly pitching performances are erratic, and relying on three horses in a five horse race won't get it done. Overachievers tend to get slapped back to reality very quickly. The Rangers on the other hand, will get their ace back next year. The core of their rotation and starting lineup are all already under contract through next year. They have two of the top ten hitting prospects in baseball according to most of the ranking services. They will eventually get back the consensus top prospect in baseball from two years ago. They will most likely start the season with two pitchers in AAA that have a major league season with one win above replacement. Have fun re-signing the Evan Gattis' and Colby Rasmus's of the world. It looks like the Astros need to start preparation for 2018.
Oh and by the way, A-Rod hit .358 in his age 20 season, not .279.
quote:quote:This was from October. Are there any Astros fans that care to dispute this now?
Here's the sad reality that only the honest Astros fan will admit to themselves. They never really had anything to "come and take". They overachieved in a division that was down and whose champion has been the most injured team in baseball history over the last two seasons. Teams that have two or maybe three players in the lineup hitting above .250 don't win divisions. The team has a couple of solid young players and then a whole bunch of spare parts that may or may not be deserving of platoon time on an average major league ball club, much less a contender. They traded away their best prospect for an aging center fielder that doesn't get on base. They will find out fairly quickly pitching performances are erratic, and relying on three horses in a five horse race won't get it done. Overachievers tend to get slapped back to reality very quickly. The Rangers on the other hand, will get their ace back next year. The core of their rotation and starting lineup are all already under contract through next year. They have two of the top ten hitting prospects in baseball according to most of the ranking services. They will eventually get back the consensus top prospect in baseball from two years ago. They will most likely start the season with two pitchers in AAA that have a major league season with one win above replacement. Have fun re-signing the Evan Gattis' and Colby Rasmus's of the world. It looks like the Astros need to start preparation for 2018.
Oh and by the way, A-Rod hit .358 in his age 20 season, not .279.
quote:quote:This was from October. Are there any Astros fans that care to dispute this now?
Here's the sad reality that only the honest Astros fan will admit to themselves. They never really had anything to "come and take". They overachieved in a division that was down and whose champion has been the most injured team in baseball history over the last two seasons. Teams that have two or maybe three players in the lineup hitting above .250 don't win divisions. The team has a couple of solid young players and then a whole bunch of spare parts that may or may not be deserving of platoon time on an average major league ball club, much less a contender. They traded away their best prospect for an aging center fielder that doesn't get on base. They will find out fairly quickly pitching performances are erratic, and relying on three horses in a five horse race won't get it done. Overachievers tend to get slapped back to reality very quickly. The Rangers on the other hand, will get their ace back next year. The core of their rotation and starting lineup are all already under contract through next year. They have two of the top ten hitting prospects in baseball according to most of the ranking services. They will eventually get back the consensus top prospect in baseball from two years ago. They will most likely start the season with two pitchers in AAA that have a major league season with one win above replacement. Have fun re-signing the Evan Gattis' and Colby Rasmus's of the world. It looks like the Astros need to start preparation for 2018.
Oh and by the way, A-Rod hit .358 in his age 20 season, not .279.
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My religious belief teaches me to feel as safe in battle as in bed. God has fixed the time for my death. I do not concern myself about that, but to be always ready, no matter when it may overtake me. That is the way all men should live, and then all would be equally brave.
-Thomas "Stonewall" Jackson
-Thomas "Stonewall" Jackson
quote:quote:This was from October. Are there any Astros fans that care to dispute this now?
Here's the sad reality that only the honest Astros fan will admit to themselves. They never really had anything to "come and take". They overachieved in a division that was down and whose champion has been the most injured team in baseball history over the last two seasons. Teams that have two or maybe three players in the lineup hitting above .250 don't win divisions. The team has a couple of solid young players and then a whole bunch of spare parts that may or may not be deserving of platoon time on an average major league ball club, much less a contender. They traded away their best prospect for an aging center fielder that doesn't get on base. They will find out fairly quickly pitching performances are erratic, and relying on three horses in a five horse race won't get it done. Overachievers tend to get slapped back to reality very quickly. The Rangers on the other hand, will get their ace back next year. The core of their rotation and starting lineup are all already under contract through next year. They have two of the top ten hitting prospects in baseball according to most of the ranking services. They will eventually get back the consensus top prospect in baseball from two years ago. They will most likely start the season with two pitchers in AAA that have a major league season with one win above replacement. Have fun re-signing the Evan Gattis' and Colby Rasmus's of the world. It looks like the Astros need to start preparation for 2018.
Oh and by the way, A-Rod hit .358 in his age 20 season, not .279.
Real talk here. That's pretty good write up and I won't argue that.
There's been a lot of chatter lately, especially with the slow start, about how the Astros approach may not be working. I've said for a while that the problems the Astros have come from the top and their approach to building the team. There is a reason baseball has been played the same way for 100s of years. Case in point Ks. There's a reason they're bad and there's a reason guys who do it a lot aren't very successful.
I've also criticized the penny pinching garbage into gold approach. It works sometimes and yeah you get lucky and hit on one or two like Collin McHugh and Will Harris (I may even put Rasmus in there as he seems to have performed better here than anywhere else he's been) but you're right. Guys like Luis Valbuena, Jake Marisnick, Marwin Gonzales, present-day Carlos Gomez don't really do much for you. I'm very skeptical that this regime is ready and willing to pony up for proven players in FA and in signing our own once they get ready to hit the market. We'll see but I have my doubts.
With that said the Astros have seemed to kind of catch lightning in a bottle and are a bit ahead of schedule. Hopefully some of the prospects turn out and eventually phase guys like I mentioned above out of the lineup. But for now it's what we've got and who we'll root for. It's boom or bust with this group and it's a drag watching them when they bust but pretty fun when they boom. And yes when we play you it's always a bust, and I don't know why. Very fascinating and oh so frustrating.
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How many of their quality prospects did Houston leverage away, ahead of schedule, when they saw their window opening earlier than anticipated last year? Did they give up much?
quote:It's because we're better.
And yes when we play you it's always a bust, and I don't know why.
Luckier
quote:Objectively, I think the astros fell into the "we're one player away" trap when they traded for Gomez and Giles during the season. Gave up way too much for the two of those guys combined.
How many of their quality prospects did Houston leverage away, ahead of schedule, when they saw their window opening earlier than anticipated last year? Did they give up much?
quote:71 - 29 isn't luck. 20 - 6 over the past season and half isn't luck.
Luckier
quote:You guys have some great pieces. I like watching Altuve play, amazes me the talent that guy has for his size (seriously) and your farm system is highly ranked with some good players (Bregman, Reed, Martes etc). It's just a matter of finding the right veterans to mix with the young players. The GM needs to be the biggest asset in any organization imo, the decisions they make will ultimately decide how the franchise does over 3-7 year spans. I think Jon Daniels has been the biggest asset for the Rangers.
Real talk here. That's pretty good write up and I won't argue that.
There's been a lot of chatter lately, especially with the slow start, about how the Astros approach may not be working. I've said for a while that the problems the Astros have come from the top and their approach to building the team. There is a reason baseball has been played the same way for 100s of years. Case in point Ks. There's a reason they're bad and there's a reason guys who do it a lot aren't very successful.
I've also criticized the penny pinching garbage into gold approach. It works sometimes and yeah you get lucky and hit on one or two like Collin McHugh and Will Harris (I may even put Rasmus in there as he seems to have performed better here than anywhere else he's been) but you're right. Guys like Luis Valbuena, Jake Marisnick, Marwin Gonzales, present-day Carlos Gomez don't really do much for you. I'm very skeptical that this regime is ready and willing to pony up for proven players in FA and in signing our own once they get ready to hit the market. We'll see but I have my doubts.
With that said the Astros have seemed to kind of catch lightning in a bottle and are a bit ahead of schedule. Hopefully some of the prospects turn out and eventually phase guys like I mentioned above out of the lineup. But for now it's what we've got and who we'll root for. It's boom or bust with this group and it's a drag watching them when they bust but pretty fun when they boom. And yes when we play you it's always a bust, and I don't know why. Very fascinating and oh so frustrating.
I hope to see the Rangers, Astros fight it out every year for the division title with one of them winning it and the other getting the Wildcard... makes waiting on football season that much more tolerable.
quote:
How many of their quality prospects did Houston leverage away, ahead of schedule, when they saw their window opening earlier than anticipated last year? Did they give up much?
I don't think they did. Many of my brethren will argue otherwise but we still have a solid farm system and at the end of the day you've got to give something to get something. I'm not mad about the trades because at the time you can't blame them for making the deals they made.
I'm pissed at our crappy FA acquisitions. Feldman and Fister are our big FA gets and they're bargain bin guys. We had legit chance to make a run at Cespedes last year and they backed off when they saw the market. The won't spend and instead try and turn these ho-hum guys into gold and it just doesn't work most of the time. All we hear from this regime time after time is 'We're now ready to spend' and we see nothing.
quote:Living in Houston, many of my friends are Astros fans. We've discussed this before. I don't have an issue w/ the Gomez trade. Who would have thought that he'd forget how to play baseball immediately upon arriving in Houston. The Giles trade was dumb. One of my best friends was livid about it considering what they gave up.quote:Objectively, I think the astros fell into the "we're one player away" trap when they traded for Gomez and Giles during the season. Gave up way too much for the two of those guys combined.
How many of their quality prospects did Houston leverage away, ahead of schedule, when they saw their window opening earlier than anticipated last year? Did they give up much?
Honestly, I think their biggest mistake was basically doing nothing in the offseason. I thought they should go hard for Zobrist and a quality veteran pitcher. Now, Zobrist was probably going to join Maddon in Chicago regardless, but he was the kind of bat they needed in that lineup. Too many .220-240 guys. Their top 3 is scary talented, but after that, it's just a bunch of guys that you really only want filling out your bottom 3. Their rotation is similar. At the top, Keuchel is fantastic (despite this year's serious regression). After that, it's prospects or spare parts. They are seriously lacking a veteran presence w/ postseason experience in both their lineup and rotation. That's why I kept telling my friends all year last season that the Rangers would catch them. The Rangers have a perfect blend of veteran/youth, and not just vet journeymen, but guys w/ serious postseason experience as well.
quote:I think that's the key...quote:
You guys have some great pieces. I like watching Altuve play, amazes me the talent that guy has for his size (seriously) and your farm system is highly ranked with some good players (Bregman, Reed, Martes etc). It's just a matter of finding the right veterans to mix with the young players. The GM needs to be the biggest asset in any organization imo, the decisions they make will ultimately decide how the franchise does over 3-7 year spans. I think Jon Daniels has been the biggest asset for the Rangers.
I hope to see the Rangers, Astros fight it out every year for the division title with one of them winning it and the other getting the Wildcard... makes waiting on football season that much more tolerable.
It's great to have talented youth, and it's great to have experience...but when you look around the MLB, the better teams tend to have both.
I think Houston has a great mix of young players. Throw in a few experienced ($$) free agents in the right spots, and I think the club takes the next level.
Otherwise, you end up like the A's...where you have good seasons on occasion, but are back to re-tooling when the lineup is pilfered.
With their market, I dont think Houston will go the route the A's have though.
quote:
Living in Houston, many of my friends are Astros fans. We've discussed this before. I don't have an issue w/ the Gomez trade. Who would have thought that he'd forget how to play baseball immediately upon arriving in Houston. The Giles trade was dumb. One of my best friends was livid about it considering what they gave up.
After seeing his quotes from last night, I'd be livid about it considering what a dumbass he is.
The Astros need to find their Beltre type acquisition. He cost a pretty penny at the time but did wonders for the organization just as some young talent was blossoming. I do think they've built a decent amount of young talent, but they've got to add at least one premium guy to the middle of the lineup through FA.
Looked at the upcoming FA class. Man, looks like the buyers will be doing their offseason shopping before the July trade deadline. Very weak class.
It was said earlier, but we did seem to be on the cusp of getting it going knowing we would have a full season of Correa and McCullers. Of course, McCullers started the year on the DL and Correa has been average at the plate to this point. None of the key role position players are having above average or even good seasons. In addition, Keuchel as not been anywhere near ace form. I think we are still close, but we need guys like Bregman (SS/3rd), Reed (1st/DH) and Musgrove (SP) to pan out with another solid veteran OF and pitcher.
I do like what we have with Springer, Altuve and Correa and the catching situation is good with Gattis and Castro platooning. Fister has been a nice surprise as a 5th starter. The bullpen has been much better as of late, but still don't know which Giles will show up for each game.
Threads like this would be much more fun (for Astros fans, anyway) if both fan bases had reasons to talk ****.
I do like what we have with Springer, Altuve and Correa and the catching situation is good with Gattis and Castro platooning. Fister has been a nice surprise as a 5th starter. The bullpen has been much better as of late, but still don't know which Giles will show up for each game.
Threads like this would be much more fun (for Astros fans, anyway) if both fan bases had reasons to talk ****.
quote:Because we are curb stomping your team, so the astro fans aren't in here.
Why do rangers fans keep talking about how many blue stars Astros posts get but then I look up and down this thread and every single ranger post has 13+ blue stars and there's 1 Astros post that even has hit 3
Good point.
Personally, I prefer Houston to be good and pushing us for first. It makes the games/rivalry way more fun and intense.
Especially when you can just see that crushing look of despair as we celebrate the walkoff win, wish you could bottle that!
Especially when you can just see that crushing look of despair as we celebrate the walkoff win, wish you could bottle that!
Saw someone on twitter, or here, point out that the 71-29 record over the past 10 years is skewed by the 3 straight 100-loss seasons by the Astros. The weird thing is that the Rangers have won at an even higher rate after the Astros became a good team.
2007-2014: 51-23 (.689)
2015-2016: 20-6 (.769)
2007-2014: 51-23 (.689)
2015-2016: 20-6 (.769)
I'd say it was skewed by the Rangers lousy 2014. It should be 63-18.
quote:
The Astros need to find their Beltre type acquisition. He cost a pretty penny at the time but did wonders for the organization just as some young talent was blossoming.
Man, I remember all the crying and wailing when Beltre was signed. "He's displacing Michael Young" everyone cried. "Jon Daniels is an idiot" they said.
quote:Really? I can't think of any of my fellow Rangers fans that were upset about signing Beltre. The guy was coming off a season where he hit .321, hit 28 HR and drove in 102. Not to mention the 49 doubles and his reputation as an elite defensive 3B.quote:
The Astros need to find their Beltre type acquisition. He cost a pretty penny at the time but did wonders for the organization just as some young talent was blossoming.
Man, I remember all the crying and wailing when Beltre was signed. "He's displacing Michael Young" everyone cried. "Jon Daniels is an idiot" they said.
Do you have any links to this? Maybe it was an issue of the size of his contract and that he had a reputation as a contract year player. I don't recall this reaction though, although it certainly is possible. His first season quickly changed that any negative feelings about the signing though.
Yeah, there might have been a few questions about how much Beltre had left in the tank, but there wasn't a lot of people upset about the signing -- and certainly not upset that he was going to be "displacing" Michael Young at 3rd base... Do you remember Michael Young at 3rd base? I'd love to say he was forgettable there... but I can still picture him 'oleing the ball in the World Series.
I think the comments about the lack of quality veterans on the Astros are on point. Our veteran bats are..
Evan Gattis - 29 (3.5 years of MLB, 1,429 at bats with Atlanta and Houston)
Colby Rasmus (the only true veteran, and only guy prior to last season with playoff experience) - 29 (10 years of MLB, 3,366 at bats with St Louis, Toronto, and Houston.. 35% of which he has proven he's a sub .220 hitter against left handers)
Luis Valbuena - 30 (9 years of MLB, 2,406 at bats with only one season where he wasnt a platoon player, and like Rasmus, has not shown proficency at hitting LHP.)
Carlos Gomez - decided to forget how to play baseball
Jason Castro - entire career with Astros.
The thing is.. it's so hard when you are rebuilding, and especially when you are ahead of schedule.. its so hard to say.. "Lets go pay a ton of money for a veteran bat in his prime despite our plan to grow from within."
But I do wonder what a Cespedes (3 years at 25 million was well within our budget and future budgets), Gordon, Zobrist, Weiters, etc would have provided this club. None of them would have been crippling contracts.
I will admit though, I have always been more about the build from within strategy for position players, so this post is mostly me second guessing after the fact.
Evan Gattis - 29 (3.5 years of MLB, 1,429 at bats with Atlanta and Houston)
Colby Rasmus (the only true veteran, and only guy prior to last season with playoff experience) - 29 (10 years of MLB, 3,366 at bats with St Louis, Toronto, and Houston.. 35% of which he has proven he's a sub .220 hitter against left handers)
Luis Valbuena - 30 (9 years of MLB, 2,406 at bats with only one season where he wasnt a platoon player, and like Rasmus, has not shown proficency at hitting LHP.)
Carlos Gomez - decided to forget how to play baseball
Jason Castro - entire career with Astros.
The thing is.. it's so hard when you are rebuilding, and especially when you are ahead of schedule.. its so hard to say.. "Lets go pay a ton of money for a veteran bat in his prime despite our plan to grow from within."
But I do wonder what a Cespedes (3 years at 25 million was well within our budget and future budgets), Gordon, Zobrist, Weiters, etc would have provided this club. None of them would have been crippling contracts.
I will admit though, I have always been more about the build from within strategy for position players, so this post is mostly me second guessing after the fact.
I seem to remember the big knock on Belts was that he only performed well in contract years. That obviously isn't the case though.
I didn't say knowledgable baseball people thought the signing was bad. I meant the rank and file dummies in the press. "Contract is too big for a player on the backside of his career" and "he's forcing out the Rangers team captain".
Trust me, most knowledgable people saw what a liability Young was.
The point being - to get a guy like that, the Astros are going to have to pay a number that generally is perceived as too much.
Trust me, most knowledgable people saw what a liability Young was.
The point being - to get a guy like that, the Astros are going to have to pay a number that generally is perceived as too much.
quote:Eh, the sips and Techies over in OR talk **** and they have no reason to do so.
Threads like this would be much more fun (for Astros fans, anyway) if both fan bases had reasons to talk ****.
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