Prime HOF Tracy McGrady - best he did was like 42 wins.
Prime HOF Paul Pierce with some solid players around him - Tony Allen, Antoine Walker, Ricky Davis, Tony Allen, Al Jefferson, WallyZ - didn't do anything until he blew it up for Garnett/Allen.

With three HOFers in Ray Allen, Pierce, Garnett, plus Rajon Rondo, Perkins, Tony Allen, etc, he won 1 title, then won 62 games and was knocked out of the 2nd round by a team starting Rashard Lewis, Hedo Turkeyglue, and Rafer Alston. They made one more Finals, where they lost to the Lakers starring Andrew Bynum, who I was told would win multiple DPOYs. Doc got a title, a finals loss, and a few exits in the Eastern Semis out of his big three. Huge disappointment.

Then Doc got traded to the Clippers with a ready-made team. Young Blake Griffin (22/10/4 from 11-15), the PointGod, DeAndre Jordan, Jamal Crawford, JJ Reddick, Darren Collison, etc. In 7 seasons with the Clippers, he had 3 2nd round exits, 3 first round exits, and missed the playoffs.

Now in Philly, with the 2nd highest vote getter in the MVP race, he got the 1 seed, then promptly lost to the 5 seed in the second round.

Guitarsoup said:

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Prime HOF Tracy McGrady - best he did was like 42 wins.
Prime HOF Paul Pierce with some solid players around him - Tony Allen, Antoine Walker, Ricky Davis, Tony Allen, Al Jefferson, WallyZ - didn't do anything until he blew it up for Garnett/Allen.

With three HOFers in Ray Allen, Pierce, Garnett, plus Rajon Rondo, Perkins, Tony Allen, etc, he won 1 title, then won 62 games and was knocked out of the 2nd round by a team starting Rashard Lewis, Hedo Turkeyglue, and Rafer Alston. They made one more Finals, where they lost to the Lakers starring Andrew Bynum, who I was told would win multiple DPOYs. Doc got a title, a finals loss, and a few exits in the Eastern Semis out of his big three. Huge disappointment.

Then Doc got traded to the Clippers with a ready-made team. Young Blake Griffin (22/10/4 from 11-15), the PointGod, DeAndre Jordan, Jamal Crawford, JJ Reddick, Darren Collison, etc. In 7 seasons with the Clippers, he had 3 2nd round exits, 3 first round exits, and missed the playoffs.

Now in Philly, with the 2nd highest vote getter in the MVP race, he got the 1 seed, then promptly lost to the 5 seed in the second round.

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and he beat, in all those series, 1 HOF coach, maybe 2?

Phil Jackson with the Lakers (was he still the coach then?) and then (maybe you could argue) Rick Carlisle, who will only be HOF because he'll coach like 20 years and have 1,000 wins maybe.

Don't think he ever beat Pop in that stretch and then there just hasn't been many generational coaches left in that time span.

He beat Phil Jackson in the Finals in 08. He beat Pop in the 2015 first round; Spurs were 6th seed.

Doc never won a playoff series in Orlando.

Coaches he beat in the playoffs:
Mike Woodson
Flip Saunders
Mark Jackson
Mike Brown
Scott Brooks
Rick Carlisle (but injured Kristaps)
Vinny Del Negro
Erik Spolestra
Stan Van Gundy
Larry Brown (with best player Stephen Jackson on 44 win Charlotte team)
Mike DAntoni
Larry Drew
Doug Collins

My understanding on Ben Simmons is that he's never put in the work to develop the shot or be consistent at the free throw line.

IF that's true, you can't build around him because you can't have one of your top players being soft on work ethic.

Iowaggie said:

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My understanding on Ben Simmons is that he's never put in the work to develop the shot or be consistent at the free throw line.

IF that's true, you can't build around him because you can't have one of your top players being soft on work ethic.

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I think back to when he was at LSU. The dude whined about having to go to school and was ultimately ineligible for the Wooden award because of his poor work ethic thereafter that A&M blasted them in the SEC tournament semifinals 71-38. It blew my mind people compared him to LeBron and MJ. Absolutely no way those guys get slapped around in the college game like that. Going all the way back to college it looked like the guy didn't care or have what it took to be a top tier superstar.

Guitarsoup said:

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He beat Phil Jackson in the Finals in 08. He beat Pop in the 2015 first round; Spurs were 6th seed.

Doc never won a playoff series in Orlando.

Coaches he beat in the playoffs:
Mike Woodson
Flip Saunders
Mark Jackson
Mike Brown
Scott Brooks
Rick Carlisle (but injured Kristaps)
Vinny Del Negro
Erik Spolestra
Stan Van Gundy
Larry Brown (with best player Stephen Jackson on 44 win Charlotte team)
Mike DAntoni
Larry Drew
Doug Collins

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Even with all of the Simmons stats floating out there tonight, this boggles my mind more than any of them. https://t.co/WW4p2yfqjn

— Sam Vecenie (@Sam_Vecenie) June 21, 2021

What. A. Game

Refs made a mess of the last 5 minutes of this game

Didnt it look like that was basket interference, or whatever its called on offense

Apparently no interference on an inbounds pass, which makes sense

Suns deserved to win, but it should have happened without the refs trying to give it away.

A player that is inbounding the ball cannot shoot the ball directly into the basket, and have it count as a basket, so it can be "interfered" with by the offensive or defensive player.

It wouldn't be a Clippers series if they didn't start 0-2.

The Phoenix Suns extended their winning streak to 9 playoff games. In the Suns' 8 previous games, they never trailed in the 4th quarter, but they needed several miracles to take a 2-0 series lead to Los Angeles. On the Suns previous possession, they first had to block out the missed opportunity to go ahead with 9.3 seconds left when Devin Booker, with Patrick Beverley draped all over him, lost the ball out of bounds. Then, when Paul George missed two free throws with 8.2 seconds, Milkal Bridges had to secure the defensive rebound to give Phoenix the final possession to pull off the final flush.

After Mikal Bridges missed a 3-point attempt, the Suns got a free timeout from the referees review and retained possession with 0.9 seconds left. Then, Jae Crowder threw a perfect inbound pass to Deandre Ayton for the game-winning alley-oop against the Clippers tough defense. After the last in a series of lengthy video reviews in the final two minutes, the officials put 0.7 seconds on the clock for the Clippers, but Paul George could not get off a shot before the buzzer expired. This was the most bizarre ending of an NBA game I have ever seen.

Monty Williams: "DA - if he throws it, you gotta try to dunk it. OK?"

Mission accomplished, @DeandreAyton.

🎥 @NBA pic.twitter.com/BowPwhydvW

— The Athletic (@TheAthletic) June 23, 2021

What a pass from that angle, and what a great move to the basket. One of those plays you always hope for, but never see executed.

dave94 said:

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What a pass from that angle, and what a great move to the basket. One of those plays you always hope for, but never see executed.

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And the screen by Book was so damn clutch

LawHall88 said:

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Guitarsoup said:

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He beat Phil Jackson in the Finals in 08. He beat Pop in the 2015 first round; Spurs were 6th seed.

Doc never won a playoff series in Orlando.

Coaches he beat in the playoffs:
Mike Woodson
Flip Saunders
Mark Jackson
Mike Brown
Scott Brooks
Rick Carlisle (but injured Kristaps)
Vinny Del Negro
Erik Spolestra
Stan Van Gundy
Larry Brown (with best player Stephen Jackson on 44 win Charlotte team)
Mike DAntoni
Larry Drew
Doug Collins

---

Even with all of the Simmons stats floating out there tonight, this boggles my mind more than any of them. https://t.co/WW4p2yfqjn

— Sam Vecenie (@Sam_Vecenie) June 21, 2021

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I heard the following stat on the Mismatch podcast, and I had to go back and see the transcript to make sure I heard it correctly. I know this is a few days late.

"In the last two seasons, Doc Rivers coached teams are 11 and 5 when they have gotten a lead of 16 or more in the postseason, the rest of the NBA combined is 76 and 3."

The Atlanta Hawks have now won 6 road playoff games, including 3 in Philadelphia in the Eastern Conference Semifinals. They won each Game 1 on the road during the playoffs, defeating the New York Knicks, Philadelphia 76ers, and now the Milwaukee Bucks. The Bucks were previously undefeated at home. They were 2-0 in a 4-0 sweep of the Miami Heat in the opening round and 3-0 in a 4-3 win over the Brooklyn Nets in the semifinals.

MW03 said:

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Head Ninja In Charge said:

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Am I tripping or has just about every single playoff game been like really good?

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Best playoff season I can remember

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Yes, several unexpected things have happened in these playoffs. In the first six games of the Dallas Mavericks vs Los Angeles Clippers game, the road team won the first six games before the Clippers won Game 7 at home. That was the first time in NBA playoff history. Also, both No. 1 seeds Utah Jazz and Philadelphia 76ers failed to even advance to their respective conference finals, much less the NBA Finals. In Game 6, the Utah Jazz led the Los Angeles Clippers 75-50 early in the 3rd quarter but still managed to lose by 12 points and the series to the Clippers 4-2. In addition, both Eastern Conference Semifinals lasted the full 7 games, and the Milwaukee Bucks and Atlanta Hawks won Game 7 on the road. Historically, the track record for road teams in Game 7s has been terrible. Home teams have won 77.9 percent of the previous Game 7s throughout NBA history, but the Bucks and Hawks defied historical track records.

That luka/Trae trade is officially not a tragedy for the Hawks. I'd still take luka over Trae, but it is getting very close to even.

The series and the post-season are both a long way from being over, but this Trae Young's moment right here.

And Greek Freak AGAIN shrinking from the spotlight. Down 3, 5 seconds to go, and they run a play for Khris Middleton who was 6 for 23 from the field and 0 for 8 from the arc Wednesday night. An all-pro player DEMANDS the ball for that last shot.

I don't disagree overall on giannis, but you simply can't run a play for him when you need a 3. That would be coaching malpractice. I don't care if giannis is begging for the ball.

GCP12 said:

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That luka/Trae trade is officially not a tragedy for the Hawks. I'd still take luka over Trae, but it is getting very close to even.

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If Luka and Trae were to swap teams, I'm not even certain the Mavs make the playoffs.

Saint Pablo said:

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GCP12 said:

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That luka/Trae trade is officially not a tragedy for the Hawks. I'd still take luka over Trae, but it is getting very close to even.

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If Luka and Trae were to swap teams, I'm not even certain the Mavs make the playoffs.

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That's possible. As I said, I'd still take luka over Trae. But, a year ago the trade looked like one of the worst trades of all time for the Hawks. Trae has made himself into a guy that can win in the NBA as the best player on a team. A year ago, he looked like a guy that just put up empty stats on a losing team. Maybe the bucks win the next 4 games to knock the Hawks out of the playoffs, but if you're a Hawks fan you have to feel pretty damn good about Trae Youngs future.

I love Luka and I wouldn't trade him for any other player in the NBA straight up. Having said that, Trae is 3 games away from the finals and luka hasn't gotten out of the first round yet. I didn't say the Hawks won the trade. I just said it doesn't look anywhere near as bad anymore.

GCP12 said:

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Saint Pablo said:

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GCP12 said:

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That luka/Trae trade is officially not a tragedy for the Hawks. I'd still take luka over Trae, but it is getting very close to even.

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If Luka and Trae were to swap teams, I'm not even certain the Mavs make the playoffs.

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That's possible. As I said, I'd still take luka over Trae. But, a year ago the trade looked like one of the worst trades of all time for the Hawks. Trae has made himself into a guy that can win in the NBA as the best player on a team. A year ago, he looked like a guy that just put up empty stats on a losing team. Maybe the bucks win the next 4 games to knock the Hawks out of the playoffs, but if you're a Hawks fan you have to feel pretty damn good about Trae Youngs future.

I love Luka and I wouldn't trade him for any other player in the NBA straight up. Having said that, Trae is 3 games away from the finals and luka hasn't gotten out of the first round yet. I didn't say the Hawks won the trade. I just said it doesn't look anywhere near as bad anymore.

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Fair enough. I think the Mavs do that 10 times out of 10, but I agree, it looks much better now than it did the last couple years.

The Hawks have just done a way better job putting pieces around Young than the Mavs had around Luka. Luka is either #1 or #2 in the league (Jokic) in pure talent, but if the other team puts 3 guys on him and the Mavs still can't score, that's a big fat problem.

The Hawks are really something to watch. A lot of role players really believing in their system. Happy for Clint Capela getting a shot to really shine. Only thing to worry about Young is how slight he is. You could make the same argument for Iverson, but he was a generational talent. Regardless, I've been rooting for the Hawks since Round 1. Them and the Suns would be a really dynamic finals.

After the Los Angeles Clippers trailed the Phoenix Suns 48-46 at halftime, the Clippers outscored the Suns 60-46 in the 2nd half to defeat the Suns 106-92. The Clippers cut the series deficit to 2-1 and snapped the Suns' 9-game playoff winning streak. Chris Paul returned after missing the first 2 games due to Covid-19 protocols, but the Clippers defense held him to 15 points on 5 of 19 field goal attempts. Since the Clippers lost their first 3 home games to the Dallas Mavericks, they have won 5 consecutive home playoff games. I won't be surprised if the Western Conference Finals lasts the full 7 games.

I hate how rep for good defense is essentially a licence to mug. Case in point: Beverly

To be fair, that was an excellent charge he just took

Or taking charges off the ball. That's not playing defense