I'm going to go ahead and be the idiot here: first time homebuyer and aware of the Homestead exemption. Doesn't Homestead cap your tax appraisal increase at 10%/year? Why all the complaining about market value? Go easy on me given my experience…
HCAD 2023
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I just sent you a message. This would be a great tenant.
This year, but it will keep going up 10% every year until it catches up.
I'll give you an example.
My dad purchased a house 4 blocks from me 20 years ago for 1/4 of what I did in 2016. His property taxes are the same as mine because he never protested and I did every year. They just kept jacking up 10% every year and he did nothing.
I'll give you an example.
My dad purchased a house 4 blocks from me 20 years ago for 1/4 of what I did in 2016. His property taxes are the same as mine because he never protested and I did every year. They just kept jacking up 10% every year and he did nothing.
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Serious question: Do you think a 10% annual increase in your property taxes is ok?
I mean theoretically no, but my question is more about people complaining about market value when tax appraisal values are capped. I've seen a lot of complaining about market values, which shouldn't impact homestead/HCAD values, no?
My market value moved from $425K to $524k. Let's ignore the fact that there is no comparable sale that would support listing my house for $524k. Even if my market value doesn't go up another dollar, HCAD will continue increasing my appraised value by the maximum 10% until my appraised matches market. They will continue to do this even if the market declines. The only way to get your market value adjusted is to protest.schmidthead said:
I mean theoretically no, but my question is more about people complaining about market value when tax appraisal values are capped. I've seen a lot of complaining about market values, which shouldn't impact homestead/HCAD values, no?
If you want to keep your taxes under control, you have to keep your market value in check...even if your appraised value is "fair".
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OK I understand what you mean now.
As AgLA06 explained, one of the issues is that for future years, your taxes can go up, even if market values go down. Over time, this can be very impactful, to the point where it forces out long time residents. If you get 10% raises from your employer every single year over the course of your career, you are a lucky man. Those who don't will get forced out.
Further, there are several people on this thread like myself whose market values went up 30% or more. I am very confident that I cannot sell my house for its market value as noted by HCAD today. If I had a "sell to HCAD now" button, I would slam it right now. These are unrealistic values, which leads to my next point.
The system is broken and I believe some people need to be in prison for letting it morph into what it is today. I might get some hate for this, but its the truth. The system is set up to hand taxpayer money back to former employees of the CAD who now consult. Much like a casino, the CAD rewards just enough people who protest their own taxes each year so that they tell others that they saved X dollars this year. Meanwhile, the majority of folks who protest their own taxes lose. Watch this thread over the next six months and pay attention to some of the stories you'll read of unsuccessful protests from the few who will admit it. Those stories are a big joke. Homeowner comes in to protest with ironclad data and is rejected for no good reason. Now lets check in on HCAD employee Joe. He's worked long enough to get a pension from the taxpayers, but when he retires and starts protesting taxes for others for a percentage is when the real money comes. When its time to protest, Joe walks in and sits across the protest table from his old coworkers, who helped set the values in the first place, and who will help determine how successful Joe's protest is (and then how good his consulting revenue will be). That is wrong. I'm not mad at anyone who protests taxes for a living, but that doesn't make the system right.
As AgLA06 explained, one of the issues is that for future years, your taxes can go up, even if market values go down. Over time, this can be very impactful, to the point where it forces out long time residents. If you get 10% raises from your employer every single year over the course of your career, you are a lucky man. Those who don't will get forced out.
Further, there are several people on this thread like myself whose market values went up 30% or more. I am very confident that I cannot sell my house for its market value as noted by HCAD today. If I had a "sell to HCAD now" button, I would slam it right now. These are unrealistic values, which leads to my next point.
The system is broken and I believe some people need to be in prison for letting it morph into what it is today. I might get some hate for this, but its the truth. The system is set up to hand taxpayer money back to former employees of the CAD who now consult. Much like a casino, the CAD rewards just enough people who protest their own taxes each year so that they tell others that they saved X dollars this year. Meanwhile, the majority of folks who protest their own taxes lose. Watch this thread over the next six months and pay attention to some of the stories you'll read of unsuccessful protests from the few who will admit it. Those stories are a big joke. Homeowner comes in to protest with ironclad data and is rejected for no good reason. Now lets check in on HCAD employee Joe. He's worked long enough to get a pension from the taxpayers, but when he retires and starts protesting taxes for others for a percentage is when the real money comes. When its time to protest, Joe walks in and sits across the protest table from his old coworkers, who helped set the values in the first place, and who will help determine how successful Joe's protest is (and then how good his consulting revenue will be). That is wrong. I'm not mad at anyone who protests taxes for a living, but that doesn't make the system right.
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Thanks for the responses, and I obviously don't want my taxes to increase 10%/year just because. My question is why complain about market value vs tax appraisal value?
Because you're being taxed in a fictitious amount. Market value only exists if you sell. The buyer determines it. So people employed by the county thar needs more and more money to keep up with bloated unbalanced budgets aren't going to be unbiased.
It's like being taxes on investments you haven't cashed out. Black Friday could make them worthless tomorrow.
I left my formal meeting last year with the CAD employee admitting I had great supporting info, but he couldn't lower it that much. They're evaluated on how much they take off. That's F'ed up.
It's like being taxes on investments you haven't cashed out. Black Friday could make them worthless tomorrow.
I left my formal meeting last year with the CAD employee admitting I had great supporting info, but he couldn't lower it that much. They're evaluated on how much they take off. That's F'ed up.
But you're not taxed on a theoretical market value… you're taxed on the appraisal value. What am I missing here?
I'm honestly curious about the disconnect between market and tax valuations
What do you think the Apraised value represents?
It's their opinion as to what your property is worth. They're assigning a fictitious value.
It's their opinion as to what your property is worth. They're assigning a fictitious value.
The amount I pay taxes on?
schmidthead said:
But you're not taxed on a theoretical market value… you're taxed on the appraisal value. What am I missing here?
Because eventually you will be taxed on the market value. That's HCAD's goal.
My appraised is $407k. If I don't protest my market value, next year my appraised will be $407k+($407k x 0.1) or $447k. The year after that, it will be $447k+($447k x 0.1) or $491k. They will keep doing this until my appraised value is $524k.
Not only does that ridiculously increase my taxes, there are no comps to support a current market value of $524k. Also, at this point in the year, there are no comps to support an increase to $447k on Jan 1, 2024.
Also, when you protest, you are never an actually protesting your appraised value. You are always protesting market value. But since appraised cannot exceed market, sometimes a protest results in a lowering of your appraised value.
schmidthead said:
The amount I pay taxes on?
You pay the tax rate based on your appraised value.
2.56% tax rate on $500k appraisal is $12,800. That's what I argued it down to from the $550k value they tried to screw me with last year.
They hit me with a 12.6% increase this year ($507k 2022 to $572k in 2022). If that increase would have been on last year's $550k it would have been $619k or $50k more than the ridiculous $70k I got this year. It compounds and snowballs out of control unless you protest every year.
It's been explained pretty well. Sure, my taxes are capped on appraised value but if market value is overly inflated, my appraised value will increase next year even if the actual real estate market drops. I mean do you expect the people who are using the worst, most inflated comps they can find to raise values now expect them to actually lower them if appropriate? The compounding effect is real.
And not like 10% is nothing. If someone has a million dollar house, which isn't crazy in Houston anymore, that's $17k in taxes. 10% is damn near an additional $2k in taxes every year.
And not like 10% is nothing. If someone has a million dollar house, which isn't crazy in Houston anymore, that's $17k in taxes. 10% is damn near an additional $2k in taxes every year.
Yes, I understand math, probably more than most of the people on this board. But *****ing about market value vs tax appraisal value is ridiculous, fear mongering.
I'm totally going to have to get a sock account after that!
Then why are you here? Only a fool would willingly pay money for the government to piss away on a made up value you can't actually get for your house.
schmidthead said:
Yes, I understand math, probably more than most of the people on this board. But *****ing about market value vs tax appraisal value is ridiculous, fear mongering.
Fear mongering? Lmao
So you really don't think my market increasing by 20+% this year is a big deal? The fact that, by default, if I don't fight it the next two years (which is time and/or money out of my pocket) my appraised value will go up 10% again next year isn't a big deal?
schmidthead said:
Yes, I understand math, probably more than most of the people on this board. But *****ing about market value vs tax appraisal value is ridiculous, fear mongering.
You are 100% incorrect. It's most definitely not fear-mongering. Your appraised value will continue to increase until it reaches market value. HCAD does not raise market value every year. I've been in my house 10 years, and a few of those, market value stayed the same. But my appraised value still went up because it was lower than market.
If your market value is too high, regardless of what the actual real estate market is doing, you will eventually be taxed on that amount. How long it takes is dependent on the delta between your appraised and market value. If you purchased within the last few years, then that delta is probably zero (or close to it).
And you're conveniently ignoring the fact that market value is what you protest. You cannot protest appraised value. They will simply adjust your appraised value if it is higher than market. The only way that happens is if you protest your market value and get it lowered.
MOTHER ****ING ****STICKS ****ING MAXXED OUT OUR APPRAISED VALUE FOR THE 7TH OR 8TH ****ING YEAR IN A ROW. I ****ING HATE THISE COCK GOBBLERS AT HCAD!!
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schmidthead said:
Yes, I understand math, probably more than most of the people on this board. But *****ing about market value vs tax appraisal value is ridiculous, fear mongering.
Jesus people. Quit feeding this troll
Not a troll, just wanted to some honest feedback. Didn't realize the responses would be that passionate!
Technically if the appraised value is fair to you, you can leave the market value as is and let a year pass (being limited to your 10% cap). Then just see what happens next year (likely the market value won't adjust in your favor).
SnowboardAg said:
Technically if the appraised value is fair to you, you can leave the market value as is and let a year pass (being limited to your 10% cap). Then just see what happens next year (likely the market value won't adjust in your favor).
This is terrible advice to give. The first thing a HCAD appraiser checks is the prior year. If you didn't protest the prior year and then go the next year and fight and want a value lower than the previous year they will laugh at you. They will literally say "well you didn't have an issue with it last year so why do you have an issue this year". Every damn year you protest.
No. Matter. What.
Mr. McGibblets said:SnowboardAg said:
Technically if the appraised value is fair to you, you can leave the market value as is and let a year pass (being limited to your 10% cap). Then just see what happens next year (likely the market value won't adjust in your favor).
This is terrible advice to give. The first thing a HCAD appraiser checks is the prior year. If you didn't protest the prior year and then go the next year and fight and want a value lower than the previous year they will laugh at you. They will literally say "well you didn't have an issue with it last year so why do you have an issue this year". Every damn year you protest.
No. Matter. What.
Seriously. Its the only tax you can actually fight thr government on so why wouldn't you?
I actually let this happen. When I first moved here, I didn't realize I needed to stay on top of the market value. Appraised seemed fair, so I ignored market. Then the next year my appraised jumped to match market. At that point, I knew both were too high.
I did protest and was able to get the market value back down, even though I did not protest the year before. But, this was probably around 2015, when the market where I am was pretty flat (HCAD didn't even increase market value for a couple of years). I had comps that strongly supported my argument.
I very seriously doubt I would be successful doing this given the current market situation.
Also, the protests in those early years have kept my appraised value low and are the big reason why my appraised value is significantly lower than my market value. The benefits of protesting market value even if your appraised seems fair are realized over time. This is a long-term strategy.
I did protest and was able to get the market value back down, even though I did not protest the year before. But, this was probably around 2015, when the market where I am was pretty flat (HCAD didn't even increase market value for a couple of years). I had comps that strongly supported my argument.
I very seriously doubt I would be successful doing this given the current market situation.
Also, the protests in those early years have kept my appraised value low and are the big reason why my appraised value is significantly lower than my market value. The benefits of protesting market value even if your appraised seems fair are realized over time. This is a long-term strategy.
Finally taking a look at the details of my appraisal.
They say my market is $146 sq/ft and appraisal is $131. I pulled the data for my neighborhood, put it into a .xls, and then filtered by houses +/- 100 sq/ft of mine, then used Google Maps to see which houses have pools. Filtering for those without pools (like me), the average is $141 and $122. Those with pools average $142 and $129. Either way, I'm priced way above similar houses in my neighborhood.
Yeah, I'm protesting.
They say my market is $146 sq/ft and appraisal is $131. I pulled the data for my neighborhood, put it into a .xls, and then filtered by houses +/- 100 sq/ft of mine, then used Google Maps to see which houses have pools. Filtering for those without pools (like me), the average is $141 and $122. Those with pools average $142 and $129. Either way, I'm priced way above similar houses in my neighborhood.
Yeah, I'm protesting.
how did you pull "the data for your neighborhood"?
aggiemike02 said:
how did you pull "the data for your neighborhood"?
this
It's in HCAD. For me, I typically just want to see data for my street. If I do an address search with just my street name (no number), it pulls the numbers for every house on the street except for mine (Because I am listed as "current owner"; IDK why it does that).
If I want to go beyond my street, I just search one or two streets over and add that info to my spreadsheet.
You can copy and paste the data into an excel spreadsheet.
HCAD also "organizes" addresses into groups. Your HCAD record has a "Neighborhood" code and a "Neighborhood Group" code. They are in the rows just under owner name and mailing address. You can use these numbers to find out what other areas/houses HCAD thinks are "comps".
For me, street data works just as well.
Edited to add: go to Quick Search; Search by Address; enter street name only. You'll get a table of results.
If you live on a street that has a name that is used elsewhere in Harris County, this method doesn't work as well. But you can still copy and paste to a spreadsheet and clean up the data.
There are also tabs at the very top of your HCAD record (under your account number) that say "Nearby Addresses", "Same Street Name", and "Related Map" (followed by four numbers and a letter). You can click on each of these to get various search results, too.
I don't find the "Related Map" results to be very good. It includes areas with homes that are not comps from a real estate standpoint.
If I want to go beyond my street, I just search one or two streets over and add that info to my spreadsheet.
You can copy and paste the data into an excel spreadsheet.
HCAD also "organizes" addresses into groups. Your HCAD record has a "Neighborhood" code and a "Neighborhood Group" code. They are in the rows just under owner name and mailing address. You can use these numbers to find out what other areas/houses HCAD thinks are "comps".
For me, street data works just as well.
Edited to add: go to Quick Search; Search by Address; enter street name only. You'll get a table of results.
If you live on a street that has a name that is used elsewhere in Harris County, this method doesn't work as well. But you can still copy and paste to a spreadsheet and clean up the data.
There are also tabs at the very top of your HCAD record (under your account number) that say "Nearby Addresses", "Same Street Name", and "Related Map" (followed by four numbers and a letter). You can click on each of these to get various search results, too.
I don't find the "Related Map" results to be very good. It includes areas with homes that are not comps from a real estate standpoint.
thanks! never not put an address in. works hcad "great" using just the street - gotta love how hard they make it.
You should get the same info from that "Same Street Name" tab I mentioned. It's just not obvious that tab is even a clickable link. It's not highlighted like other links in the record are.
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