Logos Stick said:

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Ogre09 said:

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My parents grew up learning to swim in the 60s in their community pools. The black kids in their schools weren't allowed in. There was no swimmable free open bodies of water around them, just school and community pools.

My parents were intentional about getting their kids to learn to swim. Would they have been if they had never learned? I'm was intentional about getting my kids to learn to swim. Would I have been if I had never learned?

It has to start somewhere. But we're not that far removed from when there were not equal opportunities.

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If by community pools, you mean city pools, they were most certainly allowed in. The civil rights act was passed in 1965. Pools were open to all.

My mom, who could not swim, sent me to the YMCA for free swimming lessons. The opportunities were and are there.

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Yes. And if you look at the small to medium cities-- 10k to 120k population-- pools are in either older neighborhoods that have changed demographically, or in Parks that have been built recently for enjoyment of minority population.
LOL, took my kids to a city pool right in the heart of low income housing. No black kids in their classes. Now when they opened doors for swimming, the place was full of black kids, mostly wading and splashing. in shallow end, and of course under the watchful eyes of lifeguards.
Agree that black folks dont swim because of the past, but every opportunity is out there for them to teach their kids to swim. In this day and time, the ability to swim and or take lessons is on the parent.
And it is getting to where a household with two working parents, college educated white people, are not getting their kids the lessons they need as well.

Current, undertow, rip tide, etc. Kid could have been a great swimmer and not been able to defeat nature.

The family hired Ben Crump it appears so feels like they are for sure going to play a racial angle to this.

Granted the high school I attended in Connecticut was a bedroom community being only 50 or so miles from NYC. A lot of commuters. Large school with 2000 students and that was in the early 70s. But winters were obviously not conducive to outdoor sports so more emphasis on indoor sports there.

Same set of grandparents that had the lake house also had a city pool complete with high dive that ten cents got you in for an entire day. I used to spend summers with them and they would take me to the pool in the afternoons after my grandmother got off her shift at the hospital.

Also, back in the 70s most of my female gym teachers were likely gay as few, if any of them were married and they were quite muscular as memory serves. Any kid flailing around in the pool would have been hauled out of it very quickly.. Lifesaving equipment was all around the pool areas as well.

https://www.wlox.com/2026/07/09/family-nolan-wells-hold-press-conference-with-ben-crump-rev-al-sharpton-independent-autopsy-ordered/

The playbook is being run chapter by chapter, right on cue so far. It's predictability is truly marvelous.

For the record, I don't believe the parents sought out any of these folks, I think they inserted themselves into their "camp" through an enormous amount of social peer pressure.

aggiehawg said:

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If by community pools, you mean city pools, they were most certainly allowed in. The civil rights act was passed in 1965. Pools were open to all.

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Didn't Biden have a lifeguard at a majority black neighborhood pool story?

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Yeah, he called Corn Pops "Esther Williams " and they got into a brawl at the pool and both ended up in the water. Joe pulled him out of the deep end and gave him mouth-to-mouth resuscitation saving his life earning the respect of the whole neighborhood. I think that's how the story went.

This whole things points to a bigger problem I see with kids of this age these days. No accountability. My teens, 17/18 seem to have 4,000% more sense of responsibility, manners, common sense etc than their peers. There is a 100% chance my kids would have called us before leaving saying "we can't find our friend". I don't know what the hell kind of disconnect parents have these days with their kids but their parenting sucks donkey balls. We never would have gone to an island with 4 people and left with 3. Ever.

Get involved with your kids. Teach them how to be decent human beings. Put them in 4H or something where they can be around other kids that are responsible and decent human beings.

Kids at this age should never be 'cut loose'. Teach them to reach out when their underdeveloped brains recognize that something isn't right so you can help them make good decisions. I don't think race is a problem here. ****ty kids created by ****ty parents are.

I don't t think they had reliable cell service that far offshore?

BrazosDog02 said:

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This whole things points to a bigger problem I see with kids of this age these days. No accountability. My teens, 17/18 seem to have 4,000% more sense of responsibility, manners, common sense etc than their peers. There is a 100% chance my kids would have called us before leaving saying "we can't find our friend". I don't know what the hell kind of disconnect parents have these days with their kids but their parenting sucks donkey balls. We never would have gone to an island with 4 people and left with 3. Ever.

Get involved with your kids. Teach them how to be decent human beings. Put them in 4H or something where they can be around other kids that are responsible and decent human beings.

Kids at this age should never be 'cut loose'. Teach them to reach out when their underdeveloped brains recognize that something isn't right so you can help them make good decisions. I don't think race is a problem here. ****ty kids created by ****ty parents are.

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The story one of the kid's mom posted was that they left to come back because their boat was leaking and taking on water and Nolan told them he was going to stay and catch a ride back with somebody else. Don't think he was missing at the time they left or at least that was the story she was told.

aggiehawg said:

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I don't t think they had reliable cell service that far offshore?

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They don't.

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The story one of the kid's mom posted was that they left to come back because their boat was leaking and taking on water and Nolan told them he was going to stay and catch a ride back with somebody else. Don't think he was missing at the time they left or at least that was the story she was told.

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Forget to put the plug back in?

aggiehawg said:

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The story one of the kid's mom posted was that they left to come back because their boat was leaking and taking on water and Nolan told them he was going to stay and catch a ride back with somebody else. Don't think he was missing at the time they left or at least that was the story she was told.

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Forget to put the plug back in?

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Or had a leaky plug.

txags92 said:

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aggiehawg said:

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The story one of the kid's mom posted was that they left to come back because their boat was leaking and taking on water and Nolan told them he was going to stay and catch a ride back with somebody else. Don't think he was missing at the time they left or at least that was the story she was told.

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Forget to put the plug back in?

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Or had a leaky plug.

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Kids who haven't been fully checked out on boat maintenance do have a tendency to forget those little details. Seen it several times over my years at our lake place. The Hubs has a rescued a few of them. Get out in the middle of the lake and realized they are sinking, panic and start screaming for help. We just happened to be down at the dock at those times. Throw in some alcohol being involved...and well can certainly see that happening.

aggiehawg said:

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txags92 said:

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aggiehawg said:

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The story one of the kid's mom posted was that they left to come back because their boat was leaking and taking on water and Nolan told them he was going to stay and catch a ride back with somebody else. Don't think he was missing at the time they left or at least that was the story she was told.

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Forget to put the plug back in?

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Or had a leaky plug.

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Kids who haven't been fully checked out on boat maintenance do have a tendency to forget those little details. Seen it several times over my years at our lake place. The Hubs has a rescued a few of them. Get out in the middle of the lake and realized they are sinking, panic and start screaming for help. We just happened to be down at the dock at those times. Throw in some alcohol being involved...and well can certainly see that happening.

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I did it once myself, but it was because we pulled the boat out of the water at the ramp and then noticed it was slightly skewed on the trailer rails when I went to tie it down. I failed to notice that my dad had already pulled the plug and we backed it down to reset it on the trailer. By the time we realized what was happening, we had enough water in the back end of the boat that the truck was barely able to pull it back up the ramp.

Bet you felt stupid, eh? Some of my favorite Don't-tell-Mom Dad moments were at the lake.

aggiehawg said:

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Bet you felt stupid, eh? Some of my favorite Don't-tell-Mom Dad moments were at the lake.

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Not so much that time, but definitely the time when I was 17 and we took the boat down to the ramp and the engine wasn't starting real easily. I backed down, cranked out some slack in the line from the winch, set the clicker on the winch (or so I thought) then gave the boat a shove to get it off the trailer and floating so I could unclip the strap and pull the boat over to the dock. When the boat hit the end of the slack in the strap, that winch (which was not in fact locked) started spinning and the handle came right up and popped me in the mouth. Knocked my two lower teeth crooked and split my lip wide open. 6 stitches in my lower lip later I ALWAYS double check that the clicker is set on the winch now.

OUCH! That will ruin a day of boating pretty fast.

Part of the problem I've seen with this story is that it's women driving the racial component. Women can't fathom leaving a friend behind without it being malicious, because leaving a friend behind is how women fight.

The way I see it is Nolan came to the island with his Tier 2 friends, found tail to chase and his best friend (tier 1 friend) and then told the first group he was hanging back with them. That's normal for guys. It's a big reason why you see solo males get in trouble in party situations.

But to a women, you wouldn't ditch the Tier 2 friends regardless of who was on the island because if you did, that would be considered aggression in that friend group.

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When the boat hit the end of the slack in the strap, that winch (which was not in fact locked) started spinning and the handle came right up and popped me in the mouth. Knocked my two lower teeth crooked and split my lip wide open. 6 stitches in my lower lip later I ALWAYS double check that the clicker is set on the winch now.

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My dad had this happen and it broke his nose badly enough to eventually require surgery to correct a deviated septum. Thanks to one of my cousins who was exploring the way that a wench works...


No edit - erroneous spelling "wench" is just too good to correct lol

Here's a few photos from a trip to Horn Island on my boat last July 12th. This is a typical scene out there every nice weekend in the summer. It would have would have been way more crowded on Independence Day.

schmellba99 said:

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aggiehawg said:

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Do schools not have pools anymore?

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Most do

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Is this an East Texas thing?

I can count the number of high school swimming pools in the Panhandle on the fingers of one thumb.

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Thanks to one of my cousins who was exploring the way that a wench works...

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I spent way too much of my young life trying to figure out how a wench works

CanyonAg77 said:

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Thanks to one of my cousins who was exploring the way that a wench works...

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I spent way too much of my young life trying to figure out how a wench works

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If you ever figure it out, let the rest of us in on it.

CanyonAg77 said:

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schmellba99 said:

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aggiehawg said:

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Do schools not have pools anymore?

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Most do

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Is this an East Texas thing?

I can count the number of high school swimming pools in the Panhandle on the fingers of one thumb.

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I went to Midland Lee. The posh HS was Midland High back then. But we had an indoor pool and I would swim during gym class.

Midland Lee was just your average middle class neighborhood. Had a few rich kids mostly who were in oil families and lived on large tracts outside of the city. The only Porsche in our school parking lot belonged to a math teacher who had married very, very well. Big Daddy Davenport also sported the first Rolex I had ever seen in person. Called his wife, "His friend" who have given the car and watch to him.

aggiehawg said:

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CanyonAg77 said:

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schmellba99 said:

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aggiehawg said:

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Do schools not have pools anymore?

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Most do

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Is this an East Texas thing?

I can count the number of high school swimming pools in the Panhandle on the fingers of one thumb.

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I went to Midland Lee. The posh HS was Midland High back then. But we had an indoor pool and I would swim during gym class.

Midland Lee was just your average middle class neighborhood. Had a few rich kids mostly who were in oil families and lived on large tracts outside of the city. The only Porsche in our school parking lot belonged to a math teacher who had married very, very well. Big Daddy Davenport also sported the first Rolex I had ever seen in person. Called his wife, "His friend" who have given the car and watch to him.

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I went to Friendswood HS, which was an upper end 4A school in the Houston area in the 80s and 90s and our swim team had to take a bus to the pool at Alvin HS to practice. There is a full natatorium at FHS now.

Gee, all of this time I thought I just had your average middle class childhood in the 60s and 70s. Guess I had way more options and experiences than kids do today. Weird, huh?

I assume you must need id to sign up for swim lessons. This just proves why we can't check id on Election Day.

Back on the topic, I'm not sure how this investigation will ultimately play out but the rush of so many to attribute this to a racial motivation or automatically assume foul play because it was 3 white kids and 1 black kid is beyond tiresome and what's worse is all the white guilt ridden content makers egging on that racial narrative. You've got Whoopie out there on the View saying "WE are watching" implying race is playing a role, Ben Crump showing up, etc. Ben Crump only shows up when these dynamics are in play. I've yet to see him in the ghetto when a black gangbanger guns down a black kid in a driveby.

When this type story plays out in the court of public opinion like it already has, if its found that he simply drowned with no apparent foul play, a ton of people simply won't believe it. We saw it with Karmelo with people thinking he's still pure as the driven snow.

It honestly sounded to me like he was caught in a riptide and died.

I saw on Twitter that there is an area near the island called 'the washing machine' because the rip current is that bad, sounds pretty easy to get caught out there and in trouble even if you're a strong swimmer.

Backyard Gator said:

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It honestly sounded to me like he was caught in a riptide and died.

I saw on Twitter that there is an area near the island called 'the washing machine' because the rip current is that bad, sounds pretty easy to get caught out there and in trouble even if you're a strong swimmer.

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Yes there is a reason people congregate on a particular side of the island. Gentle slope and can wade out pretty far, accommodating more boats.

The other side has a steep and sudden drop off wherein the current is very strong, according to reports I have read.

https://www.wlox.com/2026/07/09/charter-boat-captain-discusses-hazardous-conditions-possible-around-horn-island/

Much longer read but interesting.
https://www.southernliving.com/horn-island-ms-11936669?

jopatura said:

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Part of the problem I've seen with this story is that it's women driving the racial component. Women can't fathom leaving a friend behind without it being malicious, because leaving a friend behind is how women fight.

The way I see it is Nolan came to the island with his Tier 2 friends, found tail to chase and his best friend (tier 1 friend) and then told the first group he was hanging back with them. That's normal for guys. It's a big reason why you see solo males get in trouble in party situations.

But to a women, you wouldn't ditch the Tier 2 friends regardless of who was on the island because if you did, that would be considered aggression in that friend group.

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People are acting like he was left behind by friends in an active war zone

4stringAg said:

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Back on the topic, I'm not sure how this investigation will ultimately play out but the rush of so many to attribute this to a racial motivation or automatically assume foul play because it was 3 white kids and 1 black kid is beyond tiresome and what's worse is all the white guilt ridden content makers egging on that racial narrative. You've got Whoopie out there on the View saying "WE are watching" implying race is playing a role, Ben Crump showing up, etc. Ben Crump only shows up when these dynamics are in play. I've yet to see him in the ghetto when a black gangbanger guns down a black kid in a driveby.

When this type story plays out in the court of public opinion like it already has, if its found that he simply drowned with no apparent foul play, a ton of people simply won't believe it. We saw it with Karmelo with people thinking he's still pure as the driven snow.

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And you can bet that there will be white parents who restrict who their kids hang out with because of this narrative (we do not know yet if this one is fits the bill but there are examples of others that do). If the goal is raising American kids to judge by the content of character and not the color of the skin, this mess will take us the oposite direction.

Folks that make a living from race baiting have no incentive to work toward solutions. Classic collective action problem. Unfortunately, the media feverishly props them up and creates the "guilty regardless" position among certain communities that you point out. Again, collective action problem by definition.

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People are acting like he was left behind by friends in an active war zone

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And one of those white friends reported him missing before his own mother did. So apparently he cared enough to make calls to guys in other boats to see if they had brought him back.

tylercsbn9 said:

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jopatura said:

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Part of the problem I've seen with this story is that it's women driving the racial component. Women can't fathom leaving a friend behind without it being malicious, because leaving a friend behind is how women fight.

The way I see it is Nolan came to the island with his Tier 2 friends, found tail to chase and his best friend (tier 1 friend) and then told the first group he was hanging back with them. That's normal for guys. It's a big reason why you see solo males get in trouble in party situations.

But to a women, you wouldn't ditch the Tier 2 friends regardless of who was on the island because if you did, that would be considered aggression in that friend group.

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People are acting like he was left behind by friends in an active war zone

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Did you see all the American flags on those boats? I mean, scary stuff.

AgFan1974 said:

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tylercsbn9 said:

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jopatura said:

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Part of the problem I've seen with this story is that it's women driving the racial component. Women can't fathom leaving a friend behind without it being malicious, because leaving a friend behind is how women fight.

The way I see it is Nolan came to the island with his Tier 2 friends, found tail to chase and his best friend (tier 1 friend) and then told the first group he was hanging back with them. That's normal for guys. It's a big reason why you see solo males get in trouble in party situations.

But to a women, you wouldn't ditch the Tier 2 friends regardless of who was on the island because if you did, that would be considered aggression in that friend group.

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People are acting like he was left behind by friends in an active war zone

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Did you see all the American flags on those boats? I mean, scary stuff.

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Yep, Sunny Hostin would have told Nolan that he was heading into a lynching rather than a teen party.

Its like none of these people have the first clue about dynamics of partying teenagers in large groups while judging the actions of kids and telling them "they shouldn't have left their friend behind". When I was that age and on into my college years, I'd wind up 50% of the time catching a different ride home. There's always one or two in a group that want to hook up with a girl or don't want to go home just yet from the party, etc.

The people who assume things went south because "white, racist boys" behaved badly are the reason race relations have been set back in this country. They are being accused of some nefarious act because they are white and he was not.

So to avoid this, black kids and white kids should never hang out together. White kids so they aren't accused and black kids because they aren't safe.

It would be silly to wait for all the facts to come out. Don't waste an opportunity to race bait.