The last of their woke leadership will donate their empty churches to the Muslim immigrant masses, as they're doing all over Europe.

6 second commentary on the state of the United Methodist Church pic.twitter.com/Yx3ZEIn44T

— Keith Foskey (@YourCalvinist) May 2, 2024

I thought this was well said by Gigem314:

Quote:

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They worship social justice ideology.

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AGROAg88 said:

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The last of their woke leadership will donate their empty churches to the Muslim immigrant masses, as they're doing all over Europe.

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Nah

The congregations will shrivel up, and the buildings will be mostly turned over to "non-denominational" rock concert stuff

Grew up Methodist and we were members of a local Methodist church until 2018 when things started changing. We are now members of a Baptist church and it's been good.

No this isn't a parody... This is an actual conference held by the United Methodist Church in North Carolina.

This is what the woke mind virus does to people's brains.pic.twitter.com/g4BpUaNSys

— Libs of TikTok (@libsoftiktok) May 2, 2024

45-70Ag said:

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Grew up Methodist and we were members of a local Methodist church until 2018 when things started changing. We are now members of a Baptist church and it's been good.

No this isn't a parody... This is an actual conference held by the United Methodist Church in North Carolina.

This is what the woke mind virus does to people's brains.pic.twitter.com/g4BpUaNSys

— Libs of TikTok (@libsoftiktok) May 2, 2024

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The tension starting around 2:21 alone is worth the watch!

Wyoming Aggie said:

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A Net Full of Jello said:

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Wyoming Aggie said:

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Who gives a **** if they are gay? Nobody forces you to go to the church. I get sick and tired of "Christians" judging people. Isn't God the judge?

---

The Bible is pretty clear that Christians are to hold each other accountable and call out sin in each other's lives. The Methodist church is rebelling against God's word and, therefore, against God himself. As brothers and sisters in Christ, it is not only our right but our responsibility to call them out for failing to follow His teachings. If they choose to continue in their sin, that will be on them, but, as James 4:17 tells us (So whoever knows the right thing to do and fails to do it, for him it is sin.), if we know they are sinning and opt not to call out their sin and try to get them back on the right path, we are just as wrong and sinful as they are.



Just a handful of verses about holding each other accountable and calling out sin. There are many, many others:

Brothers, if anyone is caught in any transgression, you who are spiritual should restore him in a spirit of gentleness. Keep watch on yourself, lest you too be tempted. Bear one another's burdens, and so fulfill the law of Christ. - Galatians 6:1-2

"If your brother sins against you, go and tell him his fault, between you and him alone. If he listens to you, you have gained your brother. But if he does not listen, take one or two others along with you, that every charge may be established by the evidence of two or three witnesses. If he refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church. And if he refuses to listen even to the church, let him be to you as a Gentile and a tax collector. - Matthew 18:15-17

Two are better than one, because they have a good reward for their toil. For if they fall, one will lift up his fellow. But woe to him who is alone when he falls and has not another to lift him up! Again, if two lie together, they keep warm, but how can one keep warm alone? And though a man might prevail against one who is alone, two will withstand hima threefold cord is not quickly broken. - Ecclesiastes 4:9-12

Therefore, having put away falsehood, let each one of you speak the truth with his neighbor, for we are members one of another. - Ephesians 4:25

My brothers, if anyone among you wanders from the truth and someone brings him back, let him know that whoever brings back a sinner from his wandering will save his soul from death and will cover a multitude of sins. - James 5:19-20

Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly, teaching and admonishing one another in all wisdom, singing psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, with thankfulness in your hearts to God. - Colossians 3:16

Take care, brothers, lest there be in any of you an evil, unbelieving heart, leading you to fall away from the living God. But exhort one another every day, as long as it is called "today," that none of you may be hardened by the deceitfulness of sin. - Hebrews 3:13-15

Pay attention to yourselves! If your brother sins, rebuke him, and if he repents, forgive him, - Luke 17:3

Whoever says to the wicked, "You are in the right," will be cursed by peoples, abhorred by nations, but those who rebuke the wicked will have delight, and a good blessing will come upon them. - Proverbs 24:24

---

Or just let people live their damn lives while you worry about your own.

I swear "Christians" are worse than the government about telling people how to live their lives.

---

"here, let me ignore all the other posts that owned me earlier in the thread, and respond to this guy in the hope the previous ownage has been forgotten about"

45-70Ag said:

---

Grew up Methodist and we were members of a local Methodist church until 2018 when things started changing. We are now members of a Baptist church and it's been good.

No this isn't a parody... This is an actual conference held by the United Methodist Church in North Carolina.

This is what the woke mind virus does to people's brains.pic.twitter.com/g4BpUaNSys

— Libs of TikTok (@libsoftiktok) May 2, 2024

---

You can't have inclusiveness unless you first separate everyone into classes. Because class is what this is all about.

And this is why my kids know to say they are members of an Independent UMC.

This all pisses me off so much.

My wife grew up in a very vibrant UMC church in Houston (Bear Creek), he brother graduated UT and went to seminary and later his doctorate, and we baptized our kids in our local UMC (Buda).

Prior to Covid the tide was changing and we were looking elsewhere. Their lack of desire to reopen during Covid helped us make a graceful exit and not sever the ties with our friends (all much much much older) who remained and I don't blame them - when you're 75, change probably isn't what you're looking for.

But **** the UMC for letting progressivism, like liberalism, infect a great church and people like a cancer and destroying it from the inside out.

We tuned in to a video of service from last weekend and skipped around. One family, but the rest (probably about 40 people) are all over the age of 70. This church - 199 years old - will literally die and the UMC cares not.

The bishop in the video currently oversees Virginia but was previously the bishop over North Georgia, where her actions really ramped up the disaffiliation movement.

She took the unilateral action of reassigning the senior pastor of the largest, wealthiest church in the conference as political payback for being outspoken with the UMC failing to uphold the Book of Discipline. Then as a lovely parting gift to the North GA conference, she issued an edict on her way out the door to "pause" any disaffiliations until after the General Conference due to (wait for it!) "misinformation". It took legal action by almost 200 churches to get the "pause" lifted.

It is fitting that this topic is now on the Politics board, as it is obvious that all of this has much more to do with politics than religion/Christianity.

It also reinforces the long-held rule in our household - never trust a woman with two/hypenated last names.

BoDog said:

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And this is why my kids know to say they are members of an Independent UMC.

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"Independent UMC"?

Isn't that a textbook contradiction in terms?

NCNJ1217 said:

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Wyoming Aggie said:

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A Net Full of Jello said:

---

Wyoming Aggie said:

---

Who gives a **** if they are gay? Nobody forces you to go to the church. I get sick and tired of "Christians" judging people. Isn't God the judge?

---

The Bible is pretty clear that Christians are to hold each other accountable and call out sin in each other's lives. The Methodist church is rebelling against God's word and, therefore, against God himself. As brothers and sisters in Christ, it is not only our right but our responsibility to call them out for failing to follow His teachings. If they choose to continue in their sin, that will be on them, but, as James 4:17 tells us (So whoever knows the right thing to do and fails to do it, for him it is sin.), if we know they are sinning and opt not to call out their sin and try to get them back on the right path, we are just as wrong and sinful as they are.



Just a handful of verses about holding each other accountable and calling out sin. There are many, many others:

Brothers, if anyone is caught in any transgression, you who are spiritual should restore him in a spirit of gentleness. Keep watch on yourself, lest you too be tempted. Bear one another's burdens, and so fulfill the law of Christ. - Galatians 6:1-2

"If your brother sins against you, go and tell him his fault, between you and him alone. If he listens to you, you have gained your brother. But if he does not listen, take one or two others along with you, that every charge may be established by the evidence of two or three witnesses. If he refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church. And if he refuses to listen even to the church, let him be to you as a Gentile and a tax collector. - Matthew 18:15-17

Two are better than one, because they have a good reward for their toil. For if they fall, one will lift up his fellow. But woe to him who is alone when he falls and has not another to lift him up! Again, if two lie together, they keep warm, but how can one keep warm alone? And though a man might prevail against one who is alone, two will withstand hima threefold cord is not quickly broken. - Ecclesiastes 4:9-12

Therefore, having put away falsehood, let each one of you speak the truth with his neighbor, for we are members one of another. - Ephesians 4:25

My brothers, if anyone among you wanders from the truth and someone brings him back, let him know that whoever brings back a sinner from his wandering will save his soul from death and will cover a multitude of sins. - James 5:19-20

Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly, teaching and admonishing one another in all wisdom, singing psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, with thankfulness in your hearts to God. - Colossians 3:16

Take care, brothers, lest there be in any of you an evil, unbelieving heart, leading you to fall away from the living God. But exhort one another every day, as long as it is called "today," that none of you may be hardened by the deceitfulness of sin. - Hebrews 3:13-15

Pay attention to yourselves! If your brother sins, rebuke him, and if he repents, forgive him, - Luke 17:3

Whoever says to the wicked, "You are in the right," will be cursed by peoples, abhorred by nations, but those who rebuke the wicked will have delight, and a good blessing will come upon them. - Proverbs 24:24

---

Or just let people live their damn lives while you worry about your own.

I swear "Christians" are worse than the government about telling people how to live their lives.

---

"here, let me ignore all the other posts that owned me earlier in the thread, and respond to this guy in the hope the previous ownage has been forgotten about"

---

OMG I WAS SO PWN3D

cecil77 said:

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Wyoming Aggie said:

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A Net Full of Jello said:

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Again, the Bible tells us that if we see a brother or sister in Christ sinning and do nothing, we are just as guilty.

Edit: Make no mistake, we are to hold our fellow CHRISTIANS accountable. And that means the Methodists in this situation as they are rebelling against God's teaching. As a Christian, they should expect to be called out and while no one likes to be rebuked, it should be understood that it is for the good of the sinner.

---

Something about, "if any of you is without sin"

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This is one of the most abused and confused topics Christians discuss. I think there's a fundamental disconnect between holding someone accountable and forcing them to alter their behaviors. Yes we're supposed to hold each other accountable, but (and this is the hard part) the motivation must be love, not hubris/arrogance. And we have no right to force anyone to do anything. But we shouldn't have to be forced to change what we do, either.

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Nobody is forcing you to change

Unsure what the intent of that comment is. I didn't assert I'm having to change anything.

But current members of UMC congregations are being coerced (at the very least) to become something many (most if you've followed the last decade) don't want.

Captain Pablo said:

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BoDog said:

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And this is why my kids know to say they are members of an Independent UMC.

---

"Independent UMC"?

Isn't that a textbook contradiction in terms?

---

Ha ha. I see. Probably so...

We voted to leave the UMC but also decided not to join the Globalist Methodist Church.

Big Methodist church in south Plano...

What benefitted St Andrew & the other Texas UMC churches wanting to leave was the court ruling on the trust clause that the individual churches owned the property.

Churches in other states weren't so fortunate and had to pay ransom to the UMC in order to leave.

TheRatt87 said:

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What benefitted St Andrew & the other Texas UMC churches wanting to leave was the court ruling on the trust clause that the individual churches owned the property.

Churches in other states weren't so fortunate and had to pay ransom to the UMC in order to leave.

---

Also the clergy have massive pension obligations they want the leaving churches to fund.

The UMC will die. Progressive Christianity is a tough sell. Liberals don't like church. Conservatives don't want a progressive church. It will be the first choice of no one.

TheRatt87 said:

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What benefitted St Andrew & the other Texas UMC churches wanting to leave was the court ruling on the trust clause that the individual churches owned the property.

Churches in other states weren't so fortunate and had to pay ransom to the UMC in order to leave.

---

Mmmmm. I don't know about owning the property, but my church in San Antonio had to pay a hefty sum to leave.

A tiny church in NE Texas also had to pay an amount (much less, of course).

OldArmy71 said:

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TheRatt87 said:

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What benefitted St Andrew & the other Texas UMC churches wanting to leave was the court ruling on the trust clause that the individual churches owned the property.

Churches in other states weren't so fortunate and had to pay ransom to the UMC in order to leave.

---

Mmmmm. I don't know about owning the property, but my church in San Antonio had to pay a hefty sum to leave.

A tiny church in NE Texas also had to pay an amount (much less, of course).

---

Yes, the Texas ruling is not a slam dunk for the disaffiliating churches. Most are paying to leave assuming they can clear the 2/3 disaffiliation hurdle, which has not been easy for most churches.

I know of two local small churches that voted well above 50% in favor of disaffiliation but failed to meet the 2/3 majority. The 50%+ that wanted disaffiliation promptly left leaving the small minority that "won" with churches they can't fill and bills they can't pay. This is all part of the plan. Liberals want Christianity watered down to the point that the Bible could be a two page brochure on being nice to people like Jesus would do. Failing that, they are more than happy to see these churches fold. The endowments will be raided and the real estate sold and the proceeds will fund progressive causes. That's a win for the progressives.

txwxman said:

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The evangelical church ceded its moral authority when it went all-in on Trump. Its adherents can talk all they want about sin and morality, but no one will listen. Leaders in the evangelical church endorsed an ends-justify-the-means mentality. They went small to get a few judges on the bench and change public policy for a decade or two. And destroyed the church's credibility in the process.

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What color is the sky in your world?

Good grief…not enough eye rolls in the universe for this nonsense.

Wyoming Aggie said:

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NCNJ1217 said:

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Wyoming Aggie said:

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A Net Full of Jello said:

---

Wyoming Aggie said:

---

Who gives a **** if they are gay? Nobody forces you to go to the church. I get sick and tired of "Christians" judging people. Isn't God the judge?

---

The Bible is pretty clear that Christians are to hold each other accountable and call out sin in each other's lives. The Methodist church is rebelling against God's word and, therefore, against God himself. As brothers and sisters in Christ, it is not only our right but our responsibility to call them out for failing to follow His teachings. If they choose to continue in their sin, that will be on them, but, as James 4:17 tells us (So whoever knows the right thing to do and fails to do it, for him it is sin.), if we know they are sinning and opt not to call out their sin and try to get them back on the right path, we are just as wrong and sinful as they are.



Just a handful of verses about holding each other accountable and calling out sin. There are many, many others:

Brothers, if anyone is caught in any transgression, you who are spiritual should restore him in a spirit of gentleness. Keep watch on yourself, lest you too be tempted. Bear one another's burdens, and so fulfill the law of Christ. - Galatians 6:1-2

"If your brother sins against you, go and tell him his fault, between you and him alone. If he listens to you, you have gained your brother. But if he does not listen, take one or two others along with you, that every charge may be established by the evidence of two or three witnesses. If he refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church. And if he refuses to listen even to the church, let him be to you as a Gentile and a tax collector. - Matthew 18:15-17

Two are better than one, because they have a good reward for their toil. For if they fall, one will lift up his fellow. But woe to him who is alone when he falls and has not another to lift him up! Again, if two lie together, they keep warm, but how can one keep warm alone? And though a man might prevail against one who is alone, two will withstand hima threefold cord is not quickly broken. - Ecclesiastes 4:9-12

Therefore, having put away falsehood, let each one of you speak the truth with his neighbor, for we are members one of another. - Ephesians 4:25

My brothers, if anyone among you wanders from the truth and someone brings him back, let him know that whoever brings back a sinner from his wandering will save his soul from death and will cover a multitude of sins. - James 5:19-20

Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly, teaching and admonishing one another in all wisdom, singing psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, with thankfulness in your hearts to God. - Colossians 3:16

Take care, brothers, lest there be in any of you an evil, unbelieving heart, leading you to fall away from the living God. But exhort one another every day, as long as it is called "today," that none of you may be hardened by the deceitfulness of sin. - Hebrews 3:13-15

Pay attention to yourselves! If your brother sins, rebuke him, and if he repents, forgive him, - Luke 17:3

Whoever says to the wicked, "You are in the right," will be cursed by peoples, abhorred by nations, but those who rebuke the wicked will have delight, and a good blessing will come upon them. - Proverbs 24:24

---

Or just let people live their damn lives while you worry about your own.

I swear "Christians" are worse than the government about telling people how to live their lives.

---

"here, let me ignore all the other posts that owned me earlier in the thread, and respond to this guy in the hope the previous ownage has been forgotten about"

---

OMG I WAS SO PWN3D

---

Indeed you have been.

And this last post shows the maturity of a 5th grader. Take the L and fight another day.

Some Junkie Cosmonaut said:

---

Wyoming Aggie said:

---

NCNJ1217 said:

---

Wyoming Aggie said:

---

A Net Full of Jello said:

---

Wyoming Aggie said:

---

Who gives a **** if they are gay? Nobody forces you to go to the church. I get sick and tired of "Christians" judging people. Isn't God the judge?

---

The Bible is pretty clear that Christians are to hold each other accountable and call out sin in each other's lives. The Methodist church is rebelling against God's word and, therefore, against God himself. As brothers and sisters in Christ, it is not only our right but our responsibility to call them out for failing to follow His teachings. If they choose to continue in their sin, that will be on them, but, as James 4:17 tells us (So whoever knows the right thing to do and fails to do it, for him it is sin.), if we know they are sinning and opt not to call out their sin and try to get them back on the right path, we are just as wrong and sinful as they are.



Just a handful of verses about holding each other accountable and calling out sin. There are many, many others:

Brothers, if anyone is caught in any transgression, you who are spiritual should restore him in a spirit of gentleness. Keep watch on yourself, lest you too be tempted. Bear one another's burdens, and so fulfill the law of Christ. - Galatians 6:1-2

"If your brother sins against you, go and tell him his fault, between you and him alone. If he listens to you, you have gained your brother. But if he does not listen, take one or two others along with you, that every charge may be established by the evidence of two or three witnesses. If he refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church. And if he refuses to listen even to the church, let him be to you as a Gentile and a tax collector. - Matthew 18:15-17

Two are better than one, because they have a good reward for their toil. For if they fall, one will lift up his fellow. But woe to him who is alone when he falls and has not another to lift him up! Again, if two lie together, they keep warm, but how can one keep warm alone? And though a man might prevail against one who is alone, two will withstand hima threefold cord is not quickly broken. - Ecclesiastes 4:9-12

Therefore, having put away falsehood, let each one of you speak the truth with his neighbor, for we are members one of another. - Ephesians 4:25

My brothers, if anyone among you wanders from the truth and someone brings him back, let him know that whoever brings back a sinner from his wandering will save his soul from death and will cover a multitude of sins. - James 5:19-20

Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly, teaching and admonishing one another in all wisdom, singing psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, with thankfulness in your hearts to God. - Colossians 3:16

Take care, brothers, lest there be in any of you an evil, unbelieving heart, leading you to fall away from the living God. But exhort one another every day, as long as it is called "today," that none of you may be hardened by the deceitfulness of sin. - Hebrews 3:13-15

Pay attention to yourselves! If your brother sins, rebuke him, and if he repents, forgive him, - Luke 17:3

Whoever says to the wicked, "You are in the right," will be cursed by peoples, abhorred by nations, but those who rebuke the wicked will have delight, and a good blessing will come upon them. - Proverbs 24:24

---

Or just let people live their damn lives while you worry about your own.

I swear "Christians" are worse than the government about telling people how to live their lives.

---

"here, let me ignore all the other posts that owned me earlier in the thread, and respond to this guy in the hope the previous ownage has been forgotten about"

---

OMG I WAS SO PWN3D

---

Indeed you have been.

And this last post shows the maturity of a 5th grader. Take the L and fight another day.

---

Please explain to me how I was owned. There's 350,000 churches in this country. If you don't like what others are doing in their church, you can simply stay away from them instead of judging them for how they wish to worship. I know that's hard for Christians to do though. Like it or not, this judgmental worldview is the biggest reason why people are leaving the church in droves.

Wyoming Aggie said:

---

Some Junkie Cosmonaut said:

---

Wyoming Aggie said:

---

NCNJ1217 said:

---

Wyoming Aggie said:

---

A Net Full of Jello said:

---

Wyoming Aggie said:

---

Who gives a **** if they are gay? Nobody forces you to go to the church. I get sick and tired of "Christians" judging people. Isn't God the judge?

---

The Bible is pretty clear that Christians are to hold each other accountable and call out sin in each other's lives. The Methodist church is rebelling against God's word and, therefore, against God himself. As brothers and sisters in Christ, it is not only our right but our responsibility to call them out for failing to follow His teachings. If they choose to continue in their sin, that will be on them, but, as James 4:17 tells us (So whoever knows the right thing to do and fails to do it, for him it is sin.), if we know they are sinning and opt not to call out their sin and try to get them back on the right path, we are just as wrong and sinful as they are.



Just a handful of verses about holding each other accountable and calling out sin. There are many, many others:

Brothers, if anyone is caught in any transgression, you who are spiritual should restore him in a spirit of gentleness. Keep watch on yourself, lest you too be tempted. Bear one another's burdens, and so fulfill the law of Christ. - Galatians 6:1-2

"If your brother sins against you, go and tell him his fault, between you and him alone. If he listens to you, you have gained your brother. But if he does not listen, take one or two others along with you, that every charge may be established by the evidence of two or three witnesses. If he refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church. And if he refuses to listen even to the church, let him be to you as a Gentile and a tax collector. - Matthew 18:15-17

Two are better than one, because they have a good reward for their toil. For if they fall, one will lift up his fellow. But woe to him who is alone when he falls and has not another to lift him up! Again, if two lie together, they keep warm, but how can one keep warm alone? And though a man might prevail against one who is alone, two will withstand hima threefold cord is not quickly broken. - Ecclesiastes 4:9-12

Therefore, having put away falsehood, let each one of you speak the truth with his neighbor, for we are members one of another. - Ephesians 4:25

My brothers, if anyone among you wanders from the truth and someone brings him back, let him know that whoever brings back a sinner from his wandering will save his soul from death and will cover a multitude of sins. - James 5:19-20

Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly, teaching and admonishing one another in all wisdom, singing psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, with thankfulness in your hearts to God. - Colossians 3:16

Take care, brothers, lest there be in any of you an evil, unbelieving heart, leading you to fall away from the living God. But exhort one another every day, as long as it is called "today," that none of you may be hardened by the deceitfulness of sin. - Hebrews 3:13-15

Pay attention to yourselves! If your brother sins, rebuke him, and if he repents, forgive him, - Luke 17:3

Whoever says to the wicked, "You are in the right," will be cursed by peoples, abhorred by nations, but those who rebuke the wicked will have delight, and a good blessing will come upon them. - Proverbs 24:24

---

Or just let people live their damn lives while you worry about your own.

I swear "Christians" are worse than the government about telling people how to live their lives.

---

"here, let me ignore all the other posts that owned me earlier in the thread, and respond to this guy in the hope the previous ownage has been forgotten about"

---

OMG I WAS SO PWN3D

---

Indeed you have been.

And this last post shows the maturity of a 5th grader. Take the L and fight another day.

---

Please explain to me how I was owned. There's 350,000 churches in this country. If you don't like what others are doing in their church, you can simply stay away from them instead of judging them for how they wish to worship. I know that's hard for Christians to do though. Like it or not, this judgmental worldview is the biggest reason why people are leaving the church in droves.

---

Are you the same guy that (unironically) posted this:

Quote:

---

I can't imagine spending hours of my life protesting. What a waste of time. If I feel so strongly about something being wrong, I'm coming armed with something more than a stupid sign.

---

Arguing on Texags is different eh?

AGC said:

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Wyoming Aggie said:

---

Some Junkie Cosmonaut said:

---

Wyoming Aggie said:

---

NCNJ1217 said:

---

Wyoming Aggie said:

---

A Net Full of Jello said:

---

Wyoming Aggie said:

---

Who gives a **** if they are gay? Nobody forces you to go to the church. I get sick and tired of "Christians" judging people. Isn't God the judge?

---

The Bible is pretty clear that Christians are to hold each other accountable and call out sin in each other's lives. The Methodist church is rebelling against God's word and, therefore, against God himself. As brothers and sisters in Christ, it is not only our right but our responsibility to call them out for failing to follow His teachings. If they choose to continue in their sin, that will be on them, but, as James 4:17 tells us (So whoever knows the right thing to do and fails to do it, for him it is sin.), if we know they are sinning and opt not to call out their sin and try to get them back on the right path, we are just as wrong and sinful as they are.



Just a handful of verses about holding each other accountable and calling out sin. There are many, many others:

Brothers, if anyone is caught in any transgression, you who are spiritual should restore him in a spirit of gentleness. Keep watch on yourself, lest you too be tempted. Bear one another's burdens, and so fulfill the law of Christ. - Galatians 6:1-2

"If your brother sins against you, go and tell him his fault, between you and him alone. If he listens to you, you have gained your brother. But if he does not listen, take one or two others along with you, that every charge may be established by the evidence of two or three witnesses. If he refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church. And if he refuses to listen even to the church, let him be to you as a Gentile and a tax collector. - Matthew 18:15-17

Two are better than one, because they have a good reward for their toil. For if they fall, one will lift up his fellow. But woe to him who is alone when he falls and has not another to lift him up! Again, if two lie together, they keep warm, but how can one keep warm alone? And though a man might prevail against one who is alone, two will withstand hima threefold cord is not quickly broken. - Ecclesiastes 4:9-12

Therefore, having put away falsehood, let each one of you speak the truth with his neighbor, for we are members one of another. - Ephesians 4:25

My brothers, if anyone among you wanders from the truth and someone brings him back, let him know that whoever brings back a sinner from his wandering will save his soul from death and will cover a multitude of sins. - James 5:19-20

Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly, teaching and admonishing one another in all wisdom, singing psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, with thankfulness in your hearts to God. - Colossians 3:16

Take care, brothers, lest there be in any of you an evil, unbelieving heart, leading you to fall away from the living God. But exhort one another every day, as long as it is called "today," that none of you may be hardened by the deceitfulness of sin. - Hebrews 3:13-15

Pay attention to yourselves! If your brother sins, rebuke him, and if he repents, forgive him, - Luke 17:3

Whoever says to the wicked, "You are in the right," will be cursed by peoples, abhorred by nations, but those who rebuke the wicked will have delight, and a good blessing will come upon them. - Proverbs 24:24

---

Or just let people live their damn lives while you worry about your own.

I swear "Christians" are worse than the government about telling people how to live their lives.

---

"here, let me ignore all the other posts that owned me earlier in the thread, and respond to this guy in the hope the previous ownage has been forgotten about"

---

OMG I WAS SO PWN3D

---

Indeed you have been.

And this last post shows the maturity of a 5th grader. Take the L and fight another day.

---

Please explain to me how I was owned. There's 350,000 churches in this country. If you don't like what others are doing in their church, you can simply stay away from them instead of judging them for how they wish to worship. I know that's hard for Christians to do though. Like it or not, this judgmental worldview is the biggest reason why people are leaving the church in droves.

---

Are you the same guy that (unironically) posted this:

Quote:

---

I can't imagine spending hours of my life protesting. What a waste of time. If I feel so strongly about something being wrong, I'm coming armed with something more than a stupid sign.

---

---

I spoke for myself there. People are free to protest if they like. It has no bearing on my life. Just like it has no bearing on my life if a queer preacher wants to lead a church. What people on this thread are arguing is that people shouldn't be allowed to do something.

Wyoming Aggie said:

---

Some Junkie Cosmonaut said:

---

Wyoming Aggie said:

---

NCNJ1217 said:

---

Wyoming Aggie said:

---

A Net Full of Jello said:

---

Wyoming Aggie said:

---

Who gives a **** if they are gay? Nobody forces you to go to the church. I get sick and tired of "Christians" judging people. Isn't God the judge?

---

The Bible is pretty clear that Christians are to hold each other accountable and call out sin in each other's lives. The Methodist church is rebelling against God's word and, therefore, against God himself. As brothers and sisters in Christ, it is not only our right but our responsibility to call them out for failing to follow His teachings. If they choose to continue in their sin, that will be on them, but, as James 4:17 tells us (So whoever knows the right thing to do and fails to do it, for him it is sin.), if we know they are sinning and opt not to call out their sin and try to get them back on the right path, we are just as wrong and sinful as they are.



Just a handful of verses about holding each other accountable and calling out sin. There are many, many others:

Brothers, if anyone is caught in any transgression, you who are spiritual should restore him in a spirit of gentleness. Keep watch on yourself, lest you too be tempted. Bear one another's burdens, and so fulfill the law of Christ. - Galatians 6:1-2

"If your brother sins against you, go and tell him his fault, between you and him alone. If he listens to you, you have gained your brother. But if he does not listen, take one or two others along with you, that every charge may be established by the evidence of two or three witnesses. If he refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church. And if he refuses to listen even to the church, let him be to you as a Gentile and a tax collector. - Matthew 18:15-17

Two are better than one, because they have a good reward for their toil. For if they fall, one will lift up his fellow. But woe to him who is alone when he falls and has not another to lift him up! Again, if two lie together, they keep warm, but how can one keep warm alone? And though a man might prevail against one who is alone, two will withstand hima threefold cord is not quickly broken. - Ecclesiastes 4:9-12

Therefore, having put away falsehood, let each one of you speak the truth with his neighbor, for we are members one of another. - Ephesians 4:25

My brothers, if anyone among you wanders from the truth and someone brings him back, let him know that whoever brings back a sinner from his wandering will save his soul from death and will cover a multitude of sins. - James 5:19-20

Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly, teaching and admonishing one another in all wisdom, singing psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, with thankfulness in your hearts to God. - Colossians 3:16

Take care, brothers, lest there be in any of you an evil, unbelieving heart, leading you to fall away from the living God. But exhort one another every day, as long as it is called "today," that none of you may be hardened by the deceitfulness of sin. - Hebrews 3:13-15

Pay attention to yourselves! If your brother sins, rebuke him, and if he repents, forgive him, - Luke 17:3

Whoever says to the wicked, "You are in the right," will be cursed by peoples, abhorred by nations, but those who rebuke the wicked will have delight, and a good blessing will come upon them. - Proverbs 24:24

---

Or just let people live their damn lives while you worry about your own.

I swear "Christians" are worse than the government about telling people how to live their lives.

---

"here, let me ignore all the other posts that owned me earlier in the thread, and respond to this guy in the hope the previous ownage has been forgotten about"

---

OMG I WAS SO PWN3D

---

Indeed you have been.

And this last post shows the maturity of a 5th grader. Take the L and fight another day.

---

Please explain to me how I was owned. There's 350,000 churches in this country. If you don't like what others are doing in their church, you can simply stay away from them instead of judging them for how they wish to worship. I know that's hard for Christians to do though. Like it or not, this judgmental worldview is the biggest reason why people are leaving the church in droves.

---

Nope. They are leaving because it takes sacrifice, discipline, and courage to be a Christian. It's much easier to sit on the sidelines and take the "live and let live" approach as we roll downhill to hell.

cevans_40 said:

---

Wyoming Aggie said:

---

Some Junkie Cosmonaut said:

---

Wyoming Aggie said:

---

NCNJ1217 said:

---

Wyoming Aggie said:

---

A Net Full of Jello said:

---

Wyoming Aggie said:

---

Who gives a **** if they are gay? Nobody forces you to go to the church. I get sick and tired of "Christians" judging people. Isn't God the judge?

---

The Bible is pretty clear that Christians are to hold each other accountable and call out sin in each other's lives. The Methodist church is rebelling against God's word and, therefore, against God himself. As brothers and sisters in Christ, it is not only our right but our responsibility to call them out for failing to follow His teachings. If they choose to continue in their sin, that will be on them, but, as James 4:17 tells us (So whoever knows the right thing to do and fails to do it, for him it is sin.), if we know they are sinning and opt not to call out their sin and try to get them back on the right path, we are just as wrong and sinful as they are.



Just a handful of verses about holding each other accountable and calling out sin. There are many, many others:

Brothers, if anyone is caught in any transgression, you who are spiritual should restore him in a spirit of gentleness. Keep watch on yourself, lest you too be tempted. Bear one another's burdens, and so fulfill the law of Christ. - Galatians 6:1-2

"If your brother sins against you, go and tell him his fault, between you and him alone. If he listens to you, you have gained your brother. But if he does not listen, take one or two others along with you, that every charge may be established by the evidence of two or three witnesses. If he refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church. And if he refuses to listen even to the church, let him be to you as a Gentile and a tax collector. - Matthew 18:15-17

Two are better than one, because they have a good reward for their toil. For if they fall, one will lift up his fellow. But woe to him who is alone when he falls and has not another to lift him up! Again, if two lie together, they keep warm, but how can one keep warm alone? And though a man might prevail against one who is alone, two will withstand hima threefold cord is not quickly broken. - Ecclesiastes 4:9-12

Therefore, having put away falsehood, let each one of you speak the truth with his neighbor, for we are members one of another. - Ephesians 4:25

My brothers, if anyone among you wanders from the truth and someone brings him back, let him know that whoever brings back a sinner from his wandering will save his soul from death and will cover a multitude of sins. - James 5:19-20

Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly, teaching and admonishing one another in all wisdom, singing psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, with thankfulness in your hearts to God. - Colossians 3:16

Take care, brothers, lest there be in any of you an evil, unbelieving heart, leading you to fall away from the living God. But exhort one another every day, as long as it is called "today," that none of you may be hardened by the deceitfulness of sin. - Hebrews 3:13-15

Pay attention to yourselves! If your brother sins, rebuke him, and if he repents, forgive him, - Luke 17:3

Whoever says to the wicked, "You are in the right," will be cursed by peoples, abhorred by nations, but those who rebuke the wicked will have delight, and a good blessing will come upon them. - Proverbs 24:24

---

Or just let people live their damn lives while you worry about your own.

I swear "Christians" are worse than the government about telling people how to live their lives.

---

"here, let me ignore all the other posts that owned me earlier in the thread, and respond to this guy in the hope the previous ownage has been forgotten about"

---

OMG I WAS SO PWN3D

---

Indeed you have been.

And this last post shows the maturity of a 5th grader. Take the L and fight another day.

---

Please explain to me how I was owned. There's 350,000 churches in this country. If you don't like what others are doing in their church, you can simply stay away from them instead of judging them for how they wish to worship. I know that's hard for Christians to do though. Like it or not, this judgmental worldview is the biggest reason why people are leaving the church in droves.

---

Nope. They are leaving because it takes sacrifice, discipline, and courage to be a Christian. It's much easier to sit on the sidelines and take the "live and let live" approach as we roll downhill to hell.

---

"Live and let live" is the way everyone should lead their lives.

Wyoming Aggie said:

---

cevans_40 said:

---

Wyoming Aggie said:

---

Some Junkie Cosmonaut said:

---

Wyoming Aggie said:

---

NCNJ1217 said:

---

Wyoming Aggie said:

---

A Net Full of Jello said:

---

Wyoming Aggie said:

---

Who gives a **** if they are gay? Nobody forces you to go to the church. I get sick and tired of "Christians" judging people. Isn't God the judge?

---

The Bible is pretty clear that Christians are to hold each other accountable and call out sin in each other's lives. The Methodist church is rebelling against God's word and, therefore, against God himself. As brothers and sisters in Christ, it is not only our right but our responsibility to call them out for failing to follow His teachings. If they choose to continue in their sin, that will be on them, but, as James 4:17 tells us (So whoever knows the right thing to do and fails to do it, for him it is sin.), if we know they are sinning and opt not to call out their sin and try to get them back on the right path, we are just as wrong and sinful as they are.



Just a handful of verses about holding each other accountable and calling out sin. There are many, many others:

Brothers, if anyone is caught in any transgression, you who are spiritual should restore him in a spirit of gentleness. Keep watch on yourself, lest you too be tempted. Bear one another's burdens, and so fulfill the law of Christ. - Galatians 6:1-2

"If your brother sins against you, go and tell him his fault, between you and him alone. If he listens to you, you have gained your brother. But if he does not listen, take one or two others along with you, that every charge may be established by the evidence of two or three witnesses. If he refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church. And if he refuses to listen even to the church, let him be to you as a Gentile and a tax collector. - Matthew 18:15-17

Two are better than one, because they have a good reward for their toil. For if they fall, one will lift up his fellow. But woe to him who is alone when he falls and has not another to lift him up! Again, if two lie together, they keep warm, but how can one keep warm alone? And though a man might prevail against one who is alone, two will withstand hima threefold cord is not quickly broken. - Ecclesiastes 4:9-12

Therefore, having put away falsehood, let each one of you speak the truth with his neighbor, for we are members one of another. - Ephesians 4:25

My brothers, if anyone among you wanders from the truth and someone brings him back, let him know that whoever brings back a sinner from his wandering will save his soul from death and will cover a multitude of sins. - James 5:19-20

Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly, teaching and admonishing one another in all wisdom, singing psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, with thankfulness in your hearts to God. - Colossians 3:16

Take care, brothers, lest there be in any of you an evil, unbelieving heart, leading you to fall away from the living God. But exhort one another every day, as long as it is called "today," that none of you may be hardened by the deceitfulness of sin. - Hebrews 3:13-15

Pay attention to yourselves! If your brother sins, rebuke him, and if he repents, forgive him, - Luke 17:3

Whoever says to the wicked, "You are in the right," will be cursed by peoples, abhorred by nations, but those who rebuke the wicked will have delight, and a good blessing will come upon them. - Proverbs 24:24

---

Or just let people live their damn lives while you worry about your own.

I swear "Christians" are worse than the government about telling people how to live their lives.

---

"here, let me ignore all the other posts that owned me earlier in the thread, and respond to this guy in the hope the previous ownage has been forgotten about"

---

OMG I WAS SO PWN3D

---

Indeed you have been.

And this last post shows the maturity of a 5th grader. Take the L and fight another day.

---

Please explain to me how I was owned. There's 350,000 churches in this country. If you don't like what others are doing in their church, you can simply stay away from them instead of judging them for how they wish to worship. I know that's hard for Christians to do though. Like it or not, this judgmental worldview is the biggest reason why people are leaving the church in droves.

---

Nope. They are leaving because it takes sacrifice, discipline, and courage to be a Christian. It's much easier to sit on the sidelines and take the "live and let live" approach as we roll downhill to hell.

---

"Live and let live" is the way everyone should lead their lives.

---

What translation you using here? I don't see it in the king James?

AGC said:

---

Wyoming Aggie said:

---

cevans_40 said:

---

Wyoming Aggie said:

---

Some Junkie Cosmonaut said:

---

Wyoming Aggie said:

---

NCNJ1217 said:

---

Wyoming Aggie said:

---

A Net Full of Jello said:

---

Wyoming Aggie said:

---

Who gives a **** if they are gay? Nobody forces you to go to the church. I get sick and tired of "Christians" judging people. Isn't God the judge?

---

The Bible is pretty clear that Christians are to hold each other accountable and call out sin in each other's lives. The Methodist church is rebelling against God's word and, therefore, against God himself. As brothers and sisters in Christ, it is not only our right but our responsibility to call them out for failing to follow His teachings. If they choose to continue in their sin, that will be on them, but, as James 4:17 tells us (So whoever knows the right thing to do and fails to do it, for him it is sin.), if we know they are sinning and opt not to call out their sin and try to get them back on the right path, we are just as wrong and sinful as they are.



Just a handful of verses about holding each other accountable and calling out sin. There are many, many others:

Brothers, if anyone is caught in any transgression, you who are spiritual should restore him in a spirit of gentleness. Keep watch on yourself, lest you too be tempted. Bear one another's burdens, and so fulfill the law of Christ. - Galatians 6:1-2

"If your brother sins against you, go and tell him his fault, between you and him alone. If he listens to you, you have gained your brother. But if he does not listen, take one or two others along with you, that every charge may be established by the evidence of two or three witnesses. If he refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church. And if he refuses to listen even to the church, let him be to you as a Gentile and a tax collector. - Matthew 18:15-17

Two are better than one, because they have a good reward for their toil. For if they fall, one will lift up his fellow. But woe to him who is alone when he falls and has not another to lift him up! Again, if two lie together, they keep warm, but how can one keep warm alone? And though a man might prevail against one who is alone, two will withstand hima threefold cord is not quickly broken. - Ecclesiastes 4:9-12

Therefore, having put away falsehood, let each one of you speak the truth with his neighbor, for we are members one of another. - Ephesians 4:25

My brothers, if anyone among you wanders from the truth and someone brings him back, let him know that whoever brings back a sinner from his wandering will save his soul from death and will cover a multitude of sins. - James 5:19-20

Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly, teaching and admonishing one another in all wisdom, singing psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, with thankfulness in your hearts to God. - Colossians 3:16

Take care, brothers, lest there be in any of you an evil, unbelieving heart, leading you to fall away from the living God. But exhort one another every day, as long as it is called "today," that none of you may be hardened by the deceitfulness of sin. - Hebrews 3:13-15

Pay attention to yourselves! If your brother sins, rebuke him, and if he repents, forgive him, - Luke 17:3

Whoever says to the wicked, "You are in the right," will be cursed by peoples, abhorred by nations, but those who rebuke the wicked will have delight, and a good blessing will come upon them. - Proverbs 24:24

---

Or just let people live their damn lives while you worry about your own.

I swear "Christians" are worse than the government about telling people how to live their lives.

---

"here, let me ignore all the other posts that owned me earlier in the thread, and respond to this guy in the hope the previous ownage has been forgotten about"

---

OMG I WAS SO PWN3D

---

Indeed you have been.

And this last post shows the maturity of a 5th grader. Take the L and fight another day.

---

Please explain to me how I was owned. There's 350,000 churches in this country. If you don't like what others are doing in their church, you can simply stay away from them instead of judging them for how they wish to worship. I know that's hard for Christians to do though. Like it or not, this judgmental worldview is the biggest reason why people are leaving the church in droves.

---

Nope. They are leaving because it takes sacrifice, discipline, and courage to be a Christian. It's much easier to sit on the sidelines and take the "live and let live" approach as we roll downhill to hell.

---

"Live and let live" is the way everyone should lead their lives.

---

What translation you using here? I don't see it in the king James?

---

People have literally given Bible verses addressing this issue. Amazing how Wyoming just chooses to ignore those Bible verses and spouts random quotes like "live and let live" as if they somehow hold more weight than God's Word.

I guess in a sense this is reflective of how the UMC people are acting. They treat the Bible like a buffet and pick and choose what they want to believe or what conforms to their lifestyle.

First UMC Boerne punted, or whistled past the graveyard, and didn't even discuss it.

As to disaffiliation, my take is my church is more than the real property. 200 of us (or 50 of us) can start a new GMC congregation, meet in a school auditorium or other facility and grow. In several years our UMC church will be broke and we can buy the facility back at a discount. I've been a part of two church startups before, don't really want to again at my age, but I'm not going to be affiliated with the UMC and longer.

I will give our church a little while to decide, but not very long.

Quote:

---

didn't even discuss it

---

I thought it was mandated that each congregation discuss it. I did not realize it was optional.

"I know of two local small churches that voted well above 50% in favor of disaffiliation but failed to meet the 2/3 majority. The 50%+ that wanted disaffiliation promptly left leaving the small minority that "won" with churches they can't fill and bills they can't pay."

Similar story at our Methodist church. Needed at least 66.7% of the vote to leave, but after counting, recounting and counting again the votes that were cast, the percentage voting to leave was only 66.3%. Talk about a kick in the ----!

The 33.7% who thought it was a good idea to stay haven't exactly jumped up to mitigate the damage. Membership is down, attendance is down and giving is way down. Basically, just treading water at this point and not doing a very good job of that.

I dont assume membership, finances, etc of a particular church is public info and/or something you could get your hands on. There is one particular collin county church that I would love to see those trends as the pastor refused to take anything to a vote.

Wyoming Aggie said:

---

Some Junkie Cosmonaut said:

---

Wyoming Aggie said:

---

NCNJ1217 said:

---

Wyoming Aggie said:

---

A Net Full of Jello said:

---

Wyoming Aggie said:

---

Who gives a **** if they are gay? Nobody forces you to go to the church. I get sick and tired of "Christians" judging people. Isn't God the judge?

---

The Bible is pretty clear that Christians are to hold each other accountable and call out sin in each other's lives. The Methodist church is rebelling against God's word and, therefore, against God himself. As brothers and sisters in Christ, it is not only our right but our responsibility to call them out for failing to follow His teachings. If they choose to continue in their sin, that will be on them, but, as James 4:17 tells us (So whoever knows the right thing to do and fails to do it, for him it is sin.), if we know they are sinning and opt not to call out their sin and try to get them back on the right path, we are just as wrong and sinful as they are.



Just a handful of verses about holding each other accountable and calling out sin. There are many, many others:

Brothers, if anyone is caught in any transgression, you who are spiritual should restore him in a spirit of gentleness. Keep watch on yourself, lest you too be tempted. Bear one another's burdens, and so fulfill the law of Christ. - Galatians 6:1-2

"If your brother sins against you, go and tell him his fault, between you and him alone. If he listens to you, you have gained your brother. But if he does not listen, take one or two others along with you, that every charge may be established by the evidence of two or three witnesses. If he refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church. And if he refuses to listen even to the church, let him be to you as a Gentile and a tax collector. - Matthew 18:15-17

Two are better than one, because they have a good reward for their toil. For if they fall, one will lift up his fellow. But woe to him who is alone when he falls and has not another to lift him up! Again, if two lie together, they keep warm, but how can one keep warm alone? And though a man might prevail against one who is alone, two will withstand hima threefold cord is not quickly broken. - Ecclesiastes 4:9-12

Therefore, having put away falsehood, let each one of you speak the truth with his neighbor, for we are members one of another. - Ephesians 4:25

My brothers, if anyone among you wanders from the truth and someone brings him back, let him know that whoever brings back a sinner from his wandering will save his soul from death and will cover a multitude of sins. - James 5:19-20

Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly, teaching and admonishing one another in all wisdom, singing psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, with thankfulness in your hearts to God. - Colossians 3:16

Take care, brothers, lest there be in any of you an evil, unbelieving heart, leading you to fall away from the living God. But exhort one another every day, as long as it is called "today," that none of you may be hardened by the deceitfulness of sin. - Hebrews 3:13-15

Pay attention to yourselves! If your brother sins, rebuke him, and if he repents, forgive him, - Luke 17:3

Whoever says to the wicked, "You are in the right," will be cursed by peoples, abhorred by nations, but those who rebuke the wicked will have delight, and a good blessing will come upon them. - Proverbs 24:24

---

Or just let people live their damn lives while you worry about your own.

I swear "Christians" are worse than the government about telling people how to live their lives.

---

"here, let me ignore all the other posts that owned me earlier in the thread, and respond to this guy in the hope the previous ownage has been forgotten about"

---

OMG I WAS SO PWN3D

---

Indeed you have been.

And this last post shows the maturity of a 5th grader. Take the L and fight another day.

---

Please explain to me how I was owned. There's 350,000 churches in this country. If you don't like what others are doing in their church, you can simply stay away from them instead of judging them for how they wish to worship. I know that's hard for Christians to do though. Like it or not, this judgmental worldview is the biggest reason why people are leaving the church in droves.

---

People are leaving the church because it is less judgmental than before, not because it is more judgmental...

Church attendance and the growth of left-wing "accept all as they are" ideology have a perfectly inverse correlation.