Phatbob said:

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Nanomachines son said:

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Phatbob said:

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Nanomachines son said:

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ttu_85 said:

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Nanomachines son said:

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ttu_85 said:

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Nanomachines son said:

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2wealfth Man said:

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Someone is spending a ton of money on these. National TV, signage at major sporting events, etc. The ads are really opaque to me. There was one yesterday during a hockey game , I believe which showed a tran with a sad face, what I took to be a druggie, minority working a food service job, etc.

This is as a Christian: No doubt he "gets us" and wants to reach all members of the human race with his message but there is a big big AND here which is not being said (notably, we/humanity have to take up the cross and follow him). I just feel like they are promoting this "destructive empathy" which we see all too much of these days without saying the hard part out loud in their ads.

---

They are heretical. It's nothing but pure subversion of Christianity to push lgbtq, open borders, and more. They actively misrepresent and take bible verses out of context to do this.

---

Hatred under the name of Christianity is also heretical. That said we as a nation have laws that the executive branch is failing to enforce. But hatred is never part of the game. You cant cherry pick the word dude.

Love the Lord your God with all you heart, mind and soul.
Love you neighbor as you love yourself.

-- s Jesus Christ

---

Are you saying you actively support a group that deliberately takes the Bible out of context to push leftist beliefs? Do you know what the Bible says about false prophets and those who intentionally lead people astray?

---

Do you pay attention to posting history at all? I am well aware of what the Bible says about false prophets and what happens to people that lead others astray. I also know those prophets were Jewish as was Jesus himself as well as his Apostles.

Lots of false prophets out there and you will know them by their fruit. Hatred of a people is a poisonous fruit. Hatred of sin is not.

---

1st Corinthians 5:9-13

Quote:

---

Immorality Must Be Judged

9 I wrote to you in my epistle not to [f]keep company with sexually immoral people. 10 Yet I certainly did not mean with the sexually immoral people of this world, or with the covetous, or extortioners, or idolaters, since then you would need to go out of the world. 11 But now I have written to you not to keep company with anyone named a brother, who is sexually immoral, or covetous, or an idolater, or a reviler, or a drunkard, or an extortionernot even to eat with such a person.

12 For what have I to do with judging those also who are outside? Do you not judge those who are inside? 13 But those who are outside God judges. Therefore "put away from yourselves the evil person."

---

I don't keep the company of those who are actively enemies of God because these people are corruptible forces. I will minister to them, but I will never be friends with them or engage in common discourse with them.

---

How, then, can you ever possibly be salt? There are key words in that verse a lot of people are missing the "not to keep company with anyone named a brother, who is...". So are you expecting those who are not saved to be righteous first? Do they have to clean up their act before they get saved? If that is the case, what's the point of being saved, if we can do any of that on our own? We are told to judge within ourselves, not those who are not part of the body... that is for God to do.

---

The point Paul is making here is that you should not be friends with them, hang out with them, etc. not that you shouldn't minister to them. The context of your involvement with them should be based around the idea of getting them to convert. You should not do family events with their family, etc.

Also note that this is reserved for people who actively and defiantly live sinful lives and revel in that sin. Someone who is a gambler, a sexual hedonist, alcoholic, drug addict, etc. can tear apart your life easily if you let them in. You should always keep them at arms length for this very reason. That doesn't mean you should not minister to them or show them the way, just that as a Christian, you should not be friends with them.

I don't remember Jesus every becoming active friends with non-believers. He would minister to them and become friends with them after they converted, but never before.

---

This is absolutely untrue. One of the biggest complaints that the Pharisees had about Jesus was that he was a friend to sinners.

The point Paul is making is to keep the world out of Christianity, not Christians out of the world. If the one who calls themselves Christian is okay with their sin, then do not allow them to influence you. But you are called to go into the world and make disciples. Good luck with that when you are yelling at them on the street corners.

If a person can't handle being around sinners without that influencing their walk, then they really need to work on their walk, because it is not enough to do what we are called to do.

---

It wasn't a complaint, it was a lie to stir up folks. They were slandering him. The Pharisees were sinners and he wasn't a friend to them! Was he disobeying himself?!


Jesus said this:

"You are My friends if you do whatever I command you." John 15:14


One primary command was to repent and sin more more!

Rapier108 said:

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Logos Stick said:

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ttu_85 said:

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Nanomachines son said:

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ttu_85 said:

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Nanomachines son said:

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ttu_85 said:

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Nanomachines son said:

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2wealfth Man said:

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Someone is spending a ton of money on these. National TV, signage at major sporting events, etc. The ads are really opaque to me. There was one yesterday during a hockey game , I believe which showed a tran with a sad face, what I took to be a druggie, minority working a food service job, etc.

This is as a Christian: No doubt he "gets us" and wants to reach all members of the human race with his message but there is a big big AND here which is not being said (notably, we/humanity have to take up the cross and follow him). I just feel like they are promoting this "destructive empathy" which we see all too much of these days without saying the hard part out loud in their ads.

---

They are heretical. It's nothing but pure subversion of Christianity to push lgbtq, open borders, and more. They actively misrepresent and take bible verses out of context to do this.

---

Hatred under the name of Christianity is also heretical. That said we as a nation have laws that the executive branch is failing to enforce. But hatred is never part of the game. You cant cherry pick the word dude.

Love the Lord your God with all you heart, mind and soul.
Love you neighbor as you love yourself.

-- s Jesus Christ

---

Are you saying you actively support a group that deliberately takes the Bible out of context to push leftist beliefs? Do you know what the Bible says about false prophets and those who intentionally lead people astray?

---

Do you pay attention to posting history at all? I am well aware of what the Bible says about false prophets and what happens to people that lead others astray. I also know those prophets were Jewish as was Jesus himself as well as his Apostles.

Lots of false prophets out there and you will know them by their fruit. Hatred of a people is a poisonous fruit. Hatred of sin is not.

---

1st Corinthians 5:9-13

Quote:

---

Immorality Must Be Judged

9 I wrote to you in my epistle not to [f]keep company with sexually immoral people. 10 Yet I certainly did not mean with the sexually immoral people of this world, or with the covetous, or extortioners, or idolaters, since then you would need to go out of the world. 11 But now I have written to you not to keep company with anyone named a brother, who is sexually immoral, or covetous, or an idolater, or a reviler, or a drunkard, or an extortionernot even to eat with such a person.

12 For what have I to do with judging those also who are outside? Do you not judge those who are inside? 13 But those who are outside God judges. Therefore "put away from yourselves the evil person."

---

I don't keep the company of those who are actively enemies of God because these people are corruptible forces. I will minister to them, but I will never be friends with them or engage in common discourse with them.

---

How do you effectively mister to those you hate?

And if they find the Lord? You will never be friends. Sound like a hypocrite here.

I suggest you read all of 1st Corinthians for context. Which is about Paul addressing some serious trouble at the Church in Corinth. Cherry picking tiny sections of scripture to validate an immoral behavior such as hate is a very bad idea.

Oh btw you and I are not worthy to be a judge. That is the domain of the Lord.

---

Yet you are judging him.

---

No really.

Nanomachines son has specifically said he hates anyone who doesn't fit his definition of a Christian, which is a very specific statement. It can be judged all day long.

And Jesus would find such a statement to be disgusting. He hates no one on this Earth. He hates our sins and it saddens him, but he does not hate anyone.

---

I said dislike, not hate. You are the one who made the assumption it was hate. These are two very different terms.

Further, just because I dislike someone doesn't mean I won't try and minister to them.

Phatbob said:

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Nanomachines son said:

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Phatbob said:

---

Nanomachines son said:

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ttu_85 said:

---

Nanomachines son said:

---

ttu_85 said:

---

Nanomachines son said:

---

2wealfth Man said:

---

Someone is spending a ton of money on these. National TV, signage at major sporting events, etc. The ads are really opaque to me. There was one yesterday during a hockey game , I believe which showed a tran with a sad face, what I took to be a druggie, minority working a food service job, etc.

This is as a Christian: No doubt he "gets us" and wants to reach all members of the human race with his message but there is a big big AND here which is not being said (notably, we/humanity have to take up the cross and follow him). I just feel like they are promoting this "destructive empathy" which we see all too much of these days without saying the hard part out loud in their ads.

---

They are heretical. It's nothing but pure subversion of Christianity to push lgbtq, open borders, and more. They actively misrepresent and take bible verses out of context to do this.

---

Hatred under the name of Christianity is also heretical. That said we as a nation have laws that the executive branch is failing to enforce. But hatred is never part of the game. You cant cherry pick the word dude.

Love the Lord your God with all you heart, mind and soul.
Love you neighbor as you love yourself.

-- s Jesus Christ

---

Are you saying you actively support a group that deliberately takes the Bible out of context to push leftist beliefs? Do you know what the Bible says about false prophets and those who intentionally lead people astray?

---

Do you pay attention to posting history at all? I am well aware of what the Bible says about false prophets and what happens to people that lead others astray. I also know those prophets were Jewish as was Jesus himself as well as his Apostles.

Lots of false prophets out there and you will know them by their fruit. Hatred of a people is a poisonous fruit. Hatred of sin is not.

---

1st Corinthians 5:9-13

Quote:

---

Immorality Must Be Judged

9 I wrote to you in my epistle not to [f]keep company with sexually immoral people. 10 Yet I certainly did not mean with the sexually immoral people of this world, or with the covetous, or extortioners, or idolaters, since then you would need to go out of the world. 11 But now I have written to you not to keep company with anyone named a brother, who is sexually immoral, or covetous, or an idolater, or a reviler, or a drunkard, or an extortionernot even to eat with such a person.

12 For what have I to do with judging those also who are outside? Do you not judge those who are inside? 13 But those who are outside God judges. Therefore "put away from yourselves the evil person."

---

I don't keep the company of those who are actively enemies of God because these people are corruptible forces. I will minister to them, but I will never be friends with them or engage in common discourse with them.

---

How, then, can you ever possibly be salt? There are key words in that verse a lot of people are missing the "not to keep company with anyone named a brother, who is...". So are you expecting those who are not saved to be righteous first? Do they have to clean up their act before they get saved? If that is the case, what's the point of being saved, if we can do any of that on our own? We are told to judge within ourselves, not those who are not part of the body... that is for God to do.

---

The point Paul is making here is that you should not be friends with them, hang out with them, etc. not that you shouldn't minister to them. The context of your involvement with them should be based around the idea of getting them to convert. You should not do family events with their family, etc.

Also note that this is reserved for people who actively and defiantly live sinful lives and revel in that sin. Someone who is a gambler, a sexual hedonist, alcoholic, drug addict, etc. can tear apart your life easily if you let them in. You should always keep them at arms length for this very reason. That doesn't mean you should not minister to them or show them the way, just that as a Christian, you should not be friends with them.

I don't remember Jesus every becoming active friends with non-believers. He would minister to them and become friends with them after they converted, but never before.

---

This is absolutely untrue. One of the biggest complaints that the Pharisees had about Jesus was that he was a friend to sinners.

---

A bunch of corrupt vindictive liars didn't understand Jesus or his purpose in the slightest? Big difference in ministering to sinners and hanging with them in their bars, brothels etc. Jesus violently drove people out of the temple. He and other apostles routinely preached and warned about the company you keep.

Phatbob said:

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Nanomachines son said:

---

Phatbob said:

---

Nanomachines son said:

---

ttu_85 said:

---

Nanomachines son said:

---

ttu_85 said:

---

Nanomachines son said:

---

2wealfth Man said:

---

Someone is spending a ton of money on these. National TV, signage at major sporting events, etc. The ads are really opaque to me. There was one yesterday during a hockey game , I believe which showed a tran with a sad face, what I took to be a druggie, minority working a food service job, etc.

This is as a Christian: No doubt he "gets us" and wants to reach all members of the human race with his message but there is a big big AND here which is not being said (notably, we/humanity have to take up the cross and follow him). I just feel like they are promoting this "destructive empathy" which we see all too much of these days without saying the hard part out loud in their ads.

---

They are heretical. It's nothing but pure subversion of Christianity to push lgbtq, open borders, and more. They actively misrepresent and take bible verses out of context to do this.

---

Hatred under the name of Christianity is also heretical. That said we as a nation have laws that the executive branch is failing to enforce. But hatred is never part of the game. You cant cherry pick the word dude.

Love the Lord your God with all you heart, mind and soul.
Love you neighbor as you love yourself.

-- s Jesus Christ

---

Are you saying you actively support a group that deliberately takes the Bible out of context to push leftist beliefs? Do you know what the Bible says about false prophets and those who intentionally lead people astray?

---

Do you pay attention to posting history at all? I am well aware of what the Bible says about false prophets and what happens to people that lead others astray. I also know those prophets were Jewish as was Jesus himself as well as his Apostles.

Lots of false prophets out there and you will know them by their fruit. Hatred of a people is a poisonous fruit. Hatred of sin is not.

---

1st Corinthians 5:9-13

Quote:

---

Immorality Must Be Judged

9 I wrote to you in my epistle not to [f]keep company with sexually immoral people. 10 Yet I certainly did not mean with the sexually immoral people of this world, or with the covetous, or extortioners, or idolaters, since then you would need to go out of the world. 11 But now I have written to you not to keep company with anyone named a brother, who is sexually immoral, or covetous, or an idolater, or a reviler, or a drunkard, or an extortionernot even to eat with such a person.

12 For what have I to do with judging those also who are outside? Do you not judge those who are inside? 13 But those who are outside God judges. Therefore "put away from yourselves the evil person."

---

I don't keep the company of those who are actively enemies of God because these people are corruptible forces. I will minister to them, but I will never be friends with them or engage in common discourse with them.

---

How, then, can you ever possibly be salt? There are key words in that verse a lot of people are missing the "not to keep company with anyone named a brother, who is...". So are you expecting those who are not saved to be righteous first? Do they have to clean up their act before they get saved? If that is the case, what's the point of being saved, if we can do any of that on our own? We are told to judge within ourselves, not those who are not part of the body... that is for God to do.

---

The point Paul is making here is that you should not be friends with them, hang out with them, etc. not that you shouldn't minister to them. The context of your involvement with them should be based around the idea of getting them to convert. You should not do family events with their family, etc.

Also note that this is reserved for people who actively and defiantly live sinful lives and revel in that sin. Someone who is a gambler, a sexual hedonist, alcoholic, drug addict, etc. can tear apart your life easily if you let them in. You should always keep them at arms length for this very reason. That doesn't mean you should not minister to them or show them the way, just that as a Christian, you should not be friends with them.

I don't remember Jesus every becoming active friends with non-believers. He would minister to them and become friends with them after they converted, but never before.

---

This is absolutely untrue. One of the biggest complaints that the Pharisees had about Jesus was that he was a friend to sinners.

The point Paul is making is to keep the world out of Christianity, not Christians out of the world. If the one who calls themselves Christian is okay with their sin, then do not allow them to influence you. But you are called to go into the world and make disciples. Good luck with that when you are yelling at them on the street corners.

If a person can't handle being around sinners without that influencing their walk, then they really need to work on their walk, because it is not enough to do what we are called to do.

---

No, he was not friends with sinners. You are mistaking friends with acquaintance. He conversed and spoke with them often and regularly but there is no instance in which he ever deliberately did things with professed non-believers who rejected him outright. If they were willing to listen, he hung around as long as he was able to.

In every case, Jesus did become friends with them AFTER they converted though. He only ever washed the feet of his Disciples, he never did this with non-believers.

Logos Stick said:

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Phatbob said:

---

Nanomachines son said:

---

Phatbob said:

---

Nanomachines son said:

---

ttu_85 said:

---

Nanomachines son said:

---

ttu_85 said:

---

Nanomachines son said:

---

2wealfth Man said:

---

Someone is spending a ton of money on these. National TV, signage at major sporting events, etc. The ads are really opaque to me. There was one yesterday during a hockey game , I believe which showed a tran with a sad face, what I took to be a druggie, minority working a food service job, etc.

This is as a Christian: No doubt he "gets us" and wants to reach all members of the human race with his message but there is a big big AND here which is not being said (notably, we/humanity have to take up the cross and follow him). I just feel like they are promoting this "destructive empathy" which we see all too much of these days without saying the hard part out loud in their ads.

---

They are heretical. It's nothing but pure subversion of Christianity to push lgbtq, open borders, and more. They actively misrepresent and take bible verses out of context to do this.

---

Hatred under the name of Christianity is also heretical. That said we as a nation have laws that the executive branch is failing to enforce. But hatred is never part of the game. You cant cherry pick the word dude.

Love the Lord your God with all you heart, mind and soul.
Love you neighbor as you love yourself.

-- s Jesus Christ

---

Are you saying you actively support a group that deliberately takes the Bible out of context to push leftist beliefs? Do you know what the Bible says about false prophets and those who intentionally lead people astray?

---

Do you pay attention to posting history at all? I am well aware of what the Bible says about false prophets and what happens to people that lead others astray. I also know those prophets were Jewish as was Jesus himself as well as his Apostles.

Lots of false prophets out there and you will know them by their fruit. Hatred of a people is a poisonous fruit. Hatred of sin is not.

---

1st Corinthians 5:9-13

Quote:

---

Immorality Must Be Judged

9 I wrote to you in my epistle not to [f]keep company with sexually immoral people. 10 Yet I certainly did not mean with the sexually immoral people of this world, or with the covetous, or extortioners, or idolaters, since then you would need to go out of the world. 11 But now I have written to you not to keep company with anyone named a brother, who is sexually immoral, or covetous, or an idolater, or a reviler, or a drunkard, or an extortionernot even to eat with such a person.

12 For what have I to do with judging those also who are outside? Do you not judge those who are inside? 13 But those who are outside God judges. Therefore "put away from yourselves the evil person."

---

I don't keep the company of those who are actively enemies of God because these people are corruptible forces. I will minister to them, but I will never be friends with them or engage in common discourse with them.

---

How, then, can you ever possibly be salt? There are key words in that verse a lot of people are missing the "not to keep company with anyone named a brother, who is...". So are you expecting those who are not saved to be righteous first? Do they have to clean up their act before they get saved? If that is the case, what's the point of being saved, if we can do any of that on our own? We are told to judge within ourselves, not those who are not part of the body... that is for God to do.

---

The point Paul is making here is that you should not be friends with them, hang out with them, etc. not that you shouldn't minister to them. The context of your involvement with them should be based around the idea of getting them to convert. You should not do family events with their family, etc.

Also note that this is reserved for people who actively and defiantly live sinful lives and revel in that sin. Someone who is a gambler, a sexual hedonist, alcoholic, drug addict, etc. can tear apart your life easily if you let them in. You should always keep them at arms length for this very reason. That doesn't mean you should not minister to them or show them the way, just that as a Christian, you should not be friends with them.

I don't remember Jesus every becoming active friends with non-believers. He would minister to them and become friends with them after they converted, but never before.

---

This is absolutely untrue. One of the biggest complaints that the Pharisees had about Jesus was that he was a friend to sinners.

The point Paul is making is to keep the world out of Christianity, not Christians out of the world. If the one who calls themselves Christian is okay with their sin, then do not allow them to influence you. But you are called to go into the world and make disciples. Good luck with that when you are yelling at them on the street corners.

If a person can't handle being around sinners without that influencing their walk, then they really need to work on their walk, because it is not enough to do what we are called to do.

---

It wasn't a complaint, it was a lie to stir up folks. They were slandering him. The Pharisees were sinners and he wasn't a friend to them! Was he disobeying himself?!


Jesus said this:

"You are My friends if you do whatever I command you." John 15:14


One primary command was to repent and sin more more!

---

And it was never the first thing he said. It was always following an act of Grace.

The Pharisees were the "righteous" ones. They followed the rules.They didn't associate with those who didn't. Their biggest problem was that they thought that is what made them righteous.

The ads are not political, at least according the Hobby Lobby founder David Green.

Quote:

---

The motivation behind the He Gets Us campaign, according to Green, is a desire to reshape public perception of Christians: "What we're known as, as Christians, we're known as haters," he said in a podcast interview last year. "We're beginning to be known as haters we hate this group, we hate that group. But we're not. We are people that have the very, very best love story ever written, and we need to tell that love story. So, our idea is, let's tell the story. As a Christian, you should love everybody. Jesus loved everybody."

https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-features/jesus-super-bowl-ads-hobby-lobby-billionaire-family-1234962817/

---

The campaign has faced criticism from some on the left, who see the Green family as being hypocritical in their support of the ads which have an inclusive message, which goes against the left's perception of non inclusiveness within Hobby Lobby.

So apparently the some on the right and some on the left aren't fans of the ad campaign, for different reasons.

Poll: Alphabet People Friends
Does God want Christians to be friends with alphabet people?

Friend - Someone with whom one shares not just time and interests but also a deep, mutual understanding and a commitment to mutual well-being that endures over time

— The Bible Bashed Podcast (@BibleBashed) April 2, 2024

Poll: Friend of Sinners
Did Jesus "hang out" with unrepentant sinners, pursuing shared common interests with them for long periods of time in order to win them?

— The Bible Bashed Podcast (@BibleBashed) April 2, 2024

pic.twitter.com/YOeqEIWDb5

— Selenite ✝️👣🇮🇱 (@crochet_mom314) April 2, 2024

These guys have a fantastic podcast about all kinds of topics like this and questions that are politically incorrect from a Biblical standpoint. It's legitimately one of the best Christian podcasts I have ever seen.

The Kraken said:

---

The ads are not political, at least according the Hobby Lobby founder David Green.

Quote:

---

The motivation behind the He Gets Us campaign, according to Green, is a desire to reshape public perception of Christians: "What we're known as, as Christians, we're known as haters," he said in a podcast interview last year. "We're beginning to be known as haters we hate this group, we hate that group. But we're not. We are people that have the very, very best love story ever written, and we need to tell that love story. So, our idea is, let's tell the story. As a Christian, you should love everybody. Jesus loved everybody."

https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-features/jesus-super-bowl-ads-hobby-lobby-billionaire-family-1234962817/

---

The campaign has faced criticism from some on the left, who see the Green family as being hypocritical in their support of the ads which have an inclusive message, which goes against the left's perception of non inclusiveness within Hobby Lobby.

So apparently the some on the right and some on the left aren't fans of the ad campaign, for different reasons.

---

Seriously just go to the webpage. Its always a hoot when folks on the left claim "they're not being political."

Phatbob said:

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Logos Stick said:

---

Phatbob said:

---

Nanomachines son said:

---

Phatbob said:

---

Nanomachines son said:

---

ttu_85 said:

---

Nanomachines son said:

---

ttu_85 said:

---

Nanomachines son said:

---

2wealfth Man said:

---

Someone is spending a ton of money on these. National TV, signage at major sporting events, etc. The ads are really opaque to me. There was one yesterday during a hockey game , I believe which showed a tran with a sad face, what I took to be a druggie, minority working a food service job, etc.

This is as a Christian: No doubt he "gets us" and wants to reach all members of the human race with his message but there is a big big AND here which is not being said (notably, we/humanity have to take up the cross and follow him). I just feel like they are promoting this "destructive empathy" which we see all too much of these days without saying the hard part out loud in their ads.

---

They are heretical. It's nothing but pure subversion of Christianity to push lgbtq, open borders, and more. They actively misrepresent and take bible verses out of context to do this.

---

Hatred under the name of Christianity is also heretical. That said we as a nation have laws that the executive branch is failing to enforce. But hatred is never part of the game. You cant cherry pick the word dude.

Love the Lord your God with all you heart, mind and soul.
Love you neighbor as you love yourself.

-- s Jesus Christ

---

Are you saying you actively support a group that deliberately takes the Bible out of context to push leftist beliefs? Do you know what the Bible says about false prophets and those who intentionally lead people astray?

---

Do you pay attention to posting history at all? I am well aware of what the Bible says about false prophets and what happens to people that lead others astray. I also know those prophets were Jewish as was Jesus himself as well as his Apostles.

Lots of false prophets out there and you will know them by their fruit. Hatred of a people is a poisonous fruit. Hatred of sin is not.

---

1st Corinthians 5:9-13

Quote:

---

Immorality Must Be Judged

9 I wrote to you in my epistle not to [f]keep company with sexually immoral people. 10 Yet I certainly did not mean with the sexually immoral people of this world, or with the covetous, or extortioners, or idolaters, since then you would need to go out of the world. 11 But now I have written to you not to keep company with anyone named a brother, who is sexually immoral, or covetous, or an idolater, or a reviler, or a drunkard, or an extortionernot even to eat with such a person.

12 For what have I to do with judging those also who are outside? Do you not judge those who are inside? 13 But those who are outside God judges. Therefore "put away from yourselves the evil person."

---

I don't keep the company of those who are actively enemies of God because these people are corruptible forces. I will minister to them, but I will never be friends with them or engage in common discourse with them.

---

How, then, can you ever possibly be salt? There are key words in that verse a lot of people are missing the "not to keep company with anyone named a brother, who is...". So are you expecting those who are not saved to be righteous first? Do they have to clean up their act before they get saved? If that is the case, what's the point of being saved, if we can do any of that on our own? We are told to judge within ourselves, not those who are not part of the body... that is for God to do.

---

The point Paul is making here is that you should not be friends with them, hang out with them, etc. not that you shouldn't minister to them. The context of your involvement with them should be based around the idea of getting them to convert. You should not do family events with their family, etc.

Also note that this is reserved for people who actively and defiantly live sinful lives and revel in that sin. Someone who is a gambler, a sexual hedonist, alcoholic, drug addict, etc. can tear apart your life easily if you let them in. You should always keep them at arms length for this very reason. That doesn't mean you should not minister to them or show them the way, just that as a Christian, you should not be friends with them.

I don't remember Jesus every becoming active friends with non-believers. He would minister to them and become friends with them after they converted, but never before.

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This is absolutely untrue. One of the biggest complaints that the Pharisees had about Jesus was that he was a friend to sinners.

The point Paul is making is to keep the world out of Christianity, not Christians out of the world. If the one who calls themselves Christian is okay with their sin, then do not allow them to influence you. But you are called to go into the world and make disciples. Good luck with that when you are yelling at them on the street corners.

If a person can't handle being around sinners without that influencing their walk, then they really need to work on their walk, because it is not enough to do what we are called to do.

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It wasn't a complaint, it was a lie to stir up folks. They were slandering him. The Pharisees were sinners and he wasn't a friend to them! Was he disobeying himself?!


Jesus said this:

"You are My friends if you do whatever I command you." John 15:14


One primary command was to repent and sin more more!

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And it was never the first thing he said. It was always following an act of Grace.

The Pharisees were the "righteous" ones. They followed the rules.They didn't associate with those who didn't. Their biggest problem was that they thought that is what made them righteous.

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Its pretty clear what being his friend means because he defined it right there. You can twist it all you want. Ministering and sharing the gospel doesn't mean what you say it means.

Jesus did not consider the Pharisees to be righteous. It doesn't matter what the Pharisees thought. They were full of sin. Yet he wasn't hanging with them on Friday nights. So I guess he broke his own commandment per your interpretation of scripture.

Jesus loves everyone. He wants everyone to be in communion with Him.

Problem is...God can not be in communion with sin. We can never be with God as long as we were stained with sin...any sin...all sin. Sin is sin and is what keeps us separate from God. Thus, Jesus had to die for our sins so we could be cleansed and be righteous through His blood.

God wants us to come to repentance. He wants it so badly that He gave His only Son to die in our place to reconcile us with Him. He wants Us to spread this Good News to EVERYONE.

What "He gets us" fails to do is spread the Gospel. You can't spread the Gospel if you don't acknowledge that we are all sinners, we are responsible for our sin, and the only way we can be with God is to acknowledge our sin and believe that Jesus has saved us through His death and resurrection.

No where in the "He gets us" ad is this Gospel even remotely hinted at. You can't have Gospel if you don't acknowledge sin and repent of sin.

At some point, Christians are going to have to get pissed off and take a stand or just fade away to hell.

The Kraken said:

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The ads are not political, at least according the Hobby Lobby founder David Green.

Quote:

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The motivation behind the He Gets Us campaign, according to Green, is a desire to reshape public perception of Christians: "What we're known as, as Christians, we're known as haters," he said in a podcast interview last year. "We're beginning to be known as haters we hate this group, we hate that group. But we're not. We are people that have the very, very best love story ever written, and we need to tell that love story. So, our idea is, let's tell the story. As a Christian, you should love everybody. Jesus loved everybody."

https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-features/jesus-super-bowl-ads-hobby-lobby-billionaire-family-1234962817/

---

The campaign has faced criticism from some on the left, who see the Green family as being hypocritical in their support of the ads which have an inclusive message, which goes against the left's perception of non inclusiveness within Hobby Lobby.

So apparently the some on the right and some on the left aren't fans of the ad campaign, for different reasons.

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If that's the authentic motive (and maybe it is) then they're missing the mark with the lack of focus on the gospel message. I can generally see where he's coming from, and yes there is a stigma that Christians are overly critical. But I think they're swinging too far in the other direction in trying to get people to like them by painting a picture that's an inaccurate description of why we need Jesus Christ.

Logos Stick said:

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Phatbob said:

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Logos Stick said:

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Phatbob said:

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Nanomachines son said:

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Phatbob said:

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Nanomachines son said:

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ttu_85 said:

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Nanomachines son said:

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ttu_85 said:

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Nanomachines son said:

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2wealfth Man said:

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Someone is spending a ton of money on these. National TV, signage at major sporting events, etc. The ads are really opaque to me. There was one yesterday during a hockey game , I believe which showed a tran with a sad face, what I took to be a druggie, minority working a food service job, etc.

This is as a Christian: No doubt he "gets us" and wants to reach all members of the human race with his message but there is a big big AND here which is not being said (notably, we/humanity have to take up the cross and follow him). I just feel like they are promoting this "destructive empathy" which we see all too much of these days without saying the hard part out loud in their ads.

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They are heretical. It's nothing but pure subversion of Christianity to push lgbtq, open borders, and more. They actively misrepresent and take bible verses out of context to do this.

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Hatred under the name of Christianity is also heretical. That said we as a nation have laws that the executive branch is failing to enforce. But hatred is never part of the game. You cant cherry pick the word dude.

Love the Lord your God with all you heart, mind and soul.
Love you neighbor as you love yourself.

-- s Jesus Christ

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Are you saying you actively support a group that deliberately takes the Bible out of context to push leftist beliefs? Do you know what the Bible says about false prophets and those who intentionally lead people astray?

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Do you pay attention to posting history at all? I am well aware of what the Bible says about false prophets and what happens to people that lead others astray. I also know those prophets were Jewish as was Jesus himself as well as his Apostles.

Lots of false prophets out there and you will know them by their fruit. Hatred of a people is a poisonous fruit. Hatred of sin is not.

---

1st Corinthians 5:9-13

Quote:

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Immorality Must Be Judged

9 I wrote to you in my epistle not to [f]keep company with sexually immoral people. 10 Yet I certainly did not mean with the sexually immoral people of this world, or with the covetous, or extortioners, or idolaters, since then you would need to go out of the world. 11 But now I have written to you not to keep company with anyone named a brother, who is sexually immoral, or covetous, or an idolater, or a reviler, or a drunkard, or an extortionernot even to eat with such a person.

12 For what have I to do with judging those also who are outside? Do you not judge those who are inside? 13 But those who are outside God judges. Therefore "put away from yourselves the evil person."

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I don't keep the company of those who are actively enemies of God because these people are corruptible forces. I will minister to them, but I will never be friends with them or engage in common discourse with them.

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How, then, can you ever possibly be salt? There are key words in that verse a lot of people are missing the "not to keep company with anyone named a brother, who is...". So are you expecting those who are not saved to be righteous first? Do they have to clean up their act before they get saved? If that is the case, what's the point of being saved, if we can do any of that on our own? We are told to judge within ourselves, not those who are not part of the body... that is for God to do.

---

The point Paul is making here is that you should not be friends with them, hang out with them, etc. not that you shouldn't minister to them. The context of your involvement with them should be based around the idea of getting them to convert. You should not do family events with their family, etc.

Also note that this is reserved for people who actively and defiantly live sinful lives and revel in that sin. Someone who is a gambler, a sexual hedonist, alcoholic, drug addict, etc. can tear apart your life easily if you let them in. You should always keep them at arms length for this very reason. That doesn't mean you should not minister to them or show them the way, just that as a Christian, you should not be friends with them.

I don't remember Jesus every becoming active friends with non-believers. He would minister to them and become friends with them after they converted, but never before.

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This is absolutely untrue. One of the biggest complaints that the Pharisees had about Jesus was that he was a friend to sinners.

The point Paul is making is to keep the world out of Christianity, not Christians out of the world. If the one who calls themselves Christian is okay with their sin, then do not allow them to influence you. But you are called to go into the world and make disciples. Good luck with that when you are yelling at them on the street corners.

If a person can't handle being around sinners without that influencing their walk, then they really need to work on their walk, because it is not enough to do what we are called to do.

---

It wasn't a complaint, it was a lie to stir up folks. They were slandering him. The Pharisees were sinners and he wasn't a friend to them! Was he disobeying himself?!


Jesus said this:

"You are My friends if you do whatever I command you." John 15:14


One primary command was to repent and sin more more!

---

And it was never the first thing he said. It was always following an act of Grace.

The Pharisees were the "righteous" ones. They followed the rules.They didn't associate with those who didn't. Their biggest problem was that they thought that is what made them righteous.

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Its pretty clear what being his friend means because he defined it right there. You can twist it all you want. Ministering and sharing the gospel doesn't mean what you say it means.

Jesus did not consider the Pharisees to be righteous. It doesn't matter what the Pharisees thought. They were full of sin. Yet he wasn't hanging with them on Friday nights. So I guess he broke his own commandment per your interpretation of scripture.

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We are not as far apart as you might think. Jesus was able to judge the Pharisees because he knew whether or not they knew each other, so he had perfect information. There were actual righteous Pharisees, after all. The point is that you can't expect sinners to turn from sin first, and that is what leads them to Christ. That is impossible. He reaches out first, right where they (we) are, and leads them (us) out. If they reject that, our job is not necessarily to be their best buds, but we still have to reach them where they are first (we do NOT have the luxury of perfect information). We are not saved by not sinning. We are lead out of sin by being saved.

It feels like many posters are focusing on the people in the ads as "sinners" and how they should be ministered to or not. The point is that they no more need ministering to as you or me. They are no different than you in God's eye.

Phatbob said:

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It's a hard thing to get just right. The world has told all of the people these commercials are aimed at that Christianity and Christians are their enemy. Politics has told Christians that their opposites on the left are the enemy, and so we tend to reinforce that lie. We as Christians are as polarized as anyone is in this culture.

God has told us the opposite. Our struggle is not against flesh and blood. God does not see left vs right, man vs woman, black vs white. We are all sinners in need of a savior. We all have the same starting point, whether we are "right" (politically or socially) or not. So no, the message is not heretical. It is a starting point, and as long as it is just the starting point to begin the relationship with the One who matters, then it is doing what it is supposed to do.

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This is true.

But the question remains as to what the goal of these ads is. If it's designed to draw in the lost first, and then point them to Jesus thru further evangelization and discipleship, then it's a worthwhile effort very much in keeping with Jesus' ministry. But I have no idea how many people are drawn to their website and then encouraged to learn more thru partnerships with local churches, etc.

On the surface, it also looks like it's designed to motivate Christians to support particular political causes. That the ad itself is the end goal, not Jesus.

But I'm not sure either way. If I'm part of the group behind the ads and it's really about pointing people to Jesus, then I should have some metrics which show engagement from the marginalized people who seem to be the target.

Old McDonald said:

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BCG Disciple said:

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What exactly is the problem with the ads? Not going to lie, I didn't particularly like it at first but getting a little perspective it's hard for me to take issue with the message conveyed.

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christians who harbor hatred in their hearts for the marginalized experiencing cognitive dissonance over the fact that hatred is not very christlike

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Love the sinner, but hate the sin.

Tramp96 said:

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Jesus loves everyone. He wants everyone to be in communion with Him.

Problem is...God can not be in communion with sin. We can never be with God as long as we were stained with sin...any sin...all sin. Sin is sin and is what keeps us separate from God. Thus, Jesus had to die for our sins so we could be cleansed and be righteous through His blood.

God wants us to come to repentance. He wants it so badly that He gave His only Son to die in our place to reconcile us with Him. He wants Us to spread this Good News to EVERYONE.

What "He gets us" fails to do is spread the Gospel. You can't spread the Gospel if you don't acknowledge that we are all sinners, we are responsible for our sin, and the only way we can be with God is to acknowledge our sin and believe that Jesus has saved us through His death and resurrection.

No where in the "He gets us" ad is this Gospel even remotely hinted at. You can't have Gospel if you don't acknowledge sin and repent of sin.

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Absolute Truth! I only wish that I could give you more blue stars.

Even though this is a politics board, if we, or them, view it in a political point of view... one or both of us are in the wrong. We were not called deliver social justice. But also we were not called to make sure men think of themselves as men and not women. We were called to deliver the gospel. We cannot do that when we first make sure they won't listen, and our feelings of justification by our not sinning (in that way) make us prone to do that. We have to recognize that political and social differences are vastly unimportant when it comes to whether or not we are part of the Body of Christ.

If you lie to your wife or are impatient with someone on the road, is that your rejection of God? We sin because we have a sin nature, and when we have been delivered from that sin nature, it still is impossible for us to fix that on our own. How much more impossible for someone who does not have that relationship yet. The point is we have been forgiven much, and we must forgive more than 70 times 7, because it was not even a sin against us. Our job is to make sure our relationship with God is where it needs to be (that is the only thing we have control over), and give the most people possible the same opportunity. God will take care of the rest.

You catch more flies with honey than you do with vinegar.

If love and mercy are shown to those who don't know or follow Christ, some of them will change. Many won't. But God never told us to be HIM by judging others. He told us to be His hands and feet. We don't have to condone anything, but we also need to be the love that Jesus was to those He met in His time on earth. That means, to me, help represent His love for everyone. I'm a straight, white, Christian male--the one group that gets falsely judged and portrayed by our culture today. And I get up every day with the prayer to allow me to be a vessel for God, that others see and hear Jesus's love and mercy thru me. Whatever else happens, that's up to the Lord. I have no idea what will happen to the Alphabet Crew when Judgment occurs, just as I have no idea what Judgment will like for sinners like me, whether it's been infidelity, criminal activity, or any other sin we can imagine.

But I know Jesus tells me that God has a place for me if I believe in Jesus as my Savior. How I get there, how long it takes, or if its not as black and white as I want it to be when I think about Heaven, all I know is that I think any opportunity to act as Jesus did in being loving and merciful will be rewarded.

Phatbob said:

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Even though this is a politics board, if we, or them, view it in a political point of view... one or both of us are in the wrong. We were not called deliver social justice. But also we were not called to make sure men think of themselves as men and not women. We were called to deliver the gospel. We cannot do that when we first make sure they won't listen, and our feelings of justification by our not sinning (in that way) make us prone to do that. We have to recognize that political and social differences are vastly unimportant when it comes to whether or not we are part of the Body of Christ.

If you lie to your wife or are impatient with someone on the road, is that your rejection of God? We sin because we have a sin nature, and when we have been delivered from that sin nature, it still is impossible for us to fix that on our own. How much more impossible for someone who does not have that relationship yet. The point is we have been forgiven much, and we must forgive more than 70 times 7, because it was not even a sin against us. Our job is to make sure our relationship with God is where it needs to be, and give the most people possible the same opportunity. God will take care of the rest.

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Lots of words, but I don't understand the point of this reply in response to my post. It's bordering on a non sequitur.

Sorry, was replying more than just to you, there are several posts that view the point of the ads as political in nature.

We are right to be critical of that, but if we in turn judge their correctness based on politics, we are equally in the wrong.

Didn't mean to imply you were, but to flag the danger in viewing it politically at all.

DTP02 said:

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Phatbob said:

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Even though this is a politics board, if we, or them, view it in a political point of view... one or both of us are in the wrong. We were not called deliver social justice. But also we were not called to make sure men think of themselves as men and not women. We were called to deliver the gospel. We cannot do that when we first make sure they won't listen, and our feelings of justification by our not sinning (in that way) make us prone to do that. We have to recognize that political and social differences are vastly unimportant when it comes to whether or not we are part of the Body of Christ.

If you lie to your wife or are impatient with someone on the road, is that your rejection of God? We sin because we have a sin nature, and when we have been delivered from that sin nature, it still is impossible for us to fix that on our own. How much more impossible for someone who does not have that relationship yet. The point is we have been forgiven much, and we must forgive more than 70 times 7, because it was not even a sin against us. Our job is to make sure our relationship with God is where it needs to be, and give the most people possible the same opportunity. God will take care of the rest.

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Lots of words, but I don't understand the point of this reply in response to my post. It's bordering on a non sequitur.

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He's basically saying we should ignore this obvious attempt by the left to shame us by invoking religious teachings they actually hold in contempt. It's ridiculous. They are the ones buying air time and intruding on our lives with a message that implies WE are at fault. We are the reason this poor trans kid struggles. They can F right off. THEY are the ones doing the judging with this clearly political messaging.

These commercials have me thinking that it's about getting us to accept and normalize the sin and I'm not a fan of them.

Phatbob said:

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Sorry, was replying more than just to you, there are several posts that view the point of the ads as political in nature.

We are right to be critical of that, but if we in turn judge their correctness based on politics, we are equally in the wrong.

Didn't mean to imply you were, but to flag the danger in viewing it politically at all.

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Unbelievable. We're calling an obvious spade a spade. It's a political ad with no spiritual value or meaning. It's making a political statement while hiding behind a religion. It is something the left does all the time and it's very transparent to anyone with a functioning brain.

93MarineHorn said:

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DTP02 said:

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Phatbob said:

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Even though this is a politics board, if we, or them, view it in a political point of view... one or both of us are in the wrong. We were not called deliver social justice. But also we were not called to make sure men think of themselves as men and not women. We were called to deliver the gospel. We cannot do that when we first make sure they won't listen, and our feelings of justification by our not sinning (in that way) make us prone to do that. We have to recognize that political and social differences are vastly unimportant when it comes to whether or not we are part of the Body of Christ.

If you lie to your wife or are impatient with someone on the road, is that your rejection of God? We sin because we have a sin nature, and when we have been delivered from that sin nature, it still is impossible for us to fix that on our own. How much more impossible for someone who does not have that relationship yet. The point is we have been forgiven much, and we must forgive more than 70 times 7, because it was not even a sin against us. Our job is to make sure our relationship with God is where it needs to be, and give the most people possible the same opportunity. God will take care of the rest.

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Lots of words, but I don't understand the point of this reply in response to my post. It's bordering on a non sequitur.

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He's basically saying we should ignore this obvious attempt by the left to shame us by invoking religious teachings they actually hold in contempt. It's ridiculous. They are the ones buying air time and intruding on our lives with a message that implies WE are at fault. We are the reason this poor trans kid struggles. They can F right off. THEY are the ones doing the judging with this clearly political messaging.

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If that is what you got out of what I said, then you are viewing Christianity through a political lens, not the other way around.

oh no said:

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if we elected Jesus as president, maybe then we can be communist because he'd feed, clothe, and shelter everyone with miracles.

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Except He wouldn't. Jesus commanded people to follow Him. And the "socialists" were people who were committed to one another because they were all following Him together.

America is doing anything but following Jesus.

Phatbob said:

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93MarineHorn said:

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DTP02 said:

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Phatbob said:

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Even though this is a politics board, if we, or them, view it in a political point of view... one or both of us are in the wrong. We were not called deliver social justice. But also we were not called to make sure men think of themselves as men and not women. We were called to deliver the gospel. We cannot do that when we first make sure they won't listen, and our feelings of justification by our not sinning (in that way) make us prone to do that. We have to recognize that political and social differences are vastly unimportant when it comes to whether or not we are part of the Body of Christ.

If you lie to your wife or are impatient with someone on the road, is that your rejection of God? We sin because we have a sin nature, and when we have been delivered from that sin nature, it still is impossible for us to fix that on our own. How much more impossible for someone who does not have that relationship yet. The point is we have been forgiven much, and we must forgive more than 70 times 7, because it was not even a sin against us. Our job is to make sure our relationship with God is where it needs to be, and give the most people possible the same opportunity. God will take care of the rest.

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Lots of words, but I don't understand the point of this reply in response to my post. It's bordering on a non sequitur.

---

He's basically saying we should ignore this obvious attempt by the left to shame us by invoking religious teachings they actually hold in contempt. It's ridiculous. They are the ones buying air time and intruding on our lives with a message that implies WE are at fault. We are the reason this poor trans kid struggles. They can F right off. THEY are the ones doing the judging with this clearly political messaging.

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If that is what you got out of what I said, then you are viewing Christianity through a political lens, not the other way around.

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I'm viewing a political ad shrouded in religion thru a political lens.

The Kraken said:

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The ads are not political, at least according the Hobby Lobby founder David Green.

Quote:

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The motivation behind the He Gets Us campaign, according to Green, is a desire to reshape public perception of Christians: "What we're known as, as Christians, we're known as haters," he said in a podcast interview last year. "We're beginning to be known as haters we hate this group, we hate that group. But we're not. We are people that have the very, very best love story ever written, and we need to tell that love story. So, our idea is, let's tell the story. As a Christian, you should love everybody. Jesus loved everybody."

https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-features/jesus-super-bowl-ads-hobby-lobby-billionaire-family-1234962817/

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The campaign has faced criticism from some on the left, who see the Green family as being hypocritical in their support of the ads which have an inclusive message, which goes against the left's perception of non inclusiveness within Hobby Lobby.

So apparently the some on the right and some on the left aren't fans of the ad campaign, for different reasons.

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I appreciate this context… but at the end of the day fundamental transformation (a refiners fire in biblical imagery) DOES say "you require transformation." If a sinner's identity is found in their sin: it's pretty easy to see how they read this as a message of hate.

Jesus and almost all of his followers were murdered because the world hated what they said.

I guess I question if a toothless PR campaign is the best tool of evangelism. Especially regarding young men.

93MarineHorn said:

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Phatbob said:

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93MarineHorn said:

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DTP02 said:

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Phatbob said:

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Even though this is a politics board, if we, or them, view it in a political point of view... one or both of us are in the wrong. We were not called deliver social justice. But also we were not called to make sure men think of themselves as men and not women. We were called to deliver the gospel. We cannot do that when we first make sure they won't listen, and our feelings of justification by our not sinning (in that way) make us prone to do that. We have to recognize that political and social differences are vastly unimportant when it comes to whether or not we are part of the Body of Christ.

If you lie to your wife or are impatient with someone on the road, is that your rejection of God? We sin because we have a sin nature, and when we have been delivered from that sin nature, it still is impossible for us to fix that on our own. How much more impossible for someone who does not have that relationship yet. The point is we have been forgiven much, and we must forgive more than 70 times 7, because it was not even a sin against us. Our job is to make sure our relationship with God is where it needs to be, and give the most people possible the same opportunity. God will take care of the rest.

---

Lots of words, but I don't understand the point of this reply in response to my post. It's bordering on a non sequitur.

---

He's basically saying we should ignore this obvious attempt by the left to shame us by invoking religious teachings they actually hold in contempt. It's ridiculous. They are the ones buying air time and intruding on our lives with a message that implies WE are at fault. We are the reason this poor trans kid struggles. They can F right off. THEY are the ones doing the judging with this clearly political messaging.

---

If that is what you got out of what I said, then you are viewing Christianity through a political lens, not the other way around.

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I'm viewing a political ad shrouded in religion thru a political lens.

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How far deep are you having to go to get to the political ad? How many people are going to get as far deep as the political messaging? Who determines that it is political? If I read the verse that tells me to care for the widows and orphans, is that political? I say no, it isn't, that is a personal directive, but someone else could... does that negate their salvation? Does that disqualify them from sharing the gospel? I hope not, because I for sure know I have something wrong... I just don't know exactly what.

The point is if you want to look deep enough to see something you think is wrong, you will find it. Is the main point of the ad correct? Does Jesus understand you, and every single person on the planet? Yes. Does he have a path for every single person on the planet no matter where they find themselves at right now? Yes. Want to quibble over the minute details that you and I will never know who is right until we finally find out from the source, and then it won't matter anymore? We could, but then we have undermined the message to begin with.

Quote:

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The motivation behind the He Gets Us campaign, according to Green, is a desire to reshape public perception of Christians: "What we're known as, as Christians, we're known as haters," he said in a podcast interview last year. "We're beginning to be known as haters we hate this group, we hate that group. But we're not. We are people that have the very, very best love story ever written, and we need to tell that love story. So, our idea is, let's tell the story. As a Christian, you should love everybody. Jesus loved everybody."

---

So, these ads are really just a PR campaign. He's trying to get the left and non-Christians to be more open to Christianity with a message that's only halfway Christ-like. It's fine in a vacuum, I suppose. But in today's political context these ads sound preachy against actual Christians and much more "Christ-like" towards obvious sinners.

Phatbob said:

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93MarineHorn said:

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Phatbob said:

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93MarineHorn said:

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DTP02 said:

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Phatbob said:

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Even though this is a politics board, if we, or them, view it in a political point of view... one or both of us are in the wrong. We were not called deliver social justice. But also we were not called to make sure men think of themselves as men and not women. We were called to deliver the gospel. We cannot do that when we first make sure they won't listen, and our feelings of justification by our not sinning (in that way) make us prone to do that. We have to recognize that political and social differences are vastly unimportant when it comes to whether or not we are part of the Body of Christ.

If you lie to your wife or are impatient with someone on the road, is that your rejection of God? We sin because we have a sin nature, and when we have been delivered from that sin nature, it still is impossible for us to fix that on our own. How much more impossible for someone who does not have that relationship yet. The point is we have been forgiven much, and we must forgive more than 70 times 7, because it was not even a sin against us. Our job is to make sure our relationship with God is where it needs to be, and give the most people possible the same opportunity. God will take care of the rest.

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Lots of words, but I don't understand the point of this reply in response to my post. It's bordering on a non sequitur.

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He's basically saying we should ignore this obvious attempt by the left to shame us by invoking religious teachings they actually hold in contempt. It's ridiculous. They are the ones buying air time and intruding on our lives with a message that implies WE are at fault. We are the reason this poor trans kid struggles. They can F right off. THEY are the ones doing the judging with this clearly political messaging.

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If that is what you got out of what I said, then you are viewing Christianity through a political lens, not the other way around.

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I'm viewing a political ad shrouded in religion thru a political lens.

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How far deep are you having to go to get to the political ad? How many people are going to get as far deep as the political messaging? Who determines that it is political? If I read the verse that tells me to care for the widows and orphans, is that political? I say no, it isn't, that is a personal directive, but someone else could... does that negate their salvation? Does that disqualify them from sharing the gospel? I hope not, because I for sure know I have something wrong... I just don't know exactly what.

The point is if you want to look deep enough to see something you think is wrong, you will find it. Is the main point of the ad correct? Does Jesus understand you, and every single person on the planet? Yes. Does he have a path for every single person on the planet no matter where they find themselves at right now? Yes. Want to quibble over the minute details that you and I will never know who is right until we finally find out from the source, and then it won't matter anymore? We could, but then we have undermined the message to begin with.

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I'm not talking about anyone's salvation, that's certainly not up to me. Perhaps because I'm not very religious my initial reaction is to view these ads as mostly political. They are superficial. They are not targeted at LGBT people with a message of love and acceptance. They are targeted at people like me with an implication that I am the one that has fallen from Christ's teachings and that my intolerance is harming trans people. That's my problem with these commercials.

Why does it bother you?

Perhaps there is a little truth to it?

Phatbob said:

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Even though this is a politics board, if we, or them, view it in a political point of view... one or both of us are in the wrong. We were not called deliver social justice. But also we were not called to make sure men think of themselves as men and not women. We were called to deliver the gospel. We cannot do that when we first make sure they won't listen, and our feelings of justification by our not sinning (in that way) make us prone to do that. We have to recognize that political and social differences are vastly unimportant when it comes to whether or not we are part of the Body of Christ.

If you lie to your wife or are impatient with someone on the road, is that your rejection of God? We sin because we have a sin nature, and when we have been delivered from that sin nature, it still is impossible for us to fix that on our own. How much more impossible for someone who does not have that relationship yet. The point is we have been forgiven much, and we must forgive more than 70 times 7, because it was not even a sin against us. Our job is to make sure our relationship with God is where it needs to be (that is the only thing we have control over), and give the most people possible the same opportunity. God will take care of the rest.

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We are most definitely called to deliver social justice. You may view that term negatively today but it's pretty much the story of Jesus ministry.

I think that is part of where the left has won. They view everything as political. Our reaction has been to take the opposite political view, when, at least as a Christian, I think most things should have absolutely no place in politics.

Politics tells me what people are my friends and my enemies, and what constitutes "winning". But my Bible tells me a completely different message, that my struggle is not against flesh and blood, and that I should give my enemy the cloak off of my back. Those 2 are not compatible messages, so as a Christian, I know that even the political messages I agree with are sometimes going to be what I am called to act in opposition of.

ds00 said:

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Phatbob said:

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Even though this is a politics board, if we, or them, view it in a political point of view... one or both of us are in the wrong. We were not called deliver social justice. But also we were not called to make sure men think of themselves as men and not women. We were called to deliver the gospel. We cannot do that when we first make sure they won't listen, and our feelings of justification by our not sinning (in that way) make us prone to do that. We have to recognize that political and social differences are vastly unimportant when it comes to whether or not we are part of the Body of Christ.

If you lie to your wife or are impatient with someone on the road, is that your rejection of God? We sin because we have a sin nature, and when we have been delivered from that sin nature, it still is impossible for us to fix that on our own. How much more impossible for someone who does not have that relationship yet. The point is we have been forgiven much, and we must forgive more than 70 times 7, because it was not even a sin against us. Our job is to make sure our relationship with God is where it needs to be (that is the only thing we have control over), and give the most people possible the same opportunity. God will take care of the rest.

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We are most definitely called to deliver social justice. You may view that term negatively today but it's pretty much the story of Jesus ministry.

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I completely disagree, depending on what you define "social justice" as. Jesus came for a change of the relationship between God and Man, not to feed more people or make people have more stuff, but that is for a different board.