pfo said:

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Every now and then, when I am truly knowledgeable on a subject, I will read a Texags thread and be shocked at the ignorance. This thread has vaulted to the top of that list. OMG people, you have no idea what you are talking about with respect to these GLP-1 medicines.

JUST STOP!

Type 2 diabetics, those suffering from certain kidney diseases and the obese should consult with their doctors on the most effective treatments.

There is a reason Eli Lilly and Novo Nordisk can't keep enough of Mounjaro, Zepbound, Ozempic and Wegovy on the shelves to meet demand. These drugs are miracles for many people.

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The miracle cure has always been known. Proper diet and exercise.
Replacing a healthy lifestyle with drugs is a tragedy, not a miracle.

C@LAg said:

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as if this country needs another large swath of its citizens drugged up the wazoo (see ADHD and related medicines)

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Actually....I think it's a shot, not a suppository

Nanomachines son said:

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If you're at the point where you're taking these drugs, just use steroids. Seriously, it's probably safer since these drugs paralyze your digestive system (I know multiple people whose digestive systems are ****ed permanently).

Do a 16-20 week cycle of test at 500 mg/week and make sure you lift and you'll easily lose weight and build muscle. Make sure you have an aromatase inhibitor like anastrozole and then a post cycle therapy drug like nolvadex and you're good. A cycle is cheaper than these drugs and it will have a much better long term impact due to muscle memory.

It's incredible that we demonize steroids, which are an over the counter drug in 90% of the world yet we approved these, which have side effects that are demonstrably worse.

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"Yeah just **** your hormones for life bro!"

Steroids aren't the answer either. They are also a shortcut for losers.

Wife and I have been on this for about 7 months now. I'm down 50lbs, she's down 40. Has been great for people who simply can't or do not want to make time for the gym. We feel great now and have gone into a maintenance mode.

pfo said:

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jamey said:

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pfo said:

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halfastros81 said:

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True but there are a ton of people that don't have these diseases that are creating much of the demand . Personally I don't care if someone wants to take a prescription drug for weight loss purposes but I do wonder about long term health impacts , and I do feel
Like the one's with diseases should get the drug first.

The sugar industry/lobby is responsible for much of our root issues wrt to poor diet imo. The diet that was pushed by the government back in the 70's in which red
Meat and fats were blamed for increases in cardiovascular disease rather than the real root cause of carbs and sugars is in part what got us where we are wrt obesity.

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The longterm health impacts of not taking these medicines is my primary concern. Reduced heart attacks, stroke and Type 2 diabetics no longer being Type 2 diabetics alone is reason enough alone to see a dr to get these medicines. These medicines will add years to the lives of many. Plus make their remaining years healthier and happier. Losing up to 20% of body mass may have other benefits as well. For instance these drugs are now being investigated for their efficacy in helping sufferers of fatty liver disease. Novo and Lilly are testing their meds on other diseases as well.

When I look around America, I am shocked at what an obese nation we have become. I'm an old guy and today's America is shockingly fatter than the America I grew up in. I wouldn't be surprised to learn that obesity is America's #1 disease.

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I get your point. Do we know enough about its safety to prescribe it to 60 million people as the OP/article suggests? That's more than 1 in every 6 in the US

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I think so. GLP-1 drugs aren't new. They are just being used in a different way. For instance Hollywood actors have been using this type of drug for years to lose weight before roles. They always said it was diet and exercise but that's not been true for many.

Before there is enough of these drugs available for 60 million people to be on them, there will be lots more data on efficacy and safety from the millions currently on these medicines. Lilly has 5 more molecules in testing. One actually has a higher weight loss profile than Mounjaro and Zepbound.

Finally, I believe the biggest risk for obese people and diabetics is to not be taking one of these meds. Once heart disease strikes with a heart attack or stroke, many times the patient doesn't have a full recovery. Also, think of the years lost. That can occur from premature death or even the loss of an obese young person that can't get a date and is miserable. I doubt all obese people are fat and happy.

Anyway, it's something I believe people should consult their doctor about. As my dr friend said "Nobody has to be fat anymore".

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I hate to be the one to inform you and your doctor friend, but nobody had to be fat before either.

Emotional Support Cobra said:

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At this point, I am OK with obese people taking Ozempic because we need something to reduce the strain on the health care system. 5 years ago me would have railed against laziness but living in South Texas is like being on another planet and we need change. When we travel up north I marvel at all the thin people.

I thought covid would scare more people into losing weight but nope they just got mean.

I have a co-worker who is type 2 diabetes and on ozempic. She is not hardly overweight, and says her numbers are down to normal levels but she has not lost any weight per se. She eats well and follows a diet. I am thrilled for her but we had a good laugh about her not reaping any weight loss benefits.

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A lot of the people taking Ozempic et al. are not obese, just overweight.

Also, the weight loss effects are dosage dependent, so if she is on a lower dosage (which would not be surprising if her numbers are good) she wouldn't see any weight loss from the drug.

There is no world in which our economy as it is today exists without fat people and that Ozempic doesn't destroy. Fast food and medical and 3/4 of the grocery store

If you don't have the $1,000 month (or whatever annuity they are charging you) isn't the rebound when you come off these things supposed to be highly severe (i.e. you gain it all back and more).

To pagerman above, a lot of the Highland Park / River Oaks moms take this stuff so they can keep drinking their chardonnay.

Rossticus said:

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Bring back Ephedrine. I went from being a DL/DE to having the body of a Safety in one summer. Granted, I ran and worked out like an insane person but it was in no small part due to the Ephedrine. Had the energy to work 9 hours a day in a hot ass warehouse and still do 2+ hours in the weight room and 3-7 miles of cardio. Of course, sleep was a bit of an issue…. lol.

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Baller alert

Quote:

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Finally, I believe the biggest risk for obese people and diabetics is to not be taking one of these meds. Once heart disease strikes with a heart attack or stroke, many times the patient doesn't have a full recovery. Also, think of the years lost. That can occur from premature death or even the loss of an obese young person that can't get a date and is miserable. I doubt all obese people are fat and happy.

Anyway, it's something I believe people should consult their doctor about. As my dr friend said "Nobody has to be fat anymore".

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I will just add that not everyone who is obese will get a heart attack, and very, very many people with fatty liver have zero symptoms. Not making any excuses for fatasses, but all the alleged gains in quality of life are in the aggregate and not true for a subset of the population.

I've got some health issues, and the first thing they pointed at was my weight, despite normal blood pressire/blood sugar levels. Lost weight because of a fatty liver diagnosis, still feel like crap and in pain frequently but hey, my liver is clean as a whistle now. After doing labs a few weeks ago while in the ER for abdominal pain, my blood sugars abd cholesterol were so good they asked if I was on weight loss drugs thinking that was the problem (I am not, just found out that intermittent fasting works well for me).

My gastroenterologist brought up these drugs on my first visit, so I guess they do work for a lot of folks. He looked visibly disappointed once he saw my blood pressure and blood sugars were normal. Evidently it's an easy diagnosis for docs to get you to lose weight by drugs to see if that fixes your problem. That is a likely scenario going forward.

pfo said:

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Every now and then, when I am truly knowledgeable on a subject, I will read a Texags thread and be shocked at the ignorance. This thread has vaulted to the top of that list. OMG people, you have no idea what you are talking about with respect to these GLP-1 medicines.

JUST STOP!

Type 2 diabetics, those suffering from certain kidney diseases and the obese should consult with their doctors on the most effective treatments.

There is a reason Eli Lilly and Novo Nordisk can't keep enough of Mounjaro, Zepbound, Ozempic and Wegovy on the shelves to meet demand. These drugs are miracles for many people.

---

Sure they are miracles…until they aren't. But I'm sure pharma will be along soon enough with a treatment for the treatment. I feel like I've been on this roller coaster before…many many times.

Good luck.

Yes, you are right, people have many differences. One size doesn't fit all. Doctors and patients choose their best paths taking everything into account.

Mongolian Christmas said:

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pfo said:

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Every now and then, when I am truly knowledgeable on a subject, I will read a Texags thread and be shocked at the ignorance. This thread has vaulted to the top of that list. OMG people, you have no idea what you are talking about with respect to these GLP-1 medicines.

JUST STOP!

Type 2 diabetics, those suffering from certain kidney diseases and the obese should consult with their doctors on the most effective treatments.

There is a reason Eli Lilly and Novo Nordisk can't keep enough of Mounjaro, Zepbound, Ozempic and Wegovy on the shelves to meet demand. These drugs are miracles for many people.

---

Sure they are miracles…until they aren't. But I'm sure pharma will be along soon enough with a treatment for the treatment. I feel like I've been on this roller coaster before…many many times.

Good luck.

---

What is the downside to taking Mounjaro, Zepbound, Ozempic or Wegovy? I'm not aware of any meaningful negative. An obese person losing 16%-20% of total body mass with a reduced risk of heart disease is the positive. What's the negative that will require "a treatment for the treatmrnt"? I honestly don't know.

SWCBonfire said:

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Quote:

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Finally, I believe the biggest risk for obese people and diabetics is to not be taking one of these meds. Once heart disease strikes with a heart attack or stroke, many times the patient doesn't have a full recovery. Also, think of the years lost. That can occur from premature death or even the loss of an obese young person that can't get a date and is miserable. I doubt all obese people are fat and happy.

Anyway, it's something I believe people should consult their doctor about. As my dr friend said "Nobody has to be fat anymore".

---

I will just add that not everyone who is obese will get a heart attack, and very, very many people with fatty liver have zero symptoms. Not making any excuses for fatasses, but all the alleged gains in quality of life are in the aggregate and not true for a subset of the population.

I've got some health issues, and the first thing they pointed at was my weight, despite normal blood pressire/blood sugar levels. Lost weight because of a fatty liver diagnosis, still feel like crap and in pain frequently but hey, my liver is clean as a whistle now. After doing labs a few weeks ago while in the ER for abdominal pain, my blood sugars abd cholesterol were so good they asked if I was on weight loss drugs thinking that was the problem (I am not, just found out that intermittent fasting works well for me).

My gastroenterologist brought up these drugs on my first visit, so I guess they do work for a lot of folks. He looked visibly disappointed once he saw my blood pressure and blood sugars were normal. Evidently it's an easy diagnosis for docs to get you to lose weight by drugs to see if that fixes your problem. That is a likely scenario going forward.

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He might've been disappointed because many insurances don't cover these meds for weight loss, but will if you have indications of diabetes. Otherwise it's completely out of pocket. Which isn't an option for most people.

2wealfth Man said:

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If you don't have the $1,000 month (or whatever annuity they are charging you) isn't the rebound when you come off these things supposed to be highly severe (i.e. you gain it all back and more).

To pagerman above, a lot of the Highland Park / River Oaks moms take this stuff so they can keep drinking their chardonnay.

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Insurance covers the cost of the medicine for us. As far as drinking goes, a side effect we heard is Mounjaro and Zepbound decrease the desire for drinking alcohol. They are actually in a study by Lilly to determine if they might be an effective treatment for alcoholism. My wife and I don't drink so we don't have any observations to share on that.

pfo said:

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Mongolian Christmas said:

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pfo said:

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Every now and then, when I am truly knowledgeable on a subject, I will read a Texags thread and be shocked at the ignorance. This thread has vaulted to the top of that list. OMG people, you have no idea what you are talking about with respect to these GLP-1 medicines.

JUST STOP!

Type 2 diabetics, those suffering from certain kidney diseases and the obese should consult with their doctors on the most effective treatments.

There is a reason Eli Lilly and Novo Nordisk can't keep enough of Mounjaro, Zepbound, Ozempic and Wegovy on the shelves to meet demand. These drugs are miracles for many people.

---

Sure they are miracles…until they aren't. But I'm sure pharma will be along soon enough with a treatment for the treatment. I feel like I've been on this roller coaster before…many many times.

Good luck.

---

What is the downside to taking Mounjaro, Zepbound, Ozempic or Wegovy? I'm not aware of any meaningful negative. An obese person losing 16%-20% of total body mass with a reduced risk of heart disease is the positive. What's the negative that will require "a treatment for the treatmrnt"? I honestly don't know.

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I don't yet either. Tylenol cures my headache but it also is bad for my liver. As a poster above said, there are rarely short cuts in life. I don't think people should consider it a panacea and wonder drug. Phen Phen was a wonder drug as well.

bmks270 said:

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Nanomachines son said:

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If you're at the point where you're taking these drugs, just use steroids. Seriously, it's probably safer since these drugs paralyze your digestive system (I know multiple people whose digestive systems are ****ed permanently).

Do a 16-20 week cycle of test at 500 mg/week and make sure you lift and you'll easily lose weight and build muscle. Make sure you have an aromatase inhibitor like anastrozole and then a post cycle therapy drug like nolvadex and you're good. A cycle is cheaper than these drugs and it will have a much better long term impact due to muscle memory.

It's incredible that we demonize steroids, which are an over the counter drug in 90% of the world yet we approved these, which have side effects that are demonstrably worse.

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"Yeah just **** your hormones for life bro!"

Steroids aren't the answer either. They are also a shortcut for losers.

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That's not how it works. With the on cycle AI and post cycle therapy such as nolvadex you will enter into and out of a cycle with almost no issues. The people who mess up their endocrine systems are people who go in blind and don't do any research and just follow some bro science.

I've done a number of cycles over the years. It's not hard to do in a safe manner if you're not a ******.

I'm glad it's working for you and there's no question in my mind it has made you healthier by shedding the pounds but if you watch the video capcity linked you'll see the exercise component is not really a huge part of the equation. Does it help… absolutely but it's not the driving factor in American overweight/obesity issues

crowman2010 said:

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Wife and I have been on this for about 7 months now. I'm down 50lbs, she's down 40. Has been great for people who simply can't or do not want to make time for the gym. We feel great now and have gone into a maintenance mode.

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My wife and I have had the exact same results as y'all. We are so happy and are also in the maintenance mode. We must know 20 friends on these meds and everybody is thrilled!

Are you surprised at the pushback on this thread? I am. Is it ignorance?

Mongolian Christmas said:

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pfo said:

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Mongolian Christmas said:

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pfo said:

---

Every now and then, when I am truly knowledgeable on a subject, I will read a Texags thread and be shocked at the ignorance. This thread has vaulted to the top of that list. OMG people, you have no idea what you are talking about with respect to these GLP-1 medicines.

JUST STOP!

Type 2 diabetics, those suffering from certain kidney diseases and the obese should consult with their doctors on the most effective treatments.

There is a reason Eli Lilly and Novo Nordisk can't keep enough of Mounjaro, Zepbound, Ozempic and Wegovy on the shelves to meet demand. These drugs are miracles for many people.

---

Sure they are miracles…until they aren't. But I'm sure pharma will be along soon enough with a treatment for the treatment. I feel like I've been on this roller coaster before…many many times.

Good luck.

---

What is the downside to taking Mounjaro, Zepbound, Ozempic or Wegovy? I'm not aware of any meaningful negative. An obese person losing 16%-20% of total body mass with a reduced risk of heart disease is the positive. What's the negative that will require "a treatment for the treatmrnt"? I honestly don't know.

---

I don't yet either. Tylenol cures my headache but it also is bad for my liver. As a poster above said, there are rarely short cuts in life. I don't think people should consider it a panacea and wonder drug. Phen Phen was a wonder drug as well.

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The ephedrine stuff, as others have mentioned on here, was good back in the day. It was effective for a lot of people but it was over the counter and thus easily misused and subsequently banned. Hopefully with these new drugs physicians will monitor their use and they can serve our health needs for decades to come.

B-1 83 said:

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It's the drug of choice for the "Real Housewives of Calallen" . I've seen some women who look like well kept 40 year olds turn to Skeletor in 6 months.

Quote:

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As noted previously, people will take a pill or get injected, drop that weight, feel all good about themselves and a year later after they stop taking it will be bigger than when they started.

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One of the doctors I golf with said this exact same thing.

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This is something that's discussed over on the Ozempic thread. There appears to be a new thing people are calling "Ozempic skinny", because the drug doesn't apparently discriminate between muscle and fat (more so than traditional weight loss), so people are turning into skeletons, because they aren't balancing the drug with a healthy lifestyle.

Emotional Support Cobra said:

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At this point, I am OK with obese people taking Ozempic because we need something to reduce the strain on the health care system. 5 years ago me would have railed against laziness but living in South Texas is like being on another planet and we need change. When we travel up north I marvel at all the thin people.

I thought covid would scare more people into losing weight but nope they just got mean.

I have a co-worker who is type 2 diabetes and on ozempic. She is not hardly overweight, and says her numbers are down to normal levels but she has not lost any weight per se. She eats well and follows a diet. I am thrilled for her but we had a good laugh about her not reaping any weight loss benefits.

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The Atlantic published a big article on "No-zempics" last week. Apparently, about 1-in-6people will not lose weight on the drug. Scientists aren't completely certain why, but they suspect it's a genetic trait that's resistant to that part of the meds.

This is absolutely true. You will lose both muscle and fat without strength training.

halfastros81 said:

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I'm glad it's working for you and there's no question in my mind it has made you healthier by shedding the pounds but if you watch the video capcity linked you'll see the exercise component is not really a huge part of the equation. Does it help… absolutely but it's not the driving factor in American overweight/obesity issues

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The biggest component with being overweight/obesity is simply put: Portion Control.

You can workout all you want, but if you can't control how much you eat, you will constantly battle weight issues (unless of course if you have an extremely high metabolism).

This medication helps to reduce hunger cravings, and if you give it time, your ability to portion control becomes significantly easier. The wife and I are constantly splitting meals now, which has also helped reduce our expenses when we eat out. In all honesty, its almost a complete wash between the medication and the lowered cost of our food bill because we literally ate THAT much previously.

I just heard an interview with the Dutch President of Novo Nordisk

they estimate there are ONE HUNDRED MILLION Americans who are obese and able to take their shots.

nearly every american will be on some type of heavy drug for the rest of their lives.

pfo said:

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crowman2010 said:

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Wife and I have been on this for about 7 months now. I'm down 50lbs, she's down 40. Has been great for people who simply can't or do not want to make time for the gym. We feel great now and have gone into a maintenance mode.

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My wife and I have had the exact same results as y'all. We are so happy and are also in the maintenance mode. We must know 20 friends on these meds and everybody is thrilled!

Are you surprised at the pushback on this thread? I am. Is it ignorance?

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Same with us. At least that many friends/family members on it now, and all of them are experiencing fantastic results.

I think there's always a level of ignorance and skepticism with new "miracle" drugs. However, this stuff has been proven for MANY years, specifically for body builders, to be able to safely lean out before competitions.

With obesity being one of the biggest (no pun intended) issues in the US, more PCP's should be encouraging overweight/obese patients that have a hard time with portion control to get on this stuff.

LMCane said:

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I just heard an interview with the Dutch President of Novo Nordisk

they estimate there are ONE HUNDRED MILLION Americans who are obese and able to take their shots.

nearly every american will be on some type of heavy drug for the rest of their lives.

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This is an ignorant statement. You can easily taper off this medication and live a healthy lifestyle after.

If this medication reduces the amount of people that need meds for diabetes, high BP, etc, its well worth it IMO.

Tony Franklins Other Shoe said:

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Yet another product of a lazy society. Weight loss is the most simple math problem, just need to adhere to it.

Calories in < calories burned

As noted previously, people will take a pill or get injected, drop that weight, feel all good about themselves and a year later after they stop taking it will be bigger than when they started.

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I had this exact conversation with my doctor this morning. He said my insurance declining coverage for Mounjaro was probably the best problem I could have had because it gave me no choice but to lose weight the
right way by being more active and eating better/less. He also said Mounjaro, Ozempic, etc. aren't really the miracle drugs people think they are.

Quote:

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If this medication reduces the amount of people that need meds for diabetes, high BP, etc, its well worth it IMO.

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I don't understand why insurance companies won't cover these drugs for "off-label" use for weight loss, when they will cover all the other meds, treatments, and care for medical issues that directly result from obesity.

There are no miracle solutions to anything.

crowman2010 said:

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LMCane said:

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I just heard an interview with the Dutch President of Novo Nordisk

they estimate there are ONE HUNDRED MILLION Americans who are obese and able to take their shots.

nearly every american will be on some type of heavy drug for the rest of their lives.

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This is an ignorant statement. You can easily taper off this medication and live a healthy lifestyle after.

If this medication reduces the amount of people that need meds for diabetes, high BP, etc, its well worth it IMO.

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I'm pre-diabetic and overweight...after reading this thread, I've got an appt with my doctor scheduled next week to at least discuss taking this.

I get your point about portion control. I find myself sometimes having that same issue lately. I'm not full, so, hell...I'll have another bite...I know that's a habit issue, but hell, habits can be hard to break. Sometimes getting some help can get you moving in the right direction.

I took meds to quit smoking 20+ years ago - simply quitting cold turkey wasn't working. I took those meds for several months after quitting smokes and then stopped the meds and have stayed smoke free since then. But I needed that push.

So, I look at ozempic the same way. Take it for awhile, lose some weight, help my pre-diabetes, and get in the habit of the smaller portions...then it'll be easier to continue with those smaller portions when I quit taking it.

Ryan the Temp said:

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Quote:

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If this medication reduces the amount of people that need meds for diabetes, high BP, etc, its well worth it IMO.

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I don't understand why insurance companies won't cover these drugs for "off-label" use for weight loss, when they will cover all the other meds, treatments, and care for medical issues that directly result from obesity.

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More and more are starting too. A year ago the VA and tricare wouldn't cover them and now they do

Ryan the Temp said:

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Quote:

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If this medication reduces the amount of people that need meds for diabetes, high BP, etc, its well worth it IMO.

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I don't understand why insurance companies won't cover these drugs for "off-label" use for weight loss, when they will cover all the other meds, treatments, and care for medical issues that directly result from obesity.

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Probably inertia...

Takes them awhile to make changes like this, when, as you said, it's "off label".