So what can the feds do if the company absolutely refuses to comply with a subpoena?
Liberty Safes have back door codes they will give to the govt
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Last: 1 yr ago by Slicer97
TorbushQuote:
- A company can only exist as so long the government allows it.
EOTChemEAg08 said:Space-Tech said:
A few things.
- A company exists for only one purpose, to make money.
- If you think a company is "on your side" you are wrong.
- A company can only exist as so long the government allows it.
We here in the United States believe that the government is allowed to exist based on if the people allow it, commie.
That's pretty crazy they keep all the codes on record. As stated before it usually is if you lose your code then you are in trouble because there is no access to get it.
Yet they keep them and then gave them out. Wow. That is a bad move by a safe company called Liberty!
Yet they keep them and then gave them out. Wow. That is a bad move by a safe company called Liberty!
It Aint Easy Being Brown said:Space-Tech said:
A few things.A company can only exist as so long the government allows it.
Holy **** what a plebe of a take
My God
He does realize that WE ARE the govt ? Right ?
A bigger issue is that a data breach at the company now makes your safe a glorified fire blanket over your possessions. The fact that the back door codes exist at all is troubling - even more so that they will seemingly give those codes to anyone BUT the owner of the safe.
Some Junkie Cosmonaut
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AG
AggieMD95 said:It Aint Easy Being Brown said:Space-Tech said:
A few things.A company can only exist as so long the government allows it.
Holy **** what a plebe of a take
My God
He does realize that WE ARE the govt ? Right ?
Judging by the posting history, zhe doesn't realize much of anything at all.
Nanomachines son said:
One of the clearest examples I have ever seen of a business having zero understanding of its customers.
This was written by an attorney. Most of them are liberal. Liberty put their future in the hands of a liberal who went to school a bit longer and passed a special test.
In fact, as the government does with our borders, I just leave my Liberty safe open. It provides a nice container for things and the top makes nice sturdy shelf to stack things on.Andrew99 said:
Tyranny Safe
If you have nothing to hide then you have nothing to worry about.
Liberty Safe Company launches the Benedict Arnold safe series. Protects your personal effects from only you should you need access and lost your code.
www.southpawprecision.com
Type 07 FFL / Class 2 SOT
Nightforce Optics Dealer
AGM Night Vision Dealer
Type 07 FFL / Class 2 SOT
Nightforce Optics Dealer
AGM Night Vision Dealer
I was actually considering buying one of those in the next few months. Now I for sure will not.
TheHulkster said:
It is disappointing, but even if the feds weren't given the master combo, how long would that really delay them getting into the safe? I seriously doubt there's a gun safe on the market at any price that can't be cracked with enough time and motivation. Your gun safe is to keep your kids safe and to frustrate the smash-and-grab style robbers. It's not keeping either bad guys or LEOs out if you give them enough time and/or a warrant.
This. Nothing was keeping the government out of a physical safe. Dumb to think otherwise. No safe is foolproof
Space-Tech said:
A few things.
- A company can only exist as so long the government allows it.
This is not China. We have a Constitution enumerating specific powers of the Federal Government. "Dictating the existence of companies" is not one of them.
The Banned said:TheHulkster said:
It is disappointing, but even if the feds weren't given the master combo, how long would that really delay them getting into the safe? I seriously doubt there's a gun safe on the market at any price that can't be cracked with enough time and motivation. Your gun safe is to keep your kids safe and to frustrate the smash-and-grab style robbers. It's not keeping either bad guys or LEOs out if you give them enough time and/or a warrant.
This. Nothing was keeping the government out of a physical safe. Dumb to think otherwise. No safe is foolproof
Then why provide a backdoor in the first place?
Cannon has backup codes on file at the company, at least the digital locks do. Not sure about combination mechanical locks.
Logos Stick said:
This trumps Bud Light as worst business decision ever.
These guys just killed their business.
Never go full bud light.
DeSantis 2024
FJB, FJB, FJB, etc
FJB, FJB, FJB, etc
The FBI had a warrant for the safe. To force Liberty to hand over the code they would have had to serve them with a separate warrant looking for the code, it looks like all they had to do was say please though. Very disappointing for sure.
ChemEAg08 said:Space-Tech said:
A few things.
- A company exists for only one purpose, to make money.
- If you think a company is "on your side" you are wrong.
- A company can only exist as so long the government allows it.
We here in the United States believe that the government is allowed to exist based on if the people allow it, commie.
That's nice, but its no longer reality.
See: 2020 election
The Banned said:TheHulkster said:
It is disappointing, but even if the feds weren't given the master combo, how long would that really delay them getting into the safe? I seriously doubt there's a gun safe on the market at any price that can't be cracked with enough time and motivation. Your gun safe is to keep your kids safe and to frustrate the smash-and-grab style robbers. It's not keeping either bad guys or LEOs out if you give them enough time and/or a warrant.
This. Nothing was keeping the government out of a physical safe. Dumb to think otherwise. No safe is foolproof
All a safe does is delay an unauthorised person from getting to your stuff. The company has the master codes for a safe and will give a licensed locksmith the code IF AUTHORIZED BY YOU. The government can get a court order to open the safe. But the company should not be a part of that chain because their contract and only obligation is with the safe owner, not the federal government.
Seemed to go smooth as clockwork, like they've been down this road many times before. I wonder how long this backdoor has been there, how many times it has been used, and how many other things (be they safes or cellphones) have government backdoors in them.
geoag58 said:The Banned said:TheHulkster said:
It is disappointing, but even if the feds weren't given the master combo, how long would that really delay them getting into the safe? I seriously doubt there's a gun safe on the market at any price that can't be cracked with enough time and motivation. Your gun safe is to keep your kids safe and to frustrate the smash-and-grab style robbers. It's not keeping either bad guys or LEOs out if you give them enough time and/or a warrant.
This. Nothing was keeping the government out of a physical safe. Dumb to think otherwise. No safe is foolproof
All a safe does is delay an unauthorised person from getting to your stuff. The company has the master codes for a safe and will give a licensed locksmith the code IF AUTHORIZED BY YOU. The government can get a court order to open the safe. But the company should not be a part of that chain because their contract and only obligation is with the safe owner, not the federal government.
I get it, but it's just delaying the inevitable. I can see why people would be upset, but the end result is the same
I can't even comprehend the concept of a digitally locked safe. Thats the dumbest ****ing idea ever. There is no upside, and a million downsides, including this discussion.
Yet, the market is mainly digital now. Literally insane.
Yet, the market is mainly digital now. Literally insane.
geoag58 said:The Banned said:TheHulkster said:
It is disappointing, but even if the feds weren't given the master combo, how long would that really delay them getting into the safe? I seriously doubt there's a gun safe on the market at any price that can't be cracked with enough time and motivation. Your gun safe is to keep your kids safe and to frustrate the smash-and-grab style robbers. It's not keeping either bad guys or LEOs out if you give them enough time and/or a warrant.
This. Nothing was keeping the government out of a physical safe. Dumb to think otherwise. No safe is foolproof
All a safe does is delay an unauthorised person from getting to your stuff. The company has the master codes for a safe and will give a licensed locksmith the code IF AUTHORIZED BY YOU. The government can get a court order to open the safe. But the company should not be a part of that chain because their contract and only obligation is with the safe owner, not the federal government.
The company should not have a master list of codes at all. There should not be any backdoor codes whatsoever. This is a security risk and now literally everyone knows they have this information so it's going to get hacked and released since I am sure they are blithering idiots about cybersecurity too.
A good safe is one where if you lose the code then you're not opening it without a locksmith. Backdoors should not exist.
I am sure there are folks on this board that know this, but apparently not all.Cynic said:Nanomachines son said:YOU HAVE THE COMBINATION. pic.twitter.com/9S0xLlmwta
— Walleyes, Whitetails & Whiskeys are all around us (@weirbeard1) September 6, 2023
So the government could just hire a locksmith as well.
Meaning they can get in these even if they didn't get the code
Liberty will only give the "back door" instructions to a licensed locksmith. The locksmith has a responsibility to keep that information confidential. The consumer has no obligation. That is why the consumer has to call a locksmith.
The FBI has licensed locksmiths on their payroll. That is why they don't have to call one, they already have one. Even with that, they had to provide a legitimate warrant to get the information.
If you think the lack of "back door" instructions would have kept the FBI out, you aren't thinking clearly. If they want in, they will get in.
If there was no "back door" Liberty Safes would sell very few units, since if a consumer forgot the combination, it would become a very large and expensive paperweight.
What some people decide to get riled up about is fascinating.
It is much easier to fool someone than it is to convince someone that he has been fooled.
The Banned said:geoag58 said:The Banned said:TheHulkster said:
It is disappointing, but even if the feds weren't given the master combo, how long would that really delay them getting into the safe? I seriously doubt there's a gun safe on the market at any price that can't be cracked with enough time and motivation. Your gun safe is to keep your kids safe and to frustrate the smash-and-grab style robbers. It's not keeping either bad guys or LEOs out if you give them enough time and/or a warrant.
This. Nothing was keeping the government out of a physical safe. Dumb to think otherwise. No safe is foolproof
All a safe does is delay an unauthorised person from getting to your stuff. The company has the master codes for a safe and will give a licensed locksmith the code IF AUTHORIZED BY YOU. The government can get a court order to open the safe. But the company should not be a part of that chain because their contract and only obligation is with the safe owner, not the federal government.
I get it, but it's just delaying the inevitable. I can see why people would be upset, but the end result is the same
The government is involving themselves in a legal transaction between two individuals after the fact.
I predict a rush of current owners to replace their locks with aftermarket.
If the fed really wants into your safe, they could just destroy it. The backdoor just saves them the hassle of spending 5 minutes with a plasma cutter.
If the fed really wants into your safe, they could just destroy it. The backdoor just saves them the hassle of spending 5 minutes with a plasma cutter.
Watermelon Man said:I am sure there are folks on this board that know this, but apparently not all.Cynic said:Nanomachines son said:YOU HAVE THE COMBINATION. pic.twitter.com/9S0xLlmwta
— Walleyes, Whitetails & Whiskeys are all around us (@weirbeard1) September 6, 2023
So the government could just hire a locksmith as well.
Meaning they can get in these even if they didn't get the code
Liberty will only give the "back door" instructions to a licensed locksmith. The locksmith has a responsibility to keep that information confidential. The consumer has no obligation. That is why the consumer has to call a locksmith.
The FBI has licensed locksmiths on their payroll. That is why they don't have to call one, they already have one. Even with that, they had to provide a legitimate warrant to get the information.
If you think the lack of "back door" instructions would have kept the FBI out, you aren't thinking clearly. If they want in, they will get in.
If there was no "back door" Liberty Safes would sell very few units, since if a consumer forgot the combination, it would become a very large and expensive paperweight.
What some people decide to get riled up about is fascinating.
I don't know about that.
I'm betting after this a company that marketed safes with no back door codes would be the top seller almost instantly.
Make these losers break in the old fashioned way
Thats just it though. Its not 5 minutes.P.H. Dexippus said:
I predict a rush of current owners to replace their locks with aftermarket.
If the fed really wants into your safe, they could just destroy it. The backdoor just saves them the hassle of spending 5 minutes with a plasma cutter.
They need a crew to spend a day getting the safe out, or getting a plasma cutter in, and going to work on it. Its a big job requiring a team and resources and commitment and skill. And that wont happen without a warrant and a good enough reason at least in multiple minds, right or wrong. Its a multi day process involving a lot of people and skills.
Or the ****ing commies can just call the other commies push a button.
Not buying a safe with an unlocked back door. Need to rename the company to Scooby Safe "RUH ROH our Motto"
cbr said:
I can't even comprehend the concept of a digitally locked safe. Thats the dumbest ****ing idea ever. There is no upside, and a million downsides, including this discussion.
Yet, the market is mainly digital now. Literally insane.
That's irrelevant to the relationship that should exist between the safe company and their consumers.The Banned said:geoag58 said:The Banned said:TheHulkster said:
It is disappointing, but even if the feds weren't given the master combo, how long would that really delay them getting into the safe? I seriously doubt there's a gun safe on the market at any price that can't be cracked with enough time and motivation. Your gun safe is to keep your kids safe and to frustrate the smash-and-grab style robbers. It's not keeping either bad guys or LEOs out if you give them enough time and/or a warrant.
This. Nothing was keeping the government out of a physical safe. Dumb to think otherwise. No safe is foolproof
All a safe does is delay an unauthorised person from getting to your stuff. The company has the master codes for a safe and will give a licensed locksmith the code IF AUTHORIZED BY YOU. The government can get a court order to open the safe. But the company should not be a part of that chain because their contract and only obligation is with the safe owner, not the federal government.
I get it, but it's just delaying the inevitable. I can see why people would be upset, but the end result is the same
I have cut the skin off a TL rated safe (area large enough to reach in) with a plasma cutter in 5 minutes. Liberty safes are not even TL rated. It's not going to take a day for the feds to get inside unless they want it too. I would also wager that the vast majority of safe owners do not even bother to correctly anchor them, so removal isn't that big a deal.cbr said:Thats just it though. Its not 5 minutes.P.H. Dexippus said:
I predict a rush of current owners to replace their locks with aftermarket.
If the fed really wants into your safe, they could just destroy it. The backdoor just saves them the hassle of spending 5 minutes with a plasma cutter.
They need a crew to spend a day getting the safe out, or getting a plasma cutter in, and going to work on it. Its a big job requiring a team and resources and commitment and skill. And that wont happen without a warrant and a good enough reason at least in multiple minds, right or wrong. Its a multi day process involving a lot of people and skills.
Or the ****ing commies can just call the other commies push a button.
My whole point is that while Liberty has done a crappy thing, it wasn't really stopping the feds from invading their owner's privacy with a warrant.
The self ownage and lack of self awareness of these post are laughably sad.Watermelon Man said:I am sure there are folks on this board that know this, but apparently not all.Cynic said:Nanomachines son said:YOU HAVE THE COMBINATION. pic.twitter.com/9S0xLlmwta
— Walleyes, Whitetails & Whiskeys are all around us (@weirbeard1) September 6, 2023
So the government could just hire a locksmith as well.
Meaning they can get in these even if they didn't get the code
Liberty will only give the "back door" instructions to a licensed locksmith. The locksmith has a responsibility to keep that information confidential. The consumer has no obligation. That is why the consumer has to call a locksmith.
The FBI has licensed locksmiths on their payroll. That is why they don't have to call one, they already have one. Even with that, they had to provide a legitimate warrant to get the information.
If you think the lack of "back door" instructions would have kept the FBI out, you aren't thinking clearly. If they want in, they will get in.
If there was no "back door" Liberty Safes would sell very few units, since if a consumer forgot the combination, it would become a very large and expensive paperweight.
What some people decide to get riled up about is fascinating.
I don't think anyone believes it would stop the feds from opening it in the end, but at least it makes them work for it.P.H. Dexippus said:I have cut the skin off a TL rated safe with a plasma cutter in 5 minutes. Liberty safes are not TL even rated. It's not going to take a day for the feds to get inside unless they want it too. I would also wager that the vast majority of safe owners do not even bother to correctly anchor them, so removal isn't that big a deal.cbr said:Thats just it though. Its not 5 minutes.P.H. Dexippus said:
I predict a rush of current owners to replace their locks with aftermarket.
If the fed really wants into your safe, they could just destroy it. The backdoor just saves them the hassle of spending 5 minutes with a plasma cutter.
They need a crew to spend a day getting the safe out, or getting a plasma cutter in, and going to work on it. Its a big job requiring a team and resources and commitment and skill. And that wont happen without a warrant and a good enough reason at least in multiple minds, right or wrong. Its a multi day process involving a lot of people and skills.
Or the ****ing commies can just call the other commies push a button.
My whole point is that while Liberty has done a crappy thing, it wasn't really stopping the feds from invading their owner's privacy with a warrant.
If Liberty Safes had made it clear from day 1 that this code existed and would be provided to law enforcement when a valid warrant was issued, they would not be in the mess they created.
"If you will not fight for right when you can easily win without blood shed; if you will not fight when your victory is sure and not too costly; you may come to the moment when you will have to fight with all the odds against you and only a precarious chance of survival. There may even be a worse case. You may have to fight when there is no hope of victory, because it is better to perish than to live as slaves." - Sir Winston Churchill
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