Teslag said:

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No we cannot.

Any country on earth should be free to join a defensive pact without fear of being invaded by a neighbor.

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True, any country should be free to join a defensive pact without fear of being invaded.

However, Russia made it clear long ago that they were unhappy with NATO creeping eastward and we continued to push it eastward anyway.. We know that Russians are a bit crazy and very paranoid yet we continue to do things that provoke them. The point of NATO is supposed to be to prevent WW3 with the Soviet Union so why are we closer to WW3 now than any time before the fall of the Soviet Union?

Either we have very stupid leaders or our leaders want us to be at war. I certainly can't think of any reason why our leaders would want us to be at war (sarcasm).

And don't be fooled, we are at war. We are providing the bombs. We teach their people how to shoot the bombs and we are pointing out where to shoot the bombs. They just press the button. It's a proxy war if there ever was one.

A proxy war means we are not at war. Don't be fooled indeed.

Teslag said:

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Pool is misinformed. No reservists have been called up for deployment to Europe that weren't already in queue for normal rotations.

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Teslag calling someone else misinformed hahaha

Salute Ukraine!! Make sure and get all 37 of your boosters, too.

Ag in Tiger Country said:

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Teslag said:

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Ag in Tiger Country said:

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Somalia & Bosnia also come to mind, along with the 1000s of 'minor incursions' (SOF Operations &/or Drone Attacks) conducted as part of the War on Drugs &/or Terror into an untold number of countries!!

I'm fully convinced "we're the baddies."

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We are all fully aware that you and Michelle Obama hate America. That's fine company.

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Ummm, I despise Michelle & his husband; I also believe certain actors, primarily Dems but also swampy Republicans, have used unnecessary wars, including those I listed, to enrich themselves all the while endangering the lives of our proud men & women in uniform! That's not the type of company I wish to consort with, nor have I ever. Thus, I seriously question your judgement, including what you consider to be "fine", because even if such was said in jest, the rest of your comment is still alarming for its sheer stupidity.

Specifically, the "baddies" reference was to a British comedy sketch where 2 Waffen SS officers serving on the Russian Front realize they're the 'baddies' on account of the totenkopf (death-heads) affixed to their visor hats; in other words, the irony is the soldiers only realized they were the "baddies" by their attire instead of dutifully serving a corrupt regime by invading countries without provocation &/or based upon lies (like we did with 'weapons of mass destruction').

Accordingly, I have no idea what mental gymnastics you had to pull to: 1) Associate me with Michelle, & 2) how that Brit segment correlates to Michelle. In this instance, your ignorance is glaring.

Perhaps you just wanted to attack me personally b/c I previously criticized the practice of milking the VA system and collecting 100% disability just because that inept governmental institution makes it easy to STEAL from the American taxpayers by overwhelming a system with bogus claims that actually take away time and resources of the VA to properly adjudicate claims of DESERVING SOLDIERS!!!

You can rest easy knowing that I caught a ban the last time I truthfully pointed out which TexAgs poster that comment applied to; you can also rest easy knowing that I won't be a puss & complain about your personal attack, which had no basis in fact or logic.

Try harder; be better. Oh, and who the hell is the "we" in your post? I'll bet you're on an island of stupidity all by your lonesome in this instance.

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Touched a nerve. You can keep screaming from the rooftops how terrible this country is and how we are the greatest evil on the planet. It's EXACTLY what the left has done for years. I'll love and defend it for as long as I can. America is the greatest nation on earth and no one will change my mind about that.

HarryJ33tamu said:

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Teslag said:

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Pool is misinformed. No reservists have been called up for deployment to Europe that weren't already in queue for normal rotations.

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Teslag calling someone else misinformed hahaha

Salute Ukraine!! Make sure and get all 37 of your boosters, too.

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So you believe Pool is correct and IRR soldiers have been called up? (They haven't)

Quote:

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why are we closer to WW3 now than any time before the fall of the Soviet Union?

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Narrator "we aren't"

Don't need a draft. Unless, of course, the Yankees and the Confederates are going to fight again, then we might. But not for someone else's war.

All-right. I'mma break this down for you like a tailgate tent.

Take about 30-seconds and watch this gif.

Do you know what this map represents?

You. In the back on your phone. Who is that?

Teslag? What do we have here?

It's a map of sovereign independent nations voluntarily joining a defensive alliance through the years.

Do you admit that the west brought NATO up to Russia's doorstep?

No, Russias neighbors invited NATO to guard their back porch.

Do you admit that Ukraine sought NATO membership prior to February 2022?

Of course. And I can't imagine why…

Do you acknowledge that after 9-11, Ukraine became a hub for international money laundering as well as a playground for corruption, graft and kickbacks by western politicians?

Yes of course. Ukraine is and was a very corrupt nation. But that's a problem for their citizens and government to fix. Certainly not ours and certainly not Russias.

Do you acknowledge the national security interest of Russia maintaining control over Crimea particularly with regard to its Black Sea ports?

Stat Monitor Repairman said:

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Do you acknowledge the national security interest of Russia maintaining control over Crimea particularly with regard to its Black Sea ports?

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No, Crimea was a part of Ukraine and forcibly annexed via a hostile invasion. Russia had a Black Sea port by agreement prior to their invasion. They didn't just want the port, they wanted the whole peninsula and took it via bloodshed. And even after this act, they still had control of Crimea prior to February 2022.

Do you acknowledge that Russia as sovereign nation is entitled to a regional sphere of influence much like the US's Monroe doctrine in the Western Hemisphere?

No, Russia does not deserve or is entitled to a "sphere of influence". Nor do we for that matter.

Will you acknowledge that Russia and Ukraine have history that dates back to 800AD wile the United States has only been a country for 247 years?

Yes and that's as relevant as the price of tea in China. You are turning yourself inside out to justify one country invading another without provocation.

Do you see a glimmer of the smokestacks of provocation on the horizon?

No. If Russia turns around and goes home there will be peace. Just like there would have been peace for the past year and a half if they never invaded.

Not even a glimmer?

After everything we've talked about tonight, not even a glimmer of provocation?

Would it be fair to say that in Teslag's world the situation in Ukraine is binary, in that there is a right and wrong party, and a good and bad actor?

Stat Monitor Repairman said:

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Would it be fair to say that in Teslag's world the situation in Ukraine is binary, in that there is a right and wrong party, and a good and bad actor?

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Yes. Russia is 100% responsible for invading a sovereign independent nation that had zero intention to invade or attack Russia.

Alright then. If that's your analysis and opinion then we can go no further.

The, "But Russia's history with Ukraine!" argument is like saying the people who used to own your property before you can just come and kick you off it because it was theirs once. It's not anymore, but since they have a history with it, they have some kind of weird entitlement to it that trumps the fact it belongs to you now and they willingly gave up ownership.

Why did NATO encroach on Russia's sphere on influence and threaten Russia's Baltic port? Russia has hundreds of years of history with Estonia, Lithuania, Latvia, and Poland, and that's older than NATO or even the US!

Oh and Finland, since the mere possibly of sharing a border with NATO is an existential threat completely justifying war.

AgBQ-00 said:

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Supplying materiel and sanctions have also gotten us dragged into ever expanding conflict in the past.

Just pointing out that there has been a shift in mindset in those that are in position to enact drastic changes. Seriously, could any of you have ever imagined even opinion articles calling for the draft to be a thing?

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so that's just not true or correct or reality.

the United States has been supplying Israel with weaponry and "materials" since 1968 and has not been dragged into "an expanding war".

Teslag said:

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IndividualFreedom said:

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Not taking my kid to fight your war. Not going to happen. You can take me, but not her.

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Just have her claim a high school knee injury. From my experience this has kept 100% of people out of the military when civilians thank me for my service.

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Or…..this almost kept my son from joining the military as a soon to be dentist. He used an inhaler a few times on cold mornings playing youth soccer. Went through a short spell where he had trouble with cool, dry air then he out grew it. Only ever had one prescription.

He was rejected immediately went he attended medical. Had to contend it with a private pulmonologist to get accepted.

Just say kid played m soccer. From ages 12 to 18 used an inhaler. Boom they will be rejected.

Asthma is another one too. Also, lots of waivers are needed for SSRI use as well. Same with adderall. Unfortunately this bars a ton of kids these days from serving.

TheEternalPessimist said:

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My son is about to be 13 years old.

If they enact a draft to fight this stupid war and my son is 17 years old and this thing is not over...... I will move with my wife and son OUT of this country to protect my son from this.

This is NOT A DEFENSIVE WAR.

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So the Bush era War on Terror mantra of "If you don't support the military mission, then you don't support the troops and makes you a traitor" is no longer valid?
Good to know.

Stat Monitor Repairman said:

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The continued expansion of NATO from 1991 to present caused the war that we are seeing today.

And if this conflict continues to devolve, then that error can be attributed to a continued escalation of the Cold War and the outbreak of a conventional WW3.

What we are seeing today is a continuation of the Cold War.

And 20-years later, the GWOT turned into a continuation of the Cold War.

From a historical standpoint, one thing is clear.

If you step back and look at it with fresh eyes, you'll see that US has somehow been the cause, and the solution to most of the world's problems since 1944.

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Now we've come full circle back to what I said in the beginning. Which is that this is a continuation of the Cold War brought on by the continued expansion of NATO since 1991 and the continued fighting of proxy wars since that time.

Since 1955 we've seen the same thing. Which is Russian made weapons deployed agains US made weapons in a cycle that continues to this day. This was the case in Vietnam from 1955 to 1975. Was like that in Afghanistan 1 and 2 and Gulf War 1 and 2. Anybody that doesn't think the Russians were meddling in Iraq 2003 to present is denying reality. So it's been like that in countless minor conflicts since then. East v. West. Russia v the US in a conflict that continues to the proxy war we are seeing today, by Ukraine serving as a proving ground for US weapons systems, and a dumping ground for outdated US munitions.

So the idea that Russia is gonna sit there and let the west encroach indefinitely on its sphere of influence is disingenuous as letting the Russians set up shop in Cuba like they did in the 1960s.

So I can appreciate y'all's binary and simplistic view of the situation. Drive the Russians out of Ukraine, and continue to fund another 20-years war, and continue to escalate WW3.

So that's where we're at with this.

TxTarpon said:

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TheEternalPessimist said:

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My son is about to be 13 years old.

If they enact a draft to fight this stupid war and my son is 17 years old and this thing is not over...... I will move with my wife and son OUT of this country to protect my son from this.

This is NOT A DEFENSIVE WAR.

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So the Bush era War on Terror mantra of "If you don't support the military mission, then you don't support the troops and makes you a traitor" is no longer valid?
Good to know.

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I have been quite clear -- we were all suckered to support that war... and it was a bi-partisan effort to get us involved in it.

I support our military men in any conflict so that they may protect each other. Even when I don't support the prosecution of the war itself. I live in the Pensacola 'metro' area...... which has a large military population due the flight school, NAS, training areas, and proximity to Eglin as well...... Most of the military people I encounter agree with my take - you can support our military and preparedness of it WITHOUT supporting our involvement in a war in Ukraine.

And why are you talking like we are already in direct combat with Russia? Do you know something?

NO TO THE WAR IN UKRAINE!