No Spin Ag said:

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Rapier108 said:

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FireAg said:

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I continue to fail to see how a Gavin Newsom could appeal to independents...

CA is quite literally hemorrhaging tax dollars...that state is completely mismanaged...

I just don't think Newsom is the threat that some folks think...

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Think Beto to see he appeal, especially to women. Policy and failures won't matter.

And Frau Whitmer from Michigan is looking more and more likely as the replacement rather than Newsom.

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I agree that Whitmer is much more palatable to the independents and moderates. Unlike Newsome and Beto, she wouldn't be seen as someone as far to the left as those two are.

Newsome wouldn't work in the rust belt states. He's way too polished and comes off as an elitist I think she'd be heavily vetted if the time came.

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Nice post but I think you are wrong about Whitmer, she will NOT appeal to informed moderates. She is the most far left of the bunch, more so than Newsome. She is turning Michigan in a far left police state and it currently ranks among the worst of the worst in personal freedom.

Old May Banker said:

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When Biden hid in the basement and tried to avoid debates, he was chastised - and rightfully so. Why do folks change their principles?

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It's honestly pretty sad that Trump supporters aren't more embarrassed by this. For a "proven warrior" he sure does seem afraid to share his ideas with the larger public outside of his rallies and Truth Social.

FireAg said:

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J. Walter Weatherman said:

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FireAg said:

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Phatbob said:

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FireAg said:

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Okay...but my point is that there simply aren't very many that are going for DeSantis to begin with...

And that's why the national average gap is growing...at least for now...

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I think there is a difference between the support base. DeSantis is a challenger. When you support a challenger, you are already admitting that the current frontrunner is not what you want and you are willing to back certain positions and ideas in rough form. Those get worked out throughout the primary season and that vote is fluid. There is going to be an ordered list of candidates that fit more or less what you support the most.

For Trump, there is a lot of the base that has a top 5 list that Trump has all 5 slots, and there is no examination of any issues beyond "Is their last name Trump". If it is literally not possible to break into that list, because the first criteria to be on the list is to be Trump, at some point, you have to point to the people with that list and call it what it is. This obsession with Trump and only Trump is what is killing the Republican party.

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If DeSantis can't find a way to break into that list...he won't be the R nominee...

I'm sorry to say, but it is just that simple...

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The point is he can't win over any of the Trump diehards because they are 100% Trump or bust in the primary. He just needs to win the other 65-70% of the party who is actually open to another option as the other candidates drop out, hopefully in time.

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And this is where I think you (and to be fair, many others) are making a mistake...

I think in the primaries, as things stand right now, the number of "100% Trump" are greater than 30-35%...I personally think that, from a primary perspective, that number is north of 50% nationally...

That's what the national polling (and state polling) averages are telling my eyes at the moment...

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About the same thing an an old aggie\tech score 3 minutes into THE FIRST QUARTER would tell me, Absolutely nothing besides the initial offensive and defensive strategies. I personally think you are wrong and live in a Trump bubble.

In July, beside Trump propagandist, who gives a damn what the polls say . In reality most Americans have the memory of a gnat. When Trump chickens out of, or is destroyed in a debate that momentum will shift very quickly.

Its clear Trump knows he is toast unless he can convince the masses games are won at the end of the first quarter. And sure enough we have people buying in with brains off. Fortunately human nature will win out.

texagbeliever said:

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The Banned said:

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texagbeliever said:

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The Banned said:

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texagbeliever said:

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They have this determinism conundrum. They think Trump will lose 2024 because he lost in 2018 and 2020. So if DeSantis loses to Trump in 2024 they will then be forced to look for someone else because DeSantis losing in 2024 means he can't win in 2028. It is a very poor way to look at the future but it is common throughout history. I call it the logic inertia fallacy.

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This is oversimplifying the matter. People are taking data points, as well as current tends and making a prediction. He lost in 2020 because he continuously shot himself in the foot. He has continued to shoot himself in the foot. He is turning off many key demographics and is only doubling down. Now he is insulting to republican governors that have massively improved their states.

We aren't saying "anyone who loses a race can't win again". We're saying he can't win again because he hasn't changed a single thing that hamstrung him last time. If trump came out a different man ready to set aside the antics that lost the White House, I don't think desantis would even be running

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If Trump keeps shooting himself in the foot why is he still winning by so much?! If you actually believed what you posted you would be confident DeSantis was going to win. Your posting lacks that confidence.

Also I love how people can take current trends and say Trump will lose. But people definitely can't take current trends and say DeSantis will lose to Trump. Because science!

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Because of emotion. I feel like I've spelled this out in depth already. It doesn't matter what he does, a certain amount of people are going to ride or die with him. People are now backing him up on fast tracking the vaccine or claiming he was never pro-lockdown and plenty of other nonsense because he hasn't disavowed them. His followers just change their positions. Or they ignore his stupidity, like when he called desantis out on Disney (wrong) and the heartbeat bill (wrong). They just ignore it. Not because they're stupid. They are just emotionally attached and that loyalty is hard to break.

And as far as I can see, only two posters are saying desantis has a good chance. I don't think he will win the primary. Im hopeful for a win, but completely expect him to lose because of the afore mentioned emotional attachment to trump

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The latter part of the first paragraph is the Teflon persona of an imperfect candidate. It is key in the propaganda MSM environment we live in.

If DeSantis posters all but agree Trump is going to win, then wouldn't their effort be better spent getting those emotionally manipulated to be more conservative rather than trying to alienate them? Yet this is not the preferred method of the bigger personalities nor posters here.

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Most I know dont buy this at all.

Get your mugs.

DeSantis campaign to sell mug highlighting friendship with Iowa governor amid Trump feudhttps://t.co/SBQ8NRlEdK

— Team DeSantis (@TeamDeSantis) July 31, 2023

Fact Check: True

Madison's Art Rocks https://t.co/TMYYieHn8C pic.twitter.com/Yn3LQoSkPZ

— Casey DeSantis (@CaseyDeSantis) July 31, 2023

Quote:

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I want a country where Americans that work hard are able to get ahead, raise a family, and lead fulfilling, productive lives.

If we can't get that right, we will not succeed as a country.

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This is spot on.

TRM said:

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Get your mugs.

DeSantis campaign to sell mug highlighting friendship with Iowa governor amid Trump feudhttps://t.co/SBQ8NRlEdK

— Team DeSantis (@TeamDeSantis) July 31, 2023

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And yet the latest talking points from MAGA is DeSantis has less then 10 people at his Iowa events, is "low energy" and will soon drop so low he will miss future debates.

Too bad truth is something MAGA has no concept of.

He hit up the rural counties this go round. Reaching 15% of the caucus goers is kind of a big deal.

aggie93 said:

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Trump getting support from some of the best places!

1/ Given the new NYT/Sienna poll, I'd just like to remind you one more time that spending money to defeat Trump in the primary is burning through donor resources that will be desperately needed in the general election.

In this, there are three schools of thought, all wrong. pic.twitter.com/PhpSJH4CAX

— Rick Wilson (@TheRickWilson) July 31, 2023

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So the Lincoln Project now supports Trump winning the primary.

Can't make this **** up. Of course they want Trump because they know he will lose to any Democrat which is their real end game.

Today's first Trump PAC filing is in...the dormant Trump MAGA Cmte, which served as the small-dollar joint fundraising committee in 2016 and 2020, spent $202.8K on operating expenditures, sent $1.02M to the Save America leadership PAC paying his legal bills, and has $3.29M left. pic.twitter.com/68421sIUFp

— Rob Pyers (@rpyers) July 31, 2023

Talk about a high burn rate.

After raising ~$135 million over the last 18 months, it appears that Trump's committees have around $32 million left.

$22,516,391 Trump 2024
$5,658,668 Trump JFC
$3,650,887 Save America
$567,130 MAGA PAC pic.twitter.com/cyYrQTNzsf

— Rob Pyers (@rpyers) August 1, 2023

ttu_85 said:

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texagbeliever said:

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The Banned said:

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texagbeliever said:

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The Banned said:

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texagbeliever said:

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They have this determinism conundrum. They think Trump will lose 2024 because he lost in 2018 and 2020. So if DeSantis loses to Trump in 2024 they will then be forced to look for someone else because DeSantis losing in 2024 means he can't win in 2028. It is a very poor way to look at the future but it is common throughout history. I call it the logic inertia fallacy.

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This is oversimplifying the matter. People are taking data points, as well as current tends and making a prediction. He lost in 2020 because he continuously shot himself in the foot. He has continued to shoot himself in the foot. He is turning off many key demographics and is only doubling down. Now he is insulting to republican governors that have massively improved their states.

We aren't saying "anyone who loses a race can't win again". We're saying he can't win again because he hasn't changed a single thing that hamstrung him last time. If trump came out a different man ready to set aside the antics that lost the White House, I don't think desantis would even be running

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If Trump keeps shooting himself in the foot why is he still winning by so much?! If you actually believed what you posted you would be confident DeSantis was going to win. Your posting lacks that confidence.

Also I love how people can take current trends and say Trump will lose. But people definitely can't take current trends and say DeSantis will lose to Trump. Because science!

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Because of emotion. I feel like I've spelled this out in depth already. It doesn't matter what he does, a certain amount of people are going to ride or die with him. People are now backing him up on fast tracking the vaccine or claiming he was never pro-lockdown and plenty of other nonsense because he hasn't disavowed them. His followers just change their positions. Or they ignore his stupidity, like when he called desantis out on Disney (wrong) and the heartbeat bill (wrong). They just ignore it. Not because they're stupid. They are just emotionally attached and that loyalty is hard to break.

And as far as I can see, only two posters are saying desantis has a good chance. I don't think he will win the primary. Im hopeful for a win, but completely expect him to lose because of the afore mentioned emotional attachment to trump

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The latter part of the first paragraph is the Teflon persona of an imperfect candidate. It is key in the propaganda MSM environment we live in.

If DeSantis posters all but agree Trump is going to win, then wouldn't their effort be better spent getting those emotionally manipulated to be more conservative rather than trying to alienate them? Yet this is not the preferred method of the bigger personalities nor posters here.

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Most I know dont buy this at all.

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I was referring the primary and taking "the banned" own assumption. I don't think it is true either actually.

aggie93 said:

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texagbeliever said:

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Look people will have a top 5 issues. There is a 0.0% chance a real independent has donation fund allocation as one of those issues. That is why I was saying that issue isn't an issue that matters.

Crime, economy jobs, economy inflation, transgender surgery on minors, DEI, abortion climate change, Ukraine war are going to be the issues swing voters vote on.

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Ah, but Trump has made his biggest issue how he has been wrongly prosecuted. While I agree that also means ANYTHING that makes him look shady or criminal is on the table for right or wrong. It also just reinforces why he won't be able to do anything about any of those other issues you mention because he will be mired in other legal woes or explaining he isn't a crook.

Not saying any of this is right but it just is what it is. Trump is careless and it leaves him constantly exposed, that's why he couldn't get much done before and it will be the death knell for any future Presidency (or more accurately the ability to get there).

Oh and if they replace out Biden with pretty much anyone all you are going to hear about is how old Trump is and looking at videos showing his age or missteps. Of course Biden has been 100x worse but that stuff only goes around the GOP world. It will also make the "OMG, I can't handle ANOTHER 80 year old" argument have legs. God forbid Trump has even the slightest health scare which for a man his age is statistically likely to happen. He's almost certainly on meds or has issues of some kind. Without Biden there all that just falls like a ton of bricks on Trump.

Remember Trump has virtually no margin for error, any one of those issues is fatal.

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Yes Trump is making it his biggest issue DURING the primary. A primary where he and DeSantis can only quibble over social security and maybe ethanol as major differentiators on policy. It is red meat for the base. Something that will motivate them to get involved. Then when it switches to a national issue it will hopefully switch to issues he can win on that differentiate him from Biden.

The important thing is to not beat Biden before Biden is committed as running. If Trump or even DeSantis KOs Biden now then the Dems can pivot. If Biden stays relevant via this 2020 voter election fraud and a need to prove he won by winning 2024 then it keeps the democrats leaning on Biden as their guy.

You can say this is pie in the sky thinking but wouldn't this make a ton of sense? Trump is actually goading Biden to have to run which makes the democrats run on the past 4 years. Which I believe is a losing platform to run on especially if Biden is in charge of defending it.

This is going to end well.

"no@email.com" might be the least informative email address on file for a political organization I've come across https://t.co/tYewLQaAnP

— Anna Massoglia (@annalecta) July 31, 2023

In this case, I'm going to guess that was supposed to be a placeholder and someone didn't change it before submitting the document.

"Top men" like always of course.

texagbeliever said:

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aggie93 said:

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texagbeliever said:

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Look people will have a top 5 issues. There is a 0.0% chance a real independent has donation fund allocation as one of those issues. That is why I was saying that issue isn't an issue that matters.

Crime, economy jobs, economy inflation, transgender surgery on minors, DEI, abortion climate change, Ukraine war are going to be the issues swing voters vote on.

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Ah, but Trump has made his biggest issue how he has been wrongly prosecuted. While I agree that also means ANYTHING that makes him look shady or criminal is on the table for right or wrong. It also just reinforces why he won't be able to do anything about any of those other issues you mention because he will be mired in other legal woes or explaining he isn't a crook.

Not saying any of this is right but it just is what it is. Trump is careless and it leaves him constantly exposed, that's why he couldn't get much done before and it will be the death knell for any future Presidency (or more accurately the ability to get there).

Oh and if they replace out Biden with pretty much anyone all you are going to hear about is how old Trump is and looking at videos showing his age or missteps. Of course Biden has been 100x worse but that stuff only goes around the GOP world. It will also make the "OMG, I can't handle ANOTHER 80 year old" argument have legs. God forbid Trump has even the slightest health scare which for a man his age is statistically likely to happen. He's almost certainly on meds or has issues of some kind. Without Biden there all that just falls like a ton of bricks on Trump.

Remember Trump has virtually no margin for error, any one of those issues is fatal.

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Yes Trump is making it his biggest issue DURING the primary. A primary where he and DeSantis can only quibble over social security and maybe ethanol as major differentiators on policy. It is red meat for the base. Something that will motivate them to get involved. Then when it switches to a national issue it will hopefully switch to issues he can win on that differentiate him from Biden.

The important thing is to not beat Biden before Biden is committed as running. If Trump or even DeSantis KOs Biden now then the Dems can pivot. If Biden stays relevant via this 2020 voter election fraud and a need to prove he won by winning 2024 then it keeps the democrats leaning on Biden as their guy.

You can say this is pie in the sky thinking but wouldn't this make a ton of sense? Trump is actually goading Biden to have to run which makes the democrats run on the past 4 years. Which I believe is a losing platform to run on especially if Biden is in charge of defending it.

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Actually the important thing is to lay out a vision for the future and stop talking about the past.

Looking at those finance numbers though Trump might not make it to the end of the year unless he gets a major cash infusion. That burn rate is insane for this point in the campaign and his expenses are only going up. I don't think people realize just how concerning that is. BTW, before you say, "Trump's a Billionare though!" That's true but it's very unlikely he is sitting around with massive amounts of liquid assets. He is losing his ass on Truth Social and unles he wants to sell some of his assets they don't throw off huge amounts of money. Big money donors have left him and his credit sucks. It is making a LOT of sense why he is pushing so hard to get DeSantis to drop out, he isn't going to be able to keep up unless it is free media.

I'm just blown away, I didn't think it was THAT bad. He's basically got no reserves left and has been burning everything he had raised hoping to KO DeSantis.

Yeah I'm going to disagree there. The most important thing after Pearl Harbor wasn't laying out the reconstruction plan for Germany and Japan it was to counter punch and worry about the future when conditions allowed for it. You just want Trump to be a future grand plan guy because DeSantis will look better. So you shouldn't expect Trump to do that even if just for selfish reasons.

I personally will be shocked if Trump drops out because he runs out of money.

Dean Phillips is pissing a bunch of people in the DNC off right now. Go google him and you'll see why

TRM said:

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We versus the I/me someone else uses.

The question is: what kind of country do we want to have?

I want a country where Americans that work hard are able to get ahead, raise a family, and lead fulfilling, productive lives.

If we can’t get that right, we will not succeed as a country. pic.twitter.com/Ao2mjo9GT4

— Ron DeSantis (@RonDeSantis) July 31, 2023

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Contrast that with the Democrats' "Managed Decline" vision presently in operation.

He cuts to the chase extremely well. A vision of prosperity and real progress versus a dystopian Democrat world of unchecked crime, increased poverty and increased authoritarian behavior from the central government.

The Shining City on A Hill versus the Plantation State. Freedom versus Slavery. Individualism versus Conformity.

The message must come out with clarity and force or it will not come across at all.

texagbeliever said:

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Yeah I'm going to disagree there. The most important thing after Pearl Harbor wasn't laying out the reconstruction plan for Germany and Japan it was to counter punch and worry about the future when conditions allowed for it. You just want Trump to be a future grand plan guy because DeSantis will look better. So you shouldn't expect Trump to do that even if just for selfish reasons.

I personally will be shocked if Trump drops out because he runs out of money.

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Except in your analogy if Trump was in charge after Pearl Harbor we would have held a few radio shows, sent some angry telegrams, and then bombed England for some reason.

I do have to admit that the ultimate grifter finally getting taken down because he ran out of money would be pretty incredible.

texagbeliever said:

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Yeah I'm going to disagree there. The most important thing after Pearl Harbor wasn't laying out the reconstruction plan for Germany and Japan it was to counter punch and worry about the future when conditions allowed for it. You just want Trump to be a future grand plan guy because DeSantis will look better. So you shouldn't expect Trump to do that even if just for selfish reasons.

I personally will be shocked if Trump drops out because he runs out of money.

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First off both Trump and DeSantis have plans for reforming the government and DeSantis is far more comprehensive and realistic.

That said if you don't win it doesn't matter and while you and I may recognize the importance of a government overhaul that's not a top priority for Swing voters. They care about their own future and don't think much of either party. If you don't win those votes you can have all the plans or rhetoric you want but it's all just gone anyway. You have to win. Doesn't mean you don't still hold those views but you have to have the full package and a broader message. I think you are also very unrealistic thinking Trump will suddenly pivot off of Jan 6/2020/etc as well, if nothing else all it takes is a question from the media and he will go on a rage and eat up news cycles because he has zero message discipline.

The money thing isn't necessarily about Trump just dropping out but it does mean he is going to start to fade and make hard choices. If the veneer of being this super rich and invincible titan is shattered he's cooked. Trump is a Brand guy who knows how to sell an image, if that image is seen as fake he's screwed. I'm not even saying that will happen either but it's a big red flag.

Ron DeSantis SuperPAC Never Back Down posts its mid-year filing--$130.6M raised, $26.5M spent on operating expenditures ($10M on media, $4M on field, $1.5M on polling, $1M on payroll), $7.3M on IEs.

It entered July with $96.8 million on hand. pic.twitter.com/mZ6KyunYUV

— Rob Pyers (@rpyers) August 1, 2023

aggie93 said:

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texagbeliever said:

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Yeah I'm going to disagree there. The most important thing after Pearl Harbor wasn't laying out the reconstruction plan for Germany and Japan it was to counter punch and worry about the future when conditions allowed for it. You just want Trump to be a future grand plan guy because DeSantis will look better. So you shouldn't expect Trump to do that even if just for selfish reasons.

I personally will be shocked if Trump drops out because he runs out of money.

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First off both Trump and DeSantis have plans for reforming the government and DeSantis is far more comprehensive and realistic.

That said if you don't win it doesn't matter and while you and I may recognize the importance of a government overhaul that's not a top priority for Swing voters. They care about their own future and don't think much of either party. If you don't win those votes you can have all the plans or rhetoric you want but it's all just gone anyway. You have to win. Doesn't mean you don't still hold those views but you have to have the full package and a broader message. I think you are also very unrealistic thinking Trump will suddenly pivot off of Jan 6/2020/etc as well, if nothing else all it takes is a question from the media and he will go on a rage and eat up news cycles because he has zero message discipline.

The money thing isn't necessarily about Trump just dropping out but it does mean he is going to start to fade and make hard choices. If the veneer of being this super rich and invincible titan is shattered he's cooked. Trump is a Brand guy who knows how to sell an image, if that image is seen as fake he's screwed. I'm not even saying that will happen either but it's a big red flag.

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I struggle following your point to the original issue.
You said the donation was a big deal. I said it wasn't. You said no here is why. I made a point why it wasn't because these are the top issues. You countered with those aren't the issues Trump is currently running on.

Basically you have dodged addressing the point I wanted to get across, the donation thing is a non issue.

Trump runs out of money and has to pass on the torch that's great. It means he won't run third party. DeSantis will be all setup. Not relevant to the original point though. This does seem more like how wishing then likely though.

texagbeliever said:

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aggie93 said:

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texagbeliever said:

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Yeah I'm going to disagree there. The most important thing after Pearl Harbor wasn't laying out the reconstruction plan for Germany and Japan it was to counter punch and worry about the future when conditions allowed for it. You just want Trump to be a future grand plan guy because DeSantis will look better. So you shouldn't expect Trump to do that even if just for selfish reasons.

I personally will be shocked if Trump drops out because he runs out of money.

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First off both Trump and DeSantis have plans for reforming the government and DeSantis is far more comprehensive and realistic.

That said if you don't win it doesn't matter and while you and I may recognize the importance of a government overhaul that's not a top priority for Swing voters. They care about their own future and don't think much of either party. If you don't win those votes you can have all the plans or rhetoric you want but it's all just gone anyway. You have to win. Doesn't mean you don't still hold those views but you have to have the full package and a broader message. I think you are also very unrealistic thinking Trump will suddenly pivot off of Jan 6/2020/etc as well, if nothing else all it takes is a question from the media and he will go on a rage and eat up news cycles because he has zero message discipline.

The money thing isn't necessarily about Trump just dropping out but it does mean he is going to start to fade and make hard choices. If the veneer of being this super rich and invincible titan is shattered he's cooked. Trump is a Brand guy who knows how to sell an image, if that image is seen as fake he's screwed. I'm not even saying that will happen either but it's a big red flag.

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I struggle following your point to the original issue.
You said the donation was a big deal. I said it wasn't. You said no here is why. I made a point why it wasn't because these are the top issues. You countered with those aren't the issues Trump is currently running on.

Basically you have dodged addressing the point I wanted to get across, the donation thing is a non issue.

Trump runs out of money and has to pass on the torch that's great. It means he won't run third party. DeSantis will be all setup. Not relevant to the original point though. This does seem more like how wishing then likely though.

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Well you shifted as well so let me restate to be clear.

The appearance of corruption or abuse of spending is always bad. It's especially bad if you are trying to rebuild trust and are running on being more honest than the other guy. I agree that the things Swing voters mainly care about are the economy, jobs, etc and actually made that point. Trump isn't running on that though, he's running on Biden being corrupt and him being mistreated. He mentions those issues in passing but they aren't the main thrust of his campaign at all. You are arguing he will pivot and I agree he will try but I don't think it will be that easy, the press certainly isn't going to cooperate and let him lay out his positive vision.

So that means he needs to get his message out. That takes money either to do a lot of big rallies (which are expensive) or running ads (which are even more expensive). I think his base may hear it but the Swing voters won't, they will just hear the other mess because that is all he focused on up to that point and he won't be able to let it go now.

In short Trump is checkmated or painted in a corner or however you want to phrase it. He's got limited options. At the same time he has some good polls and a nice lead on DeSantis at the moment. Maybe he can find some way to keep it all going. I just don't see it. Of course DeSantis could screw up or something unforseen can and will happen as it always does. It's just right now I can't see a path to victory and success for Trump that's realistic. I can see him winning the GOP nomination but that's not going to be the cakewalk he is acting like it will be.

We will see, I will admit I have been wrong before but that's the bigger picture in my opinion based on being an amateur political junkie since I was a kid in the '80s staying up watching Reagan get elected and following how campaigns and primaries operate. I understand you disagree and that's fine, you may be right as well. Fair enough?

DeSantis’ PAC has 3Xs more money on hand than all of Trump’s 4 PACs combined. Even if Trump didn’t channel $40M to legal fees, Trump’s PACs would still be behind DeSantis. pic.twitter.com/5JFASMci0t

— Marina Medvin 🇺🇸 (@MarinaMedvin) August 1, 2023

Trump's fear of "flippers"

Zachary Basu

Former President Trump's new legal defense fund for aides and employees may double as both an act of benevolence and a potential insurance policy against a practice he has long loathed: flipping.

Why it matters: New federal charges against Trump who once said cooperating with prosecutors in exchange for leniency "ought to be illegal" rely in large part on the testimony of a Mar-a-Lago employee who allegedly was asked to delete surveillance footage subpoenaed by investigators.

Driving the news: The superseding indictment unveiled Thursday in Trump's classified documents case ensnared a new defendant Mar-a-Lago property manager Carlos De Oliveira in addition to longtime Trump valet Walt Nauta.

The indictment alleges that in June 2022, De Oliveira pulled aside another Mar-a-Lago employee identified in media reports as IT staffer Yuscil Taveras and asked for their conversation to remain private.
In a scene the indictment describes in remarkable detail, De Oliveira allegedly told Taveras that "the boss" wanted the server housing surveillance footage to be deleted a request Taveras allegedly said he could not help with.

The intrigue: Taveras received a target letter after Trump and Nauta were indicted last month prompting him to meet with investigators and provide new information about De Oliveira and the alleged cover-up, CNN reports.

Between the lines: Taveras may have cooperated, but there's no indication that Trump's co-defendants whose legal expenses have so far been covered by Trump's Save America PAC intend to flip.

Two weeks after the FBI searched Mar-a-Lago last August, the indictment alleges Nauta called another unidentified Trump employee and said words to the effect o, "someone just wants to make sure Carlos is good."
The Trump employee allegedly told Nauta that De Oliveira was loyal and would not do anything to affect his relationship with the former president.

That same day, Trump allegedly called De Oliveira and said he would get him an attorney.

The ground game and trying to win elections that some "concerned" Trump supporters talk about. Yeah, that's not happening if Donald Trump is the candidate.

But keep telling lies that the election was stolen when Trump LOST TO TO A CADAVER campaigning in his basement for an entire year.

Nearly all the grifting money that Trump has conned his supporters out of have gone to pay his legal bills and the attorneys for his witnesses and co-defendants.

After Paying Lawyers, Trump’s PAC Is Nearly Broke ... w @maggieNYT & @ShaneGoldmacher https://t.co/3Ye5mhk5Cy

— Jonathan Swan (@jonathanvswan) August 1, 2023

The Banned said:

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texagbeliever said:

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One thing you may be missing is that many DeSantis supporters want to say "I told you so" more than work towards a good outcome. It goes with their likely intellectual successes and prowess.

What tipped me off to this fact was how they are so quick to tell you the thousand ways Trump won't win in 2024. That way if Trump doesn't win they can say look I tried to tell everybody. What will be telling is which ones ultimately switch to trying to get a republican in office in 2024 versus doomsday post hope is lost if their boy loses in the primary.

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The stakes are far too high for anyone to be looking for an "I told you so". We are highly convinced based on empirical evidence that trump doesn't have a shot it hell. Us saying "I told you so" means our country is effed even more than it already is. We want trump supporters to wake up to that fact far more than we want to gloat about trump losing

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100%.

If Trump is the nominee, we all know it will be a bloodbath with him losing AGAIN Georgia and Arizona - going 0-6 in elections there with his hand picked candidates.

and for the poster who claims we are just waiting to say "I told you so"

that is the height of ridiculousness. Because the hard core Trump fans will just respond after another devastating loss with:

"well it was stolen again!!! and even if it wasn't stolen then Trump only lost because the "establishment" didn't vote for him so it's not our fault!!

so why would any DeSantis supporter be just waiting with baited breath to proclaim we were correct all along- when the only people who should hear that are the same ones that are impervious to logic anyway.

This is the ultimate in logic: "the only one who can beat Biden is.... the guy who already lost to Biden!!"

Wow. Quite the contrast.

While Trump’s PAC spent $40.2M on legal fees, the DeSantis PAC used 85% of their total $33.8M of spending for direct voter contact.

One team is building an actual campaign, the other is creating a fundraising scheme. pic.twitter.com/cCpCfESDoQ

— AG (@AGHamilton29) July 31, 2023

He's doing that to protect you.

all that campaign money and Destantis still getting crushed in the polls...

Trump tops DeSantis by 37 points in new NYT/Siena poll | The Hill

I don't mind trump spending donations on his legal team. Any republican candidate is going to get sued into oblivion. My problem is that since the election he hasn't put any work into overcoming voter integrity or ballot harvesting issues. instead, he sent out a clown of a legal team that made a mockery of the issues. And made him impossible to defend.

LarryElder said:

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all that campaign money and Destantis still getting crushed in the polls...

Trump tops DeSantis by 37 points in new NYT/Siena poll | The Hill

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Who is DeStantis?