agz win said:

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aggie93 said:

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FireAg said:

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If I were Trump, my argument would be that I'm not above actual laws, but I am above political persecution using fabricated "evidence"…

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Oh I understand the Trump argument and I think the legal prosecutions are ridiculous. I'm not the voter you need to worry about though. The voter Trump needs is the one who didn't vote for him last time, isn't really happy with where the country is right now but also really don't like how he behaved on Jan 6.

The same perceptions that are favoring Trump in the race against DeSantis will hurt him in the General with a different group of voters. Trump is great at firing up people that are sympathetic to him and glossing over the flaws. He has to get people that see his flaws and try to get them to be sympathetic. That's much, much harder.

DeSantis can just run either by pointing to Biden or on his record. He's not dynamic but he is also not someone that offends people unless they are a far left loon. That's usually how you win Swing voters, they vote AGAINST the person they like least. DeSantis is good at not making people hate him.

---

Have you come across any information that he has actually gained new national voters willing to vote for him. What groups? It seems he's not gained any in significant numbers and has only lost some who previously voted for him, particularly GOP middle America.

---

The key is that the votes that matter, those in the middle, aren't engaged at all. Yet the focus is on polls a year away from the General. Thus you need to decide which you think is a better idea. 1)Assume all norms are out the window and suddenly Trump is polling big with women and minorities on polls a year out or 2)Assume that in the end things will go back to the norms and the Suburban vote and Catholic vote that have determined every election for decades will be the decider.

There are a lot of Trump voters right now saying they won't vote DeSantis in polling today for instance but that is very unlikely to be a significant group of people a year from now.

Never underestimate how much the media and the internet tries to distract you or shape your opinion, it amazes me how folks see how they treated Trump terribly and now they are doing things to boost him with GOP voters and don't think that's intentional. Trump is making HUGE mistakes with verbal gaffes and Senior moments and they are being buried. No one is asking him why he is running a basement campaign. No one is asking him how he is going to resolve his legal issues and still effectively govern. No one is asking him how he can win without any money in his campaign because it is all going to legal fees. Instead they pump up polls, say the race is over, and push the red meat he throws out on how bad he is being treated by the DOJ or how terrible Biden is.

Correction said:

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TRM said:

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DeSantis energy policy
https://rumble.com/v3j4mt4-ron-desantis-announces-energy-policy-rollout-in-midland-texas.html

---

His policy boils down to "unleash domestic energy production" to bring back $2/gallon gasoline.

Bit of problem with that is it would require an extended period of sub-$50 crude. Good luck convincing E&P companies to raise production levels enough to push the global market back into oversupply and start losing money again. I'm sure PXD, OXY, FANG (and their shareholders) are all champing at the bit to spend billions drilling excess wells that won't turn a profit.

Interesting decision to announce the "let's slash the price of WTI in half" plan in Midland, of all places.

---

Reduce regulation and greenlight development and some magic can happen. DeSantis is going to fire everyone in the EPA that isn't on board and he has shown he DGAF in Florida. He likely already has those people lined up and ready to roll Day 1. Most organized politician in my lifetime.

LMCane said:

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Ag with kids said:

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FireAg said:

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Perhaps…but in head-to-heads against Biden currently, using the same polling entities, Trump consistently out performs DeSantis…

Again…at least for now…

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You asked a question and I answered.

That's it...

Trump is VERY polarizing. There's very little middle ground with him.

People either Like/Love him or they Dislike/HATE him. There's no squishy middle on him.

And the Like/Dislike is pretty far from the center...It's more like Strongly Like/Dislike.

---

let's not pretend and forget like the Trumpers do..

that the leftists HAVE NOT EVEN STARTED TO CAMPAIGN AGAINST TRUMP in 3 years.

but you can bet the One Billion Dollars they are stockpiling is going to be used to broadcast every single utterance and action Trump has taken since January 2021.

you think Trump is hated now by 53% of the population?!

wait until a billion dollars is spent by the democrats highlighting his greatest hits.

---

Don't forget the MULTI billions of dollars the media will spend on campaigning against him...

aggie93 said:

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agz win said:

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aggie93 said:

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FireAg said:

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If I were Trump, my argument would be that I'm not above actual laws, but I am above political persecution using fabricated "evidence"…

---

Oh I understand the Trump argument and I think the legal prosecutions are ridiculous. I'm not the voter you need to worry about though. The voter Trump needs is the one who didn't vote for him last time, isn't really happy with where the country is right now but also really don't like how he behaved on Jan 6.

The same perceptions that are favoring Trump in the race against DeSantis will hurt him in the General with a different group of voters. Trump is great at firing up people that are sympathetic to him and glossing over the flaws. He has to get people that see his flaws and try to get them to be sympathetic. That's much, much harder.

DeSantis can just run either by pointing to Biden or on his record. He's not dynamic but he is also not someone that offends people unless they are a far left loon. That's usually how you win Swing voters, they vote AGAINST the person they like least. DeSantis is good at not making people hate him.

---

Have you come across any information that he has actually gained new national voters willing to vote for him. What groups? It seems he's not gained any in significant numbers and has only lost some who previously voted for him, particularly GOP middle America.

---

The key is that the votes that matter, those in the middle, aren't engaged at all. Yet the focus is on polls a year away from the General. Thus you need to decide which you think is a better idea. 1)Assume all norms are out the window and suddenly Trump is polling big with women and minorities on polls a year out or 2)Assume that in the end things will go back to the norms and the Suburban vote and Catholic vote that have determined every election for decades will be the decider.

There are a lot of Trump voters right now saying they won't vote DeSantis in polling today for instance but that is very unlikely to be a significant group of people a year from now.

Never underestimate how much the media and the internet tries to distract you or shape your opinion, it amazes me how folks see how they treated Trump terribly and now they are doing things to boost him with GOP voters and don't think that's intentional. Trump is making HUGE mistakes with verbal gaffes and Senior moments and they are being buried. No one is asking him why he is running a basement campaign. No one is asking him how he is going to resolve his legal issues and still effectively govern. No one is asking him how he can win without any money in his campaign because it is all going to legal fees. Instead they pump up polls, say the race is over, and push the red meat he throws out on how bad he is being treated by the DOJ or how terrible Biden is.

---

100%. And certain posters are apparently much more gullible and fall for these tactics.

J. Walter Weatherman said:

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FireAg said:

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Perhaps…but in head-to-heads against Biden currently, using the same polling entities, Trump consistently out performs DeSantis…

Again…at least for now…

---

If only we had a real world example of how Trump performs against Biden.

---

how dare you use actual history against the Orange God King!

clearly everyone knows the election was "stolen" and so actually losing to Biden by 6 million votes is irrelevant!!

J. Walter Weatherman said:

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aggie93 said:

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agz win said:

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aggie93 said:

---

FireAg said:

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If I were Trump, my argument would be that I'm not above actual laws, but I am above political persecution using fabricated "evidence"…

---

Oh I understand the Trump argument and I think the legal prosecutions are ridiculous. I'm not the voter you need to worry about though. The voter Trump needs is the one who didn't vote for him last time, isn't really happy with where the country is right now but also really don't like how he behaved on Jan 6.

The same perceptions that are favoring Trump in the race against DeSantis will hurt him in the General with a different group of voters. Trump is great at firing up people that are sympathetic to him and glossing over the flaws. He has to get people that see his flaws and try to get them to be sympathetic. That's much, much harder.

DeSantis can just run either by pointing to Biden or on his record. He's not dynamic but he is also not someone that offends people unless they are a far left loon. That's usually how you win Swing voters, they vote AGAINST the person they like least. DeSantis is good at not making people hate him.

---

Have you come across any information that he has actually gained new national voters willing to vote for him. What groups? It seems he's not gained any in significant numbers and has only lost some who previously voted for him, particularly GOP middle America.

---

The key is that the votes that matter, those in the middle, aren't engaged at all. Yet the focus is on polls a year away from the General. Thus you need to decide which you think is a better idea. 1)Assume all norms are out the window and suddenly Trump is polling big with women and minorities on polls a year out or 2)Assume that in the end things will go back to the norms and the Suburban vote and Catholic vote that have determined every election for decades will be the decider.

There are a lot of Trump voters right now saying they won't vote DeSantis in polling today for instance but that is very unlikely to be a significant group of people a year from now.

Never underestimate how much the media and the internet tries to distract you or shape your opinion, it amazes me how folks see how they treated Trump terribly and now they are doing things to boost him with GOP voters and don't think that's intentional. Trump is making HUGE mistakes with verbal gaffes and Senior moments and they are being buried. No one is asking him why he is running a basement campaign. No one is asking him how he is going to resolve his legal issues and still effectively govern. No one is asking him how he can win without any money in his campaign because it is all going to legal fees. Instead they pump up polls, say the race is over, and push the red meat he throws out on how bad he is being treated by the DOJ or how terrible Biden is.

---

100%. And certain posters are apparently much more gullible and fall for these tactics.

---

the general public is sheeple

and the MAGA true believers are generally just low information voters who have more pressing personal things on their minds than following politics

it's just a fact that Trump's base is the least educated sector of the American voting public.

Former MAGA attorney Lin Wood is a witness for the state in Georgia's election interference RICO case against the former president and 18 others.

Wood, who retired from practicing law earlier this year to avoid disbarment, worked as a member of Trump's legal team in the aftermath of the 2020 election and heavily promoted claims that the election had been rigged against the former president.

According to a Wednesday filing to the Fulton County Superior Court, which seeks a resolution to potential conflicts of interest between attorneys for Trump and several of his co-defendants, Wood is a witness for the prosecution.

America's border is a warzone. And the only candidate fighting to secure our border now is the only candidate who served in a warzone: @RonDeSantis. pic.twitter.com/YfYpCwhCqy

— Never Back Down (@NvrBackDown24) September 19, 2023

It's a small town, but they probably could have planned for a better venue for the expected crowd size.

Wow - A lot of unfilled space as Trump speaks at the Jackson County Fairgrounds in Maquoketa, Iowa. pic.twitter.com/M3hkWLLVzc

— Matt Whitlock (@mattdizwhitlock) September 20, 2023

ETA:
Doesn't soound good.

NEW:

Trump slams @megynkelly as “nasty” for asking him tough questions during their interview pic.twitter.com/ty3PqQ8jZC

— John Hasson (@SonofHas) September 20, 2023

🚨Nearly 70 grassroots leaders & activists in Nevada endorse @RonDeSantis for Presidenthttps://t.co/42hhmbpvon

— Jess Szymanski (@jesszymanskii) September 20, 2023

Quote:

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In a press release, 70 grassroots leaders and community activists are identified and have endorsed Governor Ron DeSantis to the be the next president of the United States in order to "reverse America's decline and restore American greatness."

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TRM said:

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It's a small town, but they probably could have planned for a better venue for the expected crowd size.

Wow - A lot of unfilled space as Trump speaks at the Jackson County Fairgrounds in Maquoketa, Iowa. pic.twitter.com/M3hkWLLVzc

— Matt Whitlock (@mattdizwhitlock) September 20, 2023

ETA:
Doesn't soound good.

NEW:

Trump slams @megynkelly as “nasty” for asking him tough questions during their interview pic.twitter.com/ty3PqQ8jZC

— John Hasson (@SonofHas) September 20, 2023

---

This is really his first rally since he cancelled that one due to weather, it's been drop ins since then. YUGE.

DeSantis: Big Pharma has “not demonstrated the benefit of the boosters.”

Reporter: “Well, the CDC disagrees.”

DeSantis: “How good has CDC done over the last few years?”

🔥🔥 pic.twitter.com/Wz82Xn1rV1

— DeSantis War Room 🐊 (@DeSantisWarRoom) September 21, 2023

Feels like Groundhog Day

Trump is asked what precautions are being put in place to make sure the next election isn’t rigged and fraudulent. You can either watch the video or I can tell you: he doesn’t ever answer and then goes into airing grievances. He has no plan. pic.twitter.com/GXaN6Ld34O

— Burt Macklin (@BurtMaclin_FBI) September 20, 2023

Because there is nothing he can do to stop it…

TRM said:

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DeSantis: Big Pharma has “not demonstrated the benefit of the boosters.”

Reporter: “Well, the CDC disagrees.”

DeSantis: “How good has CDC done over the last few years?”

🔥🔥 pic.twitter.com/Wz82Xn1rV1

— DeSantis War Room 🐊 (@DeSantisWarRoom) September 21, 2023

---

That was outstanding, outstanding.

Why Is Donald Trump Afraid to Debate?
He's ducking exchanges with his competitors who could challenge his record and platform.
By The Wall Street Journal Editorial Board

After skipping the first GOP debate, he is also planning to blow off the second one, scheduled for next week at the Reagan Presidential Library in California.

Instead Mr. Trump will give a speech to union workers in Detroit.

Why is Mr. Trump afraid to confront other Republicans without the aid of a teleprompter?

Is he worried he'd look his age at 77 next to younger candidates?

To state the obvious, Mr. Trump is running to be President and leader of the free world. Voters deserve to hear him defend his record and his platform.

Covid-19. Whose pandemic policies worked? Mr. Trump has exchanged barbs with Mr. DeSantis, and a recent Trump advertisement intones that "Lockdown Ron" failed Florida. But Florida was one of the earliest states to reopen, and it became a mecca for many Americans fleeing the locked-down blue states.

Coward Trump too afraid to defend his real record

I mean this is funny but WTF is Trump thinking in doing this crap?

Cuck MAGA husband lets his wife present herself to the Chad-in-Chief. pic.twitter.com/aZFyRueQme

— Ian Miles Cheong (@stillgray) September 21, 2023

aggie93 said:

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I mean this is funny but WTF is Trump thinking in doing this crap?

Cuck MAGA husband lets his wife present herself to the Chad-in-Chief. pic.twitter.com/aZFyRueQme

— Ian Miles Cheong (@stillgray) September 21, 2023

---

This will be in a Democrat ad if Trump is the nominee to remind women voters what Trump thinks of women.

Rapier108 said:

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aggie93 said:

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I mean this is funny but WTF is Trump thinking in doing this crap?

Cuck MAGA husband lets his wife present herself to the Chad-in-Chief. pic.twitter.com/aZFyRueQme

— Ian Miles Cheong (@stillgray) September 21, 2023

---

This will be in a Democrat ad if Trump is the nominee to remind women voters what Trump thinks of women.

---

Democrat ads will definitely show that

and Kanye West and Nick Fuentes at Trump's house as invited dinner guests

and January 6

and the four criminal trials

and Giuliani and his four assault and wage court cases

and every statement he has made about "stolen election"

This Biden border invasion has led to asinine ideas like giving illegal aliens ID cards and allowing blanket work waivers to those coming here illegally.

As President, I will put a stop to the chaos at the southern border once and for all.https://t.co/2ORwAnN56u

— Ron DeSantis (@RonDeSantis) September 21, 2023

April: Trump predicts Disney will stop investing in FL, and might even leave the state bc of DeSantis

Five months later: Disney is increasing its FL investments and has abandoned the culture war pic.twitter.com/tQxWDwxfcU

— John Hasson (@SonofHas) September 21, 2023

As if Trump's huge lead isn't enough, it looks like he's maneuvered the nominating system to make sure he's the republican nominee. Team Trump has been quietly changing how states use their delegate rules. Is this how you want the game to be played?

https://www.yahoo.com/news/trump-team-changes-obscure-gop-100030663.html

Opalka said:

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As if Trump's huge lead isn't enough, it looks like he's maneuvered the nominating system to make sure he's the republican nominee. Team Trump has been quietly changing how states use their delegate rules. Is this how you want the game to be played?

https://www.yahoo.com/news/trump-team-changes-obscure-gop-100030663.html

---

I just read that article and I'm confused. I thought Trump was a man of the people. That he had 200 million supporters ready to vote for him. So much grass roots support that he doesn't even need to campaign.

But if that's the case, why would he need to collude with GOP insiders and officials to change the nomination rules?

And that sure sounds "swampy" to me. Sounds like something that a political elite and insider would do, not something done by a proven warrior-outsider-maverick who's fighting against the machine.

FL_Ag1998 said:

---

Opalka said:

---

As if Trump's huge lead isn't enough, it looks like he's maneuvered the nominating system to make sure he's the republican nominee. Team Trump has been quietly changing how states use their delegate rules. Is this how you want the game to be played?

https://www.yahoo.com/news/trump-team-changes-obscure-gop-100030663.html

---

I just read that article and I'm confused. I thought Trump was a man of the people. That he had 200 million supporters ready to vote for him. So much grass roots support that he doesn't even need to campaign.

But if that's the case, why would he need to collude with GOP insiders and officials to change the nomination rules?

And that sure sounds "swampy" to me. Sounds like something that a political elite and insider would do, not something done by a proven warrior-outsider-maverick who's fighting against the machine.

---

It's just so painful that we have to go down with him. After his resounding defeat in the general maybe even the Trumpers will get it and we'll never have to see him again. I guess we can hope for DeSantis in 2028 if there's still a country to hope for.

Trump solidly leads NC primary (46%). RDS now in fourth place (9%), according to Washington Post - Monmouth University poll on 9/11/23. Extensive information is provided on the questions/elements of the poll. Provided without comment or opinion.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/documents/57d3aca6-b765-4d31-9f3f-56af1162bd38.pdf?itid=lk_inline_manual_2

ts5641 said:

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FL_Ag1998 said:

---

Opalka said:

---

As if Trump's huge lead isn't enough, it looks like he's maneuvered the nominating system to make sure he's the republican nominee. Team Trump has been quietly changing how states use their delegate rules. Is this how you want the game to be played?

https://www.yahoo.com/news/trump-team-changes-obscure-gop-100030663.html

---

I just read that article and I'm confused. I thought Trump was a man of the people. That he had 200 million supporters ready to vote for him. So much grass roots support that he doesn't even need to campaign.

But if that's the case, why would he need to collude with GOP insiders and officials to change the nomination rules?

And that sure sounds "swampy" to me. Sounds like something that a political elite and insider would do, not something done by a proven warrior-outsider-maverick who's fighting against the machine.

---

It's just so painful that we have to go down with him. After his resounding defeat in the general maybe even the Trumpers will get it and we'll never have to see him again. I guess we can hope for DeSantis in 2028 if there's still a country to hope for.

---

When Trump loses, they'll spend 2 years whining about fraud, then prepare for Trump 2028.

sharpdressedman said:

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Trump solidly leads NC primary (46%). RDS now in fourth place (9%), according to Washington Post - Monmouth University poll on 9/11/23. Extensive information is provided on the questions/elements of the poll. Provided without comment or opinion.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/documents/57d3aca6-b765-4d31-9f3f-56af1162bd38.pdf?itid=lk_inline_manual_2

---

That is South Carolina, not North Carolina. Home state to Nikki Haley and Tim Scott.

ts5641 said:

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FL_Ag1998 said:

---

Opalka said:

---

As if Trump's huge lead isn't enough, it looks like he's maneuvered the nominating system to make sure he's the republican nominee. Team Trump has been quietly changing how states use their delegate rules. Is this how you want the game to be played?

https://www.yahoo.com/news/trump-team-changes-obscure-gop-100030663.html

---

I just read that article and I'm confused. I thought Trump was a man of the people. That he had 200 million supporters ready to vote for him. So much grass roots support that he doesn't even need to campaign.

But if that's the case, why would he need to collude with GOP insiders and officials to change the nomination rules?

And that sure sounds "swampy" to me. Sounds like something that a political elite and insider would do, not something done by a proven warrior-outsider-maverick who's fighting against the machine.

---

It's just so painful that we have to go down with him. After his resounding defeat in the general maybe even the Trumpers will get it and we'll never have to see him again. I guess we can hope for DeSantis in 2028 if there's still a country to hope for.

---

agreed

but the Always Trumpers will NEVER acknowledge they supported the wrong candidate. it will ALWAYS be some lame excuse.

"cheating", or "desantis voters didn't support the candidate" or "media" or "deep state" or "RINOS"

it will always be an excuse, they can never admit they demolished the Republican party and led to 8 years of leftist dominance.

all for their orange god king and mean tweets.

Captn_Ag05 said:

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sharpdressedman said:

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Trump solidly leads NC primary (46%). RDS now in fourth place (9%), according to Washington Post - Monmouth University poll on 9/11/23. Extensive information is provided on the questions/elements of the poll. Provided without comment or opinion.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/documents/57d3aca6-b765-4d31-9f3f-56af1162bd38.pdf?itid=lk_inline_manual_2

---

That is South Carolina, not North Carolina. Home state to Nikki Haley and Tim Scott.

---

notice how the Trumpers brag about every poll.. as Trump continues to get weaker and weaker in these same polls.

Today Trump is at 39% in New Hampshire and 46% in SC. in their own biased ridiculous polls

this is a guy that is one of the most famous men in the entire world- who was a sitting President. who is on the news every single day.

and he can't get a majority IN HIS OWN POLITICAL PARTY. much less independents and democrats.

but sure, loser Trump is going to beat a billion dollars coming at him from the left in 2024...

Interesting.

Endorsement could come as soon as November. pic.twitter.com/JPCnD9PB5z

— Joel Weingart (@JoelWeingart_) September 21, 2023

Quote:

---

Today Trump is at 39% in New Hampshire and 46% in SC. in their own biased ridiculous polls

this is a guy that is one of the most famous men in the entire world- who was a sitting President. who is on the news every single day.

and he can't get a majority IN HIS OWN POLITICAL PARTY. much less independents and democrats.

---

But the same thing can be said about DeSantis, can it not? If he's gaining traction, I haven't seen evidence of that. What am I missing here?

aggiehawg said:

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Quote:

---

Today Trump is at 39% in New Hampshire and 46% in SC. in their own biased ridiculous polls

this is a guy that is one of the most famous men in the entire world- who was a sitting President. who is on the news every single day.

and he can't get a majority IN HIS OWN POLITICAL PARTY. much less independents and democrats.

---

But the same thing can be said about DeSantis, can it not? If he's gaining traction, I haven't seen evidence of that. What am I missing here?

---

It's certainly been odd. The strange thing is DeSantis seems to be more and more popular. He's getting bigger and more enthusiastic attendance at events. He did awesome during the hurricane and has done well in his interviews. Did well in the Debate. No real significant mistakes. He's still picking up endorsements as well.

Trump has been making one gaffe after another. 2 Senior moments this weekend. The abortion and gender answers that were both WTF?

None of that is consistent with a campaign losing support as these polls seem to continue to show. I don't completely dismiss them but it doesn't add up. Maybe it's all over and Trump is going to coast to victory but it just doesn't seem that way.

I saw this post and thought it had some good insight:

Fox News is trash, but after the week Trump had, I needed to see what everyone else is seeing, since a very small fraction of the population is on social media.

Here’s what they’re not seeing:
- Coverage of the Megyn Kelly interview
- Trump’s comments on abortion
- DeSantis…

— MIA (@_Mama_Mia10) September 21, 2023

Yep, the media does not report on Trump's gaffes and dumbassery because they all want him as the nominee.

It means tons of ratings and clicks, plus 4 more years (and likely forever) Democrat rule.

So I am not really missing anything about DeSantis's growing base including independents and a voter base in the GOP? That really does not appear to be happening?