It seems like the thing being argued is the same thing that is at the core of the "Natices have a right to their ancestral land" argument.

A country or people is only entitled to the land for as long as they can defend it, utilize it, and govern it.

Countries have been attacking and taking over territories, people, and countries for as long as there have been humans.

The weak cultures, people, and countries die. The strong survive.

Does that make it ethically right to invade? No.
Is the reality of the world we live in such that most countries in an effort to improve the situation for their people either physically invade, or economically or culturally invade others?

Yes.

Hell it's happening to us at the border and culturally with socialism, wokism, and China influencing everything we do.

If our people and ideals are not strong enough to survive the onslaught because we have become a weak and ineffectual people, then it is better for the world and humanity if we fall to the wayside to make room for something better.

Ag with kids said:

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Teslag said:

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I think it's quite clear you have no idea what sovereignty is.

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You're only sovereign until you're not?

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Right. Apparently no nation on earth is actually sovereign.

RebelE Infantry said:

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Teslag said:

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I think it's quite clear you have no idea what sovereignty is.

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Define sovereignty in geopolitical terms.

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"gEoPoLiTiCaL tErMs"

Ags4DaWin said:

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It seems like the thing being argued is the same thing that is at the core of the "Natices have a right to their ancestral land" argument.

A country or people is only entitled to the land for as long as they can defend it, utilize it, and govern it.

(snip)

If our people and ideals are not strong enough to survive the onslaught because we have become a weak and ineffectual people, then it is better for the world and humanity if we fall to the wayside to make room for something better.

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The bolded parts are what makes the 2nd Amendment so important, critical and worth protecting at all costs.

You may think you own the house and the lot it sits on particularly if you paid the bank off. But if you cannot defend that ownership either with effective laws or courts, then you must establish that ownership by defensive force.

In the second bolded part, it reflects how important it is to be strong in this resolve to defend the Constitution and the principles and ideals this Nation was founded upon.

Its what makes what the Dems are doing such a serious threat to all of us.

Teslag said:

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Ag with kids said:

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Teslag said:

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I think it's quite clear you have no idea what sovereignty is.

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You're only sovereign until you're not?

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Right. Apparently no nation on earth is actually sovereign.

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Which he somehow doesn't realize blows up his argument that Ukraine's lack of sovereignty means they should roll over.

Teslag said:

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Ag with kids said:

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Teslag said:

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I think it's quite clear you have no idea what sovereignty is.

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You're only sovereign until you're not?

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Right. Apparently no nation on earth is actually sovereign.

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Straw man.

The reality is that we live in a world with ever changing political boundaries.

Sovereignty changes as the boundaries change.

That is the reality of the world.

Once again, you duck assertions by posting meaningless drivel. Troll troll troll your boat when you have nothing smart to say....

Agreed on all parts.

Arguing that of all the countries on earth Ukraine's borders became sacrosanct (sovereign is a religious term etymologically/historically) after 2014 is just absurd, but it's something some like to troll endlessly about. Not worth the argument, imho, as everyone not a…well most everyone knows it.

Roll over? I don't think Ukraine should roll over. The Great Z has every right to defend his performance stage. I am just against using US dollars, weaponry and people to do it.

nortex97 said:

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Agreed on all parts.

Arguing that of all the countries on earth Ukraine's borders became sacrosanct (sovereign is a religious term etymologically/historically) after 2014 is just absurd, but it's something some like to troll endlessly about. Not worth the argument, imho, as everyone not a…well most everyone knows it.

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What about when Russia said Ukraine existed as a nation in 1991 and recognized them as sovereign?

GAC06 said:

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Teslag said:

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Ag with kids said:

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Teslag said:

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I think it's quite clear you have no idea what sovereignty is.

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You're only sovereign until you're not?

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Right. Apparently no nation on earth is actually sovereign.

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Which he somehow doesn't realize blows up his argument that Ukraine's lack of sovereignty means they should roll over.

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Right. Nations don't exist unless they defend themselves. And if they do they should immediately surrender so they can save the lives of their people. Fighting back is both a duty and shameful. All at the same time.

Teslag said:

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Ag with kids said:

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Teslag said:

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I think it's quite clear you have no idea what sovereignty is.

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You're only sovereign until you're not?

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Right. Apparently no nation on earth is actually sovereign.

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We're all trans-sovereign nations...

Teslag said:

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GAC06 said:

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Teslag said:

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Ag with kids said:

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Teslag said:

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I think it's quite clear you have no idea what sovereignty is.

---

You're only sovereign until you're not?

---

Right. Apparently no nation on earth is actually sovereign.

---

Which he somehow doesn't realize blows up his argument that Ukraine's lack of sovereignty means they should roll over.

---

Right. Nations don't exist unless they defend themselves. And if they do they should immediately surrender so they can save the lives of their people. Fighting back is both a duty and shameful. All at the same time.

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And since Russia has now been invaded they are also apparently not a country either.

And they are getting military help from the Chinese and Iranian tax payers. So now Russia definitely isn't a country either.

In case anyone wonders, yes the federal government has been monitoring/coordinating censorship of the discussion of the war in Ukraine.

Additionally, while they claim (again) they have shut all of this down, high level CISA officially Brian Scully testified in a deposition that they have WIDENED their net to even conversations happening about the US banking system, war in Ukraine, and racial justice.

A truly… pic.twitter.com/UZCcauVZ6Q

— Tracy Beanz (@tracybeanz) May 24, 2023

Once again, hopefully more people continue to question the narrative some so stridently have been led to believe.

Do your own research people. You know more than you think.

Yes, 100 percent. Oh look, it's no longer a 'gasp, you tool of Putin!' Sin to notice 'hey, there are some Ukrainians getting really rich off of this war.'

Quote:

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Well, knock ME over with a feather! It wasn't that long ago that one of Tucker Carlson's biggest failings I mean hammer him unmercifully complaints was that he was a TOOL OF PUTIN for having the temerity to question where billions upon billions upon billions of U.S. taxpayers dollars were going in relation to the spigot of cash headed to Zelensky and Ukraine.

"How DARE you?!" they cried. "Democracy is UNDER ATTACK We must DEFEND IT AT ALL COST!!" And when he pretty rightfully asked were we defending democracy or enriching a dictator and his oligarch friends in the meantime, the sputtered indignation at his treacherous query knew no bounds. Why should there be any sort of accounting for so noble a cause? I mean, look Zelensky lives in fatigue trousers and wooly pully sweaters he's practically a war hero himself! Of course those billions and bazillions are in the best and purest of trustworthy hands.

If they stayed in those hands. But no one could tell anyone if they did. And you sure as Schlitz weren't allowed to ask, you spreader of Russian propaganda!!

---

“Ukrainian officials have been using the war with Russia as a smokescreen by which to enrich themselves by “extorting, plundering and weakening commercial rivals” to create a new political elite, reports POLITICO.” https://t.co/T3MMkdQHw0

— Ned Ryun (@nedryun) May 24, 2023

Quote:

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There are more stories.

Quote:

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…Meanwhile, Maxym Liashko, the co-CEO of Parimatch, is equally perplexed as to why his business has been targeted. Founded in 1994 in Kyiv and now headquartered in Cyprus, the company operates under licenses issued by local regulators in Ukraine, Central Asia, Africa, the Indian subcontinent, the United Kingdom and, until recently, in Russia and Belarus, but it immediately withdrew from those markets when Ukraine was invaded, ending franchise agreements and losing millions of dollars.

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There's also the pretty inevitable conclusion to be reached.

Quote:

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…Makaruk worries an internal commercial war is being waged in Ukraine, affecting everything from agri-business to the country's well-respected IT sector and he's not alone. As one corporate executive told POLITICO: "When the country and people need unity the most, some of the very powerful are using the cloud of war to rape businesses."
Speaking on condition of anonymity due to fear of retaliation, the executive added:

Quote:

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"No previous administration has accumulated so much power basically unlimited power and because of the war, it is untouchable in the eyes of the international community and the media."

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"Speaking out publicly is difficult because I don't want to say anything that might endanger the war effort, but sanctioning successful companies shouldn't be done to clear out competitors or punish somebody you don't like," he said.

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Quote:

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…or his buddies, the adage "In chaos there is profit" is followed by "and power."

And all on our dime.

I hope this means it's okay to ask about it now.

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Yes. More at the link.

Remember...98% of what the CIA is able to
accomplish is by throwing huge amts of
$$ around

Money buys political influence
& media time

It turns violent Nazi extremism into
a "legitimate" political POV

Everyone in Kiev knew the rich Nationalists
had the CIA's backing & $$...

— James Jos. Kroeger (@JamesKroeger5) April 24, 2023

A pro Chinese Communist Part stooge. Great source.

The Communist Party of China is probably
the least corrupt Governing Body in the World

Cuz it's led by a collective of
Morally-Centered Idealists

This is primarily because of Xi Jinping

His crusade to eradicate corruption from the CPC began early on...https://t.co/PzCDjSTfZK

— James Jos. Kroeger (@JamesKroeger5) April 5, 2023

5 edits to post one angry retort about a tweet? LOL. The guy's a progressive loon also with posts about Putin being bad, backs RFK Jr, etc. Sometimes comments are accurate though even from sources one disagrees with politically.

You must have spent some time reading this thread, thx again.

Appreciate your help keeping it bumped as an alternative source/actual discussion, without a veneer of unanimous agreement as to pimping the war cause/righteousness.

You think I'm angry? Not at all. It's just fun to see you parrot any random twitter comment you can find to put forward Kremlin talking points each day. Even if they come from CCP mouthpieces.

Another day goes by without the fake 'counter offensive' doing anything. Weird. Maybe July is part of the special Ukrainian spring season. Global warming or something probably.

In 2016, Rep. John Conyers (D) warned against arming the "Ukrainian neo-Nazi militia, the Azov Battalion," as he believed these "white supremacists and antisemitic" extremists would eventually use their weapons against their own people, similar to the Mujahideen in Afghanistan. pic.twitter.com/9E8gVPIU8j

— KanekoaTheGreat (@KanekoaTheGreat) May 21, 2023

Even some Democrats were willing to be honest about this (Neo-nazi' s etc. in Ukraine) 5 to 10 years ago.



Good podcast with Dave Smith, who was also on Rogan's show a few weeks ago I believe.

Zelensky told graduates at Johns Hopkins University, after displaying a virtual background of “fields of sunflowers, golden domes gleaming in a city skyline, and the blue and yellow Ukrainian flag flying in the sunlight,” that he is “proud Ukraine is not losing a single day in… pic.twitter.com/appirL27nK

— Pedro L. Gonzalez (@emeriticus) May 26, 2023

oh no said:

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Zelensky told graduates at Johns Hopkins University, after displaying a virtual background of “fields of sunflowers, golden domes gleaming in a city skyline, and the blue and yellow Ukrainian flag flying in the sunlight,” that he is “proud Ukraine is not losing a single day in… pic.twitter.com/appirL27nK

— Pedro L. Gonzalez (@emeriticus) May 26, 2023

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What?

The President of Ukraine gave a positive spin and message for a commencement speech and didn't go doom and gloom? Odd...

At this point, it would be better overall for Russia to complete its "exercise" in its former territory and not leave the US and its allies (er the US and its taxpayers) on the hook for reconstruction.

In the middle of Benjamin Hall's book and his on the ground description of Russian destruction along with what the Ukes did to prepare and defend is simply, utterly immense.

The real grift is just ramping up and if the Russians are ultimately repelled, we've got trillions in aid that's going to flow into there.

Hell, I may bid on contracts just to participate in the grift. Plenty of room for more than just one "Big Guy"…

The pro-russian bird chest pounding over Bakhmut after Russia was supposed to take Kiev in 3 days over a year ago is certainly a site to behold. Zelensky should definitely be ashamed.

I guess really it just begs the question why he is delivering a speech to Johns Hopkins grads.

Coulda been worse, certainly…



Someone shoulda told the gal introducing him though that…Ukraine isn't a free country by any standard, and the war has made Europe much less safe. LOL indeed at the kids responses like he is some sort of pop star a la Justin Bieber or something.

What a clown. Meanwhile, the Russians are happily expanding their relationships with our 'friends' the Saudi's.

Hey, we paid for it, or will. Everyone trusts Samantha Power and Blackrock, as much as Saint Zelensky, the CCP, Saudi's and Joe Biden, right?

@kimpeccable Halo! you can read it here: https://t.co/ohw9f1S3bq Share this if you think it's interesting. 🤖

— Thread Reader App (@threadreaderapp) May 23, 2023

Teslag said:

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The pro-russian bird chest pounding over Bakhmut after Russia was supposed to take Kiev in 3 days over a year ago is certainly a site to behold. Zelensky should definitely be ashamed.

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Zelensky is sooo brave that he spends as much time in Ukraine as Biden spends awake at 1600 Pennsylvania.

So brave, so front lines.

But maybe he does some good by advising Fetterman on how to pull off the sweats and hoodie look for faux leaders.

Right. I remember when FDR gallantly wheeled himself across the beaches of Normandy with his steadfast leadership. If only Zelensky were so brave.

Putin just posted his GoPro footage of him assaulting a trench outside of Bakhmut. Best part is that he did it in a suit.

fka ftc said:

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Teslag said:

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The pro-russian bird chest pounding over Bakhmut after Russia was supposed to take Kiev in 3 days over a year ago is certainly a site to behold. Zelensky should definitely be ashamed.

---

Zelensky is sooo brave that he spends as much time in Ukraine as Biden spends awake at 1600 Pennsylvania.

So brave, so front lines.

But maybe he does some good by advising Fetterman on how to pull off the sweats and hoodie look for faux leaders.

---

What a hot take. The man is doing his job, and sometimes that requires travel to meet with foreign leadership of countries that are providing aid during a war in which he has indeed visited frontline troops multiple times. Hell, the action has come to him multiple times through bombings, attempted assassinations, and an attempted seizure of the country's capital. He was offered a ride out, rejected it, and said he needed weapons.

Even better is that many of the same people obsessed with detracting Zelensky would have been happier if he surrendered his country on February 2022 and are seething because he didn't.

I'd say Zelensky's doing a damn fine job representing his country. He certainly has more balls than Putin who tends to stay far, far away and would rather clean out his country's poor, ethnic minorities.

Teslag said:

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Right. I remember when FDR gallantly wheeled himself across the beaches of Normandy with his steadfast leadership. If only Zelensky were so brave.

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You are right, a wheelchair bound cripple in his dying days was braver than middle age, healthy actor guarded by US trained special forces 24/7 hiding out abroad giving speeches and hanging with celebrities. Got it.

GAC06 said:

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Putin just posted his GoPro footage of him assaulting a trench outside of Bakhmut. Best part is that he did it in a suit.

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I am certain Putin has more stones than you could possibly fathom, much less be envious of.

Waffledynamics said:

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fka ftc said:

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Teslag said:

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The pro-russian bird chest pounding over Bakhmut after Russia was supposed to take Kiev in 3 days over a year ago is certainly a site to behold. Zelensky should definitely be ashamed.

---

Zelensky is sooo brave that he spends as much time in Ukraine as Biden spends awake at 1600 Pennsylvania.

So brave, so front lines.

But maybe he does some good by advising Fetterman on how to pull off the sweats and hoodie look for faux leaders.

---

What a hot take. The man is doing his job, and sometimes that requires travel to meet with foreign leadership of countries that are providing aid during a war in which he has indeed visited frontline troops multiple times. Hell, the action has come to him multiple times through bombings, attempted assassinations, and an attempted seizure of the country's capital. He was offered a ride out, rejected it, and said he needed weapons.

Even better is that many of the same people obsessed with detracting Zelensky would have been happier if he surrendered his country on February 2022 and are seething because he didn't.

I'd say Zelensky's doing a damn fine job representing his country. He certainly has more balls than Putin who tends to stay far, far away and would rather clean out his country's poor, ethnic minorities.

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"Clean out his country's poor ethnic minorities"? Who knew Putin was a Dem / Concerned Moderate. Makes some sense. He has racist and dictator like tendencies much the same as Biden.

fka ftc said:

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GAC06 said:

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Putin just posted his GoPro footage of him assaulting a trench outside of Bakhmut. Best part is that he did it in a suit.

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I am certain Putin has more stones than you could possibly fathom, much less be envious of.

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I'll cede discussion of Putin's stones to you entirely. I am not curious about said stones or your certainty about them. Not that there's anything wrong with that.

There are actually several areas where you should cede discussion, including automation of airplanes.