Think trial is set to start this summer, but maybe TBD.

I don't think that's happening. Last hearing defense brought up request for delay due to so much evidence and Judge Judge is thinking about it. I'm also concerned about Santa Claus as the prosecutor. Ann Taylor seems much more with it.

Prosecutors were aiming for a trial this summer. They want to make sure there is enough hotel space for witnesses and media and also don't want the trial to interfere with the high school that is just across the street. They want it done outside of the school year.

Defense said they needed more time. Apparently they have terabytes and terabytes of data to sift through.

Defense also has a motion pending for change of venue.

More than likely the trial will take place summer 2025.

Bryan Kohberger trial delay buys defense time to build alibi, concerns about memory of lone witness

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Bryan Kohberger's trial appears unlikely to happen before mid-2025 at the earliest

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By the time the case goes to trial, years will have passed, with potential implications for her memory of the events.

Meanwhile, suspect Bryan Kohberger's defense has bought more time to build up an alibi and pore over vast amounts of other evidence. Latah County District Judge John Judge is still weighing scheduling and a defense motion to have the trial moved to another county. And the victims' families are still waiting for justice.

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agcrock2005 said:

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Bryan Kohberger trial delay buys defense time to build alibi, concerns about memory of lone witness

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Bryan Kohberger's trial appears unlikely to happen before mid-2025 at the earliest

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By the time the case goes to trial, years will have passed, with potential implications for her memory of the events.

Meanwhile, suspect Bryan Kohberger's defense has bought more time to build up an alibi and pore over vast amounts of other evidence. Latah County District Judge John Judge is still weighing scheduling and a defense motion to have the trial moved to another county. And the victims' families are still waiting for justice.

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that sucks for everyone involved. Unreal.

https://abcnews.go.com/US/kohbergers-alibi-disputes-location-night-idaho-student-killings/story?id=109369315

Kohberger's alibi disputes his location on night of Idaho student killings: Lawyers

Lawyers for Bryan Kohberger -- the man accused of stabbing to death four Idaho college students in November 2022 -- plan to use analysis of cell phone tower data to show he was not at the home where the killings occurred, at the time the killings allegedly happened, according to a new court filing.

TAMUallen said:

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Swan Song said:

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https://abcnews.go.com/US/kohbergers-alibi-disputes-location-night-idaho-student-killings/story?id=109369315

Kohberger's alibi disputes his location on night of Idaho student killings: Lawyers

Lawyers for Bryan Kohberger -- the man accused of stabbing to death four Idaho college students in November 2022 -- plan to use analysis of cell phone tower data to show he was not at the home where the killings occurred, at the time the killings allegedly happened, according to a new court filing.

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Good luck with that. Just because your phone isn't with you doesn't mean you weren't there.

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This. I'd think it would be a no brainer to purposely leave your phone somewhere across town if you are planning on murdering someone.

TXAG 05 said:

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TAMUallen said:

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Swan Song said:

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https://abcnews.go.com/US/kohbergers-alibi-disputes-location-night-idaho-student-killings/story?id=109369315

Kohberger's alibi disputes his location on night of Idaho student killings: Lawyers

Lawyers for Bryan Kohberger -- the man accused of stabbing to death four Idaho college students in November 2022 -- plan to use analysis of cell phone tower data to show he was not at the home where the killings occurred, at the time the killings allegedly happened, according to a new court filing.

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Good luck with that. Just because your phone isn't with you doesn't mean you weren't there.

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This. I'd think it would be a no brainer to purposely leave your phone somewhere across town if you are planning on murdering someone.

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Pretty dumb defense IMO especially if it showed him stationary aka asleep or watching tv at the time.

He said he was out driving around. So if the cellphone changes ping tower location at the time the murders are happening it will be hard to refute.

That being said, cell tower data is not rock solid geolocation technology.

How typical is it for a murder case to take 2.5 years to go to trial?

There's much more than pinging to towers but I don't want to really get into it

Señor Chang said:

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How typical is it for a murder case to take 2.5 years to go to trial?

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Very.

This one will take longer due to the voluminous discovery and scheduling issues.

Just read they are going to claim his phone was connected to a tower south of Pullman and west of Moscow at the time of the murders and an expert will show the phone was moving.

I'm inferring he had GPS turned off.

Hides the cell phone in a friend's car. The friend drives around while the murders happen. He retrieves the phone when the friend returns. Instant alibi?

TexasRebel said:

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Hides the cell phone in a friend's car. The friend drives around while the murders happen. He retrieves the phone when the friend returns. Instant alibi?

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How do you convince your friend to drive around at 4am?

More likely is he drives around establishing a pattern over multiple occasions.

Drives same pattern that night and drops the phone somewhere dark along the route on that night. Commits murders and comes back for phone later. Says he was sitting watching the sky/moon/stars whatever like he has done before. Apparently has pictures of night sky on phone from previous occasions.

How you argue away the video evidence of the car in the neighborhood at the time of the murders I don't know. Maybe just claim it is not his car. From what we know he was not seen directly and you can't read the license plate so... plausible deniability. Just looking for the slimmest shadow of a doubt for jurors.

And the knife sheath.... just claim it was planted.

It's slim but all you need is one juror.

No convincing needed if you have a friend that normally drives to/from school or work early in the AM.

Why did it take so long for the defense to assert an alibi defense like this one? Did the FBI screw up the cell phone tower investigation?

TAMUallen said:

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There's much more than pinging to towers but I don't want to really get into it

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I pulled jury duty a few weeks ago and was in a pool for a case of deadly conduct involving the discharge of a firearm at an occupied vehicle. No one was hit, but the incident had occurred in late 2022. It took 18 months for a case that was far simpler than this one.

This is pretty weak sauce for an alibi under Idaho state law.

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"Mr. Kohberger has long had a habit of going for drives alone. Often he would go for drives at night," his attorney, Anne Taylor, wrote in the filing. "He did so late on November 12 and into November 13, 2022."
In the latest filing in the case, Taylor said the defense does not yet have witnesses to prove Kohberger's exact location at the time of the stabbings but added that corroboration could come during the trial.

"Mr. Kohberger is not claiming to be at a specific location at a specific time," Taylor wrote. "At this time there is not a specific witness to say precisely where Mr. Kohberger was at each moment." Taylor wrote that supporting evidence "may come from cross-examination of the state's witnesses" or from experts for the defense team.

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Wednesday's filing outlining Kohberger's alibi had been anticipated for months: Idaho law requires a defendant to submit in writing "the specific place or places at which the defendant claims to have been at the time of the alleged offense and the names and addresses of the witnesses upon whom he intends to rely to establish such alibi."

The judge in Kohberger's case repeatedly extended the submission date, most recently setting the Wednesday deadline during a hearing in late February.

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Today Kohberger's attorney met the latest deadline, claiming an expert witness will testify that his cell phone was miles away from the murder scene.

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Kohberger had already indicated his alibi in court documents that he was out driving at the time of the 4 a.m. killings. The Wednesday filing by Kohberger's attorney, Anne Taylor, suggests that he will attempt to prove it through testimony from a cell-tower expert who will claim that Kohberger's cellphone was in the wrong location to connect him to the killings...
A car matching Kohberger's was seen on surveillance footage passing the victims' house four times, and was seen speeding away about 15 minutes after its last arrival at the house. Less than half an hour later, Kohberger's phone began reporting to the cell network again, placing him on a highway traveling from Moscow back to Pullman, according to the affidavit.
The testimony from the defense expert Kohberger plans to bring in will show, the new filing by his defense attorney said, that his mobile device did not travel on that highway. Instead, he will claim Kohberger "was south of Pullman, Washington and west of Moscow, Idaho on November 13, 2022."

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These claims are at odds with information submitted in a police affidavit more than a year ago. That document details how police did a video canvas of the area and identified a white Hyundai Elantra which was in the area that night. A car matching the description was registered to Bryan Kohberger. Kohberger had given his cell phone number during a traffic stop. Investigators got a search warrant for the phone's location data and then spoke to an FBI expert with 15 years of experience in tracking cell phones. Here's what the found.

On November 13,2022 al approximately 2:42 a.m., the 8458 Phone was utilizing cellular resources that provide coverage to 1630 Northeast Valley Road, Apt G201, Pullman, WA, hereafter the "Kohberger Residence." At approximately 2:47 a.m., the 8458 Phone utilized cellular resources that provide coverage southeast ofthe Kohberger Residence consistent with the 8458 Phone leaving the Kohberger Residence and traveling south through Pullman, WA' This is consistent with the movement of the white Elantra. At approximately 2:47 a.m. the 8458 Phone stops reporting to the network, which is consistent with either the phone being in an area without cellular coverage, the connection to the network is disabled (such as putting the phone in airplane mode), or that the phone is tumed off

The 8458 Phone does not report to the network again until approximately 4:48 a.m. at which time it utilized cellular resources that provide coverage to ID state highway 95 south of Moscow, ID near Blaine, ID (north of Genesee). Between 4:50 a.m. and 5:26 a.m., the phone utilizes cellular resources that are consistent with the 8458 Phone traveling south on ID state highway 95 to Genesee, ID, then traveling west towards Uniontown, ID, and then north back into Pullman, WA. At approximately 5:30 a.m., the 8458 Phone is utilizing resources that provide coverage to Pullman, WA and consistent with the phone traveling back to the Kohberger Residence. The 8458 Phone's movements are consistent with the movements of the white Elantra fiat is observed traveling north on Stadium Drive at approximately 5:27 a.m. Based on a review of the 8458 Phone's estimated locations and travel, the 8458 Phone's travel is consistent with that of the white Elanta.

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NBC News has some information on Kohberger's expert witness who has testified in other trials.

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Kohberger's team intends to rely on testimony from cell tower data expert Sy Ray, an experienced military and law enforcement instructor who they say can prove their client was miles away from Moscow at the time of the crime. Ray has testified in many criminal cases, including homicides...

Ray founded ZetX Corp., specializing in cellular geo-location mapping, in Arizona in 2014. The company was purchased by LexisNexis in 2021.

ZetX's Trax mapping software and Ray himself were criticized in a 2022 ruling by District Court Judge Juan Villaseñor in Colorado in a trial about a man accused of stalking an ex-girlfriend. Villaseñor ruled that the Trax-related evidence was inadmissible and based on a "sea of unreliability" after other experts found the technology to be problematic.

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Via Hot Air.

Señor Chang said:

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How typical is it for a murder case to take 2.5 years to go to trial?

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Those in the justice system evidently don't work very hard.

annoyed that my bookmark keeps falling off of this thread!

Señor Chang said:

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How typical is it for a murder case to take 2.5 years to go to trial?

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Harding Street Raid in Houston was over 5 years ago. Still no court date.

Not as unusual as people might think. For a state as small as Idaho though, it is outside of the norm. Then again they don't have this gruesome of four capital muders very often either. One of the reasons why Ann Taylor is one of the few public defenders certified to do capital offense charges.

And yes, the PDs have to be certified to be lead counsel on potential death penalty cases.

aggiehawg said:

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Why did it take so long for the defense to assert an alibi defense like this one? Did the FBI screw up the cell phone tower investigation?

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Apparently, they've been waiting for all the data for a long time. The state says law enforcement has been slow to turn over information to them so it has slowed what they can turn it over to the defense.

one safe place said:

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Señor Chang said:

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How typical is it for a murder case to take 2.5 years to go to trial?

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Those in the justice system evidently don't work very hard.

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There is something like 10 terabytes of digital discovery in this case. Some of it is still being analyzed by the police and has not even been turned over to the prosecutors.

Defense experts are always going to face increased scrutiny and criticism. Anything that goes against the supposed experts employed by the state is going to be questioned, but the state experts generally get to do and say whatever they want even if it's unreliable.

AtticusMatlock said:

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Defense experts are always going to face increased scrutiny and criticism. Anything that goes against the supposed experts employed by the state is going to be questioned, but the state experts generally get to do and say whatever they want even if it's unreliable.

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Oh and fully agree. I no longer trust the FBI nor their crime labs. Have to question and vet everything.

Early on in this case, FBI using genealogy private sites to source DNA bothered me, still does. But that is where we are these days. And it is not like Aunt Flo was compelled to send in her DNA to those 23 and Me sites. Volunteered sample.

So not illegal under the law to do that. Sucks but what it is.

Do I think BK did this? Probably. Beyond a reasonable doubt? TBH, don't know. Do know if he had renewed his registration of his car in PA and not in Pullman, they would not have caught him though. That's when his car became the focus.

aggiehawg said:

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AtticusMatlock said:

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Defense experts are always going to face increased scrutiny and criticism. Anything that goes against the supposed experts employed by the state is going to be questioned, but the state experts generally get to do and say whatever they want even if it's unreliable.

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Oh and fully agree. I no longer trust the FBI nor their crime labs. Have to question and vet everything.

Early on in this case, FBI using genealogy private sites to source DNA bothered me, still does. But that is where we are these days. And it is not like Aunt Flo was compelled to send in her DNA to those 23 and Me sites. Volunteered sample.

So not illegal under the law to do that. Sucks but what it is.

Do I think BK did this? Probably. Beyond a reasonable doubt? TBH, don't know. Do know if he had renewed his registration of his car in PA and not in Pullman, they would not have caught him though. That's when his car became the focus.

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Genealogy and DNA data right now is being used in a manner that people in the public have a hard time criticizing. I mean they are "catching bad guys". But we are rapidly approaching a time when more problematic uses will be sought. I think it is a matter of time before the privacy concerns become too much to allow the government to access them.

fightingfarmer09 said:

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aggiehawg said:

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AtticusMatlock said:

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Defense experts are always going to face increased scrutiny and criticism. Anything that goes against the supposed experts employed by the state is going to be questioned, but the state experts generally get to do and say whatever they want even if it's unreliable.

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Oh and fully agree. I no longer trust the FBI nor their crime labs. Have to question and vet everything.

Early on in this case, FBI using genealogy private sites to source DNA bothered me, still does. But that is where we are these days. And it is not like Aunt Flo was compelled to send in her DNA to those 23 and Me sites. Volunteered sample.

So not illegal under the law to do that. Sucks but what it is.

Do I think BK did this? Probably. Beyond a reasonable doubt? TBH, don't know. Do know if he had renewed his registration of his car in PA and not in Pullman, they would not have caught him though. That's when his car became the focus.

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Genealogy and DNA data right now is being used in a manner that people in the public have a hard time criticizing. I mean they are "catching bad guys". But we are rapidly approaching a time when more problematic uses will be sought. I think it is a matter of time before the privacy concerns become too much to allow the government to access them.

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The genealogy they are accessing are all DNA records that people intentionally made public.

Don't really know how you expect to not allow the government to use public records someone made public in a criminal search.

This is old, but newer than the last post.

Cellphone expert testifies missing data benefits University of Idaho murder suspect

This thing seems to have died down quite a bit. Any updates on timing out there?

agcrock2005 said:

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This is old, but newer than the last post.

Cellphone expert testifies missing data benefits University of Idaho murder suspect

This thing seems to have died down quite a bit. Any updates on timing out there?

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That Article points out how long things are taking and it sure seems that way.

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The slow pace of the pretrial hearings and the discussions hanging over such a high-profile case have only delayed the trial and pushed a trial date back to spring or summer 2025 frustrating families of the victims, who say their ability to heal has been impeded. Documents filed Friday also showed that a hearing on whether to move the trial out of Latah County, initially scheduled for late June, has been further delayed to Aug. 29.

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This thread was started 11/17/2022 and Kohberger was arrested in December or 2023. WTF is it taking so long? Summer 2025! That's 18-months after he was arrested.

He waived a speedy trial and his attorney has delayed things as much as possible is my understanding.

There is actually a little mini doc on it "cyber-slueth" on paramount, the show implies that there was such a circus from the social media "detective" crowds that they may have ended up hurting the case.

It's an interesting walk through the murder and all the noise surrounding it... it doesn't do justice to just how small, quaint and insignificant that area is though.

48 Hours recently did a show on this case. Apparently, some of the parents have been doing their own investigation and fed that info to the network.