It's about time somebody made a way to put those things out quickly.

They have been around for a few years, just not enough EVs on the road for cities/fire depts to spend the money on the system and training to use it.

Knew they existed, but did not realize they were that effective. Now to figure out how to rapidly extinguish an ICE fire.

Someone research.

Just throw baking soda in it.

hph6203 said:

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Just glad we figured out how to solve the energy problem of providing a married couple 770 kWh of energy a month to run their cars. The future of EVs has been saved! Cancel fusion research, it's a waste, we already have unlimited energy!

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Another swing and a miss. Damage in dollars does not mean energy output.

Wha do you think is the maximum amount of damage in dollars 1 EV fire can do? I bet I can raise your answer.

I'm old enough to remember when you swore up and down 1EV fire could never burn down the owners house + both his neighbors (3x multiplier) but then we saw the Korea fire a week later (almost 300 houses, 1 EV)

nortex97 said:

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GAC06 said:

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I heard they create their own oxygen so statistics and numbers don't matter at all

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You probably should look up how the chemistry works and what the catalysts etc. are while/once burning. Thermal runaway means it becomes self sustaining so even if oxygen is deprived it is able to use the oxygen from the reactions to keep going. That's precisely why throwing water on it only keeps it cool, instead of extinguishing it.

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You might want to look up chemistry yourself. Once the battery drops below a certain temperature, the reaction stops and the fire goes out. That is how almost all fires are put out in reality by water. The primary mechanism is the water is a great heat sink that drops the temperature of the fuel below the temperature of reaction NOT by removing oxygen from the fire.

https://www.livescience.com/chemistry/how-does-water-put-out-fire#

PlaneCrashGuy said:

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hph6203 said:

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Just glad we figured out how to solve the energy problem of providing a married couple 770 kWh of energy a month to run their cars. The future of EVs has been saved! Cancel fusion research, it's a waste, we already have unlimited energy!

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Another swing and a miss. Damage in dollars does not mean energy output.

Wha do you think is the maximum amount of damage in dollars 1 EV fire can do? I bet I can raise your answer.

I'm old enough to remember when you swore up and down 1EV fire could never burn down the owners house + both his neighbors (3x multiplier) but then we saw the Korea fire a week later (almost 300 houses, 1 EV)

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You realize we can show ICE fires that have burned down parking garages, houses and other major structures as well, right?

It wouldn't change the calculus.

FWIW, I will say that the Corpus Christi FD policy for lithium ion fires is to contain and then allow the fire to burn out.

PlaneCrashGuy said:

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It wouldn't change the calculus.

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The guy that can't solve a = b x c

GAC06 said:

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PlaneCrashGuy said:

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It wouldn't change the calculus.

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The guy that can't solve a = b x c

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We're still waiting for you to articulate how the fire can be extinguished. Or rather man up and admit you can't.

Should scroll up on potential techniques.

To answer the question on how big an EV fire could get. It boggles the mind. It could start in Texas in a cattle pasture and spread through Nebraska destroying everything in its path, up to Idaho to destroy the potatoes and on to Oregon to kill off all the hops. No beer, no burgers, no fries, no tortilla chips. What a world that would be. Everything in its path destroyed. Totally unlimited spread potential. By God if it jumped on a ship it could kill off China! At least the North Koreans could gnaw on the burnt corpses, a true feast for the hermit kingdom.

PlaneCrashGuy said:

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It wouldn't change the calculus.

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Why? According to you, all that matters is the damage that can be caused by a car fire not the odds of the fire occurring. If both types of vehicles can catch fire and destroy a parking garage, condo complex, etc, the damage potential is equal.

Your fundamental flaw is you think all that determines the total damage is the source but once a fire has spread from that source into a major structure, the total damage and challenge to put it out is the structure, the materials it and the contents are made of and the ability of firefighters to fight the STRUCTURE fire not the car fire. Go see the Luton fire for proof.

Canada to gut EV subsidies:

Quote:

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Shrinking government incentives for EV buyers

Currently, consumers in Canada can take advantage of significant savings when buying electric vehicles, with rebates totaling up to C$12,000 (about $8,500). These subsidies include a federal rebate of up to C$5,000, while Quebec and British Columbia offer additional incentives of up to C$7,000 and C$4,000, respectively.

These rebates have driven EV adoption in Canada, particularly in provinces with higher incentives, such as Quebec and British Columbia, which have seen substantially higher market shares for EVs than Ontario, where rebates were canceled in 2018.

But this support is fading. Quebec recently announced that its subsidy would be phased out entirely by 2027. In British Columbia, rebates were limited to a narrower group of EV buyers this June, as government officials pointed to "available funding" concerns and higher-than-expected EV sales growth. These rollbacks reflect a broader trend, with provincial governments reassessing the financial viability of taxpayer-funded EV incentives amid growing budget deficits.

Canada's aggressive targets for EV sales

Canada's subsidy reduction comes as the government sets ambitious targets to reduce emissions by replacing gas-powered cars with EVs. By 2035, all new light-duty vehicles sold in Canada must be fully electric or plug-in hybrids.

To reach this goal, interim milestones require 20% of new sales to be EVs by 2026 and 60% by 2030. This escalating timeline has intensified pressure on automakers, who must now navigate both declining incentives and mounting expectations.

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Good for them. Insane market interferences.

Agreed

nortex97 said:

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Canada to gut EV subsidies:

Quote:

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Shrinking government incentives for EV buyers

Currently, consumers in Canada can take advantage of significant savings when buying electric vehicles, with rebates totaling up to C$12,000 (about $8,500). These subsidies include a federal rebate of up to C$5,000, while Quebec and British Columbia offer additional incentives of up to C$7,000 and C$4,000, respectively.

These rebates have driven EV adoption in Canada, particularly in provinces with higher incentives, such as Quebec and British Columbia, which have seen substantially higher market shares for EVs than Ontario, where rebates were canceled in 2018.

But this support is fading. Quebec recently announced that its subsidy would be phased out entirely by 2027. In British Columbia, rebates were limited to a narrower group of EV buyers this June, as government officials pointed to "available funding" concerns and higher-than-expected EV sales growth. These rollbacks reflect a broader trend, with provincial governments reassessing the financial viability of taxpayer-funded EV incentives amid growing budget deficits.

Canada's aggressive targets for EV sales

Canada's subsidy reduction comes as the government sets ambitious targets to reduce emissions by replacing gas-powered cars with EVs. By 2035, all new light-duty vehicles sold in Canada must be fully electric or plug-in hybrids.

To reach this goal, interim milestones require 20% of new sales to be EVs by 2026 and 60% by 2030. This escalating timeline has intensified pressure on automakers, who must now navigate both declining incentives and mounting expectations.

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Good for them. Insane market interferences.

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Removing the incentives and upping the mandates.

Now THAT is a way to tank an industry in your country.

hph6203 said:

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It is exactly a risk per unit of vehicles. You say it isn't, because you desperately want your years long crusade trying to engender a fear of EV fires to remain relevant.

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Stop wasting your time arguing. He and Other Anti EV-ers will use whatever fits their ICE/Gas narrative. Its like people saying Plane crashes are dangerous because almost everyone who crashes dies vs a car. But they can't see the flaw in logic that Planes are the safest form of transportation.

People who put up dumb stats to say charging at home is expensive is just dumb. Not worth even debating. I spend 1/3-1/4 vs gas of a similar car. My Tesla Y outperforms my Old X5 in almost all metrics but do it at 1/4 the cost.

Talk about Li+ fires but Tesla is about the safest car I have ever been in. The technology to prevent accidents is exceptional. I was in a highway accident and got rear ended by someone going prob 50-60mph when I was at a standstill during rush hour. When I was hit, it felt like it would when a rollercoaster starts with that Jolt. I got out of My car and the back looked it like took a 30mph hit. The other car looked like the whole front was gone. Barely a scratch, no pain afterwards. This car is a ROCK. Heavy yes, but It is built SOLID. Car was totaled because of battery replacement costs which is expensive BUT my life is worth way more than extra repair costs.

I drive from Austin to CS alot and do it with 95% FSD driving. I can eat while just looking at the road and just an easier ride now with the car always in the middle of the lanes.

I will take my chances with the rare fire vs the more common car accident giving me a better chance of walking away unhurt. Just like the Plane vs car debate; you Never Tesla group just sound dumb.

This is why my family is going all EV. No need for ICE. Charging is a breeze. I have lived Tesla x 4 years and no one has ever complained about range/charging issues.

Ag with kids said:

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Removing the incentives and upping the mandates.

Now THAT is a way to tank an industry in your country.

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If you are so OK with letting the market determine the outcome then we should just let the Chinese cars come over Tariff free? You didn't see to care when the Big 3 gets all of their incentives/bailouts/cheap loans?

Medaggie said:

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Ag with kids said:

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Removing the incentives and upping the mandates.

Now THAT is a way to tank an industry in your country.

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If you are so OK with letting the market determine the outcome then we should just let the Chinese cars come over Tariff free? You didn't see to care when the Big 3 gets all of their incentives/bailouts/cheap loans?

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I'm not agreeing with Canada's approach in any way. Just commenting on how dumb it is.

They're making it less appealing to purchase an EV and at the same time mandating that the companies sell more of them.



And where in the hell are you getting that last sentence from?

I don't think there should be government interference. I didn't support bailouts.

Medaggie said:

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I was in a highway accident and got rear ended by someone going prob 50-60mph when I was at a standstill during rush hour. When I was hit, it felt like it would when a rollercoaster starts with that Jolt. I got out of My car and the back looked it like took a 30mph hit. The other car looked like the whole front was gone. Barely a scratch, no pain afterwards.

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Lucky.

bobbranco said:

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Medaggie said:

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I was in a highway accident and got rear ended by someone going prob 50-60mph when I was at a standstill during rush hour. When I was hit, it felt like it would when a rollercoaster starts with that Jolt. I got out of My car and the back looked it like took a 30mph hit. The other car looked like the whole front was gone. Barely a scratch, no pain afterwards.

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Lucky.

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Lucky but when you start with a heavier car that is built like a tank; you sometimes make your own luck.

The back of my car looked like something you could fix easily but was totaled b/c they could not guarantee that the battery was not damaged.

Either way, its by far the safest car I have ever been in.

bobbranco said:

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Medaggie said:

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I was in a highway accident and got rear ended by someone going prob 50-60mph when I was at a standstill during rush hour. When I was hit, it felt like it would when a rollercoaster starts with that Jolt. I got out of My car and the back looked it like took a 30mph hit. The other car looked like the whole front was gone. Barely a scratch, no pain afterwards.

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Lucky.

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FWIW, that is by design. Crumple zones save lives.

Ag with kids said:

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bobbranco said:

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Medaggie said:

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I was in a highway accident and got rear ended by someone going prob 50-60mph when I was at a standstill during rush hour. When I was hit, it felt like it would when a rollercoaster starts with that Jolt. I got out of My car and the back looked it like took a 30mph hit. The other car looked like the whole front was gone. Barely a scratch, no pain afterwards.

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Lucky.

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FWIW, that is by design. Crumple zones save lives.

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Indeed. Safety. Has evolved. And crumple zones have been with us for a while.



And a longer version with other models and years.

Ag with kids said:

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bobbranco said:

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Medaggie said:

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I was in a highway accident and got rear ended by someone going prob 50-60mph when I was at a standstill during rush hour. When I was hit, it felt like it would when a rollercoaster starts with that Jolt. I got out of My car and the back looked it like took a 30mph hit. The other car looked like the whole front was gone. Barely a scratch, no pain afterwards.

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Lucky.

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FWIW, that is by design. Crumple zones save lives.

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I get Crumple zones. Just telling you my MY looked like it was in minor accident and not something at highway speed.

Tesla's autonomy lead. Tesla is a great American company that is going to Make America Innovative Again. It is wildly underestimated how libertarian the community around Tesla is. You'd be stunned by how anti-Democrat Tesla supporters are. It is a technologist/growth mindset, not an environmentalist mindset. Great products for great products sake. Make a better product and people will eventually agree with it without a mandate.

America just kicked into founder mode. Time to build! 🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸

— Ashok Elluswamy (@aelluswamy) November 6, 2024

From a business perspective I think this is substantially true:

$TSLA up 12% in the premarket. We may be seeing just this!!

— The Grape Ape (@Grape4pe20) November 6, 2024

Well as so many of the fanboys on here have assured us repeatedly, Tesla doesn't need incentives and made great strides in the past without them.

Elon was already going to be a Trillionaire, backing Trump will fast track it. If JD wins 2028 I suspect we'll be on Mars by 2030 and Elon will be a Trillionaire by then.

FSD v13 rolling out around Thanksgiving using the full resolution and refresh rate of the HW4 cameras in lieu of the cropped resolution it was using before. Probably can expect another free month of FSD in December so they can collect additional data at full resolution for the AI model

Largest account on X that covers Tesla running victory laps.

UPDATE: He finished it lol. https://t.co/68xoTJWfyH

— Sawyer Merritt (@SawyerMerritt) November 6, 2024

It was nice to get in my Tesla today and I know I did my part for America and conservatism

The Left is losing it over Trump winning

This man is so mad he said he will never buy a Tesla. I don’t know how Elon will ever recover from this 😂 pic.twitter.com/Fkki3uzJUi

— Libs of TikTok (@libsoftiktok) November 6, 2024

Perfect way to get EV mandates rolled back

https://www.torquenews.com/11826/parking-garages-new-york-are-refusing-park-tesla-cybertrucks-they-say-insurance-companies

Quote:

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Atul Sharma is a Cybertruck owner from New York, and he says there is a concerted Cybertruck ban across several parking garages in the city.

Atul first noticed this phenomenon when he drove his Cybertruck to Manhattan for work. However, he was surprised to learn that none of the parking garages he tried were willing to let him park his Cybertruck on their property.

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That's pretty devastating.

Pretty hilarious is what it is. That monstrosity really would require at least two spots, in addition to the safety concerns, in most of the urban garages I can think of, off the top of my head. Talk about an impractical vehicle for those drivers.

EV sales in Australia down 25%.

Quote:

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EV registrations fell from from 25,353 in Q2 to 18,990 units in Q3, taking battery vehicles' share of the car market down from 8.1 percent to just 6.6 percent, the lowest it's been in two years. The overall car market was down by a far less dramatic 7.6 percent in the same period.

Those EV refuseniks aren't all jumping back into plain-old combustion cars petrol sales didn't fall as badly as EV registrations, but were still down 9.2 percent. Instead, they're increasingly switching their focus from full electric to partially-electric. Sales of hybrids improved by 3.3 percent in Q3 from 46,727 to 48,282 units, but sales of plug-in-hybrids grew by a shocking 56 percent.

Modern PHEVs now offer such long electric ranges that many buyers find they can cover all of their commuting on battery power, and still have the security of a gas tank and combustion engine. But analysts think the main reason for the switch from EVs to hybrids is a financial one.

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Why? Many reasons, but subsidies have been gutted in most of the country:

Quote:

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Rebates for fully electric cars have been removed everywhere in the country except Western Australia, creating a disincentive for buyers. But PHEVs are still exempt from fringe benefits tax until April 2025, potentially saving drivers thousands of dollars on a lease, the AAA explains.

"There have been significant quarterly fluctuations over the past seven quarters, but sales figures over that period confirm a clear trend of growth for hybrids, while battery electric vehicle market share appears to have peaked for now," the AAA said.

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