tysker said:

---

Quote:

---

21% infected require hospitalization. Treatment for those hospitalized is at a minimum 100% oxygen treatment for days, at a maximum - ventilator assisted breathing for up to three weeks.

---

Is this true for all cases globally or just the places like China with higher rates of smoking, more pollution and lesser cultural hygiene standards?

---

It's varying a bit. Some of that might be an abundance of caution and application of resources. South Korea might isolate in hospitals while Vietnam might isolate at home. All these stats are pretty variable. Best cases to look at are Italy and South Korea imo. The Diamond Princess appears to have been botched so badly I'm not sure that's a great look though you could lump that in with Japan as well.

No one is testing widely enough and the ridiculous CDC guidelines definitely didn't help public confidence. I suspect after reading some articles about the impression of the FDA of the Atlanta lab that produced the kits that if the CDC had known about those issues they would have released more outside groups to be able to develop kits. Now according to new articles those outside groups will be able to test as many as 10,000 a day by the end of the week (Axios article maybe?). But it's probably 3 weeks overdue at a minimum.

tysker said:

---

Quote:

---

21% infected require hospitalization. Treatment for those hospitalized is at a minimum 100% oxygen treatment for days, at a maximum - ventilator assisted breathing for up to three weeks.

---

Is this true for all cases globally or just the places like China with higher rates of smoking, more pollution and lesser cultural hygiene standards?

---

Yes, can anyone supply information on the stats from Korea posted earlier? How many were hospitalized, etc?

Quote:

---

Is this true for all cases globally or just the places like China with higher rates of smoking, more pollution and lesser cultural hygiene standards?

---

Hygiene won't make you have a worse problem with the disease.

We don't really know. In S Korea they're trying to admit everyone because of how infectious it is.

It seems like Singapore is doing the same thing - of 108 cases all were admitted, 78 discharged and 30 remain, 6 in critical condition. No idea if that mirrors mild/serious/critical from China.

rgag12 said:

---

The world is just trying to contain this thing now because 1) We are still studying it so effective treatments can be developed and made, and 2) Because the public is hyperventilating over this.

---

I believe that a lot of the hype now stems directly from China's initial response. On or about January 23, China quarantined the cities Wuhan and two other cities with a total population of about 17 million people. Over the next week, the quarantined another 30 to 40 million people in the surrounding province. This accounts for about 3.9% of the population of China. For comparison sake, this would be equivalent to the US quarantining the entire state of Pennsylvania.

This was an unprecedented move, that caused me to audibly gasp when I heard about it. The extraordinary measures being taken by other countries have only followed suit, (e.g. Vietnam and Japan canceling schools, and travel bans all over the world.)

Two very important questions remain unanswered, (1) Why did China take the extraordinary measures they did in the first place? And, (2) do the various national governments know why, or are they just assuming the worst because it is China?

Conspiracy theories abound about a bio-engineered super-bug because the epicenter of the virus is home to Wuhan Institute of Virology, China's only Level 4 Biosafety lab. If something nasty (whether it was bio-engineered or something in nature they were simply studying) escaped from there (or even potentially escaped from there), then the response by China seems highly appropriate. The response from the rest of the world logically follows suit, because of a general lack of trust about the Chinese government.

I did a lot of reading about morbidity and mortality over the weekend. I like the chart below because it puts various diseases in perspective. My personal layman's guess based on everything I have read about Coronavirus is that we are looking at something akin to chickenpox on the low end and mumps on the high end. Not symptomatically, but just in terms of how many people could get this and how many might die. I would like to hear other takes on this as well, particularly from the OP of this thread and others in the field.

Has anyone seen an explanation (or theory, really, since this is so new everything is guesswork to some extent) as to why this doesn't seem to be as dangerous to the very young as the flu and other similar respiratory diseases?

I've seen some reports (SK for example) where none of the young have died.

As a layperson, I'm used to the concerns about this type of stuff always being about the very young, very old, and the already ill.

TurkeyBaconLeg said:

---

NOTHING HAS CHANGED

1-Wash your hands
2-Don't touch your face if you can avoid it
3-Disinfect and wipe down high traffic areas
Repeat
Repeat
Repeat...

---

facemasks best help you to stop touching your face.

DTP02 said:

---

Has anyone seen an explanation (or theory, really, since this is so new everything is guesswork to some extent) as to why this doesn't seem to be as dangerous to the very young as the flu and other similar respiratory diseases?

I've seen some reports (SK for example) where none of the young have died.

As a layperson, I'm used to the concerns about this type of stuff always being about the very young, very old, and the already ill.

---

The theory I've read that I think makes some sense is that immune systems of the young are at the strongest whilst as you age the opposite is true. Thus, you are more prone to an immuno over-response... which results in inflammation.

That said, I think there have been 0 deaths reported for ages 0-9. That's odd because I would think you would still get an outlier... but its early in the process. I hope that this stat remains true, but I don't think its realistic.

scottimus said:

---

San Antonio Press Conference on Patient that was released:

• Stayed at Hotel by the Airport
• Visited Mall near Airport (North Star Mall)
• Mall officials notified this morning
• Went to food court, ordered food sat by herself
• Exposure assessment based on two criteria
• 1 Time of Exposure
• 2 Distance of Persons at Risk to Exposure
• 18 people identified at local Hospital she was in contact with
• 16-low risk/ 2 Med Risk
• 3 exposures at the hotel - low risk
• Covid Test encompasses 2 tests of individual- upper respiratory and lower, one test came back positive, one test negative.
• Absolutely confident Hotel exposure is confined and contained.
• Holiday Inn at the Airport has been notified and people released.
• CDC plan was to release people who met criteria to be released today
• Received letter from CDC to test a 3rd time and not release people in quarantine
• CDC test results take 48-72 hours for results from CDC
• Advising hospitals to use masks for any patients coming in with upper respiratory symptoms.
• Know how many people were exposed at Holiday Inn, not possible to know exposure at mall
• She did use hotel shuttle
• Went to Mall at 5:30 exited at 7:30..spent most of her time at food court eating by herself.
• [San Antonio blaming CDC for releasing patient "should not have happened"]

---

Flipping Awesome! One of my offices is three blocks South of North Star. The Northside office has a 300 person call center in it. They like to walk to lunch and eat at North Star. Just fricken great. I am going to not spend much time at that office going forward.

DTP02 said:

---

Mtn_Guide said:

---

Interesting where he thinks there are actually 100,000s of cases we don't know about.

---

I don't think he's wrong, but I think the emphasis needs to be on "right now." The risk of catching this is extremely low in the US right now, but that's likely to change over the next several weeks.

The panic and hysteria at this stage is likely just artificially prolonging and increasing the impact this will have on the economy.

I also think he's right that there are likely hundreds of thousands of cases worldwide that haven't been documented, including a substantial number (hundreds, surely) in the US.

---

Oh, I agree. Though IF it is hundreds of thousands of undocumented cases then the math of how it spreads and the fatality rate completely changes. Then it does start to look more like a slightly more dangerous version of the flu.

InternetFan02 said:

---

TurkeyBaconLeg said:

---

NOTHING HAS CHANGED

1-Wash your hands
2-Don't touch your face if you can avoid it
3-Disinfect and wipe down high traffic areas
Repeat
Repeat
Repeat...

---

facemasks best help you to stop touching your face.

---

But as mentioned above if not used in combination with eye protection, if you touch your eyes it does nothing for you.

OldArmy71 said:

---

tysker said:

---

Quote:

---

21% infected require hospitalization. Treatment for those hospitalized is at a minimum 100% oxygen treatment for days, at a maximum - ventilator assisted breathing for up to three weeks.

---

Is this true for all cases globally or just the places like China with higher rates of smoking, more pollution and lesser cultural hygiene standards?

---

Yes, can anyone supply information on the stats from Korea posted earlier? How many were hospitalized, etc?

---

Here's Singapore's crazy good site on corona from their Ministry of Health:

https://experience.arcgis.com/experience/7e30edc490a5441a874f9efe67bd8b89

I just saw the Korea stuff in an article, no good aggregated data source from them.

Wow that's awesome

erudite said:

---

I am not sure if either google translate or my own instincts are correct.
I'm not in the medical field.
Because the edit to the post is my issue:
1) Current translation implies (natrual) chemical luminescence of some sort without reaction
2) Implies some sort of chemical reaction to bind to the antibody?

---

I thought you worked as an EMT in China last summer, your immediate family works in ID, and your extended family is in healthcare? You received a lot of unique and quite specific data, assessments, and opinions...

Quote:

---

facemasks best help you to stop touching your face.

---

Nope....You actually touch your face more wearing a face mask, as noted in recent days by CDC and HHS.....

Ag In Ok said:

---

erudite said:

---

I am not sure if either google translate or my own instincts are correct.
I'm not in the medical field.
Because the edit to the post is my issue:
1) Current translation implies (natrual) chemical luminescence of some sort without reaction
2) Implies some sort of chemical reaction to bind to the antibody?

---

I thought you worked as an EMT in China last summer, your immediate family works in ID, and your extended family is in healthcare? You received a lot of unique and quite specific data, assessments, and opinions...

---

Dude....

BigN--00 said:

---

rgag12 said:

---

The world is just trying to contain this thing now because 1) We are still studying it so effective treatments can be developed and made, and 2) Because the public is hyperventilating over this.

---

Two very important questions remain unanswered, (1) Why did China take the extraordinary measures they did in the first place? And, (2) do the various national governments know why, or are they just assuming the worst because it is China?

---

1) Did the same thing during the SARS epidemic so it is previous precedent. Original response is from the (Alleged) US use of bioweapons during the Korean war. There is a large plaque in most Chinese city centers/ highway interchanges which highlight the 16 ( or 12 I think?) core socialist values. Of which "cleanliness" (It doesn't translate well) and Public health stem from said event.

2) No idea.

cisgenderedAggie said:

---

Ag In Ok said:

---

erudite said:

---

I am not sure if either google translate or my own instincts are correct.
I'm not in the medical field.
Because the edit to the post is my issue:
1) Current translation implies (natrual) chemical luminescence of some sort without reaction
2) Implies some sort of chemical reaction to bind to the antibody?

---

I thought you worked as an EMT in China last summer, your immediate family works in ID, and your extended family is in healthcare? You received a lot of unique and quite specific data, assessments, and opinions...

---

Dude....

---

I am a US state (Texas) EMT.
My close family relative works in ID.
My family relative(s) and friends work in CCDC, CFDA.
I have a relative (distant) who works as a M.D in Pneumology in Wuhan.
I don't understand medical documents in Chinese very well. Many of these are specialty transliteration phrases that do not translate well if at all without a special dictionary.


By "Not in medical field" I mean not a doctor, sorry. I should have worded it better.

UncoverAg00 said:

---

DTP02 said:

---

Has anyone seen an explanation (or theory, really, since this is so new everything is guesswork to some extent) as to why this doesn't seem to be as dangerous to the very young as the flu and other similar respiratory diseases?

I've seen some reports (SK for example) where none of the young have died.

As a layperson, I'm used to the concerns about this type of stuff always being about the very young, very old, and the already ill.

---

The theory I've read that I think makes some sense is that immune systems of the young are at the strongest whilst as you age the opposite is true. Thus, you are more prone to an immuno over-response... which results in inflammation.

That said, I think there have been 0 deaths reported for ages 0-9. That's odd because I would think you would still get an outlier... but its early in the process. I hope that this stat remains true, but I don't think its realistic.

---

Here is the source of my response: https://www.the-scientist.com/news-opinion/why-some-covid-19-cases-are-worse-than-others-67160

I may be misinterpreting it a bit... I'm not a medical guy. I just stayed at a Holiday Inn Express.

UncoverAg00 said:

---

UncoverAg00 said:

---

DTP02 said:

---

Has anyone seen an explanation (or theory, really, since this is so new everything is guesswork to some extent) as to why this doesn't seem to be as dangerous to the very young as the flu and other similar respiratory diseases?

I've seen some reports (SK for example) where none of the young have died.

As a layperson, I'm used to the concerns about this type of stuff always being about the very young, very old, and the already ill.

---

The theory I've read that I think makes some sense is that immune systems of the young are at the strongest whilst as you age the opposite is true. Thus, you are more prone to an immuno over-response... which results in inflammation.

That said, I think there have been 0 deaths reported for ages 0-9. That's odd because I would think you would still get an outlier... but its early in the process. I hope that this stat remains true, but I don't think its realistic.

---

Here is the source of my response: https://www.the-scientist.com/news-opinion/why-some-covid-19-cases-are-worse-than-others-67160

I may be misinterpreting it a bit... I'm not a medical guy. I just stayed at a Holiday Inn Express.

---

In San Antonio?

No... Houston. Across from Rice University.

InternetFan02 said:

---

tysker said:

---

Quote:

---

this person was free for like a day and a half and managed to spend 2 hours at a mall food court spreading it. Un****ingbelievable.

---

I know; who goes to malls nowadays?

---

CDC: yeah sure you can leave...we're still waiting on test results but you probably don't have it

PatientX: great I could really use some ****ing Sbarro right now and also those bourbon chicken samples from that sketchy Asian food court place with no sign

CDC: sounds good

---

Didn't San Antonio outlaw Chickfila in free standing buildings?

Can they even get the Holy Chicken outside of malls?

Zemira said:

---

InternetFan02 said:

---

TurkeyBaconLeg said:

---

NOTHING HAS CHANGED

1-Wash your hands
2-Don't touch your face if you can avoid it
3-Disinfect and wipe down high traffic areas
Repeat
Repeat
Repeat...

---

facemasks best help you to stop touching your face.

---

But as mentioned above if not used in combination with eye protection, if you touch your eyes it does nothing for you.

---

What about sexy time? Can it be passed via kissing, saliva, or other bodily fluids?

k2aggie07 said:

---

Quote:

---

Is this true for all cases globally or just the places like China with higher rates of smoking, more pollution and lesser cultural hygiene standards?

---

Hygiene won't make you have a worse problem with the disease.

We don't really know. In S Korea they're trying to admit everyone because of how infectious it is.

It seems like Singapore is doing the same thing - of 108 cases all were admitted, 78 discharged and 30 remain, 6 in critical condition. No idea if that mirrors mild/serious/critical from China.

---

This makes sense that they're isolating confirmed cases in hospitals but is it necessary (e.g. patients need drugs, care, ventilators, etc) or it is simply a best practice to slow spread because, frankly, people cant be trusted not to go to the damn mall 30 mins after being released? Basically I'm asking are these patients being hospitalized (detained?) because they have to be treated there or because its the right thing to do given the circumstances?

Answering this question will go a long way for us to appreciate if the US healthcare system can handle the future spread.

Our company has put a hold on all non-critical business travel for the next 30 days.

Mr.Infectious said:

---

Zemira said:

---

InternetFan02 said:

---

TurkeyBaconLeg said:

---

NOTHING HAS CHANGED

1-Wash your hands
2-Don't touch your face if you can avoid it
3-Disinfect and wipe down high traffic areas
Repeat
Repeat
Repeat...

---

facemasks best help you to stop touching your face.

---

But as mentioned above if not used in combination with eye protection, if you touch your eyes it does nothing for you.

---

What about sexy time? Can it be passed via kissing, saliva, or other bodily fluids?

---

I think it is plausible. However, I do not see any information regarding tests for sexual fluids in any news source in China.

So wife just went to Costco to pick up cookies for kids school function and a lady in the parking lot was struggling with her two kids. Wife asked if she could assist with getting a cart and/or help get the kids inside the cart and the lady said no thanks as she wanted to sanitize the cart with wipes before putting her kids in. I guess its the right thing but does she know she's about to walk into a crowded Costco?

Italy's health system at limit in virus-struck Lombardy

Quote:

---

With officials expecting Italy's numbers to continue rising for at least another week, until containment measures begin to show their effect, the health care emergency in Lombardy has reached a crisis point.
Hospitals in hard-hit Lodi and Cremona were so overwhelmed at times last week, with more sick people arriving than could be accepted, that they closed their emergency rooms and new patients were taken elsewhere.
"Effectively some of the hospitals in Lombardy are under a stress that is much heavier than what this area can support," Dr. Massimo Galli, head of infectious disease at Milan's Sacco Hospital, told Sky TG24. "This epidemic is on a scale that is larger than anyone could have thought, imagined or prevented."

---

What can happen when an outbreak goes undetected for a short time.

The "good news"......

Quote:

---

Some 9% of people diagnosed with the COVID-19 need intensive care, Borrelli said.

---

tysker said:

---

So wife just went to Costco to pick up cookies for kids school function and a lady in the parking lot was struggling with her two kids. Wife asked if she could assist with getting a cart and/or help get the kids inside the cart and the lady said no thanks as she wanted to sanitize the cart with wipes before putting her kids in. I guess its the right thing but does she know she's about to walk into a crowded Costco?

---

Maybe she thinks the sanitizer is like holy water... "the power of Purell compels you! the power of Purell compels you!"

erudite said:

---

Mr.Infectious said:

---

Zemira said:

---

InternetFan02 said:

---

TurkeyBaconLeg said:

---

NOTHING HAS CHANGED

1-Wash your hands
2-Don't touch your face if you can avoid it
3-Disinfect and wipe down high traffic areas
Repeat
Repeat
Repeat...

---

facemasks best help you to stop touching your face.

---

But as mentioned above if not used in combination with eye protection, if you touch your eyes it does nothing for you.

---

What about sexy time? Can it be passed via kissing, saliva, or other bodily fluids?

---

I think it is plausible. However, I do not see any information regarding tests for sexual fluids in any news source in China.

---

Kissing is a given. Any other...errrr...contact... is highly questionable I'd think.

Ag In Ok said:

---

erudite said:

---

I am not sure if either google translate or my own instincts are correct.
I'm not in the medical field.
Because the edit to the post is my issue:
1) Current translation implies (natrual) chemical luminescence of some sort without reaction
2) Implies some sort of chemical reaction to bind to the antibody?

---

I thought you worked as an EMT in China last summer, your immediate family works in ID, and your extended family is in healthcare? You received a lot of unique and quite specific data, assessments, and opinions...

---

See my previous post(s). Apologizes for any miscommunication.
In addition, to my understanding, EMT in china is not very common. at least not the US defined EMT-B definitions.
It is mainly because system is not US based but European based. There is a doctor, nurse, and two EMT (Usually "paramedics" or what we would call "EMT-I"????).

Chinese paramedics are also not given as much leeway in their standing orders since there is a doctor in most ambulances.

2nd edit: Lots of variation in rural-urban. Some areas straight up has nurses+doctor and a driver.

Houston company claims to have a vaccine ready: vaccine

First step of a long process if true.

Rossticus said:

---

erudite said:

---

Mr.Infectious said:

---

Zemira said:

---

InternetFan02 said:

---

TurkeyBaconLeg said:

---

NOTHING HAS CHANGED

1-Wash your hands
2-Don't touch your face if you can avoid it
3-Disinfect and wipe down high traffic areas
Repeat
Repeat
Repeat...

---

facemasks best help you to stop touching your face.

---

But as mentioned above if not used in combination with eye protection, if you touch your eyes it does nothing for you.

---

What about sexy time? Can it be passed via kissing, saliva, or other bodily fluids?

---

I think it is plausible. However, I do not see any information regarding tests for sexual fluids in any news source in China.

---

Kissing is a given. Any other...errrr...contact... is highly questionable I'd think.

---

It maybe possible. I remember seeing details of Ebola being present in sexual fluids.
I am not sure if the lack of any info is because it is not CONSIDERED, or if it is NEGATIVE.

This was posted on the Travel board. 90% of the cases in China.



https://www.arcgis.com/apps/opsdashboard/index.html#/bda7594740fd40299423467b48e9ecf6

Mr.Infectious said:

---

What about sexy time? Can it be passed via kissing, saliva, or other bodily fluids?

---

Don't care. I'd rather risk it.