I stand correctedMEENAGGIE09 said:
Nope, this one is more recent...
aggiehawg said:Crap!!!!MEENAGGIE09 said:
Nope, this one is more recent...
Who do you mean by each other? The left controlled all levers of power and "justice" for 8 years leading into this ****show. (Including Fast and Furious, IRS targeting, Benghazi, and now this)Cepe said:
I also wonder if they are close to calling a truce and going back to the status quo. It's pretty clear that the entire swamp was doing this kind of stuff and spying on each other.
Quote:
But that gets back to one of the original sins of the prosecution of Manafort It was beyond the scope of Mueller's authority when the investigation started and the raid on Manafort's home took place. That Order of appointment has never been changed.
Mueller and Rod Rosenstein attempted to bootstrap authority in an August 4, 2017 memo, we previously discussed in Rosenstein Memo confirming Mueller could investigate Manafort came a week after raid on Manafort's home:
The argument is that the indictment of Manafort for business dealings is unrelated to and took place years before 2016 Russian election interference and alleged collusion.
[url=https://legalinsurrection.com/2018/04/rosenstein-memo-confirming-mueller-could-investigate-manafort-came-a-week-after-raid-on-manaforts-home/][/url]In opposition to Manafort's motion, Mueller submitted Brief in Opposition, which attached as an exhibit an August 2, 2017 Memo, which purported to confirm to Mueller that Manafort's prior business dealings were covered by the original order of appointment.
[url=https://legalinsurrection.com/2018/04/rosenstein-memo-confirming-mueller-could-investigate-manafort-came-a-week-after-raid-on-manaforts-home/][/url]The August 2, 2017, Rosenstein memo clearly is being used by Mueller to affirm Mueller's authority to investigate Manafort's non-election-related, years-old business dealings. But the timing jumped out at me.
[url=https://legalinsurrection.com/2018/04/rosenstein-memo-confirming-mueller-could-investigate-manafort-came-a-week-after-raid-on-manaforts-home/][/url]By the time of the August 2 memo, Mueller already was investigating Manafort's business dealings and gathering evidence for an indictment (which would be unsealed less than three months later).
[url=https://legalinsurrection.com/2018/04/rosenstein-memo-confirming-mueller-could-investigate-manafort-came-a-week-after-raid-on-manaforts-home/]On July 26, 2017 a week before the Rosensten memo Mueller's team raided Manafort's home, as the Washington Post reported on August 9, 2017.[/url]
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Rosenstein purporting to interpret the original Order of appointment is not in fact a change in the Order. Mueller's authority is as it was when he was appointed, and that plainly does not include matters completely unrelated to alleged Russian collusion or crimes committed in the course of the investigation. Neither of those situations applies to the prosecution of Manafort.
The problem with this post hoc authority is that it also calls into question the integrity of the Mueller operation:Quote:
The August 2, 2017 memo was classic boostrapping. It purported to confirm Mueller's authority to go after Manafort's business dealings, but Mueller already was doing that and had been doing it for weeks, culminating in the July 26 home raid.
So to the extent the Rosenstein August 2, 2017 memorandum is supposed to instill confidence that Mueller is receiving proper DOJ oversight, it does just the opposite. As least as to the portion revealed about Manafort, it shows a willingness to give post hoc justification for conduct of Mueller that does not appear authorized by the text of the original May 17 appointing Order.
LINKQuote:
Mueller has no business prosecuting someone for matters completely unrelated to alleged Russian collusion. After-the-fact expansion of authority by Rod Rosenstein, which did not change the appointing Order, cannot change that.
Mueller is torturing Manafort through these indictments without appropriate authority. That might be because Mueller thinks he can flip Manafort against Trump, or because Manafort's refusal to cop a plea has so infuriated the Mueller team that they are going to make an example of Manafort.
In either case, Mueller needs to be limited to his actual authority. Hopefully the courts will do that, because it's clear that Rod Rosenstein will not.
Read the restQuote:
We need to get to the bottom of what Comey did in all of these investigations, and whether they were compromised. We must have both tasks carried out fully and fairly. It's clear now that Rod Rosenstein, with his comments, is part of the problem, not part of the solution.
sam callahan said:
I wish I had a tenth of the faith in Horowitz as some of you.
I operate on the assumption that there are no angels of virtue in D.C. and if there were they would be squashed under the weight and corruption of those around them.
It's a bleak outlook, but one that seldom if ever gets truly challenged.
Page, maybe not. But remember, Manafort was originally brought on to manage the delegate operation for the convention. So they may have overlapped there.Quote:
Point is he has no ties to Manafort or Page. I'd bet money he never spoke to them.
So, do you still think William Wallace treatment for this pack of jackals is inappropriate?aggiehawg said:Page, maybe not. But remember, Manafort was originally brought on to manage the delegate operation for the convention. So they may have overlapped there.Quote:
Point is he has no ties to Manafort or Page. I'd bet money he never spoke to them.
One other point, Trump's lawyers have always been cooperating with Mueller, including producing a ton of documents including emails (texts, I'm not sure but consider it likely). So, it isn't safe to assume everything Mueller has he got through some type of surveillance, legal or not.
Just a quibble.
Carry on.
ETA: The Roger Stone stuff is interesting though.
You know, your comment kind of sounds like the SC is gatekeeper of the establishment, so to speak, instead of doing what they're supposed to do.FriscoKid said:
After Hillary lost they knew the dirt would come out. I think Mueller was appointed to muddy the water as much as possible so the average person didn't know what to believe. It's IG vs SC.
https://www.cnn.com/2017/09/18/politics/paul-manafort-government-wiretapped-fisa-russians/index.htmlQuote:
The FBI then restarted the surveillance after obtaining a new FISA warrant that extended at least into early this year.
Sources say the second warrant was part of the FBI's efforts to investigate ties between Trump campaign associates and suspected Russian operatives. Such warrants require the approval of top Justice Department and FBI officials, and the FBI must provide the court with information showing suspicion that the subject of the warrant may be acting as an agent of a foreign power.
It is unclear when the new warrant started. The FBI interest deepened last fall because of intercepted communications between Manafort and suspected Russian operatives, and among the Russians themselves, that reignited their interest in Manafort, the sources told CNN. As part of the FISA warrant, CNN has learned that earlier this year, the FBI conducted a search of a storage facility belonging to Manafort. It's not known what they found.
The conversations between Manafort and Trump continued after the President took office, long after the FBI investigation into Manafort was publicly known, the sources told CNN. They went on until lawyers for the President and Manafort insisted that they stop, according to the sources.
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The Justice Department's Inspector General, Michael Horowitz, will soon release a much-anticipated assessment of Democratic and Republican charges that officials at the FBI interfered in the 2016 presidential campaign. That year-long probe, sources familiar with it tell TIME, is expected to come down particularly hard on former FBI director James Comey, who is currently on a high-profile book tour. It will likely find that Comey breached Justice Department protocols in a July 5, 2016, press conference when he criticized Hillary Clinton for using a private email server as Secretary of State even as he cleared her of any crimes, the sources say. The report is expected to also hit Comey for the way he reopened the Clinton email probe less than two weeks before the election, the sources say.
The report closely follows an earlier one in April by Horowitz, which showed that the ousted deputy director of the FBI, Andrew McCabe, had lied to the bureau's internal investigations branch to cover up a leak he orchestrated about Clinton's family foundation less than two weeks before the election. (The case has since been referred to the U.S. Attorney's office in Washington, D.C., for potential prosecution.) Another IG report in March found that FBI retaliation against internal whistle-blowers was continuing despite years of bureau pledges to fix the problem. Last fall, Horowitz found that the FBI wasn't adequately investigating "high-risk" employees who failed polygraph tests.
Fruit of the poison tree..MouthBQ98 said:
So, if the FISA warrants were obtained by deceiving the courts, and virtually ALL of the intelligence turned criminal investigation's evidence was obtained based on those fraudulent and probably also abusively used warrants, isn't virtually all of the SC's evidence garbage?
Not necessarily. Lost in all of this is the huge amount of cooperation Mueller has received from Trump's White House and former campaign staffers and his family. They have turned over documents, email chains, and other communications to not only Mueller but to the House and Senate committees. That stuff is legit.MouthBQ98 said:
So, if the FISA warrants were obtained by deceiving the courts, and virtually ALL of the intelligence turned criminal investigation's evidence was obtained based on those fraudulent and probably also abusively used warrants, isn't virtually all of the SC's evidence garbage?
http://freebeacon.com/politics/goodlatte-subpoenas-justice-documents-related-clinton-probes/Quote:
Since January, more than two dozen FBI staff have been assisting the department in producing, "on a rolling basis," documents that are "responsive" to the committee's "broad request," Prior said, noting that Justice has provided 3,000 documents of the roughly 30,000 it believes are responsive to the committees' inquiries.
The 1.2 million is the number associated with IG Horowitz's investigation, not the House or Senate committees. BTW, those committees have only seen a sliver of what Horowitz has reportedly amassed.Nosmo said:
I've seen several post related to the "1.2 million documents". Apparently the relevant number of documents are much smaller. More like 30,000. Still a large number.http://freebeacon.com/politics/goodlatte-subpoenas-justice-documents-related-clinton-probes/Quote:
Since January, more than two dozen FBI staff have been assisting the department in producing, "on a rolling basis," documents that are "responsive" to the committee's "broad request," Prior said, noting that Justice has provided 3,000 documents of the roughly 30,000 it believes are responsive to the committees' inquiries.
In theory, yes. He can ask to see the files from SDNY. But he isn't a judge and cannot intervene unless he finds something completely outrageous and feels he has to tell the judge about it.jjeffers1 said:
Question - Can Horowitz investigate the ongoing investigation into Cohen?
So is this overlap of the 1.2 million?Quote:
The House Judiciary Committee on Thursday subpoenaed the Justice Department for documents related to internal DOJ and FBI decisions in the investigation of former Secretary of State Hillary Clinton's private email server, as well as potential abuses of laws governing the surveillance of members of Trump presidential campaign.
Rep. Bob Goodlatte (R., Va.), who chairs the panel, said he has grown increasingly frustrated by the DOJ's unresponsiveness to his requests for more than 1.2 million documents related to the FBI investigation into Clinton's email.
Essentially, yes. But I think that is misleading. Horowitz's investigation encompasses both the DOJ and FBI files on Hillary-gate. Not just 1.2 million from the FBI alone, as I understand it.Nosmo said:
From the article:So is this overlap of the 1.2 million?Quote:
The House Judiciary Committee on Thursday subpoenaed the Justice Department for documents related to internal DOJ and FBI decisions in the investigation of former Secretary of State Hillary Clinton's private email server, as well as potential abuses of laws governing the surveillance of members of Trump presidential campaign.
Rep. Bob Goodlatte (R., Va.), who chairs the panel, said he has grown increasingly frustrated by the DOJ's unresponsiveness to his requests for more than 1.2 million documents related to the FBI investigation into Clinton's email.
This is also why the public is having a hard time wrapping their mind around all of this. So many moving parts.Quote:
DOJ spokesman Ian Prior said in a statement at the time the subpoena was issued last month that officials are carefully combing page-by-page through the tranche of documents to redact sensitive case information.
He also pushed back on the breadth of the document request, saying the DOJ believes there are 30,000 documents relevant to the committee's inquiry and describing the 1.2 million document request as "substantial."
Lawmakers are eager to review over a million documents examined by the DOJ's inspector general, Michael Horowitz, who has separately been leading an investigation into the FBI's conduct during the election.
