Russian Orthodox Relics Used To Inspire Russky Troops

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UTExan
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8:21p, 9/11/26
And here we are worried about Protestant Christian Nationalism when it's been a thing in Europe for centuries.

" Bone fragments from the sword hand of a medieval Russian prince who won a famous victory over the Mongols have been sent to the front in Ukraine to raise army morale in the Russian Orthodox Church's latest show of support for President Vladimir Putin's war.
The sarco****us of Grand Prince Dmitry Donskoy, who died in 1389 and is revered by Russian nationalists for defeating the Mongol Golden Horde at the 1380 Battle of Kulikovo, was uncovered this summer during restoration work at Moscow's Cathedral of the Archangel inside the Kremlin."

" The Russian Orthodox Church, which has backed Putin throughout the conflict, said it had dispatched a fragment of Donskoy's right hand to Donetsk, one of four Ukrainian regions Putin said he had incorporated into Russia in 2022, a move Kyiv rejected as an illegal land grab.
Referring to Donskoy as "the holy commander," the Moscow Patriarchate of the Russian Orthodox Church said part of his remains had been sent to the front to stand invisibly shoulder-to-shoulder with Russian troops."
https://www.defensenews.com/global/2026/09/10/russia-sends-bones-of-medieval-warrior-prince-to-ukraine-front-to-boost-morale/
“If you’re going to have crime it should at least be organized crime”
-Havelock Vetinari
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CrackerJackAg
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9:03p, 9/11/26
AG
I'm curious. Is your problem actually the veneration of relics or is it that the Russian Orthodox Church doesn't see things the same way that you do.

Believe it or not, your adversary may not see things the same way that you do.

If you are hoping for a Christian nationalistic movement in America, then I'm curious, which of the thousands of denominations you would want to head up that type of thing.

I wouldn't trust any protestant group to be in charge of anything and would choose a secular government first in that scenario.

Most protestants in this country can't agree on the basics.

If it's in regards to relics, then I don't know what that would be.

The veneration of relics is neither novel nor foreign it has been standard Christian practice since the beginning, and remains the norm for the vast majority of Christians worldwide today.

Physical matter being sanctified by God's grace is rooted directly in Scripture:

2 Kings 13:21 A dead man was revived back to life simply by touching the bones of Elisha.

Acts 19:1112 Handkerchiefs and aprons that touched Paul carried healing and drove out evil spirits.

Acts 5:15 People placed the sick in the streets so that Peter's shadow might fall across them.

In the 2nd century, the Church at Smyrna collected the bones of the martyred bishop Polycarp (c. 155 AD), calling them "more valuable than precious stones and finer than refined gold," gathering at his tomb to celebrate the Liturgy.

The earliest Christians celebrated the Eucharist directly over the bones of martyrs in the catacombs.

Christianity is incarnational. The bodies of the saints were temples of the Holy Spirit (1 Cor 6:19) and are destined for bodily resurrection.

Even Protestants instinctively understand this when they visit the graves of their parents or fallen soldiers. You bring flowers, stand in silence, and treat the physical site with solemn reverence. If ordinary human intuition recognizes that physical remains matter, why should the Church not reverence the remains of those who lived and died in Christ?



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UTExan
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In reply to CrackerJackAg • 9:22p, 9/11/26
Perhaps I am trying to understand why American "Christian nationalism" is such a problem for some here when it manifests so benignly compared to the brutal Russian subjugation of peoples they have conquered and why the Russian Orthodox hierarchy supports it.
“If you’re going to have crime it should at least be organized crime”
-Havelock Vetinari
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CrackerJackAg
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In reply to UTExan • 9:35p, 9/11/26
AG
UTExan said:
Perhaps I am trying to understand why American "Christian nationalism" is such a problem for some here when it manifests so benignly compared to the brutal Russian subjugation of peoples they have conquered and why the Russian Orthodox hierarchy supports it.


For me personally, and I imagine this is probably shared with different groups and individuals

American Protestantism is so fractured divided and all over the place with some straight into lunacy (Christian Dispensationalism out other whacky prophetical groups) that I would never ever want it to have any influence on our government.

It would have the potential, depending on who's in charge, to be right up there with the Iranian Death Cult regime in nuttiness.

That's the nicest way I can put that unfortunately.
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Serotonin
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In reply to UTExan • 10:06p, 9/11/26
AG
UTExan said:
Perhaps I am trying to understand why American "Christian nationalism" is such a problem for some here when it manifests so benignly compared to the brutal Russian subjugation of peoples they have conquered and why the Russian Orthodox hierarchy supports it.

I mean…I don't want to speak for our more liberal posters on here (the people who don't like the idea of American "Christian nationalism") but…I'm going out a limb here…I don't think they're fans of Russian Christian nationalism.
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Serotonin
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10:17p, 9/11/26
AG
But seriously, have you been checked out of American politics the last five years? Putin and Russia have been #1 bad guy for American and Western European liberals up until Israel bombed everything in Gaza and Netanyahu took the #1 spot.

This would be like me saying "why are people so critical of American foreign policy when it's completely benign compared to Israel?"

Uh, the same people who would protest American foreign policy have been LOUDLY critical of Israel.
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Vox Clamantis
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In reply to UTExan • 5:45a, 9/12/26
UTExan said:
Perhaps I am trying to understand why American "Christian nationalism" is such a problem for some here when it manifests so benignly compared to the brutal Russian subjugation of peoples they have conquered and why the Russian Orthodox hierarchy supports it.


The only people worried about Christian nationalism hate both Christianity and nationalism, so I wouldn't worry much about their opinions
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Vox Clamantis
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In reply to CrackerJackAg • 5:46a, 9/12/26
CrackerJackAg said:
UTExan said:
Perhaps I am trying to understand why American "Christian nationalism" is such a problem for some here when it manifests so benignly compared to the brutal Russian subjugation of peoples they have conquered and why the Russian Orthodox hierarchy supports it.


For me personally, and I imagine this is probably shared with different groups and individuals

American Protestantism is so fractured divided and all over the place with some straight into lunacy (Christian Dispensationalism out other whacky prophetical groups) that I would never ever want it to have any influence on our government.

It would have the potential, depending on who's in charge, to be right up there with the Iranian Death Cult regime in nuttiness.

That's the nicest way I can put that unfortunately.


Yeah, imagine what would happen if Dispensationalists rose to high positions in our government?
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CrackerJackAg
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In reply to Vox Clamantis • 7:35a, 9/12/26
AG
Vox Clamantis said:
CrackerJackAg said:
UTExan said:
Perhaps I am trying to understand why American "Christian nationalism" is such a problem for some here when it manifests so benignly compared to the brutal Russian subjugation of peoples they have conquered and why the Russian Orthodox hierarchy supports it.


For me personally, and I imagine this is probably shared with different groups and individuals

American Protestantism is so fractured divided and all over the place with some straight into lunacy (Christian Dispensationalism out other whacky prophetical groups) that I would never ever want it to have any influence on our government.

It would have the potential, depending on who's in charge, to be right up there with the Iranian Death Cult regime in nuttiness.

That's the nicest way I can put that unfortunately.


Yeah, imagine what would happen if Dispensationalists rose to high positions in our government?


Don't really have to unfortunately…
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CrackerJackAg
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In reply to Vox Clamantis • 7:41a, 9/12/26
AG
Vox Clamantis said:
UTExan said:
Perhaps I am trying to understand why American "Christian nationalism" is such a problem for some here when it manifests so benignly compared to the brutal Russian subjugation of peoples they have conquered and why the Russian Orthodox hierarchy supports it.


The only people worried about Christian nationalism hate both Christianity and nationalism, so I wouldn't worry much about their opinions


Me… I'm a hard right nationalist.

I am a very conservative Orthodox Christian.

I don't want to live in a Protestant Dystopia.

Christ and America aren't the issue.

It's a lack of trust that Protestants could be successful. We would end up with Lesbian and Trans pastors as magistrates running our lives after it was co-opted because there is no firm Traditions and safe guards against insanity.
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UTExan
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In reply to CrackerJackAg • 8:43a, 9/12/26
CrackerJackAg said:
UTExan said:
Perhaps I am trying to understand why American "Christian nationalism" is such a problem for some here when it manifests so benignly compared to the brutal Russian subjugation of peoples they have conquered and why the Russian Orthodox hierarchy supports it.


For me personally, and I imagine this is probably shared with different groups and individuals

American Protestantism is so fractured divided and all over the place with some straight into lunacy (Christian Dispensationalism out other whacky prophetical groups) that I would never ever want it to have any influence on our government.

It would have the potential, depending on who's in charge, to be right up there with the Iranian Death Cult regime in nuttiness.

That's the nicest way I can put that unfortunately.

And you don't think that the Russian Orthodox hierarchy blessing Russian invasion troops is not nutty? Of course, now, Orthodox Russia is kidnapping Africans and employing atheistic North Koreans to fight for them.
And you call the Protestants whacky.
I won't even get into Roman Catholics supporting and blessing dictators like Francisco Franco or Benito Mussolini or any of the Latin American dictators.

You live in a basically Protestant-formed country here in the US. Be grateful for that fact, that Protestant Christian pioneers, soldiers, scientists and farmers offered up a society that was stable and prosperous who twice rescued the old Europe from its own follies and hatred of minorities. I have ancestors who fled France for Holland due to Catholic oppression.

Orthodox and Catholics emigrated by the millions to this (Protestant) country because the countries which embraced the Orthodox and Catholic cultures trapped their citizens in poverty and oppression. Protestants did not emigrate to Orthodox or Catholic countries.

As to Dispensationalism:

“If you’re going to have crime it should at least be organized crime”
-Havelock Vetinari
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Vox Clamantis
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In reply to CrackerJackAg • 10:11a, 9/12/26
CrackerJackAg said:
Vox Clamantis said:
UTExan said:
Perhaps I am trying to understand why American "Christian nationalism" is such a problem for some here when it manifests so benignly compared to the brutal Russian subjugation of peoples they have conquered and why the Russian Orthodox hierarchy supports it.


The only people worried about Christian nationalism hate both Christianity and nationalism, so I wouldn't worry much about their opinions


Me… I'm a hard right nationalist.

I am a very conservative Orthodox Christian.

I don't want to live in a Protestant Dystopia.

Christ and America aren't the issue.

It's a lack of trust that Protestants could be successful. We would end up with Lesbian and Trans pastors as magistrates running our lives after it was co-opted because there is no firm Traditions and safe guards against insanity.


No, I'm not talking about you, I'm talking about the people whining about Christian nationalism Utexan is trying to gotcha. We cannot care about those people, they're lost
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Vox Clamantis
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In reply to UTExan • 10:17a, 9/12/26
UTExan said:
CrackerJackAg said:
UTExan said:
Perhaps I am trying to understand why American "Christian nationalism" is such a problem for some here when it manifests so benignly compared to the brutal Russian subjugation of peoples they have conquered and why the Russian Orthodox hierarchy supports it.


For me personally, and I imagine this is probably shared with different groups and individuals

American Protestantism is so fractured divided and all over the place with some straight into lunacy (Christian Dispensationalism out other whacky prophetical groups) that I would never ever want it to have any influence on our government.

It would have the potential, depending on who's in charge, to be right up there with the Iranian Death Cult regime in nuttiness.

That's the nicest way I can put that unfortunately.

And you don't think that the Russian Orthodox hierarchy blessing Russian invasion troops is not nutty? Of course, now, Orthodox Russia is kidnapping Africans and employing atheistic North Koreans to fight for them.
And you call the Protestants whacky.
I won't even get into Roman Catholics supporting and blessing dictators like Francisco Franco or Benito Mussolini or any of the Latin American dictators.

You live in a basically Protestant-formed country here in the US. Be grateful for that fact, that Protestant Christian pioneers, soldiers, scientists and farmers offered up a society that was stable and prosperous who twice rescued the old Europe from its own follies and hatred of minorities. I have ancestors who fled France for Holland due to Catholic oppression.

Orthodox and Catholics emigrated by the millions to this (Protestant) country because the countries which embraced the Orthodox and Catholic cultures trapped their citizens in poverty and oppression. Protestants did not emigrate to Orthodox or Catholic countries.

As to Dispensationalism:



You are insane for crediting Protestantism with those things. Protestantism took 1200 years of Western civilization formed and protected by the apostolic church, and burned through the retained social capital of heterogenous Catholic Europe in like 2 centuries.

Protestantism has been the genesis of moral relativism, women's lib, universal suffrage, and virtually everything ailing the west in this moment.

Congrats for patting yourself for the managed decline Protestantism engineered after centuries of Apostolic western civilization
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UTExan
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In reply to Vox Clamantis • 10:24a, 9/12/26
Quote:
Protestantism has been the genesis of moral relativism, women's lib, universal suffrage, and virtually everything ailing the west in this moment.

You are confusing "protestantism" (really the western American trajectory of Christianity) with a cultura/societal slide to philistinism and narcissism, because many reject Jesus. Cultural degradation is not unique to Protestant countries; it is a feature of what happens when countries are too comfortable materially.
“If you’re going to have crime it should at least be organized crime”
-Havelock Vetinari
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Vox Clamantis
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In reply to UTExan • 10:40a, 9/12/26
UTExan said:
Quote:
Protestantism has been the genesis of moral relativism, women's lib, universal suffrage, and virtually everything ailing the west in this moment.

You are confusing "protestantism" (really the western American trajectory of Christianity) with a cultura/societal slide to philistinism and narcissism, because many reject Jesus. Cultural degradation is not unique to Protestant countries; it is a feature of what happens when countries are too comfortable materially.


Protestantism's rejection of authority, emphasis on personal revelation and individualism are the genesis of all of those things I mentioned.

In Protestantism, there is a fixed source of morality, but it can be interpreted in a billion different ways by a billion different individuals which absolutely neuters its theology and practice, and creates a gigantic vacuum where relativism grows.

If Pastor Joe says A is right, but Pastor Bill says B is right, is anything really right? Or is morality just a preference?

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UTExan
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In reply to Vox Clamantis • 11:36a, 9/12/26
That puts the spiritual responsibility on me instead of relying on a class of created confessors or interpreters of scripture.
“If you’re going to have crime it should at least be organized crime”
-Havelock Vetinari
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Vox Clamantis
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In reply to UTExan • 12:10p, 9/12/26
UTExan said:
That puts the spiritual responsibility on me instead of relying on a class of created confessors or interpreters of scripture.


Great, how is it working out for James Talarico? Even with our heretics in the Catholic Church I have the ability to point at them and say "heretic! That is NOT what we believe"

Every single heresy ever came about with someone's personal interpretation of scripture. Hell Talarico cited the annunciation for why he believe God is Pro-Choice.
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UTExan
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In reply to Vox Clamantis • 1:33p, 9/12/26
Better ask Talarico.

"Protestant" churches, creedal or not, generally hold that the apostolic creed is a sufficient statement of belief to avoid heresy. The "catholic" church we believe in refers to the body of believers regardless of denomination.
“If you’re going to have crime it should at least be organized crime”
-Havelock Vetinari
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10andBOUNCE
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In reply to Vox Clamantis • 2:09p, 9/12/26
AG
Vox Clamantis said:
UTExan said:
Quote:
Protestantism has been the genesis of moral relativism, women's lib, universal suffrage, and virtually everything ailing the west in this moment.

You are confusing "protestantism" (really the western American trajectory of Christianity) with a cultura/societal slide to philistinism and narcissism, because many reject Jesus. Cultural degradation is not unique to Protestant countries; it is a feature of what happens when countries are too comfortable materially.


Protestantism's rejection of authority, emphasis on personal revelation and individualism are the genesis of all of those things I mentioned.

In Protestantism, there is a fixed source of morality, but it can be interpreted in a billion different ways by a billion different individuals which absolutely neuters its theology and practice, and creates a gigantic vacuum where relativism grows.

If Pastor Joe says A is right, but Pastor Bill says B is right, is anything really right? Or is morality just a preference?


I'm sorry you believe all this is true. Must be a deep echo chamber you're trapped in.
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UTExan
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In reply to 10andBOUNCE • 3:01p, 9/12/26
Nm
“If you’re going to have crime it should at least be organized crime”
-Havelock Vetinari
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CrackerJackAg
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In reply to UTExan • 5:08p, 9/12/26
AG
UTExan said:
Better ask Talarico.

"Protestant" churches, creedal or not, generally hold that the apostolic creed is a sufficient statement of belief to avoid heresy. The "catholic" church we believe in refers to the body of believers regardless of denomination.


You came to this thread, and created it, not seeking valid discussion. You thought you had some sort of weird dunk that you don't because of your odd theological and ecclesiastical beliefs. You are just seeking division and fermenting hatefulness.

After this post, I won't be replying back to anything that you have to say. It's not valid discussion…

Any way.

Catholic (Universal) most certainly does not mean the fractured landscape of American denominationalism.

The idea that thousands of mutually contradictory Protestant sects constitute the "catholic" Church is sheer delusion.

Protestants cannot even agree among themselves on the sacraments, the nature of salvation, or basic moral teachings or let alone claim visible unity.

Rome does not consider Protestant denominations to be churches in the proper sense, but separated "ecclesial communities."

Orthodoxy has never recognized an invisible, pick-and-choose federation of believers as the One, Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic Church and generally doesn't find interaction with you guys fruitful.

For the first 1,500 years of Christianity, "catholic" meant a visible, unified, sacramental body sharing one faith, one chalice, and apostolic succession. Most certainly not an umbrella term for theological chaos and **** show off the protestant faith (whatever that is)

Claiming that reciting the bare minimum of the Apostles' Creed paper over massive doctrinal divisions is absurd.

It's redefining "catholic" into whatever allows modern whacky individualism to feel comfortable with the insanity they spew.

Nobody outside of Protestantism buys that definition, and a growing number of Protestants walking through Orthodox doors don't buy it anymore either.


Also, there's no way I'm watching your goofy propaganda dispensationalism video. We have The Church and a valid Tradition that we rely on, so I'm not gonna give the wacky content creator any clicks.

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747Ag
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In reply to Vox Clamantis • 5:17p, 9/12/26
AG
Vox Clamantis said:
UTExan said:
That puts the spiritual responsibility on me instead of relying on a class of created confessors or interpreters of scripture.


Great, how is it working out for James Talarico? Even with our heretics in the Catholic Church I have the ability to point at them and say "heretic! That is NOT what we believe"

Every single heresy ever came about with someone's personal interpretation of scripture. Hell Talarico cited the annunciation for why he believe God is Pro-Choice.

I'm briefly in Texas visiting family. Wife's baby brother getting married next weekend. What is this Talarico and why should I care as a Florida Man?
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CrackerJackAg
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In reply to 747Ag • 5:21p, 9/12/26
AG
747Ag said:
Vox Clamantis said:
UTExan said:
That puts the spiritual responsibility on me instead of relying on a class of created confessors or interpreters of scripture.


Great, how is it working out for James Talarico? Even with our heretics in the Catholic Church I have the ability to point at them and say "heretic! That is NOT what we believe"

Every single heresy ever came about with someone's personal interpretation of scripture. Hell Talarico cited the annunciation for why he believe God is Pro-Choice.

I'm briefly in Texas visiting family. Wife's baby brother getting married next weekend. What is this Talarico and why should I care as a Florida Man?


Talarico is a run-of-the-mill Protestant whack-a-doodle.

Since a good bit of protestants cannot recognize heresies and beliefs completely antithetical to Christianity they are falling for his preacher schtick and false Christianity.

The dude very well may be in the US Senate so even as a Florida man, you should care. If Texas goes America goes.

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Sapper Redux
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In reply to Vox Clamantis • 5:38p, 9/12/26
Vox Clamantis said:
UTExan said:
Perhaps I am trying to understand why American "Christian nationalism" is such a problem for some here when it manifests so benignly compared to the brutal Russian subjugation of peoples they have conquered and why the Russian Orthodox hierarchy supports it.


The only people worried about Christian nationalism hate both Christianity and nationalism, so I wouldn't worry much about their opinions


They aren't really people, right?
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UTExan
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In reply to CrackerJackAg • 7:14p, 9/12/26
CrackerJackAg said:
747Ag said:
Vox Clamantis said:
UTExan said:
That puts the spiritual responsibility on me instead of relying on a class of created confessors or interpreters of scripture.


Great, how is it working out for James Talarico? Even with our heretics in the Catholic Church I have the ability to point at them and say "heretic! That is NOT what we believe"

Every single heresy ever came about with someone's personal interpretation of scripture. Hell Talarico cited the annunciation for why he believe God is Pro-Choice.

I'm briefly in Texas visiting family. Wife's baby brother getting married next weekend. What is this Talarico and why should I care as a Florida Man?


Talarico is a run-of-the-mill Protestant whack-a-doodle.

Since a good bit of protestants cannot recognize heresies and beliefs completely antithetical to Christianity they are falling for his preacher schtick and false Christianity.

The dude very well may be in the US Senate so even as a Florida man, you should care. If Texas goes America goes.



Since you cannot address nor do you respect the diversity of Protestant Christianity other than to use language such as "insane" or other pejoratives to describe its differences with Catholicism, I suspect there's not any common ground to discuss issues. I think it strange to use corporeal relics as military inspiration but that's just me.
“If you’re going to have crime it should at least be organized crime”
-Havelock Vetinari
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CrackerJackAg
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In reply to UTExan • 7:28p, 9/12/26
AG

You were not seeking true heartfelt and genuine discussion.

You got what you were seeking and I should have just ignored this topic but I responded to you being inflammatory.

Goodnight. Best wishes.

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UTExan
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8:07p, 9/12/26
And Europe is once again discovering evangelical Christianity-
Sweden:


And France:
“If you’re going to have crime it should at least be organized crime”
-Havelock Vetinari
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In reply to UTExan • 10:22p, 9/12/26
AG
UTExan said:
And Europe is once again discovering evangelical Christianity-
Sweden:


And France:


I had to look this up. Not quite what you think.

Gemini

Scandinavia's version of Christianity evolved strangely because it was converted into a top-down, state-run civil department during the Protestant Reformation and never recovered.
Why Scandinavian Christianity Became Anomalous
Bureaucratic State Monopolies: In the 16th century, Gustav Vasa of Sweden and Christian III of Denmark-Norway seized Church property and transformed the national Lutheran churches into royal administrative organs. Pastors effectively functioned as civil servants tracking taxes, births, and census records.
The "Folk Church" (Folkkyrka) Concept: Membership became synonymous with citizenship rather than active faith. For centuries, every Swede was automatically baptized and enrolled into the Church of Sweden at birth by default (a legal requirement not fully untangled until 2000).
Extreme Modern Theological Liberalism: Because these state churches remained tethered to secular parliaments rather than conciliar dogma or Holy Tradition, they aggressively morphed alongside modern Scandinavian social democracy. Today, the Church of Sweden has bishops who openly question core tenets like the physical Resurrection or the unique divinity of Christ.
Cultural Belonging Without Belief: Sociologists call Scandinavia's posture "believing without belonging" or "belonging without believing." The vast majority only step foot in a church for weddings, funerals, or Saint Lucy's Day, viewing Christianity merely as cultural folklore and aesthetic heritage.
The Forum Context: Evangelical "Awakenings" in Europe
UTExan is sharing typical American Evangelical media tropes: taking tiny, localized blips of charismatic or Pentecostal enthusiasm and framing them as massive spiritual revivals.
The Reality in France: France is overwhelmingly secular (lacit). Growth in French Evangelicalism is real, but it is overwhelmingly driven by immigrationprimarily Sub-Saharan African, Caribbean, and Latin American immigrants gathering in suburban Paris warehousesnot an organic conversion of native French society.
The Reality in Sweden: Sweden remains one of the most thoroughly secularized societies in human history. A modest increase in charismatic churches like Livets Ord (Word of Life) in Uppsala does not signal a national awakening. Ironically, Ulf Ekman, the founder of Livets Ord and the grandfather of the modern Swedish evangelical movement, shocked everyone in 2014 by renouncing Protestantism and converting to traditional Catholicism.
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Vox Clamantis
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In reply to UTExan • 2:48a, 9/13/26
UTExan said:
CrackerJackAg said:
747Ag said:
Vox Clamantis said:
UTExan said:
That puts the spiritual responsibility on me instead of relying on a class of created confessors or interpreters of scripture.


Great, how is it working out for James Talarico? Even with our heretics in the Catholic Church I have the ability to point at them and say "heretic! That is NOT what we believe"

Every single heresy ever came about with someone's personal interpretation of scripture. Hell Talarico cited the annunciation for why he believe God is Pro-Choice.

I'm briefly in Texas visiting family. Wife's baby brother getting married next weekend. What is this Talarico and why should I care as a Florida Man?


Talarico is a run-of-the-mill Protestant whack-a-doodle.

Since a good bit of protestants cannot recognize heresies and beliefs completely antithetical to Christianity they are falling for his preacher schtick and false Christianity.

The dude very well may be in the US Senate so even as a Florida man, you should care. If Texas goes America goes.



Since you cannot address nor do you respect the diversity of Protestant Christianity other than to use language such as "insane" or other pejoratives to describe its differences with Catholicism, I suspect there's not any common ground to discuss issues. I think it strange to use corporeal relics as military inspiration but that's just me.


Diversity? I thought we were looking for unity? Correct me if I'm wrong, but does Christ say "that they be diverse, as you father are in me, and I in you?"

I think I see the problem
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In reply to CrackerJackAg • 7:19a, 9/13/26
AG
CrackerJackAg said:
747Ag said:
Vox Clamantis said:
UTExan said:
That puts the spiritual responsibility on me instead of relying on a class of created confessors or interpreters of scripture.


Great, how is it working out for James Talarico? Even with our heretics in the Catholic Church I have the ability to point at them and say "heretic! That is NOT what we believe"

Every single heresy ever came about with someone's personal interpretation of scripture. Hell Talarico cited the annunciation for why he believe God is Pro-Choice.

I'm briefly in Texas visiting family. Wife's baby brother getting married next weekend. What is this Talarico and why should I care as a Florida Man?


Talarico is a run-of-the-mill Protestant whack-a-doodle.

Since a good bit of protestants cannot recognize heresies and beliefs completely antithetical to Christianity they are falling for his preacher schtick and false Christianity.

The dude very well may be in the US Senate so even as a Florida man, you should care. If Texas goes America goes.


This basically disqualifies your opinion on Protestants if you classify Talarico as a "run of the mill" one.
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In reply to Sapper Redux • 7:29a, 9/13/26
Sapper Redux said:
Vox Clamantis said:
UTExan said:
Perhaps I am trying to understand why American "Christian nationalism" is such a problem for some here when it manifests so benignly compared to the brutal Russian subjugation of peoples they have conquered and why the Russian Orthodox hierarchy supports it.


The only people worried about Christian nationalism hate both Christianity and nationalism, so I wouldn't worry much about their opinions


They aren't really people, right?


Are you talking about unborn children or liberals?

You're in favor of legal protections for vacuuming the skulls out of one of the groups from their mother's womb, while I'm against doing so to both groups.

You're the bad guy Sapper
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In reply to 747Ag • 7:49a, 9/13/26
747Ag said:
Vox Clamantis said:
UTExan said:
That puts the spiritual responsibility on me instead of relying on a class of created confessors or interpreters of scripture.


Great, how is it working out for James Talarico? Even with our heretics in the Catholic Church I have the ability to point at them and say "heretic! That is NOT what we believe"

Every single heresy ever came about with someone's personal interpretation of scripture. Hell Talarico cited the annunciation for why he believe God is Pro-Choice.

I'm briefly in Texas visiting family. Wife's baby brother getting married next weekend. What is this Talarico and why should I care as a Florida Man?


He is the newest Democrat skin suit pretending to be a folksy Protestant pastor who has a decent chance of being the junior Texas senator, because Ken Paxton while light years better than Cornyn is an absolute degenerate.

He argues that since God gave Mary the choice to bear Jesus, he supports abortion.
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In reply to 10andBOUNCE • 7:53a, 9/13/26
10andBOUNCE said:
Vox Clamantis said:
UTExan said:
Quote:
Protestantism has been the genesis of moral relativism, women's lib, universal suffrage, and virtually everything ailing the west in this moment.

You are confusing "protestantism" (really the western American trajectory of Christianity) with a cultura/societal slide to philistinism and narcissism, because many reject Jesus. Cultural degradation is not unique to Protestant countries; it is a feature of what happens when countries are too comfortable materially.


Protestantism's rejection of authority, emphasis on personal revelation and individualism are the genesis of all of those things I mentioned.

In Protestantism, there is a fixed source of morality, but it can be interpreted in a billion different ways by a billion different individuals which absolutely neuters its theology and practice, and creates a gigantic vacuum where relativism grows.

If Pastor Joe says A is right, but Pastor Bill says B is right, is anything really right? Or is morality just a preference?


I'm sorry you believe all this is true. Must be a deep echo chamber you're trapped in.


Let's play a game. What was mainstream Protestant's opinion on artificial birth control 100 years ago, and now today.

Same for divorce and remarriage and the ordination of women.

We know what the answer will be. Then, tell me how the Holy Spirit moved among the Protestant faithful at the same exact time society's opinions on the subject changed.

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In reply to Vox Clamantis • 8:13a, 9/13/26
AG
Vox Clamantis said:
747Ag said:
Vox Clamantis said:
UTExan said:
That puts the spiritual responsibility on me instead of relying on a class of created confessors or interpreters of scripture.


Great, how is it working out for James Talarico? Even with our heretics in the Catholic Church I have the ability to point at them and say "heretic! That is NOT what we believe"

Every single heresy ever came about with someone's personal interpretation of scripture. Hell Talarico cited the annunciation for why he believe God is Pro-Choice.

I'm briefly in Texas visiting family. Wife's baby brother getting married next weekend. What is this Talarico and why should I care as a Florida Man?


He is the newest Democrat skin suit pretending to be a folksy Protestant pastor.

At least you are being fair and saying he's pretending to be…so he's either pretending or is a "run of the mill" Protestant
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In reply to Vox Clamantis • 8:19a, 9/13/26
AG
Vox Clamantis said:
10andBOUNCE said:
Vox Clamantis said:
UTExan said:
Quote:
Protestantism has been the genesis of moral relativism, women's lib, universal suffrage, and virtually everything ailing the west in this moment.

You are confusing "protestantism" (really the western American trajectory of Christianity) with a cultura/societal slide to philistinism and narcissism, because many reject Jesus. Cultural degradation is not unique to Protestant countries; it is a feature of what happens when countries are too comfortable materially.


Protestantism's rejection of authority, emphasis on personal revelation and individualism are the genesis of all of those things I mentioned.

In Protestantism, there is a fixed source of morality, but it can be interpreted in a billion different ways by a billion different individuals which absolutely neuters its theology and practice, and creates a gigantic vacuum where relativism grows.

If Pastor Joe says A is right, but Pastor Bill says B is right, is anything really right? Or is morality just a preference?


I'm sorry you believe all this is true. Must be a deep echo chamber you're trapped in.


Let's play a game. What was mainstream Protestant's opinion on artificial birth control 100 years ago, and now today.

Same for divorce and remarriage and the ordination of women.

We know what the answer will be. Then, tell me how the Holy Spirit moved among the Protestant faithful at the same exact time society's opinions on the subject changed.


I feel like this is picking at such extremes of the spectrum. Yes, obviously the conglomerate that Protestantism is known as and has become in the modern sense is something I also am not a fan of. As I have said on many other threads, I don't see how it is fair to lump in any modern progressive anti-pope churches into this big bucket and pretend like we all know each other but yet have different beliefs and come up with whatever personal revelation we want. Yes, there are heretical cults, but the majority do find common ground on the basics. All that said, I see no value or point in even maintaining a group called Protestants who are so far gone from the original intent.
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