Do you believe in the Great Flood story?

46,035 Views | 412 Replies | Last: 9 yr ago by oragator
SapperAg
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AG
Wow. You've never taken a course or read a book on evolutionary anthropology, have you? Just admit it. I don't even know where to start on that post.
Martin Q. Blank
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Sapper an expert on evolutionary anthropology. Spreadsheet updated.
SapperAg
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AG
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Sapper an expert on evolutionary anthropology. Spreadsheet updated.
Paleontology is a passion. Evolutionary anthropology is more of a side subject important in my historical work. It's good to know where we come from.
Martin Q. Blank
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MQB, mocking people without saying anything substantive. Aka business as usual for him.
I contributed on page juan.
Line up and wait 18L
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Amazing Moves
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Catholics don't believe the bible should be taken literally.
SapperAg
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AG
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As a believer and follower of Jesus Christ, I believe in the Bible as written. How can you pick and chose? If you're a non-believer, ok, whatever. If you identify yourself as a believer you must believe in all of the Bible or none of it. If you disagree with that statement, please identify which parts of the bible are true and which are false and how you know this. Thanks.


Your type of literalist interpretation is maybe 200 years old.
Jacques
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As a believer and follower of Jesus Christ, I believe in the Bible as written. How can you pick and chose? If you're a non-believer, ok, whatever. If you identify yourself as a believer you must believe in all of the Bible or none of it. If you disagree with that statement, please identify which parts of the bible are true and which are false and how you know this. Thanks.


I don't know that I'm called on to believe what I think may be stories to illustrate a point. I'm called on to get the point.
Line up and wait 18L
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Amazing Moves
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Catholics don't believe the bible should be taken literally.
I'm not a Catholic. I'm a believer.
What are you saying here? I would rather not assume.
Woody2006
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AG
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Catholics don't believe the bible should be taken literally.
I'm not a Catholic. I'm a believer.
Do you believe Jesus' parables were literal? Why couldn't the story of Job be the same?
Woody2006
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AG
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Catholics don't believe the bible should be taken literally.
I'm not a Catholic. I'm a believer.
What are you saying here? I would rather not assume.
He's saying Catholics aren't real Christians. This belief is more widespread in the Protestant world than many people like to admit.
Madman
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AG
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Catholics don't believe the bible should be taken literally.
I'm not a Catholic. I'm a believer.
You have probably read a bit on the topic then. The Catholic church has taken a pretty consistent stance on not taking everything in the bible as factual events. It could be argued it was one of the reasons they fought so hard to keep the bible out of the common tongue so as to prevent confusion on some topics. I don't know if that is the reason for example that they tried so hard to keep the bible from being translated to english but it is one explanation .
SapperAg
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AG
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Catholics don't believe the bible should be taken literally.
I'm not a Catholic. I'm a believer.


Your interpretation of the Bible (and it is an interpretation) is 200 years old. Are you saying there were no Christians for the first 1800 years of Chistianity?
Line up and wait 18L
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PA24
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AG
Some of you non believers have such a condescending tone on this board. I guess it is because you are so much smarter than everyone else and it gets kinda lonely not having an equal to talk with.

I suggest Charity work for the masses, may ease the pain and help mankind at the same time.








SapperAg
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AG
Then why the "I'm a believer," bit? Are Catholics not believers?
SapperAg
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AG
Assuming we don't do charity work is pretty damn condescending.
bigtatum
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When you say, "not a catholic, a believer," that sentence structure implies Catholics are not believers.

Lots of non believers and members of other faiths commit to charity. I am trying to donate tomore charity outside my church since my church donations really fund many of the services I consume myself.
PA24
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AG

I don't think counting carbon credits counts as charity work
bigtatum
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I don't think counting carbon credits counts as charity work


Are you acting Christlike by calling others uncharitable particularly when you have no basis for such a claim?
SapperAg
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AG
Woody2006
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AG
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Catholics don't believe the bible should be taken literally.
I'm not a Catholic. I'm a believer.
What are you saying here? I would rather not assume.
He's saying Catholics aren't real Christians. This belief is more widespread in the Protestant world than many people like to admit.
You know good and well that's not what I said. I merely said I wasnt a Catholic. Nothing more and nothing less. If you want to make stuff up then go right ahead.

Perhaps you didn't mean that, but it certainly comes across that way.
SapperAg
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AG
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I don't think counting carbon credits counts as charity work


Ignorance is never a virtue.
PA24
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AG
I am non denomination, I don't feel bad about picking on arrogant folks, especially the liberal types.
PA24
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AG
No offense sap
bigtatum
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I am non denomination, I don't feel bad about picking on arrogant folks, especially the liberal types.


Do you think implying others are arrogant is Christlike?
PA24
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AG
I believe in the grace and the truth. My sins have been washed by the blood of Christ hence the grace.

The truth is recognizing sin and identifying it.

The truth hurts aye?
Marco Esquandolas
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AG
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I believe in the grace and the truth. My sins have been washed by the blood of Christ hence the grace.

The truth is recognizing sin and identifying it.

The truth hurts aye?



Well if we are gonna start slinging mud at people we have never met,...

You are exactly the kind of Christian that makes people not want to be Christians.
Aggrad08
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AG
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Anthropology is an open ended field, there's always more to discover. Skeptics once upon a time said the bible was wrong about the hittites. Whoops.
This is a red herring. Not noticing a very small tribe in a small location is very different than not noticing shipbuilding, agriculture, domestication or winemaking for 40k years at every single fossil site bar none. It's a desperate and unsubstantiated claim to say we had such technology back then. The only thing more absurd is noah living 600 years.

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Neanderthals weren't behaviorally modern humans. They were basically apes.
They were so close we have strong evidence for mating between us. Much closer than chimps despite your claim. It's quite obvious from looking at them let alone the DNA.

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They were on this planet at least 200,000 years if not more, and still didn't advance as far as a species as we did in 20,000 years.
Anatomically modern humans are just as old. Behavior does not make a species. Even if you want to argue that there was a slight genetic variation, this variation must have occurred prior to the africa dispersal.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anatomically_modern_humans

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If they were humans, they would have accomplished a lot more, wouldn't have gone extinct so quickly, and they would share 100% of our DNA, not 99 point whatever.
No one said they were the same species, only extremely close. And there are a litany of reasons why they might die out, not the least of which is conflict with homo sapiens.

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Hell, the brown bear in europe has lasted way longer than they did once humans arrived.
You think this proves something? You realize humans are outlasted by a litany of creatures. It's a non-sequitur.

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200,000+ freakin' years, and they couldn't graduate past basic primitive tools and maybe burials (hell, elephants bury their dead, big deal, don't think anyone is claiming elephants are humans) and couldn't outlast the brown bears.
I think you are fantastically ignorant of human history and just confused if you think brown bears have anything to do with anything. There are tribes of humans today that still never graduated past basic primitive tools. Are they not human?

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Us humans have been around way less than half that time and we've already colonized the entire planet and gone to freakin outer space and to the moon. Not a very impressive resume for the neanderthals.
Actually we've been around much longer than half the time and even if I granted for no reason that 50k years ago we poofed into a new species, that species was still widespread across multiple continents. Further, as perviously noted, some humans today have the same technology, so that argument seems limited.
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The out of africa theory tries to pinpoint the geographic origin of anatomically modern humans, which weren't behaviorally modern humans, they were apes (As I mentioned previously, their resume is less than impressive) and part of the animal kingdom if you're relating it to the biblical model.
How do you explain primitive societies still around today? They are just as smart, those primitives today are human beings. It took us that long to build up our society. We had human beings make it this entire time without advancing technology for 10s of thousands of year. Are they not human? Are they just animals? Where exactly is the differentiation, And once again, we have evidence of humans spread across multiple continents by 50k year ago. And we of course have clear indications of when we developed various technologies on multiple continents. None of them are even ballpark in this timeline.

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Behaviorally modern humans are a completely separate species apart from all previous forms of life.
Source? You are just making this up. You could easily breed with a human from 60k years ago. The distinction is about behavior not speciation.

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1) arrive suddenly without warning (read up on the great leap forward and continuity hypotheses, secular darwinist scientists are directionless and have no explanation or mechanism to explain this),
You realize the continuity hypotheses directly addresses the great leap forward and claims there was no such thing right? Neither notion is remotely established and It simply doesn't matter which theory you prefer, there was no flood that wiped out all but one family at this time, and there wasn't the technology you claim there was. You have no evidence, only a repurposed Gilgamesh epic. Behavior modernity is almost certainly liked to development of language.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Behavioral_modernity

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and 2) some of the earliest evidence of presence of behaviorally modern humans is being found in the middle east region, which corroborates and supports the biblical model.
And some of the earliest behaviorally modern humans are found far from here. No evidence supports your claims for humans being isolated in the middle east 50k years ago. No evidence supports a massive genetic bottleneck at this time or massive population reduction or elimination. No evidence supports technology shown even in the ballpark.

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Basically the out of africa model is a completely unrelated topic and irrelevant to the biblical model discussion, it's a completely different topic.
No it's not, as behavior modernity must have taken place prior to the africa exodus or must not have any genetic component.

"It is thus not established if the early Homo sapiens had the genetic requirements to be able to adopt modern human behavior, such as religious beliefs, through cultural interaction. If indeed the early Homo sapiens had the ability to learn modern human behavior, once invented by other groups, there is no geographic restriction where modern behavior originated. However, if the early Homo sapiens hypothetically were genetically inhibited from adopting modern human behaviors, since cultural universals are found in all cultures including some of the most isolated indigenous groups, these traits must have evolved or have been invented in Africa prior to the exodus.[6][7][8][9]
Madman
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AG
If you are white you probably have neaderthal DNA in some cases maybe as much as 8%. Old article but you get the point.

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2010/05/100506-science-neanderthals-humans-mated-interbred-dna-gene/

Edit

http://www.nature.com/news/mystery-humans-spiced-up-ancients-sex-lives-1.14196

Also if you are asian you may have DNA from yet another early human like species.
Madman
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AG
And also interesting, from a thread I started a while back.

http://texags.com/forums/16/topics/2579744/replies/41726416

Quote:In 1984 a group of Australian Aboriginal people living a traditional nomadic life were encountered in the heart of the Gibson desert in Western Australia. They had been unaware of the arrival of Europeans on the continent, let alone cars - or even clothes.If you want to know how Australian Aboriginal peoples lived for 40,000 years, just ask Yukultji. She stepped into the 20th Century just 30 years ago. She is the youngest member of the Pintupi Nine, the last family of nomads to roam the territory around Lake Mackay, a vast glistening salt lake spanning 3,500 sq km (1,350 sq miles) between the Gibson and Great Sandy deserts of Western Australia.
BusterAg
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AG
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Behavior modernity is almost certainly liked to development of language.


My theory is that behavior modernity developed with the invention of beer / wine.

Seriously.
Madman
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AG
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Behavior modernity is almost certainly liked to development of language.


My theory is that behavior modernity developed with the invention of beer / wine.

Seriously.
Go on.
Woody2006
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AG
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And also interesting, from a thread I started a while back.

http://texags.com/forums/16/topics/2579744/replies/41726416

Quote:In 1984 a group of Australian Aboriginal people living a traditional nomadic life were encountered in the heart of the Gibson desert in Western Australia. They had been unaware of the arrival of Europeans on the continent, let alone cars - or even clothes.If you want to know how Australian Aboriginal peoples lived for 40,000 years, just ask Yukultji. She stepped into the 20th Century just 30 years ago. She is the youngest member of the Pintupi Nine, the last family of nomads to roam the territory around Lake Mackay, a vast glistening salt lake spanning 3,500 sq km (1,350 sq miles) between the Gibson and Great Sandy deserts of Western Australia.
I remember that thread. That article was so fascinating. Just imagine what it must be like to go from being a pure hunter / gatherer with no understanding of the modern world whatsoever to being introduced to such.
 
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