I'll be there!

You're absolutely entitled to your opinion, and we'll have to agree to disagree, but again I ask that you at least have a minor education on what's going on before speaking about relative safety.

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It is as safe as the stack was in 1999, and I don't think that margin of error is good enough anymore.

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That's not an opinion, sir, it's a patently false statement.

Student Bonfire is designed by a licensed civil engineer who has signed off on the project - staking his career and the livelihood of his family on the design being sound. Each log touches the ground, there is a super-set of cable wraps on each tier, and there are five poles that are buried deeply into the ground to help support the structure - not just one pole in the middle.

The structure will be approximately 40 feet wide and (counting the outhouse) 39 feet tall this year - much more base for less height than Bonfire in the late 90s.

These are just a few of the modifications off of the top of my head...I know there are many more.

Again, I'm not going to change your opinion, and I'm not necessarily trying to, but to say that this Bonfire is intrinsically no safer than 1999 is ridiculous.

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It is as safe as the stack was in 1999, and I don't think that margin of error is good enough anymore.

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With that statement you lose any and all credibility you may have had. Unless you have been living in a shell or you are just choosing to be ignorant you cannot believe what you wrote. The bonfire in 1999 was not designed and signed off by a liscensed civil engineer. The current student led bonfire has been. That quote was so blatantly ignorant that I am starting to wonder if you are just trying to stir the pot.

I've never seen so many experts on bonfire's past. There are alot of ignorant people here.

Keep the tradition alive.

I'll be there along with about 15 other people. BTHOB, and BTHOtu. Last year I went it was awesome, gave me chills, to see families, and students, former students all joined in something they believe in. Good job Ags.

I was on stack when it fell and not a day goes by that I do not think about it, especially this time of year. I never thought I would be able to support Bonfire if it wasnt like it was when I was there until I went out last year and saw in the eyes of all that were working on it the same thing I remember feeling when I was working on Bonfire. I have the best memories and made the best of friends through Aggie Bonfire and if these students get to do that then more power to them. The heart, dedication, and determination can be seen in all of them if you just go and sit back and watch them work together as Aggies. I am so proud of them for doing their best to keep Bonfire alive. Yeah it may not be as big or as popular, but the spirit and heart behind it is the same as it was in the past.

See you when it burns!!!!

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Bonfire's dead, end of story. This is a lame trash fire.

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I'm glad the students that took the initiative to get this thing going ignored bad attitudes like this.
To be honest, I didn't like the student bonfire idea at first; mainly because I was sure the on-campus version would make a comeback and I didn't want the student bonfire to affect the speed of that comeback in any way. However, it is apparent to me now that the on-campus version of bonfire is NOT coming back, so the student version to me is better than nothing.

At times it is hard for me to identify with the students attending A&M today; the fact that the top tier of the student section wasn't full on Saturday for one of the bigger games Kyle Field has seen in a while disgusts me. But knowing that there are still a few students out there who have that burning desire, not only to beat tu but also to keep the Spirit of Aggieland alive, makes me appreciate the fact that the Spirit that was alive on campus when I attended A&M is still there.

Keep up the tough work on bonfire students! Stack looks great and I hope to be there to see it burn!

BTHOtu

[This message has been edited by MassAggie97 (edited 11/16/2004 11:08a).]

I predicted to my hunting buddies right after the 99 tragedy that bonfire would return, if and only if, the students decided they wanted it to return. They are the sole decision makers on this subject, not administrators, not politicians, or lawyers and especially not internet posters on texags.

So far they have decided to continue, and I support them 100%. It is THEIR bonfire.

If you don’t support them then so be it.

As my username implies, I spent a great deal of time working on Bonfire. I never held any pot, I just worked like so many of us did. I worked axe handle stations, hung swings, and 10pennyed logs. Besides drive a tractor, I did every job a grunt could do for Bonfire.

The '99 collapse was a tragedy, especially after the collapse in '94. The lack of oversight is the fault of everyone involved; students, faculty, administration and alumni. The errors of our past are our own making.

The reasons behind Bonfire did not go away when those 12 unfortunate souls were lost. They were doing exactly the same things I had done years before for the same reasons. They lost their lives because they believed the same things I still believe in.

I understand everyone who says that this is not "Bonfire", and in some respects they are right. Our idea of Bonfire was flawed and it brought about the loss of life which was unnecessary. Bonfire must evolve to continue to exist. Still, Bonfire is more than the fire and it is more than the people who build it.

Anyone who goes out day after day to build Bonfire is not only keeping their spirit alive, but the spirit of those who came before them. Above all, everyone who is out their working on this and every other Bonfire are building the spirit of Bonfire for the future.

To everyone who understands this, I say BUILD THE H#LL OUT OF BONFIRE!

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From what i have seen, SB is running a flawless operation, safety wise. I gladly send my money to them.

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This indicual is in an excavated hole with inadequate shoring and is not wearing head protection when overhead hzards are present.




These individuals are not wearing head protection when an overhead hazard exist, and one individual is wearing open shoes.

I'm not safety expert, but I've had enough experience in industrial construction to see these violations instantly. I found these violations from 2 minutes of looking at the photos on their website. Imagine what a real safety expert would find.

I'm not poopooing what Student Bonfire is trying to accomplish, but iut appears to me they're still giving safety lip service.

Until the safety of the students building Bonfire can be reasonably assured by all, taking every possible precaution, Aggies are risking the future of any University-sanctioned Bonfire. Please respect the leaders of our great school and their decisions.

I saw those pictures and thought the same thing. I think there needs to be a little more safety awareness, but on a whole they are doing a great job.
keep it up Student Bonfire

BTHO tu

If the '99 Bonfire was a "fracture" in the student body/spirit the only natural thing to do is recover, come up with a new plan and rebuild.

What happens in an earthquake? Sh*t happens then we fix it, we don't just leave it where it was and think "darn, what could have been". What kind of message is this going to give Aggies that aren't even born yet. They will look back and see this great tradition that encountered a tragedy then we just give up and lose hope. Do airlines stop flying planes after one crashes? Do we stop driving cars after we get in a wreck? WAKE UP PEOPLE!

From those photos, I am not sure things are fixed yet.

Burdizzo proves my point.

End of story.

BigSteve

it is not the end of the story. SB will light up whether you like it or not. It is the student's decision when to end the story.

Burdizzo,
You should be commended for bringing those pictures to our attention. Looks like people still don't get the idea of safety and "headware"..... Personally, I like the guy wearing flip flopts with a 1,000 pound log standing two feet away from him.

Looks like some people still don't get the idea of safety and "headware"..... Personally, I like the guy wearing flip flopts with a 1,000 pound log standing two feet away from him.



[This message has been edited by Kendall (edited 11/16/2004 7:14p).]

As evidenced by the above photos, as much as everyone wants to have a student bonfire, it's obvious that there is still much work to be done to make it as safe as it can be. When one sees that lack of safety awareness from those that are participating in the construction, it's frightening. And that, my fellow Aggies, is the entire crux of my stand on the issue. It seems as though students, try as they might, simply do not know how to do this safely....and until they do, after what happened in 1999, how can we condone it?

You can criticize me all you want, but a picture tells a thousand words.

Beat the hell out of tu.

The PE and an OSHA safety expert were observing everything taking place in those pictures. I'll take their expertise over an anonymous internet poster with no credentials.

OSHA expert independently hired to manage safety? I doubt it...

"..The PE and an OSHA safety expert were observing everything taking place in those pictures..."

That is the scariest thing I've ever heard. And THESE are the "experts" you'll rely on? Who will be the first to get sued if the centerpole crushes the student standing in the hole. How about the student WEARING FLIP FLOPS that lost a foot because a log fell on it..who do their parents sue? Who pays for the rehabilitation and prosthetic services.

If it can't be done safely, it shouldn't be done at all.

Talk about ME losing credibility...Do you realize what you just posted?

[This message has been edited by Bigsteve (edited 11/16/2004 4:24p).]

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The PE and an OSHA safety expert were observing everything taking place in those pictures. I'll take their expertise over an anonymous internet poster with no credentials.

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Did you rent those guys from K-Mart?

ddp

[This message has been edited by MY Quaid (edited 11/16/2004 4:40p).]

Is this bonfire insured? Does the Civil Engr or the "OSHA expert" have any connection to Texas A&M (did either of them attend A&M)?

I'm glad to see Bonfire back. I don't think it will ever return to campus (and shouldn't), so hopefully the off campus one can operate safely.

BigSteve...you still havent answered the main question. You keep saying "this isnt bonfire...get over it". What would make this bonfire the 'real' bonfire for you?? You say you worked on bonfire back in the 70's and 80's, and theres no way that bonfire met the safety standards that are central to your current argument...and yet i assume that you still think of those as 'real' bonfires. Why? The only other option is that 'real' bonfire in your eyes must be sanctioned by the administration, and i'm sorry, if you consider that the defining quality of the 'real' bonfire you didnt learn a thing building it yourself. I'm sorry, thats just MY opinion. Not to mention that it wasnt sanctioned for much of its early years. The only thing we can tell from reading your posts is that you're obsessed with repeating a mantra "this is not the real bonfire" without having any compelling substance behind it. The safety discussion is an important one and should be paramount for anyone who takes these things seriously, but it contributes nothing to your position on a 'real' bonfire argument.

DtAG,

If you have to ask, you'll never understand.

Good luck in Grad School though...

BTHOtu

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Did you rent those guys from K-Mart?

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If you'd really like to question their professional competency or credentials, show up at burn and talk to them face to face.

Keegan,
FYI, I know you aren't talking to me about the OSHA folks, your explanation was enough for me.

I'm there!

Can you answer my questions? Please don't backtrack with the "if you have a question, show up and ask them" stuff. Prior to Burd's post, you and Bonfire03/AB2 were basically speaking for the PE and the OSHA guy with all of the safety talk. Now that Burd has raised real questions, AB2 is nowhere to be found, and you are resorting to "I know you are, but what am I?" type responses.

"If you'd really like to question their professional competency or credentials, show up at burn and talk to them face to face..."

I'd be happy to. But I'd do it with those pictures in my hand and ask them what the hell is going on. Who are they accountable to? Can you answer me that, Keegan?

I'd rather talk to them now than at the funeral......How about you?

Look at the pictures, Keegan. Doesn't common sense tell you SOMETHINGS WRONG WITH THESE PICTURES?

quaid - more than happy to discuss your concerns over e-mail.

aggiebomber2@yahoo.com

Why don't you discuss them on this thread............?

I dont see anyone running around drinking and playing grabass this year, its already safer than everyone bonfire in the past.


or is that what you mean by "its not real bonfire"