I wouldn't worry about his predictions needing to be spoiler tagged - based on leaks (which are based on set photos, presence at certain shoots, set photos, twitter and interviews oopsies, etc.).

Teddy Perkins said:

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Dude, you left out one HUGE (pun intended) character. What about Tyrion?

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I was in a boring conference call while typing that and was slightly distracted.

Yes. I forgot all about Tyrion. I honestly have no idea what they'll do with him. Outside of having a great screen presence and dialogue (as always) he's pretty much grown of little importance at this point, unless the old book reader theory that he is also a Targaryeon comes to pass. But at this point I don't know what point it would serve.

Urban Ag said:

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Teddy Perkins said:

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Dude, you left out one HUGE (pun intended) character. What about Tyrion?

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I was in a boring conference call while typing that and was slightly distracted.

Yes. I forgot all about Tyrion. I honestly have no idea what they'll do with him. Outside of having a great screen presence and dialogue (as always) he's pretty much grown of little importance at this point, unless the old book reader theory that he is also a Targaryeon comes to pass. But at this point I don't know what point it would serve.

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If your theories pan out, I could see him going with Brienne to help mentor and raise Jamie's offspring.

Completely agree. She's going to pull off something that will upset people.

I just hope we see the 2nd part of the prophecy - in the book there was more to the prophecy then shown in the TV series. All they included was being usurped by a younger more beautiful queen, and having 3 kids who died in shrouds of gold.

The remaining part of the prophecy could be shown as a subsequent visit to the frog lady - it's the part where she says "and when your tears have drowned you, the valonqar shall wrap his hands about your pale white throat and choke the life from you."

Much debate about the word valonqar which technically means little brother. So it as presumed to mean Tyrion. However it has been noted that Jamie is also younger as he was born 2nd to Cersei. Others raise the possibility that it did not mean HER little brother so people like Sandor Clegane, Tommen (as a risen wight), and even Arya (allowing for the Valyrian misaprop of gender pronouns as in the faulty translation of the "prince that was promised" which according to Aemon could have meant a woman).

Anyway I'd like to see the 2nd part of the prophecy. It would make sense to save it until now rather than have the viewer have to remember it from then (S5 E1 opening flashback). She could have returned to the frog lady later for clarification, revenge, who knows.

I haven't read any of the books, and have no idea where in the HBO timeline the books left off, but it seems to me that recently, the "good guys" tend to usually win. Early on, you had no idea who would be killed next. Ned Stark got beheaded, the red wedding, etc. At the end, Arya got her revenge for the red wedding, Ramsey gets eaten by his dogs, Littlefinger dies, etc. My (unfounded) guess had been that once HBO writers took over, it became more predictable and "happier" for viewers.

With that in mind, it seems that Tyrion (and pretty much everybody else) would get their revenge on Cersei, Jon Snow and Dany would marry and rule together (though it probably would be more heart string tugging if one of them dies, leaving the other in power), Sansa would run the north with Arya at her side, tall knight lady would shack up with Jamie, etc.

aTmAg said:

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I haven't read any of the books, and have no idea where in the HBO timeline the books left off, but it seems to me that recently, the "good guys" tend to usually win. Early on, you had no idea who would be killed next. Ned Stark got beheaded, the red wedding, etc. At the end, Arya got her revenge for the red wedding, Ramsey gets eaten by his dogs, Littlefinger dies, etc. My (unfounded) guess had been that once HBO writers took over, it became more predictable and "happier" for viewers.

With that in mind, it seems that Tyrion (and pretty much everybody else) would get their revenge on Cersei, Jon Snow and Dany would marry and rule together (though it probably would be more heart string tugging if one of them dies, leaving the other in power), Sansa would run the north with Arya at her side, tall knight lady would shack up with Jamie, etc.

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well that's not completely off base - we left off the books about the end of season 6 of the TV show. Season 7 was almost entirely off book. Seasons 5 and 6 primarily had content from both Books 4 and 5 although some was less "directly" from the books and more like "akin to or based on" book content.

This is a really cool mapping of chapters to TV episodes - you can see how it becomes more and more fractured as we go. solid boxes are direct references, dots are more like influences. S1 was much more directly from Book 1. S2 started to diverge more and included book 3 stuff and more indirect influence. By S6 it is all over the map with very little direct influence.

http://joeltronics.github.io/got-book-show/bookshow.html

On the flipside it has not been all happy endings even where off book:

Olenna Tyrell - poisoned but a badass exit
The Freys- Arya poisoned the entire family "the north remembers"
Sand sisters killed by Euron Greyjoy and/or Cersei
A bunch of Lannisters at the hands of the Unsullied and Dothraki or the Dragon
Randyll and Dickon Tarly - dragon fire
Thoros of Myr - froze to death
Viserion the dragon - became a ice dragon
Benjen Stark - presumably to the wights
Littlefinger - throat slit by Arya
a whole bunch of nights watch on the wall

many of those were "bad" people or unnamed multitudes but.....Olenna in particular and Thoros and Viserion were all liked and Littlefinger was a shock of sorts if not a good guy certainly a main player and out of the blue it seemed.

Also there are a whole bunch of characters dead in the show that were still alive the last we saw them in the books. and some of these had horrendous deaths:

Tommen
Myrcela
Margaery Tyrell
Loras
the High Sparrow
Doran Martell
Barristan Selmy
Jojen Reed
Hodor
Shireen
Stannis
Mance Rader



I think that's a bit temporary too - certainly you want your biggest names alive into the final season anyway. Doesn't mean it is going t continue.

How was Olenna's death gruesome? Wasn't it off screen and a painless poison at that.

Fenrir said:

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How was Olenna's death gruesome? Wasn't it off screen and a painless poison at that.

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Ok yes it was offscreen. I assumed gruesome based on poisoning deaths of others but you are right I now recall Jamie saying it was something that would be a painless death.

Quote:

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The Tullys Freys- Arya poisoned the entire family "the north remembers"

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Tullys are Arya's mother's family, just sayin'.

So you know/remember the show far better than I do... but it seems to me that a lot of the deaths you mention were not people the show wanted us to "root for". They are often people we love to hate. I don't remember all the characters you mention, but the major characters I would count as "good guys" would be the dragon, Hodor, and Shiree (ugg).

BTW, surely the Hodor thing was tipped off by Martin? Seems like that is too good for them to think that up on the fly.

Olenna and Barristan Selmy (Dany's knight guard) and Jojen were certainly good people and well liked too.

I don't recall anything from the books alluding to Hodor's name, origin, nothing in flashbacks, etc.....the books left off with Bran and Hodor in the cave having just escaped the wight attack and meet the children of the forest and the three eyed crow (raven in the TV series) so.....very well could have been from GRRM if he told them. But it's not something I would say was alluded to in any way.

Zombie Jon Snow said:

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Olenna and Barristan Selmy (Dany's knight guard) and Jojen were certainly good people and well liked too.

I don't recall anything from the books alluding to Hodor's name, origin, nothing in flashbacks, etc.....the books left off with Bran and Hodor in the cave having just escaped the wight attack and meet the children of the forest and the three eyed crow (raven in the TV series) so.....very well could have been from GRRM if he told them. But it's not something I would say was alluded to in any way.

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Did he go around saying "Hodor" all the time in the books?

aTmAg said:

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Zombie Jon Snow said:

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Olenna and Barristan Selmy (Dany's knight guard) and Jojen were certainly good people and well liked too.

I don't recall anything from the books alluding to Hodor's name, origin, nothing in flashbacks, etc.....the books left off with Bran and Hodor in the cave having just escaped the wight attack and meet the children of the forest and the three eyed crow (raven in the TV series) so.....very well could have been from GRRM if he told them. But it's not something I would say was alluded to in any way.

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Did he go around saying "Hodor" all the time in the books?

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Oh yes. thats all he ever said there too. It was revealed by Old Nan (the Stark family caretaker/servant and oldest person at Winterfell) that his real name is Walder. Old Nan told lots of tales to the Stark kids of things beyond the wall and she is Hodor's grandmother. Thats about all we know outside of physical appearance.

Zombie Jon Snow said:

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aTmAg said:

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Zombie Jon Snow said:

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Olenna and Barristan Selmy (Dany's knight guard) and Jojen were certainly good people and well liked too.

I don't recall anything from the books alluding to Hodor's name, origin, nothing in flashbacks, etc.....the books left off with Bran and Hodor in the cave having just escaped the wight attack and meet the children of the forest and the three eyed crow (raven in the TV series) so.....very well could have been from GRRM if he told them. But it's not something I would say was alluded to in any way.

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Did he go around saying "Hodor" all the time in the books?

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Oh yes. thats all he ever said there too. It was revealed by Old Nan (the Stark family caretaker/servant and oldest person at Winterfell) that his real name is Walder. Old Nan told lots of tales to the Stark kids of things beyond the wall and she is Hodor's grandmother. Thats about all we know outside of physical appearance.

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Yeah it seems to me, that Martin was setting up the "hold the door" reveal for a long time. And that he had to make sure that got in the show. Otherwise, the HBO guys would have had to notice on their own, "you know 'Hodor' sounds like 'Hold the door', maybe we do THIS."

preface- I didn't read any of the spoilers posted here. I'd rather be surprised.

a) Sansa called Dany "your Grace". Wouldn't "your majesty" be more appropriate? though off the top of my head, I can't remember to which level "grace" applies.

b) I need one more big twist and killing of a criwd favorite similar to Ned's beheading or the red wedding. I need this.

bearamedic99 said:

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preface- I didn't read any of the spoilers posted here. I'd rather be surprised.

a) Sansa called Dany "your Grace". Wouldn't "your majesty" be more appropriate? though off the top of my head, I can't remember to which level "grace" applies.

b) I need one more big twist and killing of a criwd favorite similar to Ned's beheading or the red wedding. I need this.

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a. it's interchangeable neither is in reference to some specific title really and applies equally to king or queen. that is because they are effectively qualities of the ruler (possessing grace or majesty). your grace is often used for females of a lower status (duchess' for example) because it is a quality and not a title. If you are referring to their station (position) but not the title specifically then it's my lord or my liege for example - as in they are lord over you (hence "my"). But it would never be my grace or my majesty. your highness is another although i'm not sure i've heard it in GOT but generally would be your royal highness when referring to the highest ranking royal.

same way we use your honor, your excellency or your holiness. those are qualities not titles.

it is perhaps just a little less formal - but it is not disrespectful at all in GOT. In fact your grace might be used more than any other form of address for the high ruler.

The making of material said that GRRM explained Hodor to the show runners

Sine poena nulla lex.

Sine poena nulla lex.

Come to think of it, this season will have to compete with Avengers Endgame hype. Wonder if it'll hurt the ratings.

GET HYPE

Sine poena nulla lex.