****** Game of Thrones - Season 8 ******

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M.C. Swag
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**tl;dr warning**

To keep the convo going (and because I'm bored), here's a complete compilation of suggested improvements/musings/criticisms.

What I wished they had changed:
1) Just simple better battle tactics. Not a huge deal at the end of the day but there was just a LOT of dumb decisions which many have gone over. It's not like we needed some incredibly complex battle tactics, just some common sense. There were multiple experienced field strategists and combat veterans there: Jon, Tyrion, Varys, Grey Worm, Jorah, Davos, Jaime, Beric, Sandor, Royce, Theon, Tormund, Edd, and presumably a bunch of Northern lords and Dothraki captains. I'm all for suspense, but it's lazy writing to artificially create it by having the good guys make arbitrarily dumb decisions, when they should very clearly know better. (Like, don't put trebuchets in FRONT of your castle walls and trench. Simple stuff like that)

2) At least some reaction from Dany seeing wight Viserion. As she loves to remind everyone, her dragons ARE HER CHILDREN. You'd think it'd be pretty impactful to see your child turned into a zombie that's trying to annihilate people you love.

3) Some reaction from Sansa from seeing Stark ancestors rise from the dead.

4) Jon and some other heroes with valyrian swords battle desperately with White Walkers/the Night King

5) Wight fights that are personal (Ie - wight Edd vs Jon/Sam, wight Hodor vs Jon/Arya, wight Jorah vs Dany, etc.)

6) More deaths - Why is Missandei AND Greyworm still alive? The crypts were obviously a disastrous oversight so imagine the impact it would have to see Greyworm fight to near death and escape victorious only to rush back to the crypts to find that Missandei dead...that he failed to protect her. (Something like this could have been done with Gilly/Sam or Tyrion/Jamie and it would have been pretty heart wrenching.)

7) If you're absolutely DETERMINED to have Arya kill the NK, at least do it better;
  • Jon fights the white walker generals (instead of Viserion who is off somewhere fighting Dany/Drogon/Rhaegal) with Jamie and Jorah at his side.The night king strides on towards the garden as we finally get to see heroes armed with Valerian steel vs the white walkers. Jorah is killed, Jamie and Jon are on the ropes but slowly fighting there way to the Godswood.
  • Keep the Bran NK staredown but instead of the calm circle of wights we have in this scene, there are still iron born and theon fighting, but they are losing badly. We seen Theon getting overun by wights while NK slowlys and smugly aproaches Bran, the sounds of the battle become distant, we have the "we're losing montage" we got in the series..Theon manages to get free from the wights. Theon rushes to stand guard over Bran and the NK goes to Bran. Theon desperately fights NK knowing he has zero chance. NK cuts off Theon's arm or inflicts some major wounds, but Theon knows he has faced worse from Ramsey. Mutilated, he keeps fighting beyond the limits of what most men could bear. NK has enough and kills Theon finally. Theon's last vision is of Bran, who tells him "you're a good man" and Theon smiles with the image of home and family before passing. Then you can have Arya do what she does and at least it enters the realm of possibility for her to get close with all the chaos going around.
  • Jon arrives just in time to see Theon sacrifice himself for Arya/humanity, but doesn't get involved in the fight because Arya ends it first.
  • It's the same basic story, the same ending, and pretty much the exact same scenes apart from Jon making it to the Godswood, Theon tangibly doing something and doing it in the eyes of Jon (the man he wants to impress most), and we get to see SOME white walker action.

8) Lynna doesn't get her hero moment. That was an embarrassment, and complete betrayal of what ASOIAF stands for. I don't care she's a fan and writer's favorite, the battlefield isn't place for a 12 year old and this is EXACTLY the type of dumb decision GRRM would punish for shock value. Give the kill to literally anyone else, i don't care.

9) Bran does something. Literally anything. (could do a 2 for 1 and have him warg Ghost. Easy win/win)

10) Has anyone realized that the Hound and Sansa STILL haven't had a reunion? Yea, that hasn't happened. And I'll do you one better...Jon and Jamie have yet to speak to each other (other than Jon saying "we'll need every man we can get" at his trial). This show is suffering MASSIVELY from this shortened time frame HBO has decided to impose on itself.

Some off-shoot rebuttals/musings:
  • To people applauding the 'foreshadowing' of Arya's heroic moment:
    • They keep bringing up the "blue eyes, green eyes" thing as foreshadowing that Arya kills the Night King. HOWEVER, this happened in Season 3 in 2013. And D&D said they knew Arya was going to kill the NK only 3 years ago. This is an obvious retcon of the line that was supposed to foreshadow her journey as a Faceless Assassin. It was also altered from it's original delivery - highlighted by the fact that 'blue eyes' was said before 'green eyes'. The order was 'brown eyes, blue eyes, green eyes', no emphasis is placed on blue eyes. D&D took an completely unrelated quote and forced it into a scenario just to SUBVERT my expectations. It'd be like if Sansa killed Cersei and delivered the line "when you play the game of thrones, you either win or die." DUM DUM DUMMMMMM.
    • "It gives Arya's training a purpose to have an end goal." - Wouldn't a more fitting end goal for her training be to kill Cersei? She's been on her list since S2. She specifically trained to become an assassin to kill people on her list. Her entire arc was about killing people on her list. That's why she abandoned the House of Black and White because she saw MERYN F'n TRANT in Braavos and disobeyed her training to become "No One". She couldn't let go of her lust for revenge. Now I'm supposed to believe all of that was so she could kill the Night King? I guess there's a chance she can still kill Cersei, but then Arya gets the kill on the two major villains of the series ON TOP of avenging the Red Wedding with Walder Frey. This is already ridiculous. The more I read about and discuss this episode as it relates to Arya's big moment, the worse it gets.
    • And I swear to the gods, old and new, if anyone says the words "subvert expectations" I will ninja assassinate you swifter than this Deus Ex Machina.
  • I honestly don't see what the point in Cersei is now. If Arya can ninja shank an 8,000 year old ice demon, someone who can control hundreds of thousands of dead people and a dead dragon, and the greatest threat the world has ever known, then why tf is Cersei even considered a threat? Why should I care at all about Cersei? I mean granted I haven't cared about her since the show decided to not have her face any political consequences for blowing up the sept - arguably the most despicable act in KL history - but I really don't give a **** about her now. Or why should i care about her and her stupid throne when we just had humanity saved this episode? Oh no, she might rule for a few decades, imagine the horror...compared to the extinction of human life. She doesn't even have an heir (or maybe she does, who knows with this show).
Vernada
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Rustys-Beef-o-Reeno said:

So the episode was dark for me...did anyone else have those issues?


UNSUFFRABLE
Vernada
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redline248
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bangobango said:

redline248 said:

bangobango said:

redline248 said:

As far as the show is concerned, I agree that the prophesies have been cast aside.


But they didn't, and that's what makes it so damn annoying. Melisandre's entire stoey arch was finding the PWIP. And the way they have Melisandre act in that episode is what drives me absolutely bat **** crazy about it all because it is completely inconsistent with her previous actions and dialogue..
My point was that despite things being mentioned by certain characters for the first few seasons, the prophesies were eventually cast aside. Most likely when the ran out of Martin's source material they said "f-ck it," and decided to focus on the bigger plots.


First episode of season seven (after they "knew" it was going to be Arya):



Jump to 6:30 mark for Melisandre's quote about Prince who was promised.
Ok, let's imagine when they wrote that scene, they were still considering having the prince factor into the final confrontation. Was the scene written/filmed within the 3 year window? Or did just air in that window?

Aside from that, why wouldn't they have Mel say something to call back to that scene? Or Bran, who knows almost everything? My opinion is that they deliberately left it out b/c they don't intend to bring it up again.

Could I be wrong? Of course, but I will be surprised if they make any reference to it again.

edit: One last point. Mel believes the prophesy and believes "only the prince can bring the dawn." Well, that doesn't mean it's actually true.
JABQ04
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Guess who gets to start GoT over!!! My wife has finally decided she is interested.
c-jags
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Quote:

Or why should i care about her and her stupid throne when we just had humanity saved this episode? Oh no, she might rule for a few decades, imagine the horror...compared to the extinction of human life. She doesn't even have an heir (or maybe she does, who knows with this show


Because she is an absolutely terrible person who has tried to kill almost every person in the North and the realm in an attempt to wrongfully stay in power. Every death in Westeros outside of the dude Ned decapitated in the first episode is because of her. You could argue Jaime as well but he's working towards atonement.

If I had full knowledge of the series as it stands today and had one bullet with Cersei, Joffrey, or Ramsay standing in front of me I would use it on Cersei.
The Dog Lord
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I agree with most of what you said, but at least Lyanna wasn't slaying wights left and right. She was basically killed immediately but got in a parting shot that just happened to be a big one.

If they gave some of the others (like Jorah) a death fighting the WW/NK as you described, then they could have toned hers down some. It could have been more like Jorah's with her simply getting overrun by wights. As several come in to stab her, she is able to take a few out, but the third or fourth time she is stabbed, she is down.
La Bamba
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Brian Earl Spilner said:

I'm sorry but Rocky IV is greatness.

This x100. Any of you Howland Reeds that think Rocky IV sucked is a red wearing Communist!
gigemJTH12
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Love the post MC Swag.

I think grey worm should have gone out killing the giant. Lady Mormont having the strength to still kill the giant is super far fetched. Grey worm doing it would have been believable. Plus he needed to die.
Thomas Ford 91
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Quote:

They keep bringing up the "blue eyes, green eyes" thing as foreshadowing that Arya kills the Night King. HOWEVER, this happened in Season 3 in 2013. And D&D said they knew Arya was going to kill the NK only 3 years ago. This is an obvious retcon of the line that was supposed to foreshadow her journey as a Faceless Assassin. It was also altered from it's original delivery - highlighted by the fact that 'blue eyes' was said before 'green eyes'. The order was 'brown eyes, blue eyes, green eyes', no emphasis is placed on blue eyes.


One of the podcasts I listen to made you point. The counterpoint was that the original order is correct. Walder Frey had brown eyes. The NK had blue eyes. Both Cersei and Jamie have green eyes. Mel was just putting the emphasis on the task at hand when she switched it up.
Jebber
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So just watched again

During the whole light the trench sequence and suspense. Jon was on the castle with his dragon the entire time the red witch was doing her thing. Why did he not just get his dragon to light it. Can he not direct his like Dany does?
wangus12
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Great post.

I too feel like they've made Arya into this little ultimate God Assassin who is unbeatable and to fix that she needs to lose. She doesn't have to die, but she needs to lose
Hubert J. Farnsworth
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Just read 20+ pages of replies and all I have to say is that there are some miserable people on this thread.
Mantis Toboggan MD
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Hubert J. Farnsworth said:

Just read 20+ pages of replies and all I have to say is that there are some miserable people on this thread.

In other words, I think what the good professor is trying to say is...
Body By Fisher
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wangus12 said:

Great post.

I too feel like they've made Arya into this little ultimate God Assassin who is unbeatable and to fix that she needs to lose. She doesn't have to die, but she needs to lose
I don't understand that logic. This is fantasy, and fantasies have heroes.

You probably liked the ending of The Last Jedi.
HtownAg92
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Just rewatched and just as excellent. Picked up on a few things missed in the intensity of the first watch.

Someone confirm - was the wight that Jorah beheaded just in time to save Dany the Thenn leader from Hardhome that didn't want to go, but then got killed by the WW trying to get the dragonglass?

The WW slo-mo entrance reminded me of Old School and Reservoir Dogs. If they were good guys you could have cranked up "Hero" from the Foo Fighters as they turned the corner.
SpreadsheetAg
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HtownAg92 said:

Just rewatched and just as excellent. Picked up on a few things missed in the intensity of the first watch.

Someone confirm - was the wight that Jorah beheaded just in time to save Dany the Thenn leader from Hardhome that didn't want to go, but then got killed by the WW trying to get the dragonglass?

The WW slo-mo entrance reminded me of Old School and Reservoir Dogs. If they were good guys you could have cranked up "Hero" from the Foo Fighters as they turned the corner.
Re: Thenn, I immediately recognized him and thought the same
Eso si, Que es
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bangobango said:

aTmAg said:

Zombie Jon Snow said:


Yes no doubt it added to the emotion... and for budget reasons made it easier.

But purely from a watcher point of view more light would have been better in several places. The Dothraki attack for one thing... they got off cheap there really and kill 100K without showing anything. then they roll in the clouds and obscured everything.

I get why - both cost and tension. Just saying it sucked that way for some of it.
I think the clouds and storm was a great tactical move by the NK (he seemed smarter than the good guys). And he had done it in the past, so it was consistent. I would have expected him to do that even if it was during the day. Especially when you are going against dragons. Before that storm, Jon and Dany were doing pretty damned good against the zombies. It probably would have been a close fight if it wasn't for that storm taking the dragons out of the mix.


You are insufferable on this thread with all the goal tending. You don't have to respond to every single criticism.
Just wanted to point out that while he has 56 posts since the episode aired, you are right behind him at 43 posts.

Most hockey games have 2 goal tenders

Just sayin....
La Bamba
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Completely agree with almost all your points. The writers went out of their way to give Arya the kill, going against the character arcs, and the purpose of the character's storyline from Season 1.

Starting with the induction into the Night's Watch, it has been Jon's sole motive to lead the fight against the undead. Even with all the other politics going on, he has had laser focus on this motive. To sideline his character in the most important, defining episode of his personal journey, is just a let down. He didn't need to be Rocky, he didn't need to have performed the kill, but he should have been given a bigger role in the ultimate demise of the Night King. To be neutralized by the half torn apart zombie Dragon when the two other dragons, albeit hurt, were still capable of fighting (and just conveniently disappeared) is lazy at best, SJW dishonest at worst.

And then there's Arya. Let's be honest, Arya was running for her life inside the castle. The Jurassic Park scene was one where she clearly was struggling, scared, and had trouble getting from one side of the room to the next with MAYBE 20 wights in the room. But somehow all she needed was a pep talk from the red woman for her to then proceed to escape a room with wights knocking on the door, somehow making her way down to the godswood, all while evading 20,000 wights, 20 white walkers and the Night King's peripheral vision to jump the NK. Lazy writing. I don't care how much she trained. Why was she shown struggling against a lesser force and then all of a sudden, she overcomes the insurmountable force? The Red Woman needs to coach the Texas A&M Aggie Football team apparently. Or she is really Nick Saban.

Not to mention that Season 1 laid the foundation for Arya to become a revenge machine after watching her father get beheaded by the Lannisters. She was never a player in the fight against the undead until she shows up in Winterfell last season. Understand she has very useful skills, but it just didn't seem right to do it this way.

Ok GoT apologists, fire away.


MW03
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Jebber said:

So just watched again

During the whole light the trench sequence and suspense. Jon was on the castle with his dragon the entire time the red witch was doing her thing. Why did he not just get his dragon to light it. Can he not direct his like Dany does?


I believe they were supposed to light the trench at the sign, but they audibled when they couldn't see in the storm.
agsquirrel97
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La Bamba said:

Completely agree with almost all your points. The writers went out of their way to give Arya the kill, going against the character arcs, and the purpose of the character's storyline from Season 1.

Starting with the induction into the Night's Watch, it has been Jon's sole motive to lead the fight against the undead. Even with all the other politics going on, he has had laser focus on this motive. To sideline his character in the most important, defining episode of his personal journey, is just a let down. He didn't need to be Rocky, he didn't need to have performed the kill, but he should have been given a bigger role in the ultimate demise of the Night King. To be neutralized by the half torn apart zombie Dragon when the two other dragons, albeit hurt, were still capable of fighting (and just conveniently disappeared) is lazy at best, SJW dishonest at worst.

And then there's Arya. Let's be honest, Arya was running for her life inside the castle. The Jurassic Park scene was one where she clearly was struggling, scared, and had trouble getting from one side of the room to the next with MAYBE 20 wights in the room. But somehow all she needed was a pep talk from the red woman for her to then proceed to escape a room with wights knocking on the door, somehow making her way down to the godswood, all while evading 20,000 wights, 20 white walkers and the Night King's peripheral vision to jump the NK. Lazy writing. I don't care how much she trained. Why was she shown struggling against a lesser force and then all of a sudden, she overcomes the insurmountable force? The Red Woman needs to coach the Texas A&M Aggie Football team apparently. Or she is really Nick Saban.

Not to mention that Season 1 laid the foundation for Arya to become a revenge machine after watching her father get beheaded by the Lannisters. She was never a player in the fight against the undead until she shows up in Winterfell last season. Understand she has very useful skills, but it just didn't seem right to do it this way.

Ok GoT apologists, fire away.



I can agree with this. I posted before and will reiterate, I think she could have gotten the assist (a la howland reed and Ned Stark killing Ser Authur Dayne) but that wasn't her kill. And I do love her character.
Zombie Jon Snow
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lol.... while i haven't been involved in their sparring .... i checked and I have 49......now 50.

Of course... it is my thread and...... well I am King in the North.... errr was King in the North.

Body By Fisher
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Quote:

Starting with the induction into the Night's Watch, it has been Jon's sole motive to lead the fight against the undead.
Did you start watching with Hardhome?
La Bamba
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Ok fine, it is not explicitly against the WW army in the first couple of seasons, but it focuses on the struggle with the wildlings and events occurring beyond the wall, which ultimately centers around the struggle with the Long Night, Winter is Coming, season 1 wights = struggle against NK.

Don't be so dense.
Mantis Toboggan MD
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agsquirrel97 said:

La Bamba said:

Completely agree with almost all your points. The writers went out of their way to give Arya the kill, going against the character arcs, and the purpose of the character's storyline from Season 1.

Starting with the induction into the Night's Watch, it has been Jon's sole motive to lead the fight against the undead. Even with all the other politics going on, he has had laser focus on this motive. To sideline his character in the most important, defining episode of his personal journey, is just a let down. He didn't need to be Rocky, he didn't need to have performed the kill, but he should have been given a bigger role in the ultimate demise of the Night King. To be neutralized by the half torn apart zombie Dragon when the two other dragons, albeit hurt, were still capable of fighting (and just conveniently disappeared) is lazy at best, SJW dishonest at worst.

And then there's Arya. Let's be honest, Arya was running for her life inside the castle. The Jurassic Park scene was one where she clearly was struggling, scared, and had trouble getting from one side of the room to the next with MAYBE 20 wights in the room. But somehow all she needed was a pep talk from the red woman for her to then proceed to escape a room with wights knocking on the door, somehow making her way down to the godswood, all while evading 20,000 wights, 20 white walkers and the Night King's peripheral vision to jump the NK. Lazy writing. I don't care how much she trained. Why was she shown struggling against a lesser force and then all of a sudden, she overcomes the insurmountable force? The Red Woman needs to coach the Texas A&M Aggie Football team apparently. Or she is really Nick Saban.

Not to mention that Season 1 laid the foundation for Arya to become a revenge machine after watching her father get beheaded by the Lannisters. She was never a player in the fight against the undead until she shows up in Winterfell last season. Understand she has very useful skills, but it just didn't seem right to do it this way.

Ok GoT apologists, fire away.



I can agree with this. I posted before and will reiterate, I think she could have gotten the assist (a la howland reed and Ned Stark killing Ser Authur Dayne) but that wasn't her kill. And I do love her character.

How about this alternative scenario: After Arya's initial sneak attack fails and she is being choked by the NK, instead of catching the dagger herself she unintentionally drops the dagger to the ground. Just as she is about to be killed by the NK, Theon stealthily crawls towards them and grabs the knife off the ground. Then with his final breath he exclaims, "What is dead may never die, but rises again harder and stronger!" He then rears up and stabs the NK in the chest before dying a hero's death and, as Harry Dunne would put it, "totally redeeming himself".
La Bamba
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Mantis Toboggan MD said:

agsquirrel97 said:

La Bamba said:

Completely agree with almost all your points. The writers went out of their way to give Arya the kill, going against the character arcs, and the purpose of the character's storyline from Season 1.

Starting with the induction into the Night's Watch, it has been Jon's sole motive to lead the fight against the undead. Even with all the other politics going on, he has had laser focus on this motive. To sideline his character in the most important, defining episode of his personal journey, is just a let down. He didn't need to be Rocky, he didn't need to have performed the kill, but he should have been given a bigger role in the ultimate demise of the Night King. To be neutralized by the half torn apart zombie Dragon when the two other dragons, albeit hurt, were still capable of fighting (and just conveniently disappeared) is lazy at best, SJW dishonest at worst.

And then there's Arya. Let's be honest, Arya was running for her life inside the castle. The Jurassic Park scene was one where she clearly was struggling, scared, and had trouble getting from one side of the room to the next with MAYBE 20 wights in the room. But somehow all she needed was a pep talk from the red woman for her to then proceed to escape a room with wights knocking on the door, somehow making her way down to the godswood, all while evading 20,000 wights, 20 white walkers and the Night King's peripheral vision to jump the NK. Lazy writing. I don't care how much she trained. Why was she shown struggling against a lesser force and then all of a sudden, she overcomes the insurmountable force? The Red Woman needs to coach the Texas A&M Aggie Football team apparently. Or she is really Nick Saban.

Not to mention that Season 1 laid the foundation for Arya to become a revenge machine after watching her father get beheaded by the Lannisters. She was never a player in the fight against the undead until she shows up in Winterfell last season. Understand she has very useful skills, but it just didn't seem right to do it this way.

Ok GoT apologists, fire away.



I can agree with this. I posted before and will reiterate, I think she could have gotten the assist (a la howland reed and Ned Stark killing Ser Authur Dayne) but that wasn't her kill. And I do love her character.

How about this alternative scenario: After Arya's initial sneak attack fails and she is being choked by the NK, instead of catching the dagger herself she unintentionally drops the dagger to the ground. Just as she is about to be killed by the NK, Theon stealthily crawls towards them and grabs the knife off the ground. Then with his final breath he exclaims, "What is dead may never die, but rises again harder and stronger!" He then rears up and stabs the NK in the chest before dying a hero's death and, as Harry Dunne would put it, "totally redeeming himself".
But before Theon stabs the Night King, there's a cut scene to the 20 white walkers having a casual convrsation about the Mueller Report as this is all going down.
La Bamba
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nm
Mantis Toboggan MD
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Zombie Jon Snow said:

lol.... while i haven't been involved in their sparring .... i checked and I have 49......now 50.

Of course... it is my thread and...... well I am King in the North.... errr was King in the North.



"Your Grace, but you're not. Are you? You left Winterfell a king and came back a... I'm not sure what you are now. A lord? Nothing at all?"

Translation: ain't your thread anymore
Zombie Jon Snow
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Mantis Toboggan MD said:

Zombie Jon Snow said:

lol.... while i haven't been involved in their sparring .... i checked and I have 49......now 50.

Of course... it is my thread and...... well I am King in the North.... errr was King in the North.



"Your Grace, but you're not. Are you? You left Winterfell a king and came back a... I'm not sure what you are now. A lord? Nothing at all?"

Translation: ain't your thread anymore

Shut it Sansa.

I'm banging the Queen.....err my aunt... so whatever.
Mantis Toboggan MD
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Zombie Jon Snow said:

Mantis Toboggan MD said:

Zombie Jon Snow said:

lol.... while i haven't been involved in their sparring .... i checked and I have 49......now 50.

Of course... it is my thread and...... well I am King in the North.... errr was King in the North.



"Your Grace, but you're not. Are you? You left Winterfell a king and came back a... I'm not sure what you are now. A lord? Nothing at all?"

Translation: ain't your thread anymore

Shut it Sansa.

I'm banging the Queen.....err my aunt... so whatever.

The name's Lady Mormont, you incestuous half-wit.
PatAg
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Social Media Influencer said:

wangus12 said:

Great post.

I too feel like they've made Arya into this little ultimate God Assassin who is unbeatable and to fix that she needs to lose. She doesn't have to die, but she needs to lose
I don't understand that logic. This is fantasy, and fantasies have heroes.

You probably liked the ending of The Last Jedi.
She both kicked ass AND got her ass kicked in that episode. I dont get how she is unbeatable.
Zombie Jon Snow
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well then you're dead little lady....so i can't hear you.

Unless you can rise from the dead?.... didn't think so.
Swarely
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What this whole thread has turned into

Urban Ag
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Episode IV said:

By they way someone earlier (in the many sour critiques of the episode) mentioned that it was poor story-telling consistency that the Night King re-raised his wights. I don't think he did.

Every time a wight is killed with dragon glass, fire, or Valerian Steel you can hear a "ice / glass breaking / tinkling" sound. When the NK raised his arms when Jon was pursuing him; I think only those recently dead men who were killed by the wights were the ones raised. So the NK certainly replenished his army with his dead foes, but I don't think he re-raised any wights.
Pretty close. Only those not already raised - AND - not raised after being killed by fire, Valyrian steel, or dragonglass rose. The skeletons in the crypts rose but they had never be reanimated before.

All the others that rose when the NK raised his arms were Dothraki, Knights of the Veil, Wildings, Unsullied, Lady Mormont, Dolores Edd, etc. On my re-watch it seemed painfully clear that only the newly dead/not previously reanimated could be reanimated.
Urban Ag
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bangobango said:

redline248 said:

As far as the show is concerned, I agree that the prophesies have been cast aside.


But they didn't, and that's what makes it so damn annoying. Melisandre's entire stoey arch was finding the PWIP. And the way they have Melisandre act in that episode is what drives me absolutely bat **** crazy about it all because it is completely inconsistent with her previous actions and dialogue..
Mel f'd up almost all of her predictions. It's part of why she is an amazing character in the books and series. She is not evil. She truly believes in what her purpose was even if the blood of the innocent is spilled for the realm of men. She is a true, but flawed, believer.

I was mocked endlessly for predicting Mel would return to Winterfell and die at Winterfell and that no one at Winterfell would raise a sword against her despite her past crimes. Mel showed up and gave it all up to do whatever she could against the night.

Being wrong and making bad decisions is literally a bedrock premise in both the books and the series.

As is redemption. It's a story about very flawed people. Some choose to die trying to right their wrongs. Some don't.
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