****** Game of Thrones - Season 8 ******

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Champ Bailey
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C@LAg said:

No one going to comment on the 30 seconds of silent monologuing by the Night King in front of Bran, conveniently allowing time for Arya to magically teleport in and kill him? If he had just walked up to Bran and taken his shot.....

Classic villain trope.


Normally I would agree, but the WW have pretty much always been slow. When he killed Viserion with the spear, it took him like a minute and a half to throw it.

Plus remember when it took him 7 seasons to walk to the wall?

Truvada_for_prep
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Red witch was the mvp why did she kill herself ?
Joseph Parrish
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Truvada_for_prep said:

Red witch was the mvp why did she kill herself ?
She served her purpose, just like Beric.
tk for tu juan
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gigemJTH12 said:

Remember last week when someone found that guy with high billing on the IMDB? The long lanky skinny guy? Did he show up last night? If he did he didn't stand out.

Once the show regulars were confirmed for the episode Javier Botet (Slender Man) got shuffled down the billing and they still have not filled in his role for the episode. He was probably the flash of a large monster one Dothraki ran into awhile colliding with the wights
FightinTexasAg15
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Truvada_for_prep said:

Red witch was the mvp why did she kill herself ?


Her purpose was served. The Lord of Light didn't need her anymore.
Champ Bailey
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aTmAg said:

bonfarr said:

I think it's definitely going to be Arya that kills Cersei the question is what face will she use to do it? There is some speculation that she took Little finger's face but I'm sure Cersei knows he is dead by now.

Has she killed anyone close to Cersei whose face she can use?
I think it's going to be Jamie.

Speaking of, does the show/books address the height issue? Can a 4.5 foot tall girl gain the height of a 6 foot person just by wearing their face? Is it sorta just "magic" just like the voices? If we accept that she takes over every aspect of their physical appearance then she could become the Mountain and let Jamie "meet" with Cersie. Then Jamie could kill her.


Books haven't gotten to explaining the faceless men really yet. Their magic is the most mind boggling to me.
chase128
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Enjoyed this episode, was on the edge of my seat the whole time.

Anyway, would someone explain why the red woman said "valar morghulis" to grey worm?
tk for tu juan
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Truvada_for_prep said:

Red witch was the mvp why did she kill herself ?

Used up all of her force powers like Luke in TLJ
Fenrir
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It's the braavosi version of "hello".
Bodie Broadus
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He was in the library scene with Arya hiding under the table.
redline248
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Ok, I still have like 7 pages left to read since last night. Damn you f-ckers went off with posts.

I personally enjoyed the episode, but I do think HBO stole a big payoff from Jon. I don't really care about what the writers said about wanting to go away from what everyone expected. Sometimes it's ok to give the audience what they want. I hope they give Jon a satisfying combat victory soon. I don't mean defeating a bunch of scrub soldiers in chaos like last night or BoB. I mean toe to toe with Golden Company commander, Euron, the Mountain..something. Obviously, I'm rooting for Clegane Bowl...just making a point.

So, I was wrong about Mel showing up at Winterfell. Question beomes why did she go to Essos last season and how did she get back to Winterfell right on time? Oh well. She shows up to enchant some swords, give Arya a little nudge, and then goes out like Luke Skywalker...except she didn't do anything badass.

Icecream_Ag
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chase128 said:

Enjoyed this episode, was on the edge of my seat the whole time.

Anyway, would someone explain why the red woman said "valar morghulis" to grey worm?
essos greeting probably, but also foreshadowing what was about to happen to the dothraki.
Boiling Denim
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aTmAg said:


It could be that GRRM originally planned to resurrect Jon to kill the NK, but HBO changed it. HBO was sorta stuck killing Jon Snow because of the books, and the rest was up to them.
I don't think there will be a singular Night King in the books. It doesn't really jive with GRRMs theme of nothing is black and white and everything is grey . The army of the dead will be an opposing force of nature but I doubt it will be defeated by one singular act.
C@LAg
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chase128 said:

Enjoyed this episode, was on the edge of my seat the whole time.

Anyway, would someone explain why the red woman said "valar morghulis" to grey worm?
it is a customary greeting in Essos; both of them are from Essos.

Both of them were serving and both of them had a chance to die.
G Martin 87
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bangobango said:

Ranger222 said:

Can we talk a little about Melisandre in terms of her role in this entire series? I'm fine with everything she did last night. Lit some swords, lit some wood, told Arya what her true purpose was. Ok great, no problems here.

I'm just not satisfied with her ending and really her meaning. So her destiny was to strike out the terror of the night and bring light -- accomplished. But why then, if this was her real purpose, was she messing around with Stannis for so long and his pursuit of the Iron Throne? She just realized after she left Winterfell what her true purpose is and just been hanging out?

We can say that her line to Arya about stamping out "blue eyes" and the call back to season 4 (?) was "great writing", but when she first found Arya with Gendry, she cared little about her if she knew then that Arya would ultimately kill the NK and that was Melisandre's true mission in the assist. She still cared more about Gendry then! I think it was more of the writers going back and using something of little consequence back in season 4 to play it up here because it was convenient. "Blue eyes" was not even emphasized in Melisandre's quote in season 4.

And this also plays into what the 'Lord of Light' wants with Jon and his true purpose....she says that Beric has served his purpose and now will die once the LoL is finished with him. Well....the NK is defeated. What is Jon's purpose now with the LoL? Here is a bigger question -- once that task is completed, is Jon just gonna die as he was brought back to serve one role?


They retconned that quote to try to make it seem like they didn't pull this out of their asses. It was just last season Melisandre told Dany to send for Jon bc she and him were the Pwip.
Mel has consistently misinterpreted signs and events from the beginning. It's one of her defining characteristics. She makes mistakes. As the story has progressed, it's evident that she comes to regret her errors profoundly. After finally getting it right, she chooses to end it and pay for what's she done herself.
G Martin 87
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Truvada_for_prep said:

Red witch was the mvp why did she kill herself ?
See above.
benchmark
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CFTXAG10 said:

Got dusty in here when Jorah went down at the end and Dany lost it
Except all I could think about was, "Damn, all that fighting on the back of a dragon and not a hair out of place!"
aTmAg
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redline248 said:

Ok, I still have like 7 pages left to read since last night. Damn you f-ckers went off with posts.

I personally enjoyed the episode, but I do think HBO stole a big payoff from Jon. I don't really care about what the writers said about wanting to go away from what everyone expected. Sometimes it's ok to give the audience what they want. I hope they give Jon a satisfying combat victory soon. I don't mean defeating a bunch of scrub soldiers in chaos like last night or BoB. I mean toe to toe with Golden Company commander, Euron, the Mountain..something. Obviously, I'm rooting for Clegane Bowl...just making a point.

So, I was wrong about Mel showing up at Winterfell. Question beomes why did she go to Essos last season and how did she get back to Winterfell right on time? Oh well. She shows up to enchant some swords, give Arya a little nudge, and then goes out like Luke Skywalker...except she didn't do anything badass.


Maybe the Golden Company kills Dany (with a spear SAM) and Jon gets his revenge killing the commander.
tk for tu juan
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benchmark said:

CFTXAG10 said:

Got dusty in here when Jorah went down at the end and Dany lost it
Except all I could think about was, "Damn, all that fighting on the back of a dragon and not a hair out of place!"

...or "Good luck getting the blood off that white dress"
Urban Ag
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For everyone complaining that the Army of the Dead was built up as the big bad only to get defeated in one episode, remember that:
  • They'd been killing the wildlings (and a few crows) for years
  • They kicked the NW's ass at the Fist of the First Men
  • They kicked the NW and wildling's asses at Hard Home
  • They killed a dragon
  • The destroyed the wall and Eastwatch
  • the ran straight over Last Hearth
  • They pretty much wiped out all the Dothraki and Unsullied

Just seemed painfully evident that there would not, could not, be another major engagement with the NK. He either dies or you lose. No regroup and fight another day.

Further, and I know this is disappointing to many, but it also seems clear the NK and WW's really didn't possess any level of complexity. TCOTF created him for one purpose, kill the humans, and that's all his purpose was.

And if there was ever going to be anything more to that part of the story we'll probably never know because the last time GRRM wrote anything significant about the WW's was book 2 over 20 years ago.
C@LAg
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So Bran is pointless now, and his plot armor is gone, right?

Him being the "memory of man" is irrelevant.

The prior 3ER did nothing to educate man. And now there is no need to know man's history as the only history points that were useful were those tied to the Night King and Littlefinger.

I look forward to him doing his part and serving as a mobile bomb delivery system.
jtstanley4621
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Okay that's what I thought. And it's made of Valyrian steel. But do we know the name of the dagger, or where it actually came from?
Cromagnum
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I'm hoping that their are some legit oh **** moments in the next 3 episodes that reverse some of our current apprehensions.
C@LAg
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jtstanley4621 said:

Okay that's what I thought. And it's made of Valyrian steel. But do we know the name of the dagger, or where it actually came from?
no to the name. but it is referred to as the Catspaw dagger, after the assassin.
Bodie Broadus
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Doesn't a division of Unsullied guard the main temple of R'hllor in the books?
G Martin 87
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Urban Ag said:

For everyone complaining that the Army of the Dead was built up as the big bad only to get defeated in one episode, remember that:
  • They'd been killing the wildlings (and a few crows) for years
  • They kicked the NW's ass at the Fist of the First Men
  • They kicked the NW and wildling's asses at Hard Home
  • They killed a dragon
  • The destroyed the wall and Eastwatch
  • the ran straight over Last Hearth
  • They pretty much wiped out all the Dothraki and Unsullied

Just seemed painfully evident that there would not, could not, be another major engagement with the NK. He either dies or you lose. No regroup and fight another day.

Further, and I know this is disappointing to many, but it also seems clear the NK and WW's really didn't possess any level of complexity. TCOTF created him for one purpose, kill the humans, and that's all his purpose was.

And if there was ever going to be anything more to that part of the story we'll probably never know because the last time GRRM wrote anything significant about the WW's was book 2 over 20 years ago.
Yes. The best way to think about the NK and his purpose is as a Doomsday Machine.



The CotF were losing badly in their war with The First Men. They created a Doomsday Machine in the form of the NK in desperation. They lost control of him.
Fenrir
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To your point, I was thinking this morning that the NK and WW threat was lessened in the minds of many because of the 2 year gap between seasons. It's been a long time since we saw him do anything like what we saw at hardhome.
jtstanley4621
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Cromagnum said:

I'm hoping that their are some legit oh **** moments in the next 3 episodes that reverse some of our current apprehensions.


I'd have to think so. I also still don't think we're QUITE done with prophecies or the role of the three eyed raven. No idea what they'll do, but just what I'm thinking.
Zombie Jon Snow
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jtstanley4621 said:

Just for what it's worth, it could be possible that the night king isn't dead.... I highly doubt it, but it would be kinda crazy if that were the case. They turn back to the actual game of thrones, then the night king returns right at the end. That might be dumb as hell but yeah

By the way maybe I'm rusty but what exactly do we know about the blade Arya used to kill the night king? I feel like I remember Sam coming across mention of that blade in a book somewhere, but don't totally remember fully. Can someone fill me in on that?

Good explanationI found:



Quote:

That Valyrian steel dagger has a long history on Game of Thrones. An assassin or catspaw used the dagger to try to kill Bran Stark in the first season. Littlefinger, who took the dagger from Catelyn Stark, gave the dagger back to Bran. Bran, in turn, gave it to Arya so that she could use it at this moment to save Bran. The weapon that was meant to kill Bran ended up saving his life. As the Three-Eyed Raven, Bran knew that this would come to pass. That's seemingly why he offered himself up as bait during battle planning, and also why he was staring behind the Night King's shoulder after Theon was murdered.


also

In the post-episode breakdown, showrunners David Benioff and D.B. Weiss said that they have known for three years that Arya would be the one to kill the Night King. "We knew it had to be Valyrian steel in the exact spot where the Children of the Forest put the dragonglass blade to create the Night King. And he's uncreated by Valyrian steel."





Icecream_Ag
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jtstanley4621 said:

Okay that's what I thought. And it's made of Valyrian steel. But do we know the name of the dagger, or where it actually came from?
littlefinger gave it to the assassin and he won it from tyrion. Where tyrion got it wasn't mentioned in the show.
Zombie Jon Snow
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Truvada_for_prep said:

Red witch was the mvp why did she kill herself ?

I don't think she did - she held on long enough to see the ending - she was very very very old as her true self.

WhoopN06
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The Daggers name is needle. Jon gave it to Arya.
Farmer1906
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Icecream_Ag said:

jtstanley4621 said:

Okay that's what I thought. And it's made of Valyrian steel. But do we know the name of the dagger, or where it actually came from?
littlefinger gave it to the assassin and he won it from tyrion. Where tyrion got it wasn't mentioned in the show.
Unless I am misremembering, I don't think that was ever Tyrion's. It was the lie Littlefinger told to get the Starks to war against the Lannisters.
tk for tu juan
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WhoopN06 said:

The Daggers name is needle. Jon gave it to Arya.

Nope, Needle is her sword not the dagger
Farmer1906
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WhoopN06 said:

The Daggers name is needle. Jon gave it to Arya.
No, that's her sword. Not the same thing.
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