eric76 said:

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Salute The Marines said:

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Counterpoint said:

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BadMoonRisin said:

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Proposition Joe said:

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So the media wants you scared and in your home.

And they want you vaccinated.

And they have a counter on their websites pushing big vaccination numbers (thirsty for more vaccinations!).

So mass vaccinations will result in people leaving their homes... But the media doesn't want you to leave your home... But the media is also pushing for people to get vaccinated.

That logic is absolutely astounding.

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Wanna tell me the logic of why I have to wear a mask, with no proven science behind it, when I have been vaccinated, smart guy? Im not even anti-vaccine. I got the J&J 3 weeks ago.

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EVERYONE hates wearing masks. They suck! But not everyone is lucky enough to be vaccinated. In your scenario, anyone could just SAY they were vaccinated and not have to wear a mask.

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I don't believe everyone hates wearing masks. We are repeatedly told by posters here it's not a problem and they are used to it now.

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I've been wearing masks for years when going up on the grain elevator. It's no big deal.

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See above

Counterpoint said:

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BadMoonRisin said:

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Proposition Joe said:

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So the media wants you scared and in your home.

And they want you vaccinated.

And they have a counter on their websites pushing big vaccination numbers (thirsty for more vaccinations!).

So mass vaccinations will result in people leaving their homes... But the media doesn't want you to leave your home... But the media is also pushing for people to get vaccinated.

That logic is absolutely astounding.

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Wanna tell me the logic of why I have to wear a mask, with no proven science behind it, when I have been vaccinated, smart guy? Im not even anti-vaccine. I got the J&J 3 weeks ago.

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EVERYONE hates wearing masks. They suck! But not everyone is lucky enough to be vaccinated. In your scenario, anyone could just SAY they were vaccinated and not have to wear a mask.

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Who cares? Keep your distance from those that don't wear them. problem solved.

eric76 said:

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Salute The Marines said:

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Counterpoint said:

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BadMoonRisin said:

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Proposition Joe said:

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So the media wants you scared and in your home.

And they want you vaccinated.

And they have a counter on their websites pushing big vaccination numbers (thirsty for more vaccinations!).

So mass vaccinations will result in people leaving their homes... But the media doesn't want you to leave your home... But the media is also pushing for people to get vaccinated.

That logic is absolutely astounding.

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Wanna tell me the logic of why I have to wear a mask, with no proven science behind it, when I have been vaccinated, smart guy? Im not even anti-vaccine. I got the J&J 3 weeks ago.

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EVERYONE hates wearing masks. They suck! But not everyone is lucky enough to be vaccinated. In your scenario, anyone could just SAY they were vaccinated and not have to wear a mask.

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I don't believe everyone hates wearing masks. We are repeatedly told by posters here it's not a problem and they are used to it now.

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I've been wearing masks for years when going up on the grain elevator. It's no big deal.

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I also wore one for those 12 hour days raking hay on an open-cab tractor.

Masks suck and are a huge deal to some of us. I couldn't care less if some of you are more okay with them. Wearing one 45 hours a week at work is god awful to me, and I wouldn't wear one another second in my life it it were my way here. You want to keep wearing one? Go for it. Just don't tell me to.

Counterpoint said:

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BadMoonRisin said:

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Proposition Joe said:

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So the media wants you scared and in your home.

And they want you vaccinated.

And they have a counter on their websites pushing big vaccination numbers (thirsty for more vaccinations!).

So mass vaccinations will result in people leaving their homes... But the media doesn't want you to leave your home... But the media is also pushing for people to get vaccinated.

That logic is absolutely astounding.

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Wanna tell me the logic of why I have to wear a mask, with no proven science behind it, when I have been vaccinated, smart guy? Im not even anti-vaccine. I got the J&J 3 weeks ago.

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EVERYONE hates wearing masks. They suck! But not everyone is lucky enough to be vaccinated. In your scenario, anyone could just SAY they were vaccinated and not have to wear a mask.

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Why would someone need to lie about being vaccinated? I haven't been vaccinated and I don't wear masks anymore.

coolerguy12 said:

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Quote:

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The only issue is that if a sufficient number of people don't get the vaccine, it increases the risks of variants emerging that are not covered by the vaccine. Then those vaccinated could get reinfected, those unvaccinated could get infected in large numbers, and we again have the problem of overwhelmed ICUs. Is it a likely scenario, no. But is it possible, yes. And if it happens, the odds of being able to truly get on with our lives is a little less likely. At least for those in healthcare that have to deal with it.

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Sounds scary.

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This is the problem. Holier than thou individuals accusing people of misinformation and fearmongering about vaccines yet that has been what's going on the past year about COVID.

Two weeks to stop the spread led to full lockdowns led to full eradication led to two masks led to masks even when you're vaccinated and now more fearmongering around variants.

Add on to throwing the raw death number with zero context behind it as well. These people have no self awareness or humility.

mrmill3218 said:

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Just a thought experiment:

How do we know the covid vaccines are safe long term? Do we know that there won't be and side effects or health issues months or years from now? I know they are emergency use approved by the FDA, but they're not officially FDA approved from what I understand.

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Kind of like we don't know what the long term consequences of having Covid will be for some.....

coolerguy12 said:

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Quote:

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The only issue is that if a sufficient number of people don't get the vaccine, it increases the risks of variants emerging that are not covered by the vaccine. Then those vaccinated could get reinfected, those unvaccinated could get infected in large numbers, and we again have the problem of overwhelmed ICUs. Is it a likely scenario, no. But is it possible, yes. And if it happens, the odds of being able to truly get on with our lives is a little less likely. At least for those in healthcare that have to deal with it.

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Sounds scary.

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When you post only to try to one up someone offering real information you just sound small.

Was it real information or was it a hypothetical? The line between the two has been really fuzzy the past 12 months.

I was merely pointing out how many qualifiers were in that paragraph. Sorry if that offended you.

If you are vaccinated or recovered there is no reason to wear a mask.

Wearing a mask outside is just idiotic.

Wearing a mask driving alone or with your live in family is stupid.

If you don't want to wear one then don't.

If you don't like it stay 6 feet back.

I will no longer wear one.

bigtruckguy3500 said:

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mrmill3218 said:

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How do we know the covid vaccines are safe long term? Do we know that there won't be and side effects or health issues months or years from now? I know they are emergency use approved by the FDA, but they're not officially FDA approved from what I understand.

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We don't. But we know how vaccines in the past have worked. We know how this vaccine works. We know the basic science behind it, and nothing points to a mechanism by which it could be harmful long term. We also know that vaccine adverse events tend to occur within the first 2 months following a vaccine.

Long story short, there is no way of knowing without a time machine and going forward 50+ years.

I don't know how old you are, but there was a time when we didn't know the long term side effects of the polio vaccine. Or the small pox vaccine. We don't even know the long term side effects of the majority of blood pressure medications people take on a daily basis - but we do know that taking them saves lives.

coolerguy12 said:

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Then everyone will have made their choice and we can get on with our lives. If it works you have nothing to worry about (if you chose to take it)

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The only issue is that if a sufficient number of people don't get the vaccine, it increases the risks of variants emerging that are not covered by the vaccine. Then those vaccinated could get reinfected, those unvaccinated could get infected in large numbers, and we again have the problem of overwhelmed ICUs. Is it a likely scenario, no. But is it possible, yes. And if it happens, the odds of being able to truly get on with our lives is a little less likely. At least for those in healthcare that have to deal with it.

In4TheHuddle said:

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My question to the medical and scientific community would be how do we know the genetic material ever gets turned off? Could it keep producing spike proteins for years, if so what are the risks of autoimmune disease developing from runaway protein production? I'm sure many will develop unforeseen issues, the extent of which are largely unknown. As others have pointed out, why is this unknown more risky than merely utilizing known effective treatments on at risk populations.

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Because it has been studied for decades in animal and laboratory models. Additionally, the half-life of mRNA is incredibly short. We've known for a long time that RNA gets degraded very quickly, well before anyone even conceived mRNA vaccines. If mRNA stuck around for prolonged periods of time then we'd all be walking around super swole because every time we worked out our body would produce produce protein from mRNA for a long period of time.

The half-life of mRNA is less than an hour (most of the time on the order of minutes).

mrmill3218 said:

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What is the whole "messing with your DNA" thing?

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That means people without an understanding of human biology have been spreading false rumors about the vaccine.

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This was the most thorough and concise post. Unfortunately people don't understand the societal benefit of herd immunity.

BadMoonRisin said:

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Not sure. I've never seen the medical establishment and media so thirsty to get everyone vaccinated though. It's odd.

There is a counter on CNN with numbers of vaccinations that magically took over for number of total cases somewhere near the end of January. And they are reporting statistics of "number of people over age 16" to get vaccinated...when this illness is basically completely harmless to those under 20 years old. If this was really about science, they would put the number of those over the age of 65 to get vaccinated, because that's is thepopulation where a huge majority of hospitalizations and deaths come from.

I also heard they are starting trials on those as young as 6 months old. WHY?

I guess there could be a profit motive, like anything else, but jesus. It's kind of creepy.

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There was a time when people used to listen to doctors. Now they just listen to Donald Trump.

coolerguy12 said:

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Was it real information or was it a hypothetical? The line between the two has been really fuzzy the past 12 months.

I was merely pointing out how many qualifiers were in that paragraph. Sorry if that offended you.

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The gentleman who posted that posts a lot of factual information. Your post was a one liner with none.
This board has sadly driven many doctors away, filled with political agenda shouting down anyone who doesn't agree with them.
It's a shame this board has become F17 ...(took a quick glance at your forum history).

bay fan said:

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coolerguy12 said:

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Was it real information or was it a hypothetical? The line between the two has been really fuzzy the past 12 months.

I was merely pointing out how many qualifiers were in that paragraph. Sorry if that offended you.

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The gentleman who posted that posts a lot of factual information. Your post was a one liner with none.
This board has sadly driven many doctors away, filled with political agenda shouting down anyone who doesn't agree with them.
It's a shame this board has become F17 ...(took a quick glance at your forum history).

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I agree with this. This board has become an echo chamber.

DadHammer said:

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If you are vaccinated or recovered there is no reason to wear a mask.

Wearing a mask outside is just idiotic.

Wearing a mask driving alone or with your live in family is stupid.

If you don't want to wear one then don't.

If you don't like it stay 6 feet back.

I will no longer wear one.

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We're vacinnated. Both MRNA and not dead yet. We're understanding that all don't have the ability to work from home.

Around vaccinated friends, the hood, park, etc. we don't mask. Around our kid's day care workers and waiters we do. The pandemic is still on for many. With TX moving to all adults, I suspect we'll stop masking by the end of next month. For now, we'll continue to make a small gesture to those that have to face people daily.

I really, honestly, don't care about TexAg's Politics sheeple bull**** appeals. It's dumb. Blowing by an HEB person asking you to mask today is akin to my 2 year old's tantrum. And she rocks a mask just fine. Grow up.

You say certain groups of people, yet I know someone dying in a Houston hospital on a ventilator right now that's under 50, a former marine , in good physical condition, and highly active.... not a member of any high risk pool. Know another that was under thirty and in brilliant condition, yet I helped his parents pay for the Urn. My nonagenarian grandmother on the other hand, came out of it with less trouble than me.

I realize what the trends show, but the belief one can get sick and just not worry if they're in a certain age group is... flawed.

RangerRick9211 said:

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DadHammer said:

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If you are vaccinated or recovered there is no reason to wear a mask.

Wearing a mask outside is just idiotic.

Wearing a mask driving alone or with your live in family is stupid.

If you don't want to wear one then don't.

If you don't like it stay 6 feet back.

I will no longer wear one.

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We're vacinnated. Both MRNA and not dead yet. We're understanding that all don't have the ability to work from home.

Around vaccinated friends, the hood, park, etc. we don't mask. Around our kid's day care workers and waiters we do. The pandemic is still on for many. With TX moving to all adults, I suspect we'll stop masking by the end of next month. For now, we'll continue to make a small gesture to those that have to face people daily.

I really, honestly, don't care about TexAg's Politics sheeple bull**** appeals. It's dumb. Blowing by an HEB person asking you to mask today is akin to my 2 year old's tantrum. And she rocks a mask just fine. Grow up.

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Sorry. Not masking at HEB or anywhere else that doesn't require it. Masking at this point is for theater. That's something 2 year olds do...

RangerRick9211 said:

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DadHammer said:

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If you are vaccinated or recovered there is no reason to wear a mask.

Wearing a mask outside is just idiotic.

Wearing a mask driving alone or with your live in family is stupid.

If you don't want to wear one then don't.

If you don't like it stay 6 feet back.

I will no longer wear one.

---

We're vacinnated. Both MRNA and not dead yet. We're understanding that all don't have the ability to work from home.

Around vaccinated friends, the hood, park, etc. we don't mask. Around our kid's day care workers and waiters we do. The pandemic is still on for many. With TX moving to all adults, I suspect we'll stop masking by the end of next month. For now, we'll continue to make a small gesture to those that have to face people daily.

I really, honestly, don't care about TexAg's Politics sheeple bull**** appeals. It's dumb. Blowing by an HEB person asking you to mask today is akin to my 2 year old's tantrum. And she rocks a mask just fine. Grow up.

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You put your two year old in a mask?! What the **** is wrong with you?

01agtx said:

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bay fan said:

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coolerguy12 said:

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Was it real information or was it a hypothetical? The line between the two has been really fuzzy the past 12 months.

I was merely pointing out how many qualifiers were in that paragraph. Sorry if that offended you.

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The gentleman who posted that posts a lot of factual information. Your post was a one liner with none.
This board has sadly driven many doctors away, filled with political agenda shouting down anyone who doesn't agree with them.
It's a shame this board has become F17 ...(took a quick glance at your forum history).

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I agree with this. This board has become an echo chamber.

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So someone comes from another board and doesn't agree with one of the positions (or hypothetical depending how you read the post) and all of the sudden it's my fault that the board is an echo chamber? I agree with you it's an echo chamber, but it seems we differ on which side is echoing. I'm on the side of not setting public policy based on hypotheticals and what ifs. I come here to get the latest data and factual information. Forgive me if I'm not ready to fall in line over a bunch of maybes that don't line up with what seems to be actually happening.

DadHammer said:

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If you are vaccinated or recovered there is no reason to wear a mask.

Wearing a mask outside is just idiotic.

Wearing a mask driving alone or with your live in family is stupid.

If you don't want to wear one then don't.

If you don't like it stay 6 feet back.

I will no longer wear one.

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I'm 78 and was in the hospital 8 days. On oxygen and leveled out at 96-98. Discharged and doing great. Been home and about for 2 months. Talked to 5 doctors and a bunch of nurses while in the hospital. It's interesting to me to learn what they know and what they don't know. Most doc's, if they know you, will tell you that the future is uncertain about where we'll be with the covid. They know what they know right now, but that may change down the line. Interesting to me that there is no information about O positive people and their natural resistance to the virus.Do I wear a mask? Nope. Will I be vaccinated in a month when I'm eligible? Haven't decided. Would I like more information? Yes, but so would a lot of others, including people in the medical community.

tysker said:

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bay fan said:

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coolerguy12 said:

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Was it real information or was it a hypothetical? The line between the two has been really fuzzy the past 12 months.

I was merely pointing out how many qualifiers were in that paragraph. Sorry if that offended you.

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The gentleman who posted that posts a lot of factual information. Your post was a one liner with none.
This board has sadly driven many doctors away, filled with political agenda shouting down anyone who doesn't agree with them.
It's a shame this board has become F17 ...(took a quick glance at your forum history).

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Posters have driven doctors away from this board or doctors or no longer able to add value? Besides telling people to get their vaccine, it still seems the medical and healthcare community is unable to make a clear scientific and data-driven statements to the public. Even children get frustrated and annoyed when they ask 'why?' and the retort is 'because I told you so.'

edit to add: or maybe Doctors got wise to the fact that they could be giving medical advice that is somewhat opposed to, if not in direct conflict with, guidelines and standards developed by administrators and politicians instead of on-the-ground responders like themselves. Like Mr Burr (sir) reminds us, sometimes it's better to talk less, smile more.

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Wow, that's arrogance in an extreme. Doctors not able to add value? But you do? Let's just say it's not much of a reach to say you are the perfect illustration of why fewer waste their time here. There is an abundance of data driven facts shared all the time but if people like you don't like them they reject them and scream them down. That's a fact you won't like.

bay fan said:

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tysker said:

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bay fan said:

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coolerguy12 said:

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Was it real information or was it a hypothetical? The line between the two has been really fuzzy the past 12 months.

I was merely pointing out how many qualifiers were in that paragraph. Sorry if that offended you.

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The gentleman who posted that posts a lot of factual information. Your post was a one liner with none.
This board has sadly driven many doctors away, filled with political agenda shouting down anyone who doesn't agree with them.
It's a shame this board has become F17 ...(took a quick glance at your forum history).

---

Posters have driven doctors away from this board or doctors or no longer able to add value? Besides telling people to get their vaccine, it still seems the medical and healthcare community is unable to make a clear scientific and data-driven statements to the public. Even children get frustrated and annoyed when they ask 'why?' and the retort is 'because I told you so.'

edit to add: or maybe Doctors got wise to the fact that they could be giving medical advice that is somewhat opposed to, if not in direct conflict with, guidelines and standards developed by administrators and politicians instead of on-the-ground responders like themselves. Like Mr Burr (sir) reminds us, sometimes it's better to talk less, smile more.

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Wow, that's arrogance in an extreme. Doctors not able to add value? But you do? Let's just say it's not much of a reach to say you are the perfect illustration of why fewer waste their time here. There is an abundance of data driven facts shared all the time but if people like you don't like them they reject them and scream them down. That's a fact you won't like.

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Thanks for your support, I guess? What facts am I disputing? I only challenge your non-fact based, non-data driven assumption you are making that doctors have been driven away been driven away because other posters question their arguments. I argue, instead that maybe there could be other reasons. I also added my opinion that I'm not certain what value a single doctor can provide on this board at this juncture, besides reminding people to get their shot. Most everything else, as even noted just above, is still unknown and I'm not completely sure on-the-ground doctors have much desire to share information they either don't fully understand themselves or may be in conflict with other agendas. Professionally and ethically it may make sense for them to back away at this point, that's all I'm saying. As a financial professional, I have a similar response to the B&I board.

Challenging others is how science and philosophy grow and cooperative argumentative dialogue is the basis for both the Socratic method the scientific method. I"m trying to have a conversation here and you attack me, and then blame me for it? I'm sorry but that is neither fair nor appropriate.

To the discussion of the importance of getting vaccinated. In communities that are partially vaccinated, the evolutionary pressure on the virus to find a way around the vaccine is significantly stronger than it is in communities that aren't vaccinated. The odds of a viral escape are much higher in America than Africa right now - which is why herd immunity from all variants is an important milestone. Does that mean there will ever be some sort of escape from the virus? No. But partially vaccinated communities are a threat that can lead to a much bigger problem - not that they will. Also, I would encourage you to get vaccinated not just for you, but the people that cannot get vaccinated around you (immunocompromised as an example).

The goal has never been to eradicate the virus, it's been to manage the virus. Last April it was clear eradication was impossible, but slowing the rate of infection was critical (see NYC). Everything since then has been about slowing transmission to a manageable level. Since we never had strong central leadership on the subject, we were left with fragmented local strategies that had to take into account many different variables. The vaccine gives us the pathway to manage the virus above all other measures. However, the virus will be endemic permanently.

I always find it ridiculous when people are worried about the vaccine, but not worried about the virus. It shows a complete lack of knowledge and critical thinking. Lots of good resources have been posted in this thread, so I'll leave it at that. The vaccine only has a 99.9999999999% survival rate after all.

I also don't understand why people can't do the common courtesy of wearing a mask (in public and indoors) until the vaccines are widely available to the public whether you've been vaccinated or not. It's really not asking much and it's almost over. I'd also ask that you don't drink and drive as a common courtesy to those around you. Hopefully that doesn't infringe on your rights to be selfosh and immature too much.

COVID-19 and Blood Type | Harvard Medical School

Gordo14 said:

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To the discussion of the importance of getting vaccinated. In communities that are partially vaccinated, the evolutionary pressure on the virus to find a way around the vaccine is significantly stronger than it is in communities that aren't vaccinated. The odds of a viral escape are much higher in America than Africa right now - which is why herd immunity from all variants is an important milestone. Does that mean there will ever be some sort of escape from the virus? No. But partially vaccinated communities are a threat that can lead to a much bigger problem - not that they will. Also, I would encourage you to get vaccinated not just for you, but the people that cannot get vaccinated around you (immunocompromised as an example).

The goal has never been to eradicate the virus, it's been to manage the virus. Last April it was clear eradication was impossible, but slowing the rate of infection was critical (see NYC). Everything since then has been about slowing transmission to a manageable level. Since we never had strong central leadership on the subject, we were left with fragmented local strategies that had to take into account many different variables. The vaccine gives us the pathway to manage the virus above all other measures. However, the virus will be endemic permanently.

I always find it ridiculous when people are worried about the vaccine, but not worried about the virus. It shows a complete lack of knowledge and critical thinking. Lots of good resources have been posted in this thread, so I'll leave it at that. The vaccine only has a 99.9999999999% survival rate after all.

I also don't understand why people can't do the common courtesy of wearing a mask (in public and indoors) until the vaccines are widely available to the public whether you've been vaccinated or not. It's really not asking much and it's almost over. I'd also ask that you don't drink and drive as a common courtesy to those around you. Hopefully that doesn't infringe on your rights to be selfosh and immature too much.

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Now do the survival rate of the virus. Especially for those under 65.