Me too. Heck of a deal at HEB

What's everyone drinking tonight? 2004 Silver Oak Alex Valley 1.5L here.

Found this at my girlfriend's mom's place.

1.5L. What can y'all tell me?

Had an '11 bard with the family. Needs more time but figured eff it, wanted to celebrate with everyone.

If it has been stored properly, drink it now. I had an 85 Krug on Sunday, and while it still had some good fruit in it, it had very few bubbles, and was exhibiting a lot of sherry and oxidative flavors. You have to like old champagne to enjoy it.
If it hasn't been stored properly, you might as well open it and see how it is. Regardless of what you do, that wine isn't going to get any better, so you might as well drink it.

At the parents house with the family and didn't see the years but he below were opened:

Alpha Omega petit Verdot/cab franc
Joseph Phelps Pinot (don't remember the Sonoma vineyard)
Barnett vineyard Pinot
Signorello cab
Myriad Napa cab

'03 Silver Oak Napa Cab thus far

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1.5L. What can y'all tell me?

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I don't anything about the wine but I can tell you that 1.5L will get ya drunk!

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I had an 85 Krug on Sunday, and while it still had some good fruit in it, it had very few bubbles, and was exhibiting a lot of sherry and oxidative flavors.

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The '75 Dom I had on my birthday was like that. Very, very different. I'd rather have a '96 Salon but it was a fun wine. Glad I did it, but also glad I had the '75 Yquem later that night to finish strong.

2012 Caymus Jeroboam

Deutz Champagne to start today, and 2010 Joseph Phelps Insignia with lunch. 2009 Realm To-Kalon later tonight.
Merry Christmas you winos.

Thought this might be the best place to ask this question. My mother in law asked me to see if I could sell these two bottles pictured below.



I did some googling but couldn't find a ton of information. Do you think these bottles are worth much? If they are I'd like to try and sell them.

Hello!

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Merry Christmas you winos.

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Same to you, sir.

We are having Rivers Marie and a cab TBD. Had planned on other wines but are switching it up as plans for the day changed.

and I officially gifted myself several bottles of DRC today. Life is good. I hope you all have a great day with your families and cherish every moment. Merry Christmas to you all and God bless.

We added a 2012 Two Old Dogs Herb Lamb Vineyard (the second wine to the Herb Lamb wines) to drink after we drank the Realm. We also drank a 2010 AP vin Rosella's Vineyard Pinot for before dinner drinking.
I've made some cellar space today.

Cross Posted from General Board

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First growth wines go with everything. It was a trick question.

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Cross-posted to Food and Spirits Board "What's in your wine cellar"

Thanks for posting this! The OP's use of the term "First Growth" is a common but inaccurate description. However, I doubt you would/did go wrong drinking any of these, or as one poster put it, to "drink them all!" At first blush, my pick was the Pontet-Canet for a couple of reasons: 2006 was a good year and it's from Pauillac, which arguably has the greatest concentration of top Bordeaux. No attack intended on the OP or anyone else whatsoever, but since I am currently buying some recent Bordeaux vintages this thread encouraged me to take a deeper dive on the subject and to challenge myself to share what little knowledge I may have.


BORDEAUX OVERVIEW

Today there are officially only 5 First Growth Bordeaux and all come from the "Left Bank" (meaning West side of the Gironde Estuary) near the city of Bordeaux, France: of the Northwestern villages of Bordeaux known as "Medoc" are Pauillac's 1) Chateau Lafite, 2) Chateau Latour and 3) Chateau Mouton Rothschild, which was later added in 1973, and Margaux's 4) Chateau Margaux; of the Southwestern villages known as "Graves" are Pessac-Leognan's 5) Chateau Haut-Brion.

Commonly included in discussions today on First Growth wines (since the 1855 list only included the Left Bank wines of Medoc and Graves), which make up the unofficial "Club of 9" are the following:

6) Chateau d'Yquem - a white wine from the Graves village of Sauternes and one of the original 5 First Growth wines in 1855

and the "Right Bank" wines....
7) Chateau Cheval Blanc - Bordeaux from St. Emilion (Eastern region) village of St. Emilion
8) Chateau Ausone - same as Cheval Blanc
9) Chateau Petrus - Bordeaux from the Pomerol village near St. Emilion


CLASSIFICATION

Bordeaux is classified among some 50+ appellations covered by six different classifications. In other words, labels are confusing if not misleading. So there are different rating systems depending upon where the Bordeaux was produced. Here are some decent resources I have come across:

Bordeaux Classification primer http://www.world-food-and-wine.com/wine-classification-in-bordeaux

Medoc and Graves Chateaus producing since 1855 http://www.thewinecellarinsider.com/bordeaux-wine-producer-profiles/bordeaux/1855-bordeaux-classification/

Medoc Chateaus not included in the 1855 guide http://www.thewinecellarinsider.com/bordeaux-wine-producer-profiles/bordeaux/list-of-crus-bourgeois-classification/

Graves Chateaus not included the 1855 guide http://www.wine-searcher.com/graves-classification.lml

Saint Emilion Chateaus http://www.thewinecellarinsider.com/bordeaux-wine-producer-profiles/bordeaux/list-of-current-st-emilion-classifications/


THE LINE-UP

So back to the OP's selections from Left to Right (Chateau/Year/appellation/classification/auction price at Wine Searcher/average rating at Cellar Tracker):

• Calon Segur 2005 St. Estephe "Grand Cru," Third Growth, $85, 92 points
• Beychevelle 2012 St. Julien "Grand Vin," Fourth Growth, $65, 89 points
• Brane-Cantenac 2008 Margaux "Grand Cru," Second Growth, $65, 89 points
• Pavie MacQuinn 2011 St. Emilion (different classification) "Premier Grand Cru," Class B, $60, 92 points
• Pontet-Canet 2006 Pauillac "Grand Cru," Fifth Growth, $89, 92 points

As you can see, the lowly Fifth Growth "Pontet-Canet" sells for more and rates higher than the once esteemed Second Growth Brane-Cantenac (yes, I get that they are different vintages but really the point stands) while the only Chateau not rated in the 1855 guide AND from the Right Bank of St. Emilion, Pavie, ties for the highest score while at the lowest cost. In all, not bad for left bank Bordeaux on a budget. Personally, I would probably avoid the Beychevelle St. Julien and the Brane-Cantenac Margaux after some light research, but I would be interested in drinking the 2006 Pontet-Canet right now and may look for some 2010-2012 Pavie to add to my cellar. My latest addition is a 2011 Lynch Bages, another lowly Fifth Growth that is outselling and outscoring most Second Growth Bordeauxs!

and by comparison...

• Lafite Rothschilde - 2010 Pauillac, First Growth, $1100, 98 points
• Latour - 2008 Pauillac, First Growth, $625, 95 points
• Petrus - 2011 Pomerol, First Growth, $2072, 95 points
• d'Yquem - 2005 Sauternes, First Growth, $596, 97 points
• Haut-Brion - 2012 St. Emilion, First Growth, $398, 96 points

THE TAKEAWAY

True First Growth Bordeaux are expensive and rare. The Second-Fifth Growth classification system is junk.too much has changed in 160 years! The use of Premier Gran Cru, Grand Cru Classe, Grand Cru and the like do not necessarily speak to the quality of the wine IN THAT PARTICULAR BOTTLE but rather the potential of that wine to be of a superior quality based on the terroir/winemaker/history of the Chateau. There are both great values and tremendous rip-offs when purchasing Bordeaux; it pays to do your homework!

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More later when I've time, but I'm not sure if #6 is correct.

The father in law and I decided to drink a little heavily at Christmas dinner (and several hours after). Final death count was 9 bottles. (Not just the two of us drinking, there were probably 7 of us, but most only had a couple of glasses)

Bottles drank from both of our stock:
-2011 screaming eagle second flight
-2012 Jordan Chardonnay x2
2003 caymus special select
-2011 caymus special select
-2012 hundred acre few and far between cab x3
- something else that at this point I completely forgot.

I felt like **** this morning.

Classifications of French wines are complicated and confusing. That post is (sort of) right but incomplete and a couple of misstatements I think. But it is a very complex subject and not really able to be condensed in a post.

The 1855 classification was for Medoc only. Haut-Brion is in Passac-Leognan, but it was the exception.
Sweet wines were classified as well, 14 second growths, 11 first growths and one "first superior growth" which is Chateau d'Yquem.

Also note that in Bordeaux the chateaux is classified, while in Burgundy the vineyard is classified.

Other areas have their own classifications or no classifications. Pomerol has no classification therefore Petrus is unclassified.

The Bordeaux right bank region of St. Emilion has it's own completely separate classification system started in 1954 and reclassified every ten years. It's controversial and in a bit of flux. "Premiere Grand Cru" is the top classification and there are 18 of them but four are ranked "A" above the others. In addition to the Ausone and Cheval Blanc mentioned, Angelus and Pavie are in the same "A" category of St. Emilion Premier Grand Cru.

Graves has it's own system as well, started in 1953. It has only 16 properties including Haut-Brion which is also on the 1855 Medoc list.

There is also a "Cru Bourgeois" classification in Medoc for Chateaux omitted from the 1855 classification. It started in 1932 and is rerated every 10 years. It is now used as a an annual quality assessment more than a classification of chateaus. There are about 250 of them. A new classification system may be enacted in 2016.

And... Medoc has "Cru Artisan" for small family owned estates. About 44 of them.

I don't think I agree that the 1855 classification is obsolete. In general it does a decent job. It was originally based on price (1855 prices) but is still a fairly good indicator today. The prices of the first growths have gotten silly, but the Russell Crowe narrated "Red Obsession" does a fun job of showing how Chinese billionaires have run up the price.

Shopping based upon Medoc classifications almost requires carrying a list with you. Burgundy absolutely does.

One last complication. All of these classifications apply to AOC wines, (the official EU term is PDO -Protected designation of Originl) There are also IGP wines, which are a step down in quality but can have some really good value.

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The father in law and I decided to drink a little heavily at Christmas dinner (and several hours after). Final death count was 9 bottles. (Not just the two of us drinking, there were probably 7 of us, but most only had a couple of glasses)

Bottles drank from both of our stock:
-2011 screaming eagle second flight
-2012 Jordan Chardonnay x2
2003 caymus special select
-2011 caymus special select
-2012 hundred acre few and far between cab x3
- something else that at this point I completely forgot.

I felt like **** this morning.

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Yeah, but what a night! I bow to your dedication!

One misstatement that I believe you are referring to was my including Graves in the 1855 classification when your position is that Haut-Brion was included only as an exception at that no other Chateau outside of Medoc was considered--- is that correct? If so, was there another misstatement?

Bought a couple more mixed cases of 2009-2010 French Bordeaux and Rhones this week with a few special 2005s for the collection. Can't wait to spend more time drinking and less time buying!

My knowledge is academic, you likely have more experience than I.

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6) Chateau d'Yquem - a white wine from the Graves village of Sauternes and one of the original 5 First Growth wines in 1855

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This is what caught my eye. Yquem wasn't one of the original first growths. I don't consider it withthem. It was part of a completely different classification., Minor point and shaving at the edges though!

My family is all together at my house for the first time in 11 years (we typically travel to them) so we decided to drink champagne. We let my 12 year old niece pop the cork and take the first sip, which was a gulp. Typical in this family, I guess...

we drank Delille wines with Christmas dinner - the '14 Estate Blanc and the '14 Doyenne Rousanne. both were great with the food. We also opened an '11 Aix which is a Cab/Syrah from Delille and it was great for the price point.

Mike Smith just killed it on Wine Advocate's Napa Report...four 100 point wines and several more 99 and 98 point wines. Great winemaker! Great guy!

Realm had three 100 point wines, a 99, and two 98's.

Is WA getting looser with the 100 point ratings?

It seems that way, but I've tasted a few of these and for my palate, I have to agree with him on some '12 and '13. But for '14, I doubt you see many, if any at all, 100's.

Can you list Mike's wines?

All cabs...

100 points
Carter GTO
Carter The OG
Carter Las Piedras
Myriad Dr Crane Reserve Elysian

99 points
Scarlett Cabernet McGah reserve

98 points
12C cabernet reserve
Carter Granddaddy
Myriad George III
Myriad Dr Crane
Quivet Las Piedras

97 points
Carter Three Kings

Several more of his are in the mid 90's. He's pretty excited today to say the least.

2012 or 2013? Thx

These are '13s. This was the second half of the 2013 Napa report.

Scarecrow also got 100...looks like I'll wait till 2014 to consider dropping them. I kid but they are getting expensive!

Glad I got most of those Myriads. Will be interesting to see if Elysian goes over $200 now...

The only reason I can think of for the Elysian Reserve going over $200 is '14 being a "lesser" vintage. But then again, he sets his prices way before any ratings come out. I don't blame him one bit if he pops over that mark. But then again, Mike makes "affordable" wines and had been pretty good about not going too crazy on prices so he may keep it down. So that's two reasons I guess.

I bought a mag and two 750s of Elysian. I probably should have just bought all 750s but I guess I can break the mag out at my 50th birthday party...a decade from now.

Going to napa week of Feb 17th, staying in Yountville. We've been three times but wanted to get opinions on some of vineyards to visit. like the more private tastings.