Yes, BB.

Disease

Wow. Wonder if that can be/was insured.

Probably. Don't think he's replanting. And, he has few money concerns...

Yeah, but NO ONE likes losing $$.

MooreTrucker said:

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Just wanted to share this in case it hasn't been already....

Top 10 Wineries in Texas

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Pretty comical article.
Perdenales, Becker, lost oak , lol

Even William Chris is just mediocre table wine.

I will agree with Cecil about Calais. Ben produces a pretty good batch every now and then. I have been disappointed with the latest Lewis releases. We have decided to cancel that membership.

Honestly, I agree with all of that.

I've really enjoyed Ben's Cabernet efforts, and really liked his Botrytized Chenin Blanc. Some of his minor grape stuff, not so much.

WC has a couple of wines I like, "Hunter" and the "Artists Blend" GSM. Chris is a good Ag and is a leader in the quest for "Texas Wine" to mean... well... Texas Wine.

Lewis I include for effort and attitude. Doug's a good guy, and I think will make some really good wine at some point.

Speaking of wine clubs???

cecil77 said:

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Honestly, I agree with all of that.

I've really enjoyed Ben's Cabernet efforts, and really liked his Botrytized Chenin Blanc. Some of his minor grape stuff, not so much.

WC has a couple of wines I like, "Hunter" and the "Artists Blend" GSM. Chris is a good Ag and is a leader in the quest for "Texas Wine" to mean... well... Texas Wine.

Lewis I include for effort and attitude. Doug's a good guy, and I think will make some really good wine at some point.

Speaking of wine clubs???

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Well, a lot of the Hill Country wine comes from up here, esp. temperanillo. And guys like Trilogy are putting out some pretty good Malbec, too, as well as cab and petite verdot. I'm thinking West Tx is about to become a bigger player soon.

The vast majority of Texas wines made/sold by wineries in the Hill Country are grapes from West Texas. Something like 85% of Texas wine grapes are grown there. If the huge (for Texas) Terry County producers can be convinced to drop their yields and raise their quality, it will be a sea change for Texas grapes. Narra vineyards already has, and the wines from their grapes are outstanding. Sadly there's far too many 8-12 ton/acre yields producing $15 grocery store wine that had a $30 price tag in the winery.

The economic reality, is that to be DTC the "winery" is most profitable on 290. The scare quotes is because little of the wine is actually fermented in the wineries on 290. Texas Custom Wine Works in Brownfield makes a bunch of it.

And, of course, by federal law "Texas" on the front label only means 75% (or more) of the grapes are Texas grapes. The big producers (Messina Hof, Becker, Llano) leverage this to produce much more wine appellated "Texas" than they could if they really produced 100% Texas wine.

Two quick brags:
* Dan Gatlin (with Neal Newsom) planted the first Tempranillo vines in west Texas in (I think) 1997. Dan had to convince Neal to do it, and guaranteed the first crop.
* Inwood produces all of it's wine in the 290 winery, from fermentation to bottling. Both for it's west Texas grapes and it's Fredericksburg grapes.

I like some of the WC better than table wine, but really, nothing wrong with good table wine either. Of course their pricing doesn't really reflect table wine except for a couple of the white blends.

I think Hilmy is a better winery at the moment than Lewis. Just my opinion based on limited samples.

I agree again. Eric went through a few mediocre years, though. We were there a couple months ago, and enjoyed a few of his wines. He was also a very gracious host. He was pretty young an raw a decade ago when starting out. I'm glad he clearly indicates his California wine (the "aka" branding), but wish he could stick to Texas.

cecil77 said:

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The vast majority of Texas wines made/sold by wineries in the Hill Country are grapes from West Texas. Something like 85% of Texas wine grapes are grown there. If the huge (for Texas) Terry County producers can be convinced to drop their yields and raise their quality, it will be a sea change for Texas grapes. Narra vineyards already has, and the wines from their grapes are outstanding. Sadly there's far too many 8-12 ton/acre yields producing $15 grocery store wine that had a $30 price tag in the winery.

The economic reality, is that to be DTC the "winery" is most profitable on 290. The scare quotes is because little of the wine is actually fermented in the wineries on 290. Texas Custom Wine Works in Brownfield makes a bunch of it.

And, of course, by federal law "Texas" on the front label only means 75% (or more) of the grapes are Texas grapes. The big producers (Messina Hof, Becker, Llano) leverage this to produce much more wine appellated "Texas" than they could if they really produced 100% Texas wine.

Two quick brags:
* Dan Gatlin (with Neal Newsom) planted the first Tempranillo vines in west Texas in (I think) 1997. Dan had to convince Neal to do it, and guaranteed the first crop.
* Inwood produces all of it's wine in the 290 winery, from fermentation to bottling. Both for it's west Texas grapes and it's Fredericksburg grapes.

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Very interesting. Thanks, Cecil.

Two things:

A Len Napolitano book I read the other day said "Texas" wines must be 85% Texas grapes. California must be 100% and everywhere else is 75%.

Quote:

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the "winery" is most profitable on 290

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It doesn't hurt that the landscape along 290 is much prettier than the landscape along 385.

bularry said:

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I like some of the WC better than table wine, but really, nothing wrong with good table wine either. Of course their pricing doesn't really reflect table wine except for a couple of the white blends.

I think Hilmy is a better winery at the moment than Lewis. Just my opinion based on limited samples.

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WC?

Federal appellation labeling law:

Appellated as:
Political subdivision (e.g. country, state or county) : 75%
I don't believe Texas has any state laws overriding that.

AVA (e.g. Texas Hill Country or Russian River Valley) : 85%

Single vineyard (e.g. Newsome Vineyards or To Kalon) : 95:


California: 100% (state law)

Oregon: 100% (state law)

Washington: 95% (state law)

Another weird quirk is you can name up to three political subdivisions on the label, but they have to be contiguous. SO you can't put on a label that both Texas and California grapes are used. Hence the ubiquitous "American" appellation on so many wines from Texas wineries.

Than there's the "For Sale in Texas Only" on the back label. Since it makes the wine a state product, federal laws no longer apply and there's no appellation at all. I look at FSITO as shorthand for "there's few, if any, Texas grapes in this bottle, and we're not gonna tell you anyway."

DTC?

MooreTrucker said:

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bularry said:

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I like some of the WC better than table wine, but really, nothing wrong with good table wine either. Of course their pricing doesn't really reflect table wine except for a couple of the white blends.

I think Hilmy is a better winery at the moment than Lewis. Just my opinion based on limited samples.

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WC?

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William Chris


DTC: "Direct To Consumer" (sorry for the jargon)

I'll probably stick with those overly-manipulated, overpriced, overly-hyped fruit bombs from NV.

Ah!

Stagecoach said:

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I'll probably stick with those overly-manipulated, overpriced, overly-hyped fruit bombs from NV.

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And you'll be missing out on some incredible wines, regardless of price. But hey, whatever empties your back pocket and swells your front...

cecil77 said:

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Federal appellation labeling law:

Appellated as:
Political subdivision (e.g. country, state or county) : 75%
I don't believe Texas has any state laws overriding that.

AVA (e.g. Texas Hill Country or Russian River Valley) : 85%

Single vineyard (e.g. Newsome Vineyards or To Kalon) : 95:


California: 100% (state law)

Oregon: 100% (state law)

Washington: 95% (state law)

Another weird quirk is you can name up to three political subdivisions on the label, but they have to be contiguous. SO you can't put on a label that both Texas and California grapes are used. Hence the ubiquitous "American" appellation on so many wines from Texas wineries.

Than there's the "For Sale in Texas Only" on the back label. Since it makes the wine a state product, federal laws no longer apply and there's no appellation at all. I look at FSITO as shorthand for "there's few, if any, Texas grapes in this bottle, and we're not gonna tell you anyway."

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You're right, it was the AVA designation. But there was a bill passed in 2017 to make Texas a 100% state, but it only applies to wines labeled after Sept 1, 2017.

Quote:

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You're right, it was the AVA designation. But there was a bill passed in 2017 to make Texas a 100% state, but it only applies to wines labeled after Sept 1, 2017.

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I don't think that it made it out of committee. Messina Hof took the lead in opposing. And truth be told, it was a poorly written law. It should be by vintage, e.g. wine with a vintage date of 2018... Chris Brundrett (WC and a good 'Ag) took a lead in promoting it.

And the argument from the big producers that it would decrease their production by 25% is specious. They could make the identical wines from 75% Texas grapes and appellate "American" with no problem. However, the fact that they balk at that shows that the "Texas" Appellation is of value to them. And, if so, why not make it 100%? It will happen eventually, but will take awhile, I think.

And as to the WineRoad 290, it's reported that we are now 2nd only to Napa Valley in wine tourism visitors. Being in the center of 3 of the largest metropolitan areas in the country doesn't hurt...

I get it, Cecil; you fancy yourself the second coming of Bianca Bosker. My comment was satirical. A core tenet of enjoying wine is to drink what you like. But could you possibly shelve the wallet envy and condescending attitude for a change? You enjoy your wine journey, and I'll enjoy mine.

Damn, man,...

As someone who drinks a LOT of wine ...

My advice to the people that ask - drink the cheapest wine you enjoy. And that answer is different for all of us based on palate and pocketbook.

Best $20 Cabs:

• Smith and Hook
• Justin
• Fortnight
• Freakshow

What else?

Thanks! I'll take a look...

Sangiovese question. We really enjoy the Sangiovese produced by the Seghesio Family Winery. The wine is much richer and heavier than most versions with the same grape and it is also something that doesn't have to necessarily be paired with food. The guy at Total Wine and More told me the heft and depth come from leaving the grapes on the vine longer and then soaking them with skins on for a longer period.

Any similar Sangiovese's you'd recommend? While we enjoy the Seghesio version, when you add shipping, it becomes a much pricier wine (about $35) than what we would consider for a regular drinking wine.

Check out any Brunello. 100% Sangiovese with extended maceration (i.e. soaked on the skins longer)

Here's part of the brunello article in wiki:

Quote:

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Traditionally, the wine goes through an extended maceration period where color and flavor are extracted from the skins.

The altitude and climate of the Montalcino region has provided an area where Sangiovese ripens more fully and consistently than anywhere else in Tuscany. These factors contribute to the body, color, extract and tannins commonly associated with Brunello di Montalcino. In contrast to Chianti, the other famous Sangiovese based wine of Tuscany, Brunello di Montalcinos have a more fleshy texture with common aromas and flavors of blackberry, black cherry, black raspberry, chocolate, leather and violets.

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I don't have any specific recommendations, but experimenting is part of the fun, right!

Agree on Brunello!

Brunello's I've enjoyed:
Altesino
Casanova di Neri
Poggio Antico
Argiano

Much appreciated. I'll report back after some research.

Banfi also has some Brunello vineyards/wines, I believe. They should be easy to find.

MooreTrucker said:

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bularry said:

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I like some of the WC better than table wine, but really, nothing wrong with good table wine either. Of course their pricing doesn't really reflect table wine except for a couple of the white blends.

I think Hilmy is a better winery at the moment than Lewis. Just my opinion based on limited samples.

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WC?

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William Chris

Greener Acres said:

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Sangiovese question. We really enjoy the Sangiovese produced by the Seghesio Family Winery. The wine is much richer and heavier than most versions with the same grape and it is also something that doesn't have to necessarily be paired with food. The guy at Total Wine and More told me the heft and depth come from leaving the grapes on the vine longer and then soaking them with skins on for a longer period.

Any similar Sangiovese's you'd recommend? While we enjoy the Seghesio version, when you add shipping, it becomes a much pricier wine (about $35) than what we would consider for a regular drinking wine.

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There are a lot of pretty big Chianti Classicos out there in the market and generally much lower priced than a decent Brunello. I wouldn't give up on that hunt, either.

Has there been discussion about canned wines?

Little if any, but I'll play,...

I've tried a few Rose's recently (House Wine, Ava Grace, Porch Rocker). They've been acceptable. Wouldn't make it a staple but, for the summer, very manageable.

Bought wife the Porch Rocker Chardonnay for a pool party a week ago and she liked. (not that her palate is,..well, I'll stop,..)