I'm not going to call you sparkle pony. So...SP.

Congrats on the willingness to move.

Denver is expensive, you need to be prepared for that. However, it's not unaffordable. I move here after graduation with 500 bucks in the bank.

I don't have kids so telling you what school district to pick is hard. Others here can chime in. I live in Highlands Ranch, a southern suburb.

I keep seeing folks saying that it's expensive, but can you quantify that? Home prices aren't exorbitant from what I've seen online, and the income tax is only ~4%...are gas/food/property taxes a lot higher?

Home prices are higher, but property taxes are much much lower.

4 percent seems way off.

I just sold my house in Highlands Ranch it is under 2000 ft.² for $375,000.

I imagine the same house in Texas to be 280 290

Thanks for the information. I live downtown.

I said the state income tax was ~4%, not property values.

Silver I think there is actually a john Hollys downtown...

Silver,

I recommend Tommy Thai and Thai Basil (TB usually has .25 beers). Both are Thai in name but serve all kinds of Asian dishes. I'm a big Johnny Holly fan too.

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Any advice in general for people thinking of making the Texas to CO move?

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I just sold my house in Highlands Ranch it is under 2000 ft.² for $375,000.

I imagine the same house in Texas to be 280 290

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Does that include basement?

We bought our house for under 300k in 2012, and I think we could get in the 375-400k range right now. It's just under 3350 square feet.

*As a disclaimer to SP, I thought we'd be lucky to get our house for the same price in a TX suburb when we bought it.... much less in a great Denver suburb by one of my favorite golf courses. In general, I'd expect to spend 35-45% more on a house here than in a Houston/Dallas suburb.

[This message has been edited by proudaggie02 (edited 5/6/2014 12:42p).]

We do have a basement. 500 finished square feet. So 2400.

But I would never count that as living space.

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I keep seeing folks saying that it's expensive, but can you quantify that? Home prices aren't exorbitant from what I've seen online, and the income tax is only ~4%...are gas/food/property taxes a lot higher?

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I don't think Denver is expensive for the quality of life you get, especially compared to the coasts. As far as gauging prices, here is what I would consider:

-CO State income tax = ~4.6%
-Property taxes = ~.075
-Car registration = probably an extra $200-500/year (I think I pay $180/year for 5-yr old SUV; they get you on new cars.... $975 for my wife's SUV last year).
-Groceries = maybe just a bit more expensive (I buy meat & produce at Sprouts and Costco.... bananas $.55/lb, apples are $.89-$1.59/lb for most varieties; ribeye and ny strip are $6-7/lb at Costco).

Here is a hypo to help you look at it:
-90k family income = $4,000 increase due to CO State tax (should get a tax break on State inc tax paid)
-250k house = $4,000 savings assuming .75% CO prop tax vs 2.35% TX prop tax (which is a guess on my part).

*There must be some small things that add up & make it more expensive here because it seems like I should save more than I do.

Ummmm, your golf, skiing, and Bourbon habits...

^
Very true.

Thanks for all that info, Proud, that's the kind of stuff I was looking for.

Sparkle.. Proud hit it on the head.

Do the math.. don't just look at the price tags.

0.7% prop tax makes a huge difference. My tax rate in far NW Houston suburbs was 4%.

Outside of prop and income tax and car registration, I have noticed no discernible difference in the cost of living in Houston vs. Denver. Gas, food, shopping, etc.. are all roughly the same.

Outdoor life can get pricey, like skiing.. But hey, the rest of the US comes to spend a week vacation to ski, so of course there's a price on that... however living here you can do it for much cheaper than a tourist.



[This message has been edited by 62strat (edited 5/7/2014 9:48a).]

*One thing I failed to mention in my hypothetical above is that a 250k house in the Denver area would probably cost you 185-200k in a Texas suburb. So assuming a 20% down payment, you're looking at an extra 11-12k for buying a house. My guess is that a house will appreciate more in Denver.

And as far as golf, you get considerably better courses for cheaper prices. And yes, 75 rounds of golf and 25 days of skiing gets a little pricey.... though I haven't skied that much in 2-3 years.

With a 1 year old running around, I doubt we'd be skiing that much anyways, and I don't golf. We'd be doing the freebie stuff like camping and hiking =)

Every time I lurk on this board, there's another person talking about moving to Colorado. It's making me jealous!! I want to move there so bad, but it's hard at this point in my career to find a comparable job (and compensation). If this keeps up, I may be sacrificing the kids' college funds just to make a move! Ha!

^
That's tough.

I think my parents thought I would be ready to move back to Texas after a couple years in Denver. I told them after a year or so that it would take at least 5x my salary for me to consider moving back to TX & that I would probably make it about 1 year before I'd move back to Denver. I still feel that way. I'd much rather work an extra 1-2 years and live in CO, than live in TX and work 1-2 years less. Just my 2 cents.

Basically what I'm reading into all this is if we can find work with about a 5-10% paybump, we'll be sitting pretty in CO. Good to know! Might take a year or two to regrow our down payment fund, since we'd be breaking even selling our house in Dallas after only 3 years.

SP, I think you're thinking right. These guys obviously know better because they are there, but I've done a ton of homework on it and cranked numbers every which way.

My conclusion has been for a while that I could move for the same money I'm making in Dallas. While I'd pay more for the house, the property taxes alone make up for most of that. The other costs (car registration, etc.), aren't that significant in the grand scheme.

Major difference is I might have to move to a smaller house to keep the housing price from getting too out of control. But, the lifestyle in Colorado is such that I wouldn't care about having more room inside. I wouldn't be moving to stay inside that much.

Yeah, that would be the toughy for us as well, our current house isn't all that big to begin with (3/2 1800sqf)...so we'd be down to possibly a 2/1 for a while.

Meant to ask, as someone that has lived in Texas his entire time on earth, what the heck about winter? Loaded question I know.

Are most cars ok up there? I know they don't salt the roads, so you don't have to worry about winterizing. Do people keep a set of snow tires? Chains? I literally have no idea how any of that works.

Wife drives a little 2WD Honda Fit and I've got a 2WD Honda CR-V

They salt the roads here. At the end of the day a big snow can mean crappy commute. But the city can handle the snow removal since it's a regular occurrence and we have the resources.

A 2wd car will work fine 340 days of the year. For the other 25 days, you may wish you had 4wd, but a front wheel drive will still get by.

However, once you get an AWD or 4wd you'll be glad you did.

And remember don't discount the basement sq ft on a newish house. If you have a newer one story house, the basement can typically double the space.

I'll be honest with both of you. If you wait and try to save up, you are never gonna do it. I moved here right out of college and I did not have children, but i think you are just going to have to take a leap.

As far as getting more pay in Denver, people typically don't get raises to move here. My biggest hang up right now is that the politics suck. The weed legalization is creating problems and I'm not sure how I feel about it.

But everyday I get up and see mountains and breathe clean air. Make the move, make it work. You can always go back to Texas but you won't.

[This message has been edited by Dbtexasag05 (edited 5/7/2014 6:31p).]

What problems do you feel legalization is causing? Genuinely interested, as I support nationwide legalization.

Then you will fit right in.

In all seriousness, 4th graders are selling weed at school. That's a problem.

My wife is a practitioner at Children's Hospital and parents are bringing children in and can't have a sober conversation as their child goes into surgery. They can call the cops about
Booze but not legalized marijuana.

The industry is driving businesses out of buildings. Rent in some areas has gone up 300 percent. It's going to change how business is done. Is that bad? Good? Nobody knows yet, but it is a drug. Drugs are federally illegal. It's time to see what happens.

Ultimately I am not going to derail the Denver thread. I do think they jumped the gun on legalization.

Fair enough, I don't want to derail anything either. Just haven't heard many first hand opinions of the negative impacts it's having on the state. Thanks for sharing.

Of course.

Seriously...make the move!

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They salt the roads here. At the end of the day a big snow can mean crappy commute. But the city can handle the snow removal since it's a regular occurrence and we have the resources.

A 2wd car will work fine 340 days of the year. For the other 25 days, you may wish you had 4wd, but a front wheel drive will still get by.

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I agree. In my 5 years here, there have been probably 20 days per year where winter conditions have adversely affected my commute. Much of the Denver area is within a 10-minute drive to light rail. I tend to primarily take light rail on snowy days. Also, if the snow is not too bad (or it snowed overnight), I can typically beat the traffic if I leave my house by 6:20 or 6:30 on winter weather days.
Another perk here is that it never rains & is rarely cloudy. It’s not as green as Texas for half of the year, but we rarely have to deal with flooding (but mountain towns sometimes do), canceling outdoor plans because of rain, etc…

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I'll be honest with both of you. If you wait and try to save up, you are never gonna do it. I moved here right out of college and I did not have children, but i think you are just going to have to take a leap.

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Completely agree. I took a leap and moved out here with a nice load of law school debt, not much money in the bank, and no job for me or my wife. I had some good leads, but I decided it was time. Fortunately, I got 2 offers when my wife and I visited two weeks before moving & my wife got a job within about 3 weeks.

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As far as getting more pay in Denver, people typically don't get raises to move here.

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The “sunshine tax” as I’ve heard it called. Everyone wants to live here & it’s one of the most educated metros in America. That’s not to say that can’t move up if you work hard.

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But everyday I get up and see mountains and breathe clean air. Make the move, make it work. You can always go back to Texas but you won't.

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Amen brother!

Alcohol was an illegal drug too.. I really see no fundamental difference in the two.

Why can they call the cops if the parent is drunk, but not high?

Either way, the parent apparently drove the child while under the influence, which is not legal.

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In all seriousness, 4th graders are selling weed at school. That's a problem.

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That is also illegal for the 10 year old... is it a direct result of legalization of weed? I don't think so. A responsible parent who now legally buys weed is not going to have the weed accessible to the child.
This is coming from an irresponsible parent, who was likely buying weed before it was legal.

Thread Derailed. Lets get back to talking about the mountains.

[This message has been edited by dbtexasag05 (edited 5/8/2014 12:40p).]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zH2-SqgJTlU

[This message has been edited by 62strat (edited 5/8/2014 1:43p).]