aggietony2010 said:

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gigem1223 said:

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Too many players pressing and it's mostly the vets.

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The script says Adolis swings on 3 straight out of the zone.

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Maybe that's the sacrifice this team needed

That's was fast Jung

Anyone think MLB is scripted?

Bottom of the 9th they better come out just trying to get bases. Don't come out trying to tie it with one swing. Let's walk this off!

God Bless

I hate life

Baseball Gods are so cruel to us right now. Just can't catch a damn break.

Guess the bright side is somehow we still have a 3.5 game lead.

Brutal.

Not playing good baseball right now. Hopefully they get out of this funk soon.

Screw the Jays.

Screw RISP.

Screw this ump and his janky zone. I hope he winds ump homeless watching robots do the job he's incapable of doing.

Thankfully a lot easier to stomach without losing much ground in the division.

rbtexan said:

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DallasAg 94 said:

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Proposition Joe said:

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Or it's very simply that he's an average pitcher that had an anomaly year last season.

Even with the career year last season, he has a career ERA+ of 100.

He's a 4.5ish ERA, back of the rotation pitcher. There's value in that, but there's no magic approach Maddux can teach him or the like.

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Perez has the stuff to be a 2/3. His issue was always falling apart when he got negativity rolling. An error, or a bad pitch for a HR would become 5+ runs in a game. I think we all saw his ability to limit the damage last year and there were comments about it (if only by me. )

I think 2022 was more along the lines of what he is capable. You look at those 3 games in 2023 and that's 19ER in 11.2 IP. The other 10 games he is 18ER in 59.2 IP which is a 2.72 ERA. 77% of his outings (10/13) were really good.

We'll see where he is tonight and how he does. If his splits continue, maybe you look at him as a Home SP.

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I'm actually more in agreement with Proposition Joe on this.

Years & years ago, I bought a giant book (probably 4 inches thick or better) that had the stats of every player who ever made the major leagues...Baseball Almanac I think it was called. At any rate, I went through the entire book and discovered players I had never heard of who had either really great seasons or careers. Hal Trosky for example looked like he was going to be a superstar and then faded - I found out later it was because of severe migraine headaches.

In looking at the historical stats, you'd be amazed how many players you never heard of who had one great season, maybe two - usually either their first couple of seasons, or later in their career. But almost everyone of them slid back to their statistical norms. A couple of Rangers examples are George Wright and Kevin Elster. Wright started out like gangbusters and faded quickly. Elster came over late in his career and had one magical season that he never replicated.

What I did NOT find was many players who put up mediocre stats for the majority of their career, and then somehow found themselves in their 30s and elevated their game substantially. There are, of course, exceptions - knuckleball pitchers for one, and former Ranger Jamie Moyer was another. But for the most part, historically speaking, what a player does is what he is.

That's why I'm inclined to believe last season was an anomaly and the Perez we're seeing this year is who he is. Hopefully he'll prove me wrong, but the preponderance of historical stats lead me to think otherwise.

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I disagree.

You can't compare Hal Trosky... a guy with 2 appearances and 3.0 IP with a 6.00 ERA. He was 44-30 in the minors and played in the '50s. The height of the mound changed in the '70s so, comparing pitchers before and after is very difficult.

When it comes to modern day SPs... there are hundreds of SPs that don't make their MLB debut until they are 25-26.

Consider Colby Lewis who failed in MLB with the Rangers from age 22-27 with a 6.71 ERA. Went 3.93 from age 30-32.

Verlander @32 had a career 3.52 ERA. He is a 2.87 since with 136 GS and over 876 IP. He was 23 when he had his 1st full season.

Owen White at 23, just had a cup of coffee. By his age, Martin had already 213 IP with a 4.13 ERA in MLB. Leiter, Rocker, et al are still struggling in the Minors.

If Owen White were to remain in Arlington.... he likely improves over his 1st G, but he may be 2 years away from making the rotation. Think about what his ERA would be.

Modern day pitching, it isn't unusual, IMO, for a SP to be 30... 31 years old before he puts everything together.

I agree Perez' season last year may have been an anomaly... we'll see, I guess.

Someone want to tell Brien Rea (post game anchor) that our lead is not dissipating.

What was weird about this game is it seemed like whenever we got any runners on base, the home plate umpire expanded the strike zone by 2 or 3x its normal size.

We aren't playing great right now, but home plate umpires have been really hurting us. It seems like we've been swinging at literally everything lately, but the few times we take a pitch and it's pretty much as low as your foot. What do you expect these hitters to think?

Can't put it all on the umps, but I had no real complaints about the umpires in the TB series. We just got beat and had bad matchups. The umpires for the angels series and the one tonight all went in dry and hard on us. Very ridiculous.

I just want to get to the road trip asap. This team needs a change of scenery and maybe they'll start hitting. Scoring 1 run at home is pathetic.

aggietony2010 said:

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Someone want to tell Brien Rea (post game anchor) that our lead is not dissipating.

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It is to the Angels, who may be the hottest team in baseball.

The Rangers didn't show up again. They are pathetic. To bad we can't bring up the AAA team for the next couple of games and send this whole roster down

DallasAg 94 said:

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Grapesoda2525 said:

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The Rangers didn't show up again. They are pathetic. To bad we can't bring up the AAA team for the next couple of games and send this whole roster down

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Maybe baseball isn't for you.

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Or not being high…

DallasAg 94 said:

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rbtexan said:

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DallasAg 94 said:

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Proposition Joe said:

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Or it's very simply that he's an average pitcher that had an anomaly year last season.

Even with the career year last season, he has a career ERA+ of 100.

He's a 4.5ish ERA, back of the rotation pitcher. There's value in that, but there's no magic approach Maddux can teach him or the like.

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Perez has the stuff to be a 2/3. His issue was always falling apart when he got negativity rolling. An error, or a bad pitch for a HR would become 5+ runs in a game. I think we all saw his ability to limit the damage last year and there were comments about it (if only by me. )

I think 2022 was more along the lines of what he is capable. You look at those 3 games in 2023 and that's 19ER in 11.2 IP. The other 10 games he is 18ER in 59.2 IP which is a 2.72 ERA. 77% of his outings (10/13) were really good.

We'll see where he is tonight and how he does. If his splits continue, maybe you look at him as a Home SP.

---

I'm actually more in agreement with Proposition Joe on this.

Years & years ago, I bought a giant book (probably 4 inches thick or better) that had the stats of every player who ever made the major leagues...Baseball Almanac I think it was called. At any rate, I went through the entire book and discovered players I had never heard of who had either really great seasons or careers. Hal Trosky for example looked like he was going to be a superstar and then faded - I found out later it was because of severe migraine headaches.

In looking at the historical stats, you'd be amazed how many players you never heard of who had one great season, maybe two - usually either their first couple of seasons, or later in their career. But almost everyone of them slid back to their statistical norms. A couple of Rangers examples are George Wright and Kevin Elster. Wright started out like gangbusters and faded quickly. Elster came over late in his career and had one magical season that he never replicated.

What I did NOT find was many players who put up mediocre stats for the majority of their career, and then somehow found themselves in their 30s and elevated their game substantially. There are, of course, exceptions - knuckleball pitchers for one, and former Ranger Jamie Moyer was another. But for the most part, historically speaking, what a player does is what he is.

That's why I'm inclined to believe last season was an anomaly and the Perez we're seeing this year is who he is. Hopefully he'll prove me wrong, but the preponderance of historical stats lead me to think otherwise.

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I disagree.

You can't compare Hal Trosky... a guy with 2 appearances and 3.0 IP with a 6.00 ERA. He was 44-30 in the minors and played in the '50s. The height of the mound changed in the '70s so, comparing pitchers before and after is very difficult.

When it comes to modern day SPs... there are hundreds of SPs that don't make their MLB debut until they are 25-26.

Consider Colby Lewis who failed in MLB with the Rangers from age 22-27 with a 6.71 ERA. Went 3.93 from age 30-32.

Verlander @32 had a career 3.52 ERA. He is a 2.87 since with 136 GS and over 876 IP. He was 23 when he had his 1st full season.

Owen White at 23, just had a cup of coffee. By his age, Martin had already 213 IP with a 4.13 ERA in MLB. Leiter, Rocker, et al are still struggling in the Minors.

If Owen White were to remain in Arlington.... he likely improves over his 1st G, but he may be 2 years away from making the rotation. Think about what his ERA would be.

Modern day pitching, it isn't unusual, IMO, for a SP to be 30... 31 years old before he puts everything together.

I agree Perez' season last year may have been an anomaly... we'll see, I guess.

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Yeah, so...you looked up the wrong Hal Trosky. You found Hal Trosky Jr., I was talking about his father, who was a first baseman for Cleveland and had a solid career with one magical season.

How's this for a stat line. As a 23 yr old in 1936...
151 G
629 AB
124 R
216 H
.343 Avg
45 2B
9 3B
42 HR
162 RBI
36 BB
58 SO

In addition to looking up the wrong guy, you also incorrectly assumed that I was comparing players. I wasn't comparing anybody. I was making the point that if you look at the history of baseball, you will find dozens and dozens of players who had one great season that far eclipsed any other season in their career. Guys like Ripper Collins, Wayne Garland, Joe Charboneau, Cito Gaston, and going way way back, Bill James (the pitcher, not the stat guy).

Perez has thrown nearly 1400 innings in the majors. His record is 81-80 with a 4.44 ERA. That's who he is, and that's not bad. He's a really really good bottom of the rotation starter, you can win championships with guys like that at the bottom of your rotation. But he's never going to consistently be the top of the rotation pitcher he was last season IMO.

DallasAg 94 said:

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Proposition Joe said:

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DallasAg 94 said:

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Proposition Joe said:

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Or it's very simply that he's an average pitcher that had an anomaly year last season.

Even with the career year last season, he has a career ERA+ of 100.

He's a 4.5ish ERA, back of the rotation pitcher. There's value in that, but there's no magic approach Maddux can teach him or the like.

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Perez has the stuff to be a 2/3. His issue was always falling apart when he got negativity rolling. An error, or a bad pitch for a HR would become 5+ runs in a game. I think we all saw his ability to limit the damage last year and there were comments about it (if only by me. )

I think 2022 was more along the lines of what he is capable. You look at those 3 games in 2023 and that's 19ER in 11.2 IP. The other 10 games he is 18ER in 59.2 IP which is a 2.72 ERA. 77% of his outings (10/13) were really good.

We'll see where he is tonight and how he does. If his splits continue, maybe you look at him as a Home SP.

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A lot of pitchers show the stuff to be a 2/3 but can't ever consistently harness it. That's Perez.

He's pitched almost 1400 big league innings as a 4.5ish ERA pitcher.

He pitched hundreds of AA/AAA innings as mostly a 4.5ish ERA pitcher.

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Actually, he is 4.07 in the Minors.

And you've been on here long enough to know Martin has been well ahead of typical age at every stop.

At 17, he pitched in Spokane of the NWL. It is a Fall league where college kids drafted in June go to play. He was the 2nd youngest player ever in the league, 2nd only to King Felix. Typical age is 22-23.

At 18, he was pitching in Frisco @ AA.

He was 21.84, when he made his MLB debut.

@ 22, after his 1st full season of MLB (20GS, 3.62, 124.1 IP) he signed a deal that covered his 2 Serf years and his 3 Arb years. He got a $1M signing bonus and a committment from JD that they would help him do everything politically necessary to get his family out of Venezuela. The $1M, from what I understood would help him pay for lawyer fees.

So, I would not call his path typical. And yes, I've protective of him. I followed him from Spokane all the way through.

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Actually he is a 4.52 ERA pitcher in AA/AAA. What he did in A ball 15 years ago isn't of much relevance - I think we all agree he's got good enough stuff to handle A ball hitters. Point is he's never really been consistently dominant against AA/AAA batters.

At a certain point when a guy has 600ish innings of 4.5ish ERA pitching in AA/AAA and 1400ish innings of 4.5ish ERA pitching in the big leagues you have to start accepting that he's a 4.5ish ERA pitcher.

That doesn't mean he won't have better games, or better seasons. But he'll also have worse games, and worse seasons.

He's 32 years old. He's not well ahead of typical age anymore. Peak age is typically in the 26-28 age, so there's not a lot of data that supports he's going to start improving as he hits his mid-30's. He's a #4/#5 starter.

I don't think Proposition Joe or myself are bagging on Perez. He's a really good pitcher if you view him in the proper context.

Personally I'm glad CY didn't sign him to a long-term deal after last season. He would've had to overpay considerably for what Perez is most likely going to provide consistently. If JD had still been around, I would not at all have been surprised if he had given Perez a 5-6 yr deal for near top of the rotation money, and then we'd all spend the next handful of seasons b*tching about how we got fleeced.

Anybody have a Nathaniel Lowe bobblehead and interested in trading for the DeGrom bobblehead from last night??

Evan Carter began a rehab assignment last night in the ACL, hopefully meaning he's back to full health. I'd love for him to get back to his April play and end up with RR by the end of July.

You're right, it's all about how you look at it. Perez isn't a cy young contending pitcher night in and out. He's a guy that at home will give you a decent to good start. On the road and the offense is going to have to put up at least 4 runs. If we get to the point where Perez is the worst in the rotation then I would say we have one of the best rotations in all of MLB. He certainly performed well enough for us to get the win last night.

Any idea when Gray will start again?

Tomorrow

This next month or so is critical and crazy. The rotation is super stressed right now. Not only because deGrom isn't there to fill and eat innings at the top, but because that's forced guys who just can't go deep in games to pitch, and that has really eaten into the bullpen. Because of this, the Rangers are considering doing a six man rotation, with Bradford likely getting the bulk of that work and in the long reliever role. Ragans and Otto are also being stretched out at RR to hopefully alleviate some stress.