Cleveland is looking for an outfielder with team control. I wouldn't rule them out as a trade partner.

Would they trade a starter?

but CLE isn't going to give up any starters if they are looking to add an outfielder.


marcus stroman may be a target from CHC

BMX Bandit said:

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but CLE isn't going to give up any starters if they are looking to add an outfielder.


marcus stroman may be a target from CHC

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Why not?

BMX Bandit said:

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but CLE isn't going to give up any starters if they are looking to add an outfielder.


marcus stroman may be a target from CHC

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1. You might be surprised
2. I don't think Stroman is on Houston's radar unless things have changed. He doesn't want to come to Houston, and his personality is such that you don't want him on your team if he isn't happy.

It's possible.

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Farmer1906 said:

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BMX Bandit said:

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but CLE isn't going to give up any starters if they are looking to add an outfielder.


marcus stroman may be a target from CHC

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Why not?

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if they are adding an outfielder because they want to win division and advance in playoffs. why would they trade a starter from the team? it doesn't make any sense.

now, if they go no a downward spiral and are out of it, then they may trade a starter, but more likely for prospects.

Tucker making a pitch to Ohtani?

https://www.chron.com/sports/astros/article/astros-shohei-ohtani-free-agency-18196606.php

Kyle Tucker gives Shohei Ohtani Astros' impressive free-agency pitch
Houston's lone All-Star participant made quite the pitch to the presumptive MVP.
By Michael ShapiroUpdated July 12, 2023 10:30 a.m.

Houston Astros outfielder Kyle Tucker is no stranger to facing off against Shohei Ohtani. On Monday, Tucker made his pitch to bring the two-way phenom and presumptive American League MVP to Houston.

Ohtani's impending free agency after the 2023 season is one of baseball's dominant storylines as the second half of the season approaches. The 29-year-old could certainly return to the Angels on a contract likely surpassing $500 million, though given Los Angeles' continued playoff droughtthe franchise's last playoff victory was 14 years agoperhaps Ohtani could eye greener pastures this winter. Tucker seems to know exactly where Ohtani should play next.
"Houston is a really good spot. I love playing there," Tucker told Bill Shaikin of the Los Angeles Times. "We play indoors. Really good food. No income tax. We've got a really good team. That should speak for itself."

Tucker's pitch, however appealing, likely won't lure Ohtani to Houston for a number of reasons. The Astros aren't exactly fond of handing out nine-figure deals in free agency, and even if team owner Jim Crane was willing to flex his full financial might, Houston would still face plenty of big-market competition from the Mets, Dodgers and Angels among others. The idea of Ohtani donning an Astros uniform is more a video-game fantasy than any possible reality.

Don't fret, Astros fans. The defending champions still sport plenty of top-line talent at the Major League level, including Tucker, who has a healthy 15 steals, 33 extra-base hits and a 131 OPS+. And frankly, the theoretical money spent on Ohtani should be used to retain Houston's current collection of All-Stars. Jose Altuve and Alex Bregman will be free agents after the 2024 season. Tucker is slated to enter free agency the year after.
Don't expect another external spending spree from Crane anytime soon. Opening his pocketbook to pay Tucker is the more likely option, even at a price tag that will likely surpass Jose Altuve's franchise-record $151 million extension signed in 2018.

BMX Bandit said:

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Farmer1906 said:

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BMX Bandit said:

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but CLE isn't going to give up any starters if they are looking to add an outfielder.


marcus stroman may be a target from CHC

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Why not?

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if they are adding an outfielder because they want to win division and advance in playoffs. why would they trade a starter from the team? it doesn't make any sense.

now, if they go no a downward spiral and are out of it, then they may trade a starter, but more likely for prospects.

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Because they is how winning small market teams operate. They can sell off a declining Bieber with 1.5 years left to acquire someone like Chas with 4.5 years of control to start in their OF cheaply.

if they aren't in playoffs, yes. but they won't do that if they are trying to get in playoffs.


are there examples of teams in first place in a small market trading their ace pitcher?

BMX Bandit said:

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if they aren't in playoffs, yes. but they won't do that if they are trying to get in playoffs.


are there examples of teams in first place in a small market trading their ace pitcher?

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Yes, look at Tampa. They did it with Archer a few years ago.

Farmer1906 said:

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BMX Bandit said:

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if they aren't in playoffs, yes. but they won't do that if they are trying to get in playoffs.


are there examples of teams in first place in a small market trading their ace pitcher?

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Yes, look at Tampa. They did it with Archer a few years ago.

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TB was in 3rd in east when the trade was made, 20 games out of first.

so that is not an example.

No way we sign Ohtani, but is there even a REMOTE possibility we rent him? He pretty much checks every single box we need. The Angels aren't in a position to demand a ton because no team is going to part with their top notch prospects for a wild gamble he resigns.

Tell me about it. I have Bieber on my fantasy team. He's been the epitome of inconsistent.

Remarkable day for Yankees to do that.

Sorry my memory isn't perfect. How about Jmo for Bader last year. Both teams contending. Both selling from a strength to help a weakness.

even that doesn't qualify. what was montgomery? 4th starter for yankees at best? he wasn't going to be in their playoff rotation.

Bieber, even if he has not performed well, is at worse 2nd best starter on guardians. teams trying to be in playoffs don't have a history of trading that type of player.

is it possible? sure, but there isn't a history of anything similar happening that I can think of.

OKCAg2002 said:

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No way we sign Ohtani, but is there even a REMOTE possibility we rent him? He pretty much checks every single box we need. The Angels aren't in a position to demand a ton because no team is going to part with their top notch prospects for a wild gamble he resigns.

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No. This is not happening. I don't know why this keeps getting brought up haha

I also think Cleveland realizes the chances of actually contending for a championship right now are very low. The division is weak and that's the only reason they have a chance at the playoffs right now.

I'm not going to press it too far, but I don't think teams are going to be giving up as much as we think for 2 months of his service. I agree that it is, at best, highly highly unlikely the Angels would trade him to an interdivisional team. Also, they'd have to face the backlash from all directions. Their fans would throw a fit, and the media would hate that we'd have him. For that last point, it would be delicious to drink in all of the MLB fan tears.

But, yeah. Pipe dream.

OKCAg2002 said:

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I'm not going to press it too far, but I don't think teams are going to be giving up as much as we think for 2 months of his service. I agree that it is, at best, highly highly unlikely the Angels would trade him to an interdivisional team. Also, they'd have to face the backlash from all directions. Their fans would throw a fit, and the media would hate that we'd have him. For that last point, it would be delicious to drink in all of the MLB fan tears.

But, yeah. Pipe dream.

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All it takes is one desperate GM who wants to blow it out for a chance this year to drive up the price. Someone made a good point the other day that the if the Astros lost their mind and went after him, you're trading high quality players to someone in the division, and that can come back to bite you in the future.

BMX Bandit said:

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even that doesn't qualify. what was montgomery? 4th starter for yankees at best? he wasn't going to be in their playoff rotation.

Bieber, even if he has not performed well, is at worse 2nd best starter on guardians. teams trying to be in playoffs don't have a history of trading that type of player.

is it possible? sure, but there isn't a history of anything similar happening that I can think of.

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2022 NYY JMo - 3.69 ERA, 3.91 FIP, 1.099 WHIP (excluding his very good STL run)
2023 CLE Bieber - 3.77 ERA, 4.14 FIP, 1.248 WHIP

I think you're overrating what Bieber is now.

Regardless, now that I am back at a computer I can throw a few more at you.

2019 Indians won 93 games and traded away Bauer for a package midseason.
2020 Indians made the postseason and traded away Kluber for Clase.

The Guardians and teams like them know they aren't going to be able to sign guys long-term without a major discount (see Jose Ramirez). So they unload guys while they still have value (basically the entire 2017 Indians staff, Lindor, etc).

EastCoastAgNc said:

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OKCAg2002 said:

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I'm not going to press it too far, but I don't think teams are going to be giving up as much as we think for 2 months of his service. I agree that it is, at best, highly highly unlikely the Angels would trade him to an interdivisional team. Also, they'd have to face the backlash from all directions. Their fans would throw a fit, and the media would hate that we'd have him. For that last point, it would be delicious to drink in all of the MLB fan tears.

But, yeah. Pipe dream.

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All it takes is one desperate GM who wants to blow it out for a chance this year to drive up the price. Someone made a good point the other day that the if the Astros lost their mind and went after him, you're trading high quality players to someone in the division, and that can come back to bite you in the future.

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I wouldn't put it past the Mariners to make a deal for Ohtani. They are desperate for the postseason and success in the postseason.

OKCAg2002 said:

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I'm not going to press it too far, but I don't think teams are going to be giving up as much as we think for 2 months of his service. I agree that it is, at best, highly highly unlikely the Angels would trade him to an interdivisional team. Also, they'd have to face the backlash from all directions. Their fans would throw a fit, and the media would hate that we'd have him. For that last point, it would be delicious to drink in all of the MLB fan tears.

But, yeah. Pipe dream.

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Hard to picture Moreno trading away the potential GOAT especially with the kind of money he likes to throw around. They could have gotten a king's ransom for Ohtani - like Hershel Walker to Vikings type deal - and rebooted their team into a contender with the last decade's GOAT leading the way. Arte would probably beat anyone's offer but has to know Ohtani doesn't want to waste away in Anaheim.

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2022 NYY JMo - 3.69 ERA, 3.91 FIP, 1.099 WHIP (excluding his very good STL run)

2023 CLE Bieber - 3.77 ERA, 4.14 FIP, 1.248 WHIP

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not a relevant comparison.

it only matters what the player is to the team he is on.

Beiber is a key piece of any playoff run for Cleveland. Montgomery was not for NY

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So they unload guys while they still have value (basically the entire 2017 Indians staff, Lindor, etc).

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which were unloaded in season while team in playoff hunt?

yes, desperation is a big part of it.

the Angels would take Kirby and/or Gilbert plus a couple of minor leaguers for Ohtani

Good point on Cleveland not really contending.

They may win their division and make the playoffs but they know they're in no position to compete.

Why not strike while the iron is hot and there are teams wanting some of their pieces? Civale would be a good candidate as well.

Hell we traded our starting CFer while we were in contention.